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Topic: Better one with God than a thousand without Him.
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Eden
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posted
From Mark E: Yeah Eden, I'm amazed too! but who am I to argue about it! Where there's life, there's hope... I guess
From Eden: I guess reveals that you don’t know the redemption that is in Jesus Christ. I don’t have to guess anymore.
from Mark E: "I believe this is the problem. Although it is good to help out those in need, humility is needed in order to give God the glory in life. You see, you must be humble to deny yourself and follow Christ Jesus, giving God all the credit for your good works."
This is a sad thing I have to relate to you. You must have never felt God smile. I'm not separated from God child. God's glory is my glory. Say what you will. Who feels it knows it. I don't know how else to tell you. I've been picked up off of death's door step. I've been through things you couldn't imagine. The spirit lives with me and calls me son. You laugh away if you will. I'm no joke. I've been adopted by the spirit on account of my betrayal by this stinging ugly world. I wouldn't expect you to believe me. I just ask for due respect, and that's all. I do appreciate the point by point criticism. Thanks for hearing my request.
from Eden: Mark, unless you have accepted Jesus’s sacrifice on the cross on behalf of all of ur sins, you are yet in (responsible for) ur sins. Mark, the language you use in your paragraphs above are Lucifer’s attempt at Jesus-like holiness. Like Islam, always a B-version of the LORD’s A-version.
from Mark E: I believe this is the problem. Although it is good to help out those in need, humility is needed in order to give God the glory in life. You see, you must be humble to deny yourself and follow Christ Jesus, giving God all the credit for your good works.
from Eden: that sounds good, doesn’t it? “give God all the credit for your good works.” But nowhere has Mark E. mentioned the sacrifice of Jesus for his sins yet; and that is crucial; anyone who does not accept Jesus’s sacrifice on the cross is yet in their sins.
from Mark E: This is dead wrong in my experience. In truth it is Satan who would have you deny yourself. God's glory IS his children whom he loves. God smiles on me and I feel it. Sometimes it's a thought that triggers the smile, and sometimes it's a word to another. These are tender encouragements. It's not all a bed of roses though. God can be tough on me as well. Love is not all about affection. It's more about need. It's a difficult path at times.
from Eden: Mark, I feel you, brother. Love is not always about affection. The Bible says, “God is Love”, referring to the God of Israel is Love. Mark, are you referring to the God of Israel is love, or are you just generally saying, god is love?
from Mark E: I believe that people should pray for those people who need help and are suffering in life, no matter where they are. And I believe that it is possible to balance prayer to God with praise to God.
from Eden: Yes, I believe that it is possible to balance prayer to God with praise to God. Dear brother Mark E., would you be so kind as to tell me who your God is? (I realize that you are deregistered.)
from Mark E. Yeah I know what too many believe!
from Eden: Well, the Bible declares that “only few will find the way to eternal life”? When you therefore say, “too many believe”, you reveal your New Ageness.
from Mark E. They put their hands together in the parlors, and we're undermanned in the trenches! Try reaching out with those hands. Those hands do God's work. Do you think so little of God that he needs you to ask for him to help his beloved children?
from Eden: Mark said: Do you think so little of God that he needs you to ask for him to help his beloved children?
from Eden: think so little of God? That’s how Satan would talk. I think so much of God that I would ask Him to help his children on earth.
From Mark E: I heard the call, and now I've gotten it under way! Come on down from man-made-heaven to the trenches here in man-made hell.
from Eden: from Mark E: Come on down from man-made-heaven to the trenches here in man-made hell.
from Eden: Didn’t I tell you?
from Mark E: I believe this is where you might be mistaken. Just because someone claims to be a Christian, does not mean they actually are Christian.
from Eden: that’s where the Devil’s BS comes in. Let me tell you, devil, I am a Christian, not because of what I have done or accomplished, but because of the finished work of Jesus Christ on the suffering cross; and don’t you ever forget that.
from Mark E: If you are a Christian, you shouldn’t have to tell anyone, they would already know by what you do, you would poke out like a sore thumb.
from Eden: A sinner saved by grace does not necessarily stick out like a sore thumb. And let me remind you, devil, no Christian ever sticks out like a “sore” thumb, but like an “okay” thumb.
In summary, Mark E., you do not talk like a bornagain Christian.
Eden
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Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
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posted
Amen Dale!!!
There is ONLY ONE foundation of true faith, and that is the Lord Jesus Christ:
1 Cor. 3:
10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
The Word of God is the Barometer of Truth for the Believer:
2 Tim. 3:
13: But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
14: But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15: And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Anyone who rejects the Lord Jesus Christ has as their foundation of faith shifting sand, that which is arbitrary to their flawed and limited perspective. Place your faith and trust in the Lord Jesus Christ, the Rock of our salvation. In Christ one will not be moved by life's storms which buffet.
Every man has a perspective which is filtered through experiences, bias, prejudice, desires and agendas. The Word of God reveals that which is absolute Truth.
If ANY WITNESS rejects the Lord Jesus Christ, rejects the Word of God, then that is a false witness and their testimony without credibility for the Believer, for faith and instruction.
Matt. 7:
24: Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
25: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
26: And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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becauseHElives
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Member # 87
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posted
Mark Elbing
quote:
"A false witness is one who reports that he has seen what he has not actually seen.
That is not what Yeshua declared to be the truth.
The Age of the Blessed Ones
We missed out, didn't we? Wouldn't you like to have been there when the followers of Jesus discovered the empty tomb? Wouldn't you like to have been there when the risen Lord appeared to his followers and spoke with them?
Seriously now, can you imagine seeing Jesus? Seeing him alive after seeing him crucified a few days before? We missed out, didn't we?
Maybe not . . .
Imagine that you were a follower of Christ at the time of his death and resurrection. Not one of the 12 disciples, but a member of the wider group of followers of Jesus. Some of the other followers of Jesus come to you excitedly telling you that Jesus has been raised from the dead and that he is with some of his followers in a house on Moses Street. So you go running toward the house to see him. On the way, you encounter another follower of Jesus who says, "Have you heard, Jesus is alive!"
You say, "Yeah, I'm on my way to see him now. He's in the house on Moses Street, right?"
"Yeah, that's right. Hey, do you know what he just told Thomas?"
"No, what?"
"He said that those who don't see him and yet believe that he is alive are blessed."
"What?"
"Yeah, you know how Thomas said that he wouldn't believe the Lord was alive unless he touched Jesus' scars."
"Yeah, I know."
"Well, when Jesus appeared to him, he invited Thomas to touch his scars, and, of course, Thomas believed when he saw Jesus. So just a little while ago, Jesus said to him, `Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed' (John 20:29, TNIV).' Jesus says that those who don't see him and yet believe are blessed."
Now what are you going to do? You hear that the risen Lord is at the house on Moses Street. You love him and you really want to see him. But the word on the street is that those who don't see him and yet believe are blessed. Will you head on over to Moses Street and see him? Or will you take this report to heart and believe without seeing thus entering a class that Jesus pronounced as blessed?
In John 20:24-29, we read that Thomas, one of the Twelve, was not with the rest of the disciples when the risen Jesus appeared to them earlier, so Thomas did not see the risen Jesus. The other disciples went and told him, "We have seen the Lord!"
Thomas didn't believe them. He said, "Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe" (v. 25, TNIV).
Thomas gets a bad rap. What's his nickname? "Doubting Thomas." But all of the disciples were doubters. Thomas wanted to see Jesus' scars, and he would get that chance. But, in the passage just before this, Jesus showed his scars to the rest of the disciples. Why did he do that? Probably because the rest of the disciples were having trouble believing too.
In Luke 24, some women were the first to see the risen Jesus and they went back to tell the disciples. How did they take the news? The passage says, "They did not believe the women, because their words seemed to them like nonsense" (Luke 24:11, TNIV).
Thomas was a doubter, but so were the rest of the disciples. So don't be so hard on him.
Anyway, Thomas heard the report of the risen Lord, but he refused to believe unless he got to see him and touch his scars. Well, a week later the disciples were in a house together again, and Thomas was with them this time. The doors were locked, but still Jesus came and stood among them. He spoke to Thomas, saying, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe" (v. 27).
Thomas got it then. The passage does not say that he actually touched Jesus' scars. Seeing may have been enough for him. At any rate, he said to Jesus, "My Lord and my God!"
Then Jesus said to Thomas, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." (v. 29, TNIV)
The disciples who actually saw the risen Lord enjoyed an advantage over us. It is a lot easier to believe something when you see it and experience it. One day we, like them, will see the risen Lord. But the moments of those days right after the discovery of the empty tomb and when the risen Jesus appeared to his followers are gone forever. That handful of followers of Jesus experienced firsthand that watershed moment in the history of humanity, and we never can.
But we can and do experience something that those followers of Jesus back then can never, ever experience. We believe in the crucified and risen Jesus even though we have never seen him. Because of this, according to Jesus, we belong to class of believers that is blessed.
Those early disciples who saw the risen Lord were blessed in ways that we never can be. But Jesus made a point of telling those disciples who did see him that we who did not see him are blessed.
I'm not trying to put us in a competition of blessedness with the followers of Jesus who saw him after his resurrection. For God's plan to unfold as it has someone had to see him alive. But we should not miss the fact that we do not belong to a class of believers that is somehow a notch below those who were there with the risen Lord and saw him and heard him. No, we belong to a class that those disciples never belonged to. A class that Jesus himself declared blessed.
How is it that we who believe even though we have not seen are blessed? I can't tell you exactly. I'm not talking about a comparison of the relative blessings of those who believe and those who do not. This passage sets up a dynamic between the blessings of two different groups of the followers of Jesus.
We can see in this passage and others that the disciples, like Thomas, who saw the risen Lord were certainly blessed in their seeing. But, compared to their experience of seeing the risen Lord, how can we who have not seen and yet have believed be considered blessed?
The answer is, I don't know. Not exactly. Some days I think it sure would be nice to see and talk to Jesus--face-to-face. But on other days I get hints of the glories of the age in which we live. An age that is uniquely our own. An age that God set up as the precursor to the glorious culmination of the kingdom.
Isn't it interesting that God did not choose the time when the risen Messiah was seeable as the age to precede the culmination of the kingdom? No, God chose our age. God chose the age of those who believe even though we have not seen to be the last one before the culmination of the kingdom.
God must think a lot of us, my friends. Yeah, I don't why either, but it is nonetheless obvious. There appears to be a lot to the blessed status that Jesus describes in this passage.
I don't claim to understand all of this. But there are moments when I realize that something really glorious--really blessed--is taking place right now. Something that God's people of yore cannot be a part of. Oh, they had their own ages with their own importance in God's plan. But there is a blessedness about our age of discipleship that we must not overlook.
1 Peter 1 contains some lines that explore the glories of our relationship with the Lord. In verses 8-9 we hear something of an echo of Jesus' words to Thomas: "Though you have not seen him, you love him; and even though you do not see him now, you believe in him and are filled with an inexpressible and glorious joy, for you are receiving the end result of your faith, the salvation of your souls" (TNIV).
Before those lines and after those lines the passage describes further the wonders of a relationship with the Lord enjoyed by those who have not seen and yet believe. Then there is this amazing thought at the end of verse 12 of that passage: "Even angels long to look into these things" (TNIV).
The glorious angels of heaven long to look into the relationship with the Lord that we have now. The angels, who get to be in the presence of the bright glories of God in heaven, yearn for just a tiny peek into our relationship with the Lord--we who have not seen and yet believe.
Imagine having something the angels can't have, yet they long for. Apparently we do.
Most of you have heard of the parable of the frog in the kettle. The story goes that, if you put a frog in a kettle of water and heat it up very, very slowly, the frog will stay there until it finds itself in deadly, boiling water and dies. The parable is meant to show how we can slowly adjust to very unhealthy and even dangerous environments.
Certainly there is a lot of truth to that parable and we should heed its warning. But the words of Jesus to Thomas expose a flipside to the parable of the frog in the kettle. The followers of Jesus in this age are in a far more blessed environment than we often seem to realize.
There is a tendency on the part of many of the followers of Jesus to be down on our times. Certainly there is plenty of ugliness and evil about our times. Yet none of this changes the fact that we live in the age of some who are declared blessed by Jesus. The Messiah's blessed ones are living and working and blessing in the world right now, and we are the Messiah's blessed ones. Let us live like we believe we are blessed.
Remember my scenario earlier about a believer who was faced with the choice of seeing the risen Lord or being one of the blessed ones who did not see and yet believed? Well, we don't have that choice. We can't decide between seeing the risen Jesus and not seeing the risen Jesus today.
But, we can choose to believe what Jesus said. We can choose to believe that we who have not seen and yet believe are blessed. Then we can live like we believe we are blessed . . . or not.
Mark, are you a mason?
This is another fine example of the “HEGELIAN DIALECTIC”, Mark did not in any way respond to the actual post. His comments were only cut and divide tactics. Pure Hegellian.
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002
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Mark Elbing
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A new student approached the master and asked how he should prepare himself for his training. "Think of me a bell," the master explained. "Give me a soft tap, and you will get a tiny ping. Strike hard, and you'll receive a loud, resounding peal."
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Mark Elbing
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Yeah Eden, I'm amazed too! but who am I to argue about it! Where there's life, there's hope... I guess ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
"I believe this is the problem. Although it is good to help out those in need, humility is needed in order to give God the glory in life. You see, you must be humble to deny yourself and follow Christ Jesus, giving God all the credit for your good works."
This is a sad thing I have to relate to you. You must have never felt God smile. I'm not separated from God child. God's glory is my glory. Say what you will. Who feels it knows it. I don't know how else to tell you. I've been picked up off of death's door step. I've been through things you couldn't imagine. The spirit lives with me and calls me son. You laugh away if you will. I'm no joke. I've been adopted by the spirit on account of my betrayal by this stinging ugly world. I wouldn't expect you to believe me. I just ask for due respect, and that's all. I do appreciate the point by point criticism. Thanks for hearing my request.
"I believe this is the problem. Although it is good to help out those in need, humility is needed in order to give God the glory in life. You see, you must be humble to deny yourself and follow Christ Jesus, giving God all the credit for your good works."
This is dead wrong in my experience. In truth it is Satan who would have you deny yourself. God's glory IS his children whom he loves. God smiles on me and I feel it. Sometimes it's a thought that triggers the smile, and sometimes it's a word to another. These are tender encouragements. It's not all a bed of roses though. God can be tough on me as well. Love is not all about affection. It's more about need. It's a difficult path at times.
"I believe that people should pray for those people who need help and are suffering in life, no matter where they are. And I believe that it is possible to balance prayer to God with praise to God."
Yeah I know what too many believe! They put their hands together in the parlors, and we're undermanned in the trenches! Try reaching out with those hands. Those hands do God's work. Do you think so little of God that he needs you to ask for him to help his beloved children? I heard the call, and now I've gotten it under way! Come on down from man-made-heaven to the trenches here in man-made hell. God doesn't need your fantasies of the value of your prayers. He needs your physical help with his beloved children. It's not God's will they suffer. It's those misunderstandings such as the value of parlor prayers that's killing us. There's worse than that. Poverty is planned. I'll say no more. Help is not a word or a thought or a prayer. A prayer to me is a way, not a mental condition!
"I believe this is where you might be mistaken. Just because someone claims to be a Christian, does not mean they actually are Christian. If you are a Christian, you shouldn’t have to tell anyone, they would already know by what you do, you would poke out like a sore thumb. People could see you from a mile away, because of the light shining brightly within; not by some gaudy pendant or necklace with a Christian symbol on it. I encourage you to pray and read the bible and allow God to explain to you what a Christian is. That way, you will be able to understand."
Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, I've heard it all before and it's meaningless. There were good Nazi's too I've heard. The point is, I wouldn't associate myself with a name so besmutted with the blood of children. I understand that to some Christianity is some 'pie in the sky' standard unkept in this world in any significant fashion. You tell me it's not Christians who have done this to the name. Well, they sure got away with it. Reality can not be denied. Christians have spilled more blood than any other horde on Earth to date. What a distinction! If I believed in Christ then I might revert to another title such as: 'follower of the teachings of the 'Lord' Jesus Christ'.
"You are right, Drew knows you not, and you know Drew not. So how can you make such accusations against this man? How has he been working iniquity against your name? How do you know his intentions? Please explain yourself, sir."
Here we go then.
"It is ALL about Jesus and He is the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE.
ANY witness who denies the Lord Jesus Christ is a false witness."
I neither confirm nor deny what I have not witnessed with these eyes. I'm an honest witness and not a false witness. You go ahead and take people's word and call it faith. I've learned not to trust people. There are way to many liars with power motives for me to do that. As I tell you, I live with the spirit and the spirit remains unnamed and that's acceptable and makes sense to me when I see all the needless violence arising over clashes assembled by those who would utilize religious bigotry among other things for promoting wars for whatever purpose.
I don't say I know his intentions, nor are his intentions relevant. What is relevant is what he said without knowing. I know my own way. Leave me to judge it.
I had quoted:
"A false witness is one who reports that he has seen what he has not actually seen.
Take the simple example of a man who reports an event that he did not witness. He reports it as if he has certain knowledge of what he did not see. He reports what another testifies to without having actually seen with his own eyes! Not only is the man a false witness. He is a gossip repeating heresay. He is also a liar!
Let's not play games with the truth. If you find fault in what I have witnessed then please address this specifically as I am not prideful, rather I am open to correction. Please refrain from heresay as evidence and show me who you are by reporting only what is within the realm of your own understanding"
to which Drew responded:
"Wind without substance, wells without water. Testimony of nothing but seeking to validate the one who witnesses.
The Word of God is Truth and those who reject Christ Jesus our Lord, God manifest in the flesh are false witnesses."
I didn't live in those times. I have nothing to prove. I neither confirm nor deny what other's have witnessed. I myself will make my stand on honesty. If honesty isn't good enough then Bye bye me!
That's not going to win over a truth seeker. Is Drew preaching to the choir? I'm really sad about the whole thing but I have a responsibility to be honest about this. I want and need Drew. I'm not going to let him slide by with that kind of rubbish.
I don't want to belabor the point any further. I have outstanding vision. I'm quick to turn when you reach me. That's not happening. Drew needs to refine his approach. You're doing pretty good for a Christian! Make it real, this is a real world. The truth is my guide. I earned my eyes by walking. Drew keeps taking the whole thing off track by revealilng his belief that I'm some kind of praise seeker attempting to earn my redemption. He doesn't understand. I'm fighting for MY LIFE, OUR LIFE. I FEEL this connection to everyone rationally. I know my fate depends on OUR fate. We're bound regardless of what we think or if we're more or less good. That's the way this world is. We have one ship. If the ship sinks, well I guess that's it for this. I firmly believe that this life is precious despite my lack of satisfaction with OUR circumstances. I strive to do my part to turn the world around. It's not about anyone's credit. That repeated accusation offends me admittedly! It's about staying alive long enough to see the changes that would indicate that we're moving in the direction of victory. That's not at all the case.
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Eden
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Better one with God than a thousand without Him.
Yes and when I think about how the scripture says that "only few will find Him", then I marvel that I'm being allowed to participate.
Eden
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Itty-Bitty Girl
Advanced Member
Member # 4579
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quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
What we on the righteous path attempt to do is serve all God's children. This is at times a heartbreaking and heavily taxing burden. There are moments of spiritual reward, but it's right back to the friction of the day. How am I being crucified? I'm on the front lines in the trenchs battling for my life and others. I'm here to share my experiences, not to be treated like Satan. Maybe that's who I am to some here. I don't know.
Dear friend. You sir, are not the enemy. We are not here to fight you. We love you. And I certainly do respect your quest for truth.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
Drew has a bad habit of testifying for others in terms of why they do things, talking about glory and such folly. Glory is for the damned. We don't have time for that silly stuff here in my postiton.
When I say, “give God the glory in life,” What I mean is: Give God the credit for all the good works you do in life. And when I say “Jesus will come in all of His glory,” What I mean is, Jesus will come back in all of His splendor, magnificence, majesty. I do not think that your meaning of glory is the same as the ones I mentioned, and I believe that is why you feel this way. I believe that all of this is just a great big misunderstanding.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
Humility isn't something you need to learn here among the desperately needy. Humility is the only thing. Glory for me is feeling the love of the desperate as you reach out to them with what they need again and again. The spirit shares in the Glory. Yes it's my Glory. And it's all of our Glory. We all rise together.
I believe this is the problem. Although it is good to help out those in need, humility is needed in order to give God the glory in life. You see, you must be humble to deny yourself and follow Christ Jesus, giving God all the credit for your good works.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
I mean to debunk the nonsense of the Pseudo-Christian Rappers who don't know. Who FEELS it KNOWS it and that's all there is to it. Too many people out there love to sit in their parlors praising the NAME, while nearly a billion children world-wide according to witnesses are suffering severe malnutrition. That all quite unneccessary. It's a matter of priorities not a failure of technology.
I believe that people should pray for those people who need help and are suffering in life, no matter where they are. And I believe that it is possible to balance prayer to God with praise to God.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
We can send zillion dollars to Mars to collect dust, but we dump excess grain in the sea rather than deliver it to those in need. Remember that nearlyl every elected official in USA is a christian. And you wonder why a front line soldier of the truth is a bit taken aback by the arrogance of some who talk without knowing?
I believe this is where you might be mistaken. Just because someone claims to be a Christian, does not mean they actually are Christian. If you are a Christian, you shouldn’t have to tell anyone, they would already know by what you do, you would poke out like a sore thumb. People could see you from a mile away, because of the light shining brightly within; not by some gaudy pendant or necklace with a Christian symbol on it. I encourage you to pray and read the bible and allow God to explain to you what a Christian is. That way, you will be able to understand.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
With respect to pride: I said, Drew's been working iniquity against my name to achieve vanity. It's on the boards. If you are the big tree, let me tell you that we are the small axe, sharp and ready to cut you down (well sharp). No weak out shall prosper. And whosoever diggeth a pit shall fall in it. Rather than answer my questions he treats me like a fool. He knows me not.
You are right, Drew knows you not, and you know Drew not. So how can you make such accusations against this man? How has he been working iniquity against your name? How do you know his intentions? Please explain yourself, sir.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
I am a witness, and these are the things that I have seen with these eyes which are my own. I share the visions of my eyes with you as a warning to hypocrites and others. Doubt me! You have eyes to see, let them see. You have ears to hear, let them hear. I refuse to take the blame for your misinterpretations. I have nothing to prove. If you observe a fault in my observations, please teach me. Let the TRUTH be our guide. In our confessed ignorance let doubt bind us in the seeking.
Yeah, you know what? It has been hard for me to comprehend some of the things that you say, I must admit. I even hope that I have not even misinterpreted one word of your reply.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
I humble myself to him ready for a give and take learning experience and I don't receive back due respect for what it's worth.
Can you show how you were disrespected by Drew?
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
This is to be a debate forum concerned with false teachings as posted, rather than a bible reprint forum. It's insulting to the spirit of the boards to have questions gone unanswered and bible excerpts reprinted again and again as if I hadn't read it the many times before.
Scriptures are often repeated for those who read, but do not understand. Maybe it would help if you had asked for an interpretation of the verse repeated. Your question may have just been answered with scripture.
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Elbing:
Speak to me as a human being whigh I am, and one with whom the spirit is well pleased. I'm not here to prove anything and I don't enjoy being insulted with a certain sort of silence. It pains me to be here at times but I do it for us all. I do answer questions as best I can and so too do I like my questions answered. I like criticism, that helps me to grow, however, please make your criticisms specific so I can understand them.
Very well then, sir, I have done the best that I could do.
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Mark Elbing
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What we on the righteous path attempt to do is serve all God's children. This is at times a heartbreaking and heavily taxing burden. There are moments of spiritual reward, but it's right back to the friction of the day. How am I being crucified? I'm on the front lines in the trenchs battling for my life and others. I'm here to share my experiences, not to be treated like Satan. Maybe that's who I am to some here. I don't know. Drew has a bad habit of testifying for others in terms of why they do things, talking about glory and such folly. Glory is for the damned. We don't have time for that silly stuff here in my postiton. Humility isn't something you need to learn here among the desperately needy. Humility is the only thing. Glory for me is feeling the love of the desperate as you reach out to them with what they need again and again. The spirit shares in the Glory. Yes it's my Glory. And it's all of our Glory. We all rise together. I mean to debunk the nonsense of the Pseudo-Christian Rappers who don't know. Who FEELS it KNOWS it and that's all there is to it. Too many people out there love to sit in their parlors praising the NAME, while nearly a billion children world-wide according to witnesses are suffering severe malnutrition. That all quite unneccessary. It's a matter of priorities not a failure of technology. We can send zillion dollars to Mars to collect dust, but we dump excess grain in the sea rather than deliver it to those in need. Remember that nearlyl every elected official in USA is a christian. And you wonder why a front line soldier of the truth is a bit taken aback by the arrogance of some who talk without knowing?
With respect to pride: I said, Drew's been working iniquity against my name to achieve vanity. It's on the boards. If you are the big tree, let me tell you that we are the small axe, sharp and ready to cut you down (well sharp). No weak out shall prosper. And whosoever diggeth a pit shall fall in it. Rather than answer my questions he treats me like a fool. He knows me not.
I am a witness, and these are the things that I have seen with these eyes which are my own. I share the visions of my eyes with you as a warning to hypocrites and others. Doubt me! You have eyes to see, let them see. You have ears to hear, let them hear. I refuse to take the blame for your misinterpretations. I have nothing to prove. If you observe a fault in my observations, please teach me. Let the TRUTH be our guide. In our confessed ignorance let doubt bind us in the seeking.
I humble myself to him ready for a give and take learning experience and I don't receive back due respect for what it's worth.
This is to be a debate forum concerned with false teachings as posted, rather than a bible reprint forum. It's insulting to the spirit of the boards to have questions gone unanswered and bible excerpts reprinted again and again as if I hadn't read it the many times before. Speak to me as a human being whigh I am, and one with whom the spirit is well pleased. I'm not here to prove anything and I don't enjoy being insulted with a certain sort of silence. It pains me to be here at times but I do it for us all. I do answer questions as best I can and so too do I like my questions answered. I like criticism, that helps me to grow, however, please make your criticisms specific so I can understand them.
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Itty-Bitty Girl
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I respectfully and kindly ask, what is the problem here, Mark?
I would like to know how you can prove brother Drew a liar.
I would also like to know how you are being crucified.
How does my brother Drew show pride?
Posts: 1051 | Registered: Apr 2005
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Mark Elbing
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You say "The works you declare are the works which so many do also, but in the name of Jesus and not in their own name, nor for their own glorification."
You're a liar. Best stick to witnessing what you've seen, rather than revealing your ignorance. You're now seen to be a false witness with these eyes.
I'm being crucified is why I do what I do. I'm fighting for my life. It just so happens as I fight for mine, you also benefit. Your pride is an abomination. You make it quite clear.
You need to learn some basic communication skills. By the way, God's glory is his children, all of them, even you in your warped bewretched state of pride and ignorance. You're not Jesus Drew. Speak with Drew's mouth! Try asking a few questions before you run your filthy mouth. I may have to get out the soap. That's not an idle remark.
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Caretaker
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Jesus Christ IS the Way, the Truth, and the Life. Without Christ the "spirit" you declare is not the Spirit of God.
The works you declare are the works which so many do also, but in the name of Jesus and not in their own name, nor for their own glorification.
Many reach out with the hand of compassion to those in desperate need, and besides filling the belly, they provide nurture for the soul through the Living Word.
The comfort which you declare you give is temporal, fleeting at best. The comfort found in Christ is eternal, neverending. What you declare is dead is truly eternally alive in the hearts of His children.
The eternal love of Christ walks the prison corridors, and brings hope to the hopeless.
The eternal love of Christ visits the sick, the needy, the destitute, the undesirable by worldly standards. The eternal love of Christ puts 3 meals a day in front of 100s in Russellville, AR. The eternal love of Christ walks among bikers and dopers in Wichita, KS., and breaks the shackles of bondage and sets the captives free. The eternal Love of Christ puts new roofs on the shantys, food into empty larders, education into the minds of the unskilled, and a helping hand to all who ask in the back-hills of Apalachia.
You declare that you nurture the physical. The love of Christ within His Body nurtures the physical and also feeds the soul with the Braed of Life.
The love of Christ leads Brother Walt to drive many miles to bring a message of Hope to those in need upon the highways. The love of Christ brings forgiveness to the Auca from Rachel Saint, and Nates son is still reaching-out with the TRUE love of Christ in the jungles.
For almost 2000 years the TRUE love of Christ has indwelled the hearts and lives of the Brethren, and led them upon the pathways of His perfect will. The Blessed Assurance is a reality for those who will receive Christ Jesus our Lord.
For 29 years the eternal Love of Christ has led this old sinner saved by grace to walk the pathways of His perfect will and eternal love for His precious children. The love of Christ has ministered through this cracked-pot to those who found themselves in need. Sometimes its a little old lady with a flat tire. Sometimes its broken bleeding young drunks that just rolled their dune buggy, and are in and out of awareness. Sometimes its stands with firehose in hand, between a 6' wall of flame rolling in at 25 mph from the SW, and the home of Mary who lives just up the road. Sometimes the Love of Christ is called-out with 45 minutes sleep to stop three fathers from beating the young drunk who just shot bottle rockets into their childrens tent, and has hung his truck over a culvert. Sometimes the Love of Christ extricates the man with a broken leg from the waves crashing into the dock. Sometimes the love of Christ gives the older woman gas money and food so she can continue her trek home. Sometimes the love of Christ offers shelter, prayer and a bit of gas money to the young man going to visit his wife in prison. It is irrelevent what one is called to do, for it is ONLY by His will and for His glory.
The love of Christ Jesus our Lord is ALIVE in the hearts and lives of the Brethren. If you are truly doing your part to help those in need as you declare, then that is a good work. If the spirit you follow is not the Holy Spirit of God through Christ Jesus our Lord, then you will one day stand before the Throne of God empty-handed, for the righteousness of man is found only through the Cross of Calvary and the propitiation of Christ.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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Mark Elbing
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Without understanding, "JESUS CHRIST" is not Lord to anyone. "JESUS CHRIST" without proper understanding is two words. Two words that have divided men in war for several thousand years. My mind is a more magnificient creation by far than your idol you call the 'holy' bible. This is not because it has some power over men, it's because men do what they will first, then seek the justifications within the text. You often use the 'two words', but tell me this: where are the writings of Jesus in the 'holy' bible, this idol you consult, which is a dead thing made of earth that speaks not? Please answer my questions. I've been kind enough to ask you many questions, but you're not kind in reply. My questions are so little important to you. Tell me how important 'two words' are to you.
If you were drowning would you have me throw you 'two words'? ...or would you rather I throw you a life preserver?
C'mon Drew. I don't deny the spirit. I live with the spirit. This is a real world Drew. We need real solutions here. I'm a worker. I aid the fallen ones. They come to me by many for assistance. They all know that what I have I share, right down to my own house and what's in it.
Jesus Christ was a teacher of a way. He worked in parables. He inspired the apostles with doubt to humble them. Some folks know 'two words' and think the world is theirs. I'm here for you Drew, come to me! I'm the one tied to the whipping post! You'll know me by my smile.
420 S. Charles St.
Lansing, MI 48912
(517) 267-1473
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Caretaker
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The only foundation upon which one can build is the Lord Jesus Christ.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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Mark Elbing
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posted
Are you speaking of your idol? What savior do you know? I hear only the translated remnants of the long misunderstood and fought over testimonies of those dead and gone. I see thousands of years of failure. If the truth were ever the foundation of the church then you wouldn't see what you do today. I see the quaility of the seed in the harvest. That is the abomination that is the living church. Don't blame some invisible enemy who comes as a thief in the night. Christians are planting the seeds of the church's downfall. Blame yourselves. You love the darkness, for in the darkness you worship your misunderstandings. I come to you with open arms. Little you know about me, since so little you understand of what I have written. Just so were Christ's apostles lost in darkness according to scripture. The symbolisms in the parabols needed to be revealed before they were understood. You look for God in some grand manifestation. Some can see God in all things. Your Satan will surely have you then. Your own understandings are your wings you will need to fly. Without the wings of understanding, you're lost. I lay my thoughts bare before you, but you hide behind your grossly misunderstood idols. If you knew these things so well that you might straighten the disaster with your 'eyes of Christ' then speak to me in your own words and teach me of your ways. I make parables of the better teachings of your own religion and hand them down to you. You take these and rather than connect the symbols, you revert to literal or technical translation of the living word of past ages and turn it to dead confusion. Every liar loves a dead prophet, for he makes no contradiction to their twisted interpretations! See your Church warring and dividing, disobedient, and thriving on your Satan's rewards, calling these blessings! Kindness is not approval. Kindness is truth. You'd be amazed at my grasp of things. You don't know me. You won't bring it out in me, because you have no questions. You have only answers, and the answers you have, lead us to where we are now. This is a dying world my friend. Allow me the respect a stranger is due. I just might have a piece of the puzzle we need to build our understanding together.
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Caretaker
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Amen Dale!!!!!!
John 1:
1: In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2: The same was in the beginning with God.
3: All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4: In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
5: And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
6: There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
7: The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
8: He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
9: That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
10: He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
11: He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
12: But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
14: And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
15: John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
16: And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.
17: For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
Come to Christ Mark.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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Mark Elbing
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posted
by MacFLY (Mark Elbing)
THE CHAIN: (The Faith) truth+justice+love+kindness+sharing+mercy+honesty+fairness+
support+assistance+service+understanding+tolerance+fidellity+
unselfishness+communication+doubt+reconcilliation+caring+
compassion+consistancy
'The chain' is made up of words that represent actions (ways) in our lives.
If you fail to uphold the way described by any link in the chain, then the whole chain crumbles. Faith is a way rather than a state of mind.
Each time the chain crumbles, the more difficult it may be to repair.
...
Hope begins with awareness, courage, commitment and change. There is no other way. The steps must be taken, or else life is forsaken!
Take foundational inventory. You may ask yourself: Do I ever really benefit from sin? Does anybody? Why do I do things that hurt myself and others? Is there hope for me? Does anybody care? Be honest. The truth loves honesty.
LIFE is not in a word, LIFE is not in a thought, LIFE is not in a baptism, LIFE is not in the sacrifice of a dove. LIFE is not in a vain ritual. LIFE is real, play hard!
Water won't likely wash away your sins, nor likely will fire, nor likely will any Earthly power. On Earth, what is done is done.
The Earth is orderly. Jump off a cliff and it's unlilkely Angels will catch you and reward you with your choice of kingdoms here on Earth! Jump off a cliff and you'll likely fall to your death or serious injury. Realilty is orderly rather than forgiving. There are consequences for actions we take here. How precious is your life to you here?
The loss is ours. Cry for us always. We are the children. What brings the healing?
Healing is in our positive ways. Healing is in our positive actions. Healing is in our positive changes. We must do our part. Take the steps that lead to our healing! When one rises we all rise together!
Emerge from the shadows. Come into the light of understanding. Help to mend our fallen ways and allow the unbroken chain (mended faith) to keep us together.
Hypocrisy is negative to the eyes of truth. Avoid it. It is a plague!
------------------------------------------------
The Chain Lyrics
by Fleetwood Mac
(L.Buckingham, M.Fleetwood, C.McVie, J.McVie, S.Nicks)
Listen to the wind blow
Watch the sun rise
Run in the shadows
Damn your love
Damn your lies
And if
You don't love me now
You will never love me again
I can still hear you saying
You would never break the chain.
List to the wind blow
Down comes the night
Run in the shadows
Damn your love
Damn your lies
Break the silence
Damn the dark
Damn the light
And if
You don't love me now
You will never love me again
I can still hear you saying
You would never break the chain.
<chorus: repeat and fade out>
<hope of salvation> (chain keep us together)
<reality of sin> (running in the shadows)
------------------------------------------------
Back on the Chain Gang - The Pretenders
I found a picture of you, ho
What hijacked my world that night
To a place in the past
We've been cast out of, ho
Now we're back in the fight
We're back on the train yeah, oh
back on the chain gang
Circumstance beyond our control, ho
The phone, TV and the news of the world
Got in the house like a pigeon from Hell, oh
Threw sand in our eyes and descended like flies
Put us back on the train yeah
Oh, back on the chain gang
The powers that be
That force us to live like we do
Bring me to my knees
When I see what they've done to you.
But I'll die as I stand here today
Knowing that deep in my heart
They'll fall to ruin one day
For making us part.
I found a picture of you, ho
Those were the happiest days of my life
Like a break in the battle was, was your part, ho
In the wretched life of a lonely heart (ooh ah)
Now we're back on the train hey
Oh, back on the chain gang.
ah,ah
ah,hah
------------------------------------------------
Compilation CDs containing this song:
Only Dance: 1980-1984
MTV Class of 1983
Entertainment Weekly: The Greatest Hits 1983
Casey Kasem: America's Top 10 Through the Years [BOX SET]
VH-1 Storytellers [LIVE]
Casey Kasem: America's Top 10 Through Years - The 80's
Billboard Top Album Rock Hits 1983
Entertainment Weekly: The Greatest Hits 1980-1984 [BOX SET]
Like, Omigod! The '80s Pop Culture Box (Totally) [BOX SET]
Women Who Rock
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Itty-Bitty Girl
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posted
Amen Dale, this is something that I really needed to hear. We need more soldiers like you fighting on the frontlines for the Lord.
I like the lyrics to this song!
Artist: MICAH STAMPLEY
Song Name: WAR CRY
Album: THE SONGBOOK OF MICAH
This is a war cry!
CHORUS:
I hear the sound of a voice crying out in the wilderness
Prepare ye the way of the Lord!
I hear the sound of a voice
it sounds like thunder
Prepare ye the way of the Lord!
This is a war cry
calling all of the warriors
With your weapons fit for the fight
We must stand as a people
filled with His light
Prepare ye the way of the Lord (Repeat)
The Creator is waiting for us to acknowledge Him
Prepare ye the way of the Lord
So I will sing and I will shout
until He returns for me
Prepare ye the way of the Lord
Let us kneel down and reverence His presence
So all the world will see
That He is faithful and just
deserving all glory
Prepare ye the way of the Lord (4x)
Oh, we're waiting on our Savior,
Oh, we're waiting on our King
Oh, we're waiting on our Master,
Oh He is our everything
CHORUS
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons; its time to fight
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons, Fight! Fight!
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons; its time to fight
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons, Fight! Fight!
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons; its time to fight
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons, Fight! Fight!
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons; its time to fight
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons, Fight! Fight!
This is the war cry...
For the warriors...
Prepare ye the way of the Lord (4x)
Prepare ye the way of the Lord!
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons; its time to fight
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons, Fight! Fight!
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons; its time to fight
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons, Fight! Fight!
This is the war cry...
For the warriors...
Prepare ye the way of the Lord (4x)
Prepare ye the way of the Lord!
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons; its time to fight
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons, Fight! Fight!
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons; its time to fight
This is the war cry for the warriors
Pick up your weapons, Fight! Fight!
Soldiers! Where all the warriors?
Prepare! Prepare ye the workers of the crop!
Prepare ye the way of the Lord (4x)
Prepare ye the way of the Lord!
____________________
God bless you, Dale. Thank you for allowing God to use you to inspire me to continue on in the fight for the Lord.
Posts: 1051 | Registered: Apr 2005
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becauseHElives
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Member # 87
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posted
"I do not see how any Christian, most of all a Christian minister, can go into these lodges with unbelievers. They say they can have more influence for good, but I say they can have more influence for good by staying out of them and then reproving their evil deeds. You can never reform anything by unequally yoking yourself with ungodly men. True reformers separate themselves from the world.
But, some say to me, if you talk that way you will drive all the members of secret societies out of your meetings and out of your churches. But what if I did?
Better men will take their places. Give them the truth anyway and if they would rather leave their churches than their lodges, the sooner they get out of the churches the better.
I would rather have ten members who are separated from the world than a thousand such members. Come out from the lodge.
Better one with God than a thousand without Him.
We must walk with God and if only one or two go with us, it is all right. Do not let down the standard to suit men who love their secret lodges or have some darling sin they will not give up."
(Dwight L. Moody)
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002
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