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Topic: PROOF THAT WE ARE LIVING IN THE LAST DAYS
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bluefrog
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Hey Dog, I thought that was you. ![[pound]](graemlins/pound.gif)
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Found in Him
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shhhhhhhh, now, quit tellin everybody my personal hygiene habits! ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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Eden
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bluefrog wrote quote:
A pastor who was doing missionary work told me that he was in Africa where they know nothing about deodorant...
And probably no soap and no toothpaste and no washed clothes either! Those were the good o' days, I tell you...
love, Eden
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bluefrog
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A pastor who was doing missionary work told me that he was in Africa where they know nothing about deodorant and he had a group of about 2100 in a closed in building and it was hot. He said it was pretty rank. But when he said "Everybody raise your hands and praise the lord" he almost died.
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Found in Him
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Strike two Eden! I'm still gonna like you! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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Eden
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FoundinHim wrote quote:
eeeeeeewwww! Do you know that reading his words makes me want to go take a bath?
With all due respect, you should really take a bath more frequently than just when you are motivated by these words, don't you think?
But maybe that is PROOF THAT WE ARE LIVING IN THE LAST DAYS!!
"Oh beautiful, for spacious skies..."
love, Eden
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Found in Him
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quote:
If, however, they are found Judaizing, they shall be shut out from Christ"
Really?
Scary! Scary to even think such a thing, let alone say it.
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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Found in Him
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eeeeeeewwww! Do you know that reading his words makes me want to go take a bath? I'm serious!
quote:
(2)We Catholics do not accept the Bible as the only rule of faith. Besides the Bible we have the living Church, as a rule to guide us.
Really? Won't they be surprised to hear that faith comes from hearing-- hearing from the word of God? -- um, pretty sure that if they don't have the faith part-- whooz church guides them? ewe!
quote:
We say, this Church instituted by Christ, to teach and guide men through life, has the right to change the Ceremonial laws of the Old Testament and hence, we accept her change of the Sabbath to Sunday.
Change the laws of the old testament? Really? Did they go to the mountain top and get those changes from God? I would not want to be the men that have decided such things and lead others astray by such actions!
I won't comment my thoughts on the unmarried priesthood...ewe, ewe, ewe!
It makes me feel dirty reading his words!
I'm gonna read up on this stuff. I know my son told me one time that the Pope's "throne" has an up-side down cross on it???
What a mess!
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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bluefrog
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OK, I found the letter about the Sabbath.
Letter of inquiry:
Thomaston, Ga
May 22, 1954
Pope Pius XII, Rome, Italy
Dear Sir;
Is the accusation true, that Protestants accuse you of? They say you changed the Seventh Day Sabbath to the, so-called Christian Sunday: Identical with the First Day of the week. If so, when did you make the change, and by what authority?
Yours very truly,
J.L. Day
The Reply:
THE CATHOLIC EXTENSION MAGAZINE
180 Wabash Avel, Chicago, Illinois
(Under the Blessing of Pope Pius XII)
Dear Sir;
Regarding the change from the observance of the Jewish Sabbath to the Christian Sunday, I wish to draw your attention to the facts:
(1) That Protestants, who accept the Bible as the only rule of faith and religion, should by all means go back to the observance of the Sabbath. The fact that they do not, but on the contrary observe Sunday, stultifies them in the eyes of every thinking man.
(2)We Catholics do not accept the Bible as the only rule of faith. Besides the Bible we have the living Church, as a rule to guide us. We say, this Church instituted by Christ, to teach and guide men through life, has the right to change the Ceremonial laws of the Old Testament and hence, we accept her change of the Sabbath to Sunday. We frankly say, "yes", the Church made this change, made this law, as she made many other laws, for instance, the Friday Abstinence, the unmarried priesthood, the laws concerning mixed marriages, the regulation of Catholic marriages, and a thousand other laws.
(3) We also say that of all Protestants, the
Seventh-day adventists are the only group that reason correctly and are consistent with their teachings. It is always somewhat laughable to see the Protestant Churches, in pulpit and legislature, demand the observance of Sundays of which there is nothing in the Bible.
With best wishes
Peter R. Tramer, Editor
That's it for the letter.
In Vol 2, page 316 of The History of the Christian Councils it says:
The Council of Laodicea, AD 364, passed a law (Canon XXIX) which decreed: "Christians shall not Judaize and be idle on Saturday but shall work on that day; but the Lord's day they shall especially honor, and as being Christians, shall, if possible do no work on that day. If, however, they are found Judaizing, they shall be shut out from Christ"
So, it appears that the Christians were still worshiping on Saturday over 300 years after Christs ascension to heaven. The point was they hated the Jews and it was very hard to see the change made so they started killing the Christians and took away the right to any written word or gatherings. It's all recorded.
Since God gave the commandments the only changes were made by man without authority.
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Copper25
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Constantine, look up the king/ruler of an empire Constantine. He was responsible for changing the worship day to Sunday to align with the sun god because many in his empire had those false practices.
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Isaiah 40:6) The voice said, Cry. And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all the goodliness thereof is as the flower of the field
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bluefrog
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EDEN...scriptures that speak about thing or people becoming new have nothing to do with the Sabbath, and you don't just change the Sabbath day because of some historical changes on your own do you? The 4th Commandment says to remember the sabbath and keep it holy. We have no authority, regardless of what the reason is, to change it.
I did find one note on the subject:
"A Doctrinal Catechism," (Catholic) page 174, has the following question and answer:
Question: Have you any other way of proving that the Church has power to institute festivals of precept?"
Answer: Had she not such power..she could not have substituted the observance of Sunday, the first day of the week, for Saturday, the seventh day, a change for which there is no Scriptural authority."
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bluefrog
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The Pope believes that he is the replacement for Jesus while He is gone. (yes, gone) and thusly, can do whatever he dang well pleases, and does.
I will hunt down the letter about the Sabbath and post it for ya.
Also interesting is what is inscribed on the popes hat, and relates to numbers 666. I showed you where the scriptures say never call another Father. Why do they do this ?
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Eden
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Well, it may in fact be that the early Christians themselves moved their memorial day to Sunday which was the first day of the week, seeing as how the Sabbath was celebrated by the (unsaved) Judaic community.
And the first day of the week, or Sunday, was also the day that our Lord rose from the dead, so that the Christians naturally commemorated Sunday or the first day of the week as their day of coming together for the "new creatures in Christ Jesus":
2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
Galatians 6:15
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision avails anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
Mark 16:9
Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
Acts 20:7
And upon the first day of the week when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the next day; and he continued his speech until midnight.
So I think we need to be less hasty to blame the Catholic church for Christians celebrating on the first day of the week, or Sunday.
love, Eden
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Found in Him
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Bluefrog...
When I talk to folks about the Sabbath being changed to Sunday it usually falls on deaf ears.
Did Jesus change it? I have a letter proving that the pope changed it and they are humored that we still use their sabbath.
The Seventh Day Churches sure are serious about it. There are Seventh Day Adventists, Baptists, Christians that I know of.[/QUOTE]
Can you explain this about the Sabbath? What's in the letter? I seen where you wrote about the 10 commandments being changed-- The Pope must think he has authority to do such things?
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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The Beauty of Holiness777
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Good post BecauseHelives!
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In God I'am Complete.
I am a "Spiritual Being" living in a physical body.
{Prayer - a force that reaches people and places when we can't}
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bluefrog
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When I talk to folks about the Sabbath being changed to Sunday it usually falls on deaf ears.
Did Jesus change it? I have a letter proving that the pope changed it and they are humored that we still use their sabbath.
The Seventh Day Churches sure are serious about it. There are Seventh Day Adventists, Baptists, Christians that I know of.
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Eden
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That's interesting, bluefrog. I never knew that. I see that No. 2 and Nos. 9 and 10 are involved in this shuffle, with 9 and 10 basically saying the same thing. velly intelesting.
love, Eden
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bluefrog
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Yes, but don't ask me which one.
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Found in Him
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Great! ![[mad2]](graemlins/mad2.gif) -- Did Pope do that?
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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bluefrog
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Yes, I will try to do it this way...I will do Ours in CAPS and Theirs in Upper and Lower Case.
1.THOU SHALT HAVE NO OTHER GODS BEFORE ME.
I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt not have strange gods before Me.
2.YOU SHALL NOT MAKE FOR YOURSELF AN IDOL.
Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain. (note: You shall not make for yourself an idol, is left out completely)
3.YOU SHALL NOT TAKE THE NAME OF THE LORD YOUR GOD IN VAIN.
Remember that thou keep holy the Sabbath day.
4.REMEMBER THE SABBATH DAY TO KEEP IT HOLY.
Honor thy father and thy mother.
5.HONOR YOUR FATHER AND YOUR MOTHER.
Thou shalt not kill.
6.YOU SHALL NOT MURDER.
Thou shalt not commit adultery.
7.YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY.
Thou shalt not steal.
8.YOU SHALL NOT STEAL.
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
9.YOU SHALL NOT GIVE FALSE TESTIMONY AGAINST YOUR NEIGHBOR.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife.
10.YOU SHALL NOT COVET.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's goods.
Also, I might mention that the Catholics changed the Sabath from Saturday to Sunday. Jesus never changed it. Protestants kept it..the Day of the Sun, from pagan religion.
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Betty Louise
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Are the Catholic Ten Commandments different?
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
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bluefrog
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Speakin of Moses, did you know he started out as a basket case ? And speaking of Moses have you read the 10 commandments for Christians compared to the one the Catholics use?
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Found in Him
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You are exactly right bluefrog, it's not something to really debate over. I also pray to be on the first flight outta here via the rapture-- Thanks!
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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bluefrog
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I have a thousand year layover marked on my calander.
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Found in Him
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Over the body of Moses.
Just wanted to clarify that.
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Found in Him:
Personally I believe Moses the was taken. The grave is no where to be found. Biblical? You decide. Jude speaks of a debate over the body of Moses.
Not Biblical.
Jude speaks of a Angelic debate.
Jude.1
[9] Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses,
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That is all.....
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Found in Him
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Personally I believe Moses the was taken. The grave is no where to be found. Biblical? You decide. Jude speaks of a debate over the body of Moses.
I believe Moses and Elijah to be the two witnesses in the book of Revelation.
I promise you that I WILL keep my mouth shut over what I "believe" going forward!
that's biblical.
And that is all.
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Found in Him:
quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
So what about the people who lived in India in 1000 B.C. or the people who lived in China in 1500 B.C., will they have "the same opportuntiy to be saved", and if so, how?
love, Eden
Moses and Elijah were the only ones I find from the old testament that were "taken" directly into God's heaven. why?
[/QUOTE]
Not Biblical.
The Book of Deuteronomy
Chapter 34
5 So Moses the servant of the LORD died there in the land of Moab, according to the word of the LORD.
6 And he buried him in a valley in the land of Moab, over against Bethpeor: but no man knoweth of his sepulchre unto this day.
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That is all.....
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becauseHElives
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Eden, I have ask myself those same question?
what I know, is only what I have learned from the scriptures that has been revealed to me by the Spirit...
I know Yahweh is love...
I know Yahweh is merciful....
I know Yahweh is long suffering....
I know Yahweh doesn't want any to perish....
I know Yahweh is a righteous Judge....
I know Yahweh examines and knows the heart of every man, woman, boy and girl....
I know none will be Judge unfairly on That Day...
I know none will have any excuse when they receive their just rewards....
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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Copper25
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quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
Hi, Copper25, you wrote to Eden quote:
But in history look what happen to the heathen that dwelt in evil...
Do you suppose that they were greater sinners than us?
Luke 13
4 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, do you think that they were sinners above all men that dwelled in Jerusalem?
love, Eden
did I ever say that my brother? I simply laid down verses that I was led to lay down, when Christ said many, How many is many considering that Psalm 12:6) "The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times."
The fact is that God owes the human race nothing, absolutly nothing
Isaiah 45:9) Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker! Let the potsherd strive with the potsherds of the earth. Shall the clay say to him that fashioneth it, What makest thou? or thy work, He hath no hands?
Romans 9:21) "Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?"
Romans 9:22-23)"What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,"
Again, does not God do as he pleases. Look at pharoah of Moses' day. God raised him for such a purpose that he might show his power and wonders
Romans 9:17) "For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth."
I say again, who and I mean who does God owe, He is the creator of us all
Ezekiel 18:4) "Behold, all souls are mine ; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die."
So who does God owe a second chance to seeing that He owes none of us in the entire human race from the beginning of time anything?
Therefore as our Lord say before
Matthew 7:13) Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat
because every soul is his and seeing that it is wrriten "many there be which go in thereat", who is man to say that he deserveth a second chance for I say onto you that all have sinned and the wages of sin is death.
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Isaiah 40:6) The voice said, Cry. And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all the goodliness thereof is as the flower of the field
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Eden
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Hi, Copper25, you wrote to Eden quote:
But in history look what happen to the heathen that dwelt in evil...
Do you suppose that they were greater sinners than us?
Luke 13
4 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, do you think that they were sinners above all men that dwelled in Jerusalem?
5 I tell you, No: but, except you repent, you shall all likewise perish.
But we are saved by the blood of Jesus because we were able to read the Word of God and we were preached to and we ended up believing for salvation.
Romans 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
Romans 3:23
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
In order for God not to be a respector of persons, don't all people who have ever lived have to have the same opportunity to save themselves?
The heathen are NOT more sinful than we were when we had our conversation among them, before our salvation, so if someone in the jungle in Amazonia in 700 B.C. never even heard of Israel and they died, shouldn't there be some provision for THEM to accept the offer of reconciliation thru Jesus?
love, Eden
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Found in Him
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Ephesians 4:8-10 (KJV) "Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.(9) (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth? (10) He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)"
1 Peter 3:19 (KJV) "By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;"
1 Peter 4:5-6 (KJV)
"Who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead. For this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit."
God doesn't leave anybody out-- I think He is real proud of His Son.
Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. 2He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for[a] the sins of the whole world.
6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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Copper25
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quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
Hi, Copper25, you wrote to Eden [QUOTE]Isaiah 45:22) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
So it seems to me that Jesus at some point will have to give all the dead who have NEVER even heard of Israel an "equal opportunity to get saved", or not?
love, Eden
Wait so you are saying that if someone died and they did not turn from there iniquity, that they should be given another chance after they are dead? Once again, is God a favor of persons? I think not. Is God a God of justice, I think so
Acts 17:29) Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
Acts 17:30)"And the times of this ignorance God winked at"
But in history look what happen to the heathen that dwelt in evil and that got prophesized against and destroyed by the hand of God
also remember
Romans 1
21) Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22) Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23) And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24) Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25) Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator
Humans from the beginning were still held accountable for their actions
Hosea 4:6) "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children."
Now consider this, God's own people, his children of Israel were many destroyed when they submitted to the Golden calf near mount Sinai, many were destroyed by the plague when they tempted God in the wilderness, when he sent the multitude of quails, then how many died of the fiery flying serpents, now consider this, those were of his chosen nation, the people of whom the promise was derived to keep.
Also look at this verse
Genesis 18:20) And the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous
God is a God of justice and as we know only a remnant will enter the kingdom of all people from the beginning of time. Most are going to end up in destruction and damnation as our Lord Jesus has spoken
Matthew 7:13) Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat
So justice will be done and as far as ignorance goes odds don't look good for such because even those of his own people got destroyed. How much more the rest of the people in history?
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Isaiah 40:6) The voice said, Cry. And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all the goodliness thereof is as the flower of the field
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Eden
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Hi, Copper25, you wrote to Eden quote:
Isaiah 45:22) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
This was the calling for the whole earth, whether a person knows it or not, God has spoken through the prophets and the announcement was made during the period of the Old covenant and even before that, strangers roamed with Israel after they left Egypt and many joined there after ...
But you do realize that in 1000 B.C. and in 1500 B.C., the people in India and the people in China HAD NO IDEA THAT ISRAEL, and the Old Covenant, EVEN EXISTED.
Even the Bible says,
Romans 10:14
How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?
Romans 10:18
But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.
Even when Paul wrote Romans in the 1st century A.D., no apostles had preached the gospel in China, or in Papua New Guinea, and there are millions of people who have died historically who have never even heard of Israel's existence in the Middle East.
Or, are all these people supposed to get saved just from looking at the environment:
Romans 1:20
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.
But I personally don't know of anyone who came to Jesus just from looking at the environment, do you know anyone?
So it seems to me that Jesus at some point will have to give all the dead who have NEVER even heard of Israel an "equal opportunity to get saved", or not?
love, Eden
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Found in Him
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Sorry Daniel, I did not mean to jump ahead of you and answer. My tail-feathers get in a bunch when any question arises about Jesus being preached to all souls throughout all time.
The Father has so beautifully displayed His love for all of mankind throughout all ages -Through- His Son.
All things have been given to Jesus by The Father and my feathers greatly get messed up when Jesus is not unmistakeably glorified as the centerpiece of salvation for all men for all time.
I'm just an old Jesus bird I guess.
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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oneinchrist
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Hi Eden,
I believe that Copper 25 answered the question you asked me...........showing that even in the time BC "justification" was still through faith........faith in God. Found in Him's post also may answer the question......what about those who may have never heard the word? ....yes, Jesus even preached to the spirits in prison before He rose up to God in heaven. Now we really see that God is undoubtedly no respecter of persons. Praise Him!
With love in Christ, Daniel
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Found in Him
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Found in Him:
quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
So what about the people who lived in India in 1000 B.C. or the people who lived in China in 1500 B.C., will they have "the same opportuntiy to be saved", and if so, how?
love, Eden
Why was Jesus in the heart of the earth for three days? It would have only taken him 2 seconds to obtain the keys of death and hell from satan. Did He visit Abraham's bossism and preach?
Did not God say that NONE would be justified by their works? All fleshly righteousness is a filthy rag.
ALL and I repeat ALL from the time of Adam until the last gentile is grafted into God's kingdom MUST kneel at the cross and accept God's Son Jesus to be worthy of heaven.
Moses and Elijah were the only ones I find from the old testament that were "taken" directly into God's heaven. why?
ALL must accept Jesus.
NO ONE is getting in any other way. [/QUOTE]
Also Enoch disappeared as well--sorry, forgot him.
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
Hi, oneinchrist, you wrote quote:
Hi Found in Him,
Yes, I agree with you. I believe that everyone is given the same opportunity to be saved. The Holy Ghost is no respecter of persons. The unsaved are not unsaved because God is not willing to save them, no, rather it would be because they are unwilling to repent and believe on the Lord Jesus.
So what about the people who lived in India in 1000 B.C. or the people who lived in China in 1500 B.C., will they have "the same opportuntiy to be saved", and if so, how?
love, Eden
Rom.2
[13] (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
[14] For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
[15] Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
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That is all.....
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Found in Him
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posted
*bosom
thanks
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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Found in Him
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
So what about the people who lived in India in 1000 B.C. or the people who lived in China in 1500 B.C., will they have "the same opportuntiy to be saved", and if so, how?
love, Eden[/QUOTE]
Why was Jesus in the heart of the earth for three days? It would have only taken him 2 seconds to obtain the keys of death and hell from satan. Did He visit Abraham's bossism and preach?
Did not God say that NONE would be justified by their works? All fleshly righteousness is a filthy rag.
ALL and I repeat ALL from the time of Adam until the last gentile is grafted into God's kingdom MUST kneel at the cross and accept God's Son Jesus to be worthy of heaven.
Moses and Elijah were the only ones I find from the old testament that were "taken" directly into God's heaven. why?
ALL must accept Jesus.
NO ONE is getting in any other way.
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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Copper25
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
So what about the people who lived in India in 1000 B.C. or the people who lived in China in 1500 B.C., will they have "the same opportuntiy to be saved", and if so, how?
love, Eden [/QB]
Think about what you are saying and see if it makes sense, under the old covenant everyone still had the same opportunity to submit themselves to God just like all have the opportunity to submit to Christ. Is God a favor of persons? I think not. Even in the prophecies Isaiah was lead by the Spirit to call all the earth to seek the Lord God and live.
Isaiah 45:22) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
This was the calling for the whole earth, whether a person knows it or not, God has spoken through the prophets and the announcement was made during the period of the Old covenant and even before that, strangers roamed with Israel after they left Egypt and many joined there after, once again God is not a favor of persons, Look at your biblical history carefully.
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Isaiah 40:6) The voice said, Cry. And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all the goodliness thereof is as the flower of the field
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Eden
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posted
Hi, oneinchrist, you wrote quote:
Hi Found in Him,
Yes, I agree with you. I believe that everyone is given the same opportunity to be saved. The Holy Ghost is no respecter of persons. The unsaved are not unsaved because God is not willing to save them, no, rather it would be because they are unwilling to repent and believe on the Lord Jesus.
So what about the people who lived in India in 1000 B.C. or the people who lived in China in 1500 B.C., will they have "the same opportuntiy to be saved", and if so, how?
love, Eden
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oneinchrist
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posted
Hi Found in Him,
Yes, I agree with you. I believe that everyone is given the same opportunity to be saved. The Holy Ghost is no respecter of persons. The unsaved are not unsaved because God is not willing to save them, no, rather it would be because they are unwilling to repent and believe on the Lord Jesus.
With love in Christ, Daniel
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Copper25
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Copper25:
Think about it, look at these verses carefully
Revelation 14:1)And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
Revelation 14:4)These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
So unless all of those Israelites who are saved are only men, then how can there possibly be only 144,000?
Revelation 14:1)And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
Revelation 14:4)These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
So 144,000 all men
Now look back to this verses
Revelation 7
3)Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
4)And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
144,000 thousand, now are these two passages where there are 144,000 a coincidence? Could the elect reserved during the entire tribulation period only contain all men 144,000, and not a soul is gained in Israel the whole 7 years?
Revelation 7:3) Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
Think about it, servants, the word servants implicates that they are reserved for God's use. These are they that are used as instruments in spreading the gospel, being as prophets and evangelist. These are they that God has chosen to recruit and gain more people, they are his servants. Once again, there ministry is going to be lead by the leading of God to do his will, they will not just be sitting around inactive, nay, but I tell you that they will be spreading the truth and proclaiming the Lord and his salvation.
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Isaiah 40:6) The voice said, Cry. And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all the goodliness thereof is as the flower of the field
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bluefrog
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COPPER 25...Sorry, I can't figure where you are goin with this or what the point is.
Yes, there were more than 144,000...
Rev 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people and tongure, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands.
In Rev 14 1-4 we are in heaven and they are all believers and the word of God in their heads. When it talks about their being virgins it is a figure of speech saying they are not polluted or will be polluted under the great religious system under antichrist in the coming days.
I've gotta go.
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Copper25
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posted
Think about it, look at these verses carefully
Revelation 14:1)And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
Revelation 14:4)These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
So unless all of those Israelites who are saved are only men, then how can there possibly be only 144,000?
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Isaiah 40:6) The voice said, Cry. And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all the goodliness thereof is as the flower of the field
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bluefrog
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ONEINCHRIST...Subj: Proof that we are living in the last days.
I agree with you. I have found nothing to prove otherwise. This is my lifetime puzzle. Gotta make my travel plans don't ya know.
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Copper25
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quote:
Originally posted by oneinchrist:
It is my understanding that some people think, based upon some of Paul words, that all jews will repent and be saved...........but I think that Revelation shows us that there are only a certain number of numbers that will be saved.
With love in Christ, Daniel
Revelation 7:4) And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
Think about it, an 144,000 seal, but that is not the whole number. Why because look after the two prophets,
Revelation 11:13)And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
Now think about it, the seals on the 144,000 were right before the chaos. Meaning that those that were "affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven" were not part of the original 144,000 of the tribes that were first initially sealed, thus concluding that the real number is more then 144,000.
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Isaiah 40:6) The voice said, Cry. And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all the goodliness thereof is as the flower of the field
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Found in Him
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posted
a "blindness" is upon the jewish people.
God will take that away.
Romans 11
The Remnant of Israel
1I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means! I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. 2God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew. Don't you know what the Scripture says in the passage about Elijah—how he appealed to God against Israel: 3"Lord, they have killed your prophets and torn down your altars; I am the only one left, and they are trying to kill me"[a]? 4And what was God's answer to him? "I have reserved for myself seven thousand who have not bowed the knee to Baal."[b] 5So too, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace. 6And if by grace, then it is no longer by works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace.[c]
7What then? What Israel sought so earnestly it did not obtain, but the elect did. The others were hardened, 8as it is written:
"God gave them a spirit of stupor,
eyes so that they could not see
and ears so that they could not hear,
to this very day."[d] 9And David says:
"May their table become a snare and a trap,
a stumbling block and a retribution for them.
10May their eyes be darkened so they cannot see,
and their backs be bent forever."[e]
Ingrafted Branches
11Again I ask: Did they stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious. 12But if their transgression means riches for the world, and their loss means riches for the Gentiles, how much greater riches will their fullness bring!
13I am talking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I make much of my ministry 14in the hope that I may somehow arouse my own people to envy and save some of them. 15For if their rejection is the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead? 16If the part of the dough offered as firstfruits is holy, then the whole batch is holy; if the root is holy, so are the branches.
17If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, 18do not boast over those branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. 19You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in." 20Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid. 21For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either.
22Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. 23And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24After all, if you were cut out of an olive tree that is wild by nature, and contrary to nature were grafted into a cultivated olive tree, how much more readily will these, the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree!
All Israel Will Be Saved
25I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. 26And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written:
"The deliverer will come from Zion;
he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.
27And this is[f] my covenant with them
when I take away their sins."[g]
28As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies on your account; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, 29for God's gifts and his call are irrevocable. 30Just as you who were at one time disobedient to God have now received mercy as a result of their disobedience, 31so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now[h] receive mercy as a result of God's mercy to you. 32For God has bound all men over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.
He will not forget them. We will all share in His mercy.
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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Found in Him
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by oneinchrist:
It is my understanding that some people think, based upon some of Paul words, that all jews will repent and be saved...........but I think that Revelation shows us that there are only a certain number of numbers that will be saved.
With love in Christ, Daniel
God is not willing that any should perish-- the problem then lies with mans will right?
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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