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The Downing Street memo says the Bush administration believed that war was inevitable and was determined to use intelligence about weapons of mass destruction to justify the ouster of Saddam.

The "intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy," says the memo, recounting a July 23, 2002, meeting of Prime Minister Tony Blair and his national security team. The meeting took place just after British officials returned from Washington.

U.S. officials and Blair deny the assertion about intelligence and facts being "fixed," a comment that the memo attributes to the chief of British intelligence at the time. The meeting took place eight months before the invasion of Iraq.

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I only learned about this alleged 9/11 cover-up recently and was absolutely appalled that it could be possible. Here's the official site by the guy that started it all, for those interested in following the issue: http://www.reopen911.org/

See the LINKS section of the site for lots of material on this subject. Here's just a few:

Conspiracy Theory Sites:
911 CITIZEN'S WATCH: http://www.911citizenswatch.org
911 STRIKE http://www.911-strike.com
911 SKEPTICS UNITE http://911skeptics.blogspot.com
911 SHARE THE TRUTH http://www.911sharethetruth.com
PROPOSITION 911 http://www.proposition911.org
SCOTT LEDGER'S TRUTH SITE: http://www.scottledger.com

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In fact, the government has failed to produce significant wreckage from any of the four alleged airliners that fateful day. The familiar photo of the Flight 93 crash site in Pennsylvania shows no fuselage, engine or anything recognizable as a plane, just a smoking hole in the ground," said Reynolds. "Photographers reportedly were not allowed near the hole. Neither the FBI nor the National Transportation Safety Board have investigated or produced any report on the alleged airliner crashes."

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First, as we pointed out in our article, NEWS1314 ( http://www.cuttingedge.org/news/n1314.cfm ) entitled, "Is George W. Bush A Born Again Christian?", George W. is an adept in the Satanic Secret Society, Skull and Bones, as was his father, President George Bush, and his grandfather, Prescott Bush. Thus, George W. has strong Generational Witchcraft in his family, a dark and insidious hold. Skull & Bones is an Illuminist secret society so dark and Satanic that its German chapter, the Thule Society, trained Adolf Hitler into the deepest recesses of Satanism. But, that is not the worst of the news. All such secret societies teach their members, and require them to affirm, that the only reason Jesus Christ could have performed the miracles He did was because He was a member of an Egyptian secret society and capable of much higher occult powers than the Pharisees and Sadducees of the day. In other words, such societies teach their members that Jesus was empowered by Satan. This is the Unpardonable Sin, [Mark 3:22-29] and if George W. affirmed it when he was a member of Skull & Bones, he is incapable of being saved, because the Holy Spirit will never call him to the Father, which is an absolute requirement to being saved.

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Originally posted by peh:
I'm almost certain to catch flack for this response but I am really getting tired of the Bush bashing posts. We FINALLY have a praying president and the very people who should be finding reasons to support him are instead finding reasons to out loud and loudly suspect him of all manner of evil plots and plans.

If anyone who posted the negative statements, most of which seem to be based on heresy, had to sit in the Oval Office and make the kind of decisions Bush has to on a daily basis, I wonder how many SERIOUSLY whacked plans would emerge!
in Romans 13:1 "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God "

Now if the power is in the office, and Bush is in the office, then he is in the office because it is "ordained of God".
As Gamaliel said in Acts 5:35-39 "Men of Israel, take heed to yourselves what you intend to do regarding these men.....keep away from these men and let them alone; for if this plan or this work is of men, it will come to nothing; but if it is of God, you cannot overthrow it-- lest you even be found to fight against God."

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AMEN peh. We should be praying for your president. He has the toughest job in the world.

Quote "Is George W. Bush A Born Again Christian?", George W. is an adept in the Satanic Secret Society, Skull and Bones, as was his father, President George Bush, and his grandfather, Prescott Bush. Thus, George W. has strong Generational Witchcraft in his family, a dark and insidious hold."

I don't believe this for one second. Just because something is printed about someone doesn't make it true.
 

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Posted by Gramajo320 (Member # 4667) on :
 
Our government most assuredly did not plan nor execute the tragedy of Sept. 11 and for anyone to say that is just very sad! That was done by the foreign terrorists whose full identities were revealed later and their pictures were shown all over the newscasts for quite awhile!

I saw those plane crashes as they happened, I saw the burning flames, I saw the buildings collapsing, and I saw the faces of the ones who did make it out and what they looked like! I later heard what Todd Beamer said to his wife on his cell phone just before he and two other brave men fought the terrorists on their plane and forced it to crash in a field in PA the words "Let's roll!" Those three men sacrificed their lives as did others that fateful day. Over 3,000 lives were lost that fateful day in NY, Washington D.C., and PA, the passengers aboard the planes, the workers in the towers, the firemen, police officers and other people! There most certainly were full investigations! One should not say that our government was behind it because that is absolutely not true! Just because some articles are put on the internet does not mean they are true and factual and that anyone should believe they are! Discernment is needed where those articles are concerned!
 

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Posted by whitesands777 (Member # 3424) on :
 

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I'm almost certain to catch flack for this response but I am really getting tired of the Bush bashing posts. We FINALLY have a praying president and the very people who should be finding reasons to support him are instead finding reasons to out loud and loudly suspect him of all manner of evil plots and plans.

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Originally posted by whitesands777:
If I'm going to put my faith in something it's going to be God's Word and Jesus Christ...We have God's Word to be our measuring stick to determine what is right and what is wrong...Going along with everything any one man does other than Jesus can get us in trouble...Keep your eyes on Jesus, not the government for your "peace and safety".

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UPDATED INFORMATION

During the presidential campaign of 2000, George W. Bush cast great new light on his past, and current, membership of the Skull & Bones. On August 1, 2000, Republican Candidate George W. Bush was interviewed by Walter Isaacson on cnn.com. This report, posted on the CNN internet site, was entitled, "George W. Bush: "My Heritage Is Part Of Who I Am' ". The results for the Biblically discerning are shocking and definitive. Put your discernment hat on.

In the course of the interview, Isaacson asked George W. about his past Skull and Bones experience. If ever George W. had a perfect opportunity to genuinely come clean about Skull and Bones, this was the time. As we revealed in this article, above, Skull and Bones is deeply and darkly Satanic; its sister German secret society, The Thule Society, had trained Adolf Hitler into the deepest and darkest of Satanic Black Magick. If George W. were truly Born Again, this opportunity was perfect for him to repent of his past involvment and to boldly reveal the terrible Antichrist plans that Skull and Bones has been moving America toward for the past 170 years. Did George W. repent and come clean?

No! Listen:

"TIME: But you [George Sr and George W.] sure shared a lot of the same upbringing: Andover, Yale, even Skull and Bones. Did you have any qualms, say, about joining an elite secret club like Bones?

Bush: No qualms at all. I was honored. I was fairly nonchalant. I didn't view it as a great heritage thing. I didn't take it all that seriously.

TIME: Demystify it a bit for those who might think it's a cross between a Masonic Lodge and the Trilateral Commission. Did your father show up for your initiation, like your grandfather showed up for his?

Bush: Without revealing all the great secrets? I got a few of my old club mates who could demystify it right off the bat. My dad didn't tap me. Someone a year ahead of me tapped me. There was an entry celebration. I can't remember whether my dad showed up or not. I don't think so. "

What a brilliant answer! In just a few brief sentences, George W. Bush buried all the deepest, darkest facts about Skull and Bones with a nonchalant, almost flippant, answer. Instead of tasking this opportunity to really tell the truth about Skull and Bones, and repenting of it, and telling of its global Antichrist aspirations, George W. simply added his experience in this society to the general litany of the experiences that made his character and personality what it is today!

This answer absolutely screams the truth about George W. Bush and the lack of genuineness about his claim to be Born Again. Since 1776, the President of the United States is the most important single political position in the world of the Masters of the Illuminati. The occult unfinished pyramid on the back of our official One Dollar Bill, with the Eye of Horus [Lucifer] atop, tells you the truth of this fact. If anyone ever came into this office and tried to turn against the Illuminati, he would be assassinated.

We have one primary example of just one President who turned against the Illuminati once he was in office; his name was President John F. Kennedy. Consider these facts, against the backdrop that Kennedy was assassinated in
Novermber, 1963:

Spring, 1963: President Kennedy announced that he was going to withdraw American forces from the Vietnam War.

September, 1963: President Kennedy announced that he would have 1,000 "American boys" home by Christmas.

President Kennedy was planning to use the powers of his office of the presidency to fully inform the American people of the Illuminati plan to enslave us, and only weeks later, he was assassinated. However, his assassination was carried out according to the favorite number of the Illuminati, the eleven:

* Kennedy was murdered during the 11th month [November]

* Kennedy was murdered on the 22nd day [11 x 2]

* Kennedy was murdered at the 33rd parallel [11 x 3]

* Kennedy was murdered in the Masonic Dealey Plaza, the site of an old Masonic Lodge during the time of the Texas revolution designed to free Texas from Mexican control.

Kennedy was murdered with the accompanying signature of the Illuminati, just as surely as the Number 11 formed the Illuminist signature of the attack on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon on September 11, 2001.

Had George W. Bush really been Born Again, he could have taken the course Kennedy chose, to reveal the Plan of the Illuminati that has been fostered by Skull and Bones. The fact he did nothing of the kind tells the discerning Christian all he needs to know about George W. Bush. As Pastor Bob said in NEWS1539, there is nor forgiveness without repentance, and we have seen no repentance from Bush concerning Skull and Bones. No contrite heart over Skull and Bones. No sorrow over Skull and Bones.

No repentance whatsoever. Now you know the truth about George W. Bush. Are you courageous enough to see it?

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DIRECT ROOTS FROM SKULL AND BONES TO BAVARIAN ILLUMINISM

As Rosenbaum continued his research, he found strong -- even indisputable -- links between Bones and the Bavarian Illuminists. The Bavarian Illuminists were part of the original Masters of the Illuminati, established by that Satanic Jesuit Priest, Adam Weishaupt. First, Rosenbaum discovered documents which detailed the origins of Bones back to Germany. These documents stated, "Bones is a chapter of a corps of a German University..." The document described at length its relationship with this German Secret Society (the Thule Society) which lead to the founding of the Skull and Bones in 1832.

Secondly, Rosenbaum discovered that, "above the arched walls above the vault of the (Bones) sacred room, #322", is a painting of skulls surrounded by Masonic symbols.

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22And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

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To the Freemason/Bonesman, this says that he has become a god.

I’ve posted many things on this board about Freemasonry… the major point is that they worship Satan (they call him Lucifer, the angel of light). That is their god.
 

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Posted by MySavingGrace (Member # 4697) on :
 
I changed link length for you guys so post deleted.
 

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Posted by HisGrace (Member # 3438) on :
 
Psst - I read an article the other day saying that Paul was the anti-christ. Be careful folks, his whole ministry was just a cover-up by the Bible.

If I said something like that, it would make just as much sense as the garbage being printed on the web about the president.
 

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Posted by redkermit (Member # 4059) on :
 
There has been some Bush bashing done here (on this board). I'm not accusing anyone specifically, but I have seen it. I don't think we should attack anyone, no difference what party they are. I totally agree it's ok to question authority, but there is no place for personal attacks.

Now, as to whether GWB is a born-again believer? You don't know, I don't know, the writers of the articles don't know, only he and God know for sure whether GWB has truly accepted Jesus Christ as his Savior. We should ALWAYS pray for our president (all of our leaders for that matter), whether they claim to be a Christian or not, whether they are democrat, republican, independent, red or yellow, black or white, they are precious in God's sight!


 

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Posted by TEXASGRANDMA (Member # 847) on :
 
We should always pray for our President no matter who he or she is. But, on the other hand, we should be aware that just because a person says one thing in public doesn't mean they feel that way in private. Politicians by nature will do or say anything to get in office and stay in office.
Trust in God not politicans.
betty
 

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Posted by peh (Member # 4446) on :
 

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American citizens have every right to question what a man that was voted into office does that could affect the country in which we live.

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Bush has done some things that seem great, and other things baffle the mind...

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Personally it's baffling how some people agree with everything the president does because "he's republican" or just because he's the president or whatever...

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If I'm going to put my faith in something it's going to be God's Word and Jesus Christ...We have God's Word to be our measuring stick to determine what is right and what is wrong...

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Originally posted by peh:
.
"I know something" is, after all, just one iota of an inch removed from out and out gossip. "I know something you don't" even has the hiss of satanic pride in it.

Prayer for and seeking to find the best in anyone, I think most Christians would agree, is a Godly characteristic.
So why not look for reasons for what the president does, instead of automatically looking for an iniquitous motive behind it?


And, I'd like to hear from one person on here who prints negative stuff about the Bushes or other people in power positions say that God told them to print the post. I'd really like to have anyone be able to honestly tell me that.

Or better yet, the challenge could be to give me a Scripture that tells us we'd better try to have people in power removed by our (evil) "outspokenness".

Or at least a Scripture that told you you'd best warn the rest of us dummies to "watch out, the boogie man is out to get you"!

I know who has a plot against us Christians, and it isn't the politicians we need to be watchful of. Jesus said "Watch and pray", He didn't say "Watch and speak evil of dignitaries."

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This is exactly where a lot of Americans get wrong. We have rights? Who are we? What rights do we have that weren't given us by God? We have the right to call on the Lord Who put people in power. We have the right to ask that He give us wisdom to understand His choices.

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quote:

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Originally posted by yahsway:
HisGrace, In what way is Bush honoring Israel according to Gods word? Shalom

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Quote "Is George W. Bush A Born Again Christian?", George W. is an adept in the Satanic Secret Society, Skull and Bones, as was his father, President George Bush, and his grandfather, Prescott Bush. Thus, George W. has strong Generational Witchcraft in his family, a dark and insidious hold." [Eek!]

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do the skull and bones have anythign to do with masons/freemasons? I was at the bookstore yesterday and saw a section on them and one book showed the star like the pentagram of the occult witchcraft inside the compass looking symbol. I've also haerd that the masons are part of satanic worship. I was researching different people's "gods' for my own study of stuff not covered in relgion class. Baphomet is the name of it. And, the dark occult has it as the center of a pentagram 9think thats what its called, but the star in the circle)

I think the masons were part of satanic witchcraft. Though I dont agree with doing wicca, I know there's different kindas white, black, and also blood (the really bad stuff!) And, I saw too that supposedly this "god" (I think its satan) was praised/worshipped by the knights templar of the crusades. I think the knights templar may be associated with skull and bones and free masons.

I odnt know much on skull and obnes, but form what I do, unless somebody has actually cahnged their ways and no longer associates with it, how can they consider themselves Chrsitian or born again? I feel skull and bones is worhsipping themselves as idols and very satanic. I'm not sure if they do human sacrifices but I wouldnt be surprised. I saw the movie on it with Paul Walker, but that's just a movie and probably not how dark it really is.


The thing with concentration camps, I know some people say dreams as prophecies is bs but I don't. I certainly don't think I"m a prophet form God but do have prophecy at times. Last month, I had a dream (felt like in movies with "visions" due to flashes of light or lighting between scense then me waking up.) Anyways, I just remember seein a barcode or chp and then people in lines at a place to get it, then people (including me) not getting it, then some type of struggle/fight/violence/ then bein shipped off in trains in like old black and white film like the ones I've seen on the hoolocaust. I've heard about FEMA and stuff having camps I've also heard about library books we get being monitored. I bet my book purchases or wish lists are too and probably internet activity.

But, I feel that aI shouldnt stop researching the truth, cause that's what Satan and the NWO want. They'd want me to be too scared to know the truth cause of what would happen to me. But, if Martin Luther King was too scared of goin to jail (and I have a feeling he knew he'd be assassinated) what would of happened with the civili rights movement?
If people were too afraid of persectuytion and death in spreading the word of God and Jesus, would satanic occult stuff be what people where I live do? Would I have to worry about my own parents sacrificing me to satan?

I used to think even though I didnt agree on the war, I dont know what I'd do if in power. I dont know for sure if 9/11 was an inside job, but I wouldnt say its impossible. I think that it is not good to underestimate the wickedness of man. Just because I could never imagine myself or people I assoicate with doing this, that doesnt mean others don't. I mean, if almost 2,000 of our troops can die for this "hjoly war" and veterans get cuts and our health care gets cuts, what makes it impossible for 3,000 lives to just be a "cut"? To people who are so posessed by satan and darkness, one life, 3,000 lives or a million lives doesn't matter to them. It doesn't "affect" them. More and more I see similarities to Bush and Hitler. Her'es a picture of Bush doin the Nazi salute (possible its altered and also if you don't wanna see, don't clikc cause its disturbing I warn you. I also have file of him flipping the middle finger and smiling all evil (and that file is certainly not altered.)


I've heard that many things in Washington DC are satanic. Different symbols and sculptures. There's an obelisk too 9or more than one) That I know was an Egyptian thing for I think the sun God. And, there's studies of Constantine following a sun god etc.
here's info on the darkness and satanism in Washington DC (again dont click this one if you feel it may disturb or haunt you. I dont want that to anybody just showing proof.)
http://satanism.faithweb.com/

her'es stuff on illuminati:
http://www.illuminati-news.com/moriah.htm
the picture of the pentagram inside a ritualistic picture (and seeing the pentagram as a symbol under the compas for masonry yesterday) shows it is very possible that they are the same. My fiancee said too he knows that Masonry is witchcraft. And, the pyramid in back of dollar bill and all the stuff with "all seeing eye" that is very dark and occult. And, to me very disgusting to put "In God We Trust" on the same bill as the all seeing eye! If they trusted God so much, why need the eye? A friend of mine told me he thought the pyramid meant "father, son, holy spirit" but I feel its illuminati (and 13 tiers of it, just like the 13 stripes with the eagle and possibly the 13 colonies) and satanism and dark occult. Its very distrubing that it says tursitng in God while having that, but remember revlations about the mark of the beast to buy or sell? I've read somewhre that in Babylonian numerals the numerals by the pyramid are the 666. So, maybe the mark of the beast had started with the dollar bill too. And, if ther's really a pentagram supposed to be by the ocmpass, if there's 3 of them or aligned then that may be it. Or the compas, the numerals, and something else. I've heard too that washington was of the 33rd rank of masonry. 3+3=6 andmaybe there's math in that with stuff too. like how the top tier of the pyramid may be that rank, the picture of him, then something else. We do need currency to buy or sell right now.


i'm gorna post link in two parts just cut and paste beginning of line after end of last one.
http://www.the7thfire.com/new_world_order/illuminati/
secret_order_of_the_illuminati.htm
this talks about the "shadow government" in link I"ll post. And, the picture alone on top of page is very disturbing! So don't lcick it if you dont want to have that around, I don't wish harm on anyone..

There's a book called "666:illuminati" or just 666 I think that has the all seeing eye and the three sixes under the pyramid etc:
i'm posting link in 3 parts.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-

/1572580143/qid=1119122247/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/102-

7687263-5941769?v=glance&s=books


I've seen a cover of a book too with the split pyramid with all seeing eye (eye of horus) outside of the blobe almost like its a satelite or spaceship and with light shining on it (and the light form all seeing eye on bill etc makes me think of lucipher with light)


I think a neat idea maybe to do emails and letters to people to pray for bhalf of our citizens and the world, to not be "deceived" and to not get the mark and to not stop beliving in and siding with God and Jesus no matter what. And, informing people of the truth.

I feel the Middle East, particularly the holy land need our prayers as do the Jewish over there. The whole world needs prayer.

After 9/11, former pope John Paul had a day of fasting and prayer, Bush killed people. Not sure of quote or context but of a message from John Paul "No injustices from yesterday can excuse a single injustice today."

I'm not putting my stance on abortion here but there is a rapper Immortal Technique in a song where this line hits very hard "callin abortion murder in a medical buildin, but dont give a what?! about bombing iraqi children?" A life is still a life. An Iraq life weighs no less for their soul than another. They could have had a chance to find God and be saved. Now, they are dead and it cannot happen. Iraq and those places need missionaries, priests, biships, nuns, believers, choirs, bibles, and the word of God and Jesus, not more death and destruction and dispair!

And my Dad told me a goo dquote he's heard "The worst sin in the world is human suffering."


Democracy is a form of "false peace" with how we're doing it. And, our soldiers feel they are serving God and their country and are fooled. It's absolutey disgusting how the illuminati and satanic elite are claiming God to deceive people into thinking its "God's will." The Vatican even said if we invade iraq then God is not on our side.

Bus, the man of "God" cuases more death and more dispair upon our citizens. Give cuts to the rich.

I feel the patriot act and FEMA is just another way to have their version of the Gestapo. And, I see it possible for Bush to stay in power by the constituion being ratified. Even if the votes are against it, that doesnt mean it won't "win" (much like the past two "elections")

My professor of world civliziation said in a joking tone last month about Bush and the pharoah. Someone asked the difference between Imperialism and Dynasty. He said Imperialism is the conquering of others and rule and Dyunasty is the rulers and the family. And, he "joked" like the bush Dynasty. And, there was an original source about a funeral in Greece after the first year of the Pelopenician war and how at the speach, nothing was said to mourn the soldiers but how they should be so lucky and honeored to die for Greece etc. He "joked" it was like a sppech a "preident" mgiht say. My professor is also from Texas so maybe he knows more on him too. But, I also wonder if he tlaked about the Pharoah being like Bush due to satanic reasons. How the infamous pharoah felt he was a God and all that. I feel Bush views himself that way too. The Pharoah wouldnt care how many die, neither would Bush or the satanic illuminati and elite.

We need prayer for the souls of our soldiers in Iraq! (now going into Syria too, how sad.) Prayers for Isreal and Jeruselam and for Jesus's sacrifice and message to not be forgotten. Prayers for non-bleievers to find God and Jesus and know the truth. Prayers to fellow Christians to stay true to God, to not be deceived, and not cave in to the Beast and Satan. Prayers and protection to us believers from the Beast and Satan to not be deceived and lead astray. That we may know the truth but not get involved in the dark occult and satanic ways. That we may have the armor of God instead of the sword of Satan through our hearts. Our mortal life is temporary, but where our souls go is necessary. We shall win in the end and God will win. Good will win over evil. Prayers to stay strong in the ways of God and Jesus. That we be soldiers of Christ and not foes for Satan. To remember and belive that chrsit will come for us in the end and we will win. We must face whatever comes at us and not cave in. Not just for us, but for Jesus Christ and his sacrifice. He died so that we can join him in heaven and see our friends and family in heaven and live in eternal happiness and bliss. Let us not forget what he came for, how people lived before him, and how we cannot allow ourselves to turn like man did in the days of Noah. Know that the word of God, Jesus, the disciples is the ONLY word. Do not be deceived by things that "comfort" us that the end may not come or that God isnt real or Stan is the way. Satan will try and get as many as he can, but he will loose. May God shield us and protect us and we wear the blood of Christ not the blood of satan or the mark of the Beast. Prayers for everyone on this board and their friends and families. Prayers to the world and unsaved souls to find God and join us in Heaven. Prayers to those who do follow Satan and false idols to see the true way and come to God and Jesus and find contentment and truth and heaven. Thank God for his son Jesus and for creating us. And, for the disicples and others who faced persecution and death so that Christ and God may be known for us. The Lord is our shepard, we are the flock. Let us stay with him and not the wolves in sheep's clothing. Even if Hell comes upon earth that we shall fear no evil and fight for God and for Jesus. Prayers to all Amen!
 

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Posted by HisGrace (Member # 3438) on :
 

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Originally posted by SoftTouch:
MySavingGrace - Could you please DELETE that
link to the online book above? It's causing
this whole thread to scroll too far over to the
right because the link is too long. Thanks!)

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Just a reminder - I guess you didn't see this post. Thanks darlin'
 

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Posted by HisGrace (Member # 3438) on :
 
The New World Order -There is a worldwide conspiracy being orchestrated by an extremely powerful and influential group of genetically-related individuals (at least at the highest echelons) which include many of the world's wealthiest people, top political leaders, and corporate elite, as well as members of the so-called Black Nobility of Europe (dominated by the British Crown) whose goal is to create a One World (fascist) Government, stripped of nationalistic and regional boundaries, that is obedient to their agenda. Their intention is to effect complete and total control over every human being on the planet and to dramatically reduce the world's population by 5.5 Billion people.

While the name New World Order is a term frequently used today when referring to this group, it's more useful to identify the principal organizations, institutions, and individuals who make up this vast interlocking spiderweb of elite conspirators....

web page
 

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Posted by SoftTouch (Member # 2316) on :
 
Dear MySavingGrace,

even if you delete the first one I asked you too,
the last post you posted has another really long
link that will also scroll the page over...

Could you please take that one out too?
It's really hard to read this thread because
of this scrolling problem. (Please delete both
long links)

Thanks!
 

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Posted by peh (Member # 4446) on :
 
redkermit said:

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(Is) GWB...a born-again believer? You don't know, I don't know, the writers of the articles don't know, only he and God know for sure whether GWB has truly accepted Jesus Christ as his Savior.

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Just wanted to give a kudo to you, redkermit, for this reminder.
 

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Posted by SoftTouch (Member # 2316) on :
 
"Ye shall know them by their fruits"
 

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Posted by SoftTouch (Member # 2316) on :
 
Are these things a Born Again person says? Is this Good Fruit? We are told to look at the Fruit... (The source document is a newsletter, so I'm unable to give a link)


"When a reporter asked Bush if the God of Islam was the same as the God of Christianity, he replied: "I believe we worship the same God.""

"Bush repudiated the Christian faith on Good Morning America when Charles Gibson asked: “Do Christians and non-Christians and Muslims go to heaven in your mind?” The President replied: “Yes, they do. We have different routes of getting there.”"

"Bush also showed his Universalism in Houston when he said: “I don’t talk about a particular faith. I believe the Lord can work through many faiths, whether it be the Christian faith, the Jewish faith, Muslim faith, Hindu faith. When I speak of faith, I speak of all faiths, because there is a universal call, and that main universal call is to love your neighbor. It extends throughout all faith.”"

"Bush blasphemed God when he said at the Islamic Center of Washington that the “Koran is God’s word.”"

"President Bush honored the obscene rocker Ozzy Osbourne at the White House, (May 4, 2002) when he said: "The thing about Ozzy is he's made a lot of big hit recordings-Party With the Animals, Sabbath Bloody Sabbath, Face in Hell, Black Skies, and Bloodbath in Paradise. Ozzy, Mom loves your stuff.""

"Bush has continued the pro-homosexual policies of Bill Clinton, in making a moral wrong, a legal right, but it only transfers labels. Then he appointed an openly homosexual ambassador to Romania who had his lover move in with him in the official residence. How can such appointments be justified by his faith in Christ? Bush even supported homosexual civil unions and other pro-homosexual positions. But it gets worse. He also appointed Scott Evertz, a homosexual to be director of the White House Office of National AIDS Policy; then promoted him to a more lofty position, replacing him with another homosexual! No Christian could justify such actions."

"Bush's use of vulgar language cannot be tolerated. According to Time (3-23-03) he told three U.S. Senators (and then National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice), “F*** Saddam. We’re taking him out!” Before his election, Bush called the Wall Street Journal’s Al Hunt a "f****** son of a b****" in a Dallas restaurant in the presence of his wife and 4-year old son! The President also said (into a live microphone) that New York Times reporter Adam Clymer was a "major-league a** hole." Evidently Mr. Bush, doesn’t know that Christians don't talk that way and even non-Christian gentlemen don’t talk that way in the presence of ladies."

"Mrs. Bush, is not totally innocent either after her shameful performance at the correspondence dinner. It was bad enough that she gave credibility to the vile television show, Desperate Housewives, but she waded deep in the sewer with her “joke” about her husband masturbating a male horse while trying to “milk” it. (New York Times, 5-3-05.)

Furthermore, the sight of President Bush laughing so hard at her lewd jokes told us that his heart was not troubled by these gay jokes coming from his wife. Several days later, Mr. Bush joked with Russia's President Putin about the whole affair. President Bush was not disturbed in the least little bit by Laura's comments."

And lets not forget how he's selling out Israel!


If you'd like photographic evidence... I know where to find a picture of Mr. Bush flipping 'the bird' to a photographer as well... but I don't want to go there. I would think this should be enough.

I Voted for this man because he said he was a Born Again Christian... I'm Not seeing it!
 

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Posted by TEXASGRANDMA (Member # 847) on :
 
It is funny how people did not mind judging Senator Kerry, but now we should not judge President Bush.
 

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Posted by whitesands777 (Member # 3424) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by TEXASGRANDMA:
It is funny how people did not mind judging Senator Kerry, but now we should not judge President Bush.

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Very good point....
 

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Posted by Gramajo320 (Member # 4667) on :
 
I agree with your posting, Texas Grandma.
 

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Posted by redkermit (Member # 4059) on :
 
I never "judged" Senator Kerry. And I would not approve of anyone else judging him. I did not vote for Bush because he claimed to be a born again Christian, I voted for him because his platform claimed to support the majority of the issues I agree with. What would happen if no candidates openly professed to be a Christian, would you just not vote?

quote:

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Are these things a Born Again person says? Is this Good Fruit? We are told to look at the Fruit...

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In the time I've been on this board, I've seen some pretty amazing things said by people who claim to be Christians.
 

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Posted by bygrace (Member # 4556) on :
 
Redkermit writes:
In the time I've been on this board, I've seen some pretty amazing things said by people who claim to be Christians.


Isn't this the truth!
 

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Posted by hardcore (Member # 4492) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by TEXASGRANDMA:
It is funny how people did not mind judging Senator Kerry, but now we should not judge President Bush.

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Hey TG and all ...

Just a reminder:

Judging what someone says or does is not the same as judging the person's heart.

I do not judge Bush's heart at all, but I can discern what comes out of his mouth and see how it lines up with scripture.

If he is indeed saved (and I certainly pray that he is), then he is at best seriously confused about the book he claims belief in.
 

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Posted by MySavingGrace (Member # 4697) on :
 
to me his involvement with the skull and bones is the biggest problem i have with him. unelss hes no longer in it, I can't consider him truly saved.

He may in his mind be doing what's right. That doesn't mean its not satan fooling him either
 

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Posted by HisGrace (Member # 3438) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by MySavingGrace:
to me his involvement with the skull and bones is the biggest problem i have with him. unelss hes no longer in it, I can't consider him truly saved.
He may in his mind be doing what's right. That doesn't mean its not satan fooling him either

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For goodness sake, please don't believe everything you hear or read.
 

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Posted by hardcore (Member # 4492) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by HisGrace:

quote:

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Originally posted by MySavingGrace:
to me his involvement with the skull and bones is the biggest problem i have with him. unelss hes no longer in it, I can't consider him truly saved.
He may in his mind be doing what's right. That doesn't mean its not satan fooling him either

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For goodness sake, please don't believe everything you hear or read.

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I believe the President is on record confirming his memership in the Skull and Bones. Not everything you hear and read is untrue either.

It seems as if you think many are going too far in one direction, but it also appears that you go too far in the other.
 

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Posted by HisGrace (Member # 3438) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by hardcore:
It seems as if you think many are going too far in one direction, but it also appears that you go too far in the other.

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Things are starting to heat up to a personal level, so it is time that I left this thread.
 

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Posted by helpforhomeschoolers (Member # 15) on :
 
I do not have the ability to judge if Bush is a born again Christian. I certainly do have the ability to judge the things he says and does if they be of God or not or if they line up with scripture.

I can tell you that they do not!

Bush says he is a born again Christian and until he says otherwise I can only judge that if he is a Born again Christian, he is a deceived born again Christian or a sinful one but I cannot and should not judge his salvation!

I can tell you that if he is a born again Christian God will deal with him and bring him to where he needs to be or God will take him out of this world that he not blaspheme the Gospel.

If he is not then God will give him long enough to show the full scope of his iniquity.

Either way it is not for me to judge whether he is a born again christian, but to judge his words and actions whether they be sin or not.

I can tell you that based on the criteria that has been written here, some of you would have judged me not to be a born again Christian 10 years ago. I was though and that is exactly why God dealt with me as a son.

I have been deceived; there was a day when I argued with my own husband that God if he wanted to could and would speak to me through a tarrot card!

There was a day when I would have argued adimantly for the right of a women to have an abortion.

There was a day when I would have argued that the Dali Lama was a man of God.

I have sat in the middle of a native american sweat logde and chanted in Lakota to what I thought was God - the great spirit Wakan Tanka.

Satan comes as an angel of light!!!!

There was a day when I thought Napolean Hill taught something of God and not something of witchcraft.

There was a day when I would have argued that Norman Vincent Peale was a teacher of Godly principles.

The devil can and does deceive Christians. But not forever if they are Christians. The devil can and does get Christian people to do his work. Ever have a fight with your husband and say ugly things? Ever get so mad or hurt that you hated? Whose work do you think you were doing in those times?

As long as a man has life in his body you do not know whether or not God will bring him to repentance.

This does not mean that we do not judge the actions and words that we see; we do! We are commanded to do so. We can say any day that those actions and those words are not of God because we have the Scripture to show us what is of God, but we cannot judge that a man be saved or not saved before God himself has declared it. How do you know that tomorrow George W. Bush will not fall on his knees, repent of his error and become a witness for Christ? I tell you I do not know this.... but I pray for it!
And I will continue to do so until God tells me to stop. And I thank God every day that there was someone praying for me all the days that I walked in wickedness. Jesus was praying for me. Until Jesus tells me that he is not praying for Bush to repent and return to God, then I will not say if Bush will ascend or decend, because to do so is to bring also Christ down.

Yes, we can see the apostsy. I do see the apostasy in so many. but there is a line between saying someone is not speaking or doing what a Christian should be speaking and doing and saying that a Christian would not. Christians would do a lot of things if a christian were deceived.

A Christian SHOULD not say some of the things that Bush as said. A Christian SHOULD not do some of the things that Bush has done. That is all I can know about Bush.
 

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Posted by hardcore (Member # 4492) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by HisGrace:

quote:

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Originally posted by hardcore:
It seems as if you think many are going too far in one direction, but it also appears that you go too far in the other.

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Things are starting to heat up to a personal level, so it is time that I left this thread.

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My apologies HisGrace. I did not intend a personal assualt on you.

My intended point:
There are posters here who seem to go to one extreme or the other regarding certain types of articles.

To me, those who do not accept any of them as truth are just as extreme as those who accept all them blindly.

I should have "spoken" in more general terms.

Please forgive. No offense intended.
 

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Posted by HisGrace (Member # 3438) on :
 
All is forgiven hardcore
 

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Posted by Elisheba (Member # 4801) on :
 
Hi,

I'm new, and I have a lot of reading to do to catch up.

Just because President Bush 'says' he prays and is Christian doesn't make it true. It seems most politicians will say what they believe will garner them the most votes.

In regards to the Masons, Illuminati, etc., I've seen lots of information that says that the upper levels of these organizations are indeed satanic, along with the Catholic cult Opus Dei.

The lower levels are usually great people, hardworking, kind, very generous and giving of their time and money to help needy children and other valid causes.

But according to some sources, the upper levels control all the banking and finances of the world.

As someone already said, you can't believe everything you read. There are lots of websites that dispute this.

~Elisheba (cool emoticons)
 

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Posted by SoftTouch (Member # 2316) on :
 
Hi Elisheba and Welcome to the BBS!!!

It seems you've done some research yourself on these matters?

Please understand that I'm not trying to 'debate' or 'discredit' anything you've said. I just wanted to make the following points:

It is very true, there are lots of websties that do dispute the things regarding the Illumanti, Freemasonry bing Satanic at the higher levels, etc... However, There are So Many people who have come out of these organizations and are giving testimony of what they have witnessed and participated in that it's very hard to dispute this. I have seen video and DVD presentations where ex-members of Freemasonry have given accounts of their 'rituals' and then another testimony was given by someone who came out of 'witchcraft' and gave Identical accounts on the rituals they had to go through. They are the same. It's very hard to dispute so many first hand accounts (but people still try).

The amount of information out there and the witnesses testimonies says that these things are real... even if we don't want to believe it.

And you're absolutely right that most people in the lower degrees of Freemasonry have No Idea of what it's truly about. They are kept in the dark about the 'degree' that's above them on purpose. These are mostly good hearted and well meaning people, and if they knew what it was really about, then I'm certain they wouldn't be involved in it.
 

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Posted by Elisheba (Member # 4801) on :
 
Hi SoftTouch,

Yes, I've done lots of research, and to avoid offending anyone I tried to keep my opinion fairly neutral sounding.

However, I tend to believe as you do.

One person whose testimony comes to mind is Robert Hansson.

I allowed myself to be led astray a several years ago and actually practiced witchcraft, beginning with wicca and working my way into the darker stuff. The rituals that people in the upper levels of these organizations take part in are basically the same.

Witches call what they do an 'earth based religion', satanists call it what it is. That's the only difference I've seen. I'll post my testimony soon.

~Elisheba
 

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Posted by SoftTouch (Member # 2316) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Elisheba:
I allowed myself to be led astray a several years ago and actually practiced witchcraft, beginning with wicca and working my way into the darker stuff. The rituals that people in the upper levels of these organizations take part in are basically the same.

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PRAISE GOD Your Eyes Were Opened and you Repented!!!! Are you Trusting Only in the Lord Jesus Christ for your Salvation now? (I'm guessing yes, since you're here )

(I may not be able to reply back for a while... my computer died and I'm using my husbands - which I can't access very often)
 

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Posted by MySavingGrace (Member # 4697) on :
 
did masonry come from the knights templar and was the knights templar corrupt?

ive heard they worshipped basphomet (i think he's satan.) Also, at Barnes and Noble last week I saw a book on masron iwth a pentagram (withcraft) symbol under the compass. the all seeing eye seems very satanic and witchcaft to me.


and is skull and bones society in masonry?

and were/are most of our presidents and our founding fathers masons?

i wish i didnt loose my links cause my bokmarks got taken away when my browser messed up. But, theres stuff on illuminati and masonry. There's something on satanic stuff in Washington Dc. They have a big obelisk (think its washington monument) too.

I wouldnt be surprised if some of the corrupt masons do voodoo and black and blood magic upon people and try to control them that way.
 

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Posted by Elisheba (Member # 4801) on :
 
I put an address for a lot of information someone gathered in the "Christian Advertisement" section. I thought that's where it belonged.

I've got to go somewhere, but I'll be back.

I have lots of other things to talk about other than the end times things,

~Elisheba~
 

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