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Author Topic: What About The Real Holy Spirit
WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Caretaker:
quote:
Originally posted by Aaron:
Ha. I was going to post that next Eden. [Wink]

quote:
Originally posted by Brotherbrown:
I take it in context. Context, context, context.
Verse 14 sets the context. He glorifies Christ by taking Christs words from the Word of God.
John 16:14
14 "He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.

Maybe if you said "context" one more time your rationale would come true?

Alas, I fear you are beyond reason.

Aaron

The revealed reality which has been shown to every Believer on this Board. Your heart is hardened Bbrown, and your theology in error and not sourced from the Holy Spirit of God.

Titus 3:
10: A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;
11: Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.

Amen

--------------------
That is all.....

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Caretaker
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quote:
Originally posted by Aaron:
Ha. I was going to post that next Eden. [Wink]

quote:
Originally posted by Brotherbrown:
I take it in context. Context, context, context.
Verse 14 sets the context. He glorifies Christ by taking Christs words from the Word of God.
John 16:14
14 "He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.

Maybe if you said "context" one more time your rationale would come true?

Alas, I fear you are beyond reason.

Aaron

The revealed reality which has been shown to every Believer on this Board. Your heart is hardened Bbrown, and your theology in error and not sourced from the Holy Spirit of God.

Titus 3:
10: A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;
11: Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

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WildB
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 -

--------------------
That is all.....

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Brotherbrown
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quote:
Originally posted by Caretaker:
Well Bbrown, you are not studying the Word in context, or you would not be wresting scriptures to substantiate error. Context must be understood within not only a particular verse, but with chapter, Book, and entire Bible as a whole.

What you are doing is not context but pretext, seeking to gather individual scriptures to substantiate your theological corruption.

B. The True God

We believe in one living and true God who is the Creator of heaven and earth;
who is eternal, almighty, unchangeable, infinitely powerful, wise, just and
holy.

We believe that the one God eternally exists in three Persons: the Father, the
Son, and the Holy Spirit; and that these three are one God, co-equal and
co-eternal, having precisely the same nature and attributes, and worthy of
precisely the same worship, confidence, and obedience. Matthew 3:16, 17;
Matthew 28:19, 20; Mark 12:29; John 1:14; Acts 5:3, 4; II Corinthians 13:14.

C. God the Father

We believe in God the Father, Creator and Sustainer of all things, perfect in
holiness, wisdom, power and love. We believe that He concerns Himself
mercifully in the affairs of men; that He hears and answers prayer; that He
sent His Son into the world; that He saves from sin and death all who come
to Him through His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. Genesis 1:1; Psalms 7:9;
Matthew 5:48; John 3:16; Acts 13:17-25; Acts 14:15-17; Acts 17:24-28.

D. The Person and Work of Jesus Christ

We believe in the deity of Jesus Christ, that He was conceived of the Holy
Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, lived a sinless life, and is fully God and fully
Man. We believe that our redemption has been accomplished solely by the
blood of our Lord Jesus Christ, who was made to be sin, and made a curse for
us, dying in our place that we might be forgiven. We believe that He died not
only for our sins, but also for the sins of the entire world. We believe that He
was raised from the dead in bodily form and that He ascended into heaven,
where He sits at the right hand of God the Father interceding for us.

We believe in the personal, bodily, imminent and pre-millennial return of our
Lord Jesus Christ for His Church and His subsequent millennial reign over
restored Israel and the kingdoms of the world. Luke 1:30-35; 2:7; John 1:1-4;
Romans 9-11; Philippians 2:5-11; Colossians 1:13-19; Hebrews 1:1-3; I Peter
3:18; I Corinthians 15:3-7; Hebrews 7:25; Acts 1:11, 15:14-17; I
Thessalonians 4:13-18; I John 2:2.

E. The Holy Spirit

We believe that the Holy Spirit is not merely an influence, but a divine Person;
that He is the source and power of all acceptable worship and service and is
our abiding Counselor and Helper. We believe that the baptism of the Holy
Spirit occurs at the moment of conversion and is that act whereby believers
are united with Christ as part of His body; that the Holy Spirit permanently
indwells all believers in Christ; that He will never depart from the Church nor
from the weakest believer; that by His indwelling the believer is enabled to
live a godly life. John 14:16,17; 16:13-15; Acts 1:8; 5:3,4; Romans 8:9; I
Corinthians 6:19; 12:13; Galatians 5:22,23.

I can see you cant separate your theories from what the Word of God says. You have to many preconcieved ideas and you go to scripture trying to support them. But in reality your fighting against what is written.
Trinity is not in the Word of God, deity is not in the Word of God, God the Son is not in the Word of God, God the Holy Spirit is not in the Word of God.
And what does the Word of God say. Paul said not to even think beyond what is written.

1 Cor 4:6
6 Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively transferred to myself and Apollos for your sakes, that you may learn in us not to think beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up on behalf of one against the other.
(NKJ)

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Brotherbrown
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quote:
Originally posted by Aaron:
Ha. I was going to post that next Eden. [Wink]

quote:
Originally posted by Brotherbrown:
I take it in context. Context, context, context.
Verse 14 sets the context. He glorifies Christ by taking Christs words from the Word of God.
John 16:14
14 "He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.

Maybe if you said "context" one more time your rationale would come true?

Alas, I fear you are beyond reason.

Aaron

Your opinion.
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Caretaker
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Well Bbrown, you are not studying the Word in context, or you would not be wresting scriptures to substantiate error. Context must be understood within not only a particular verse, but with chapter, Book, and entire Bible as a whole.

What you are doing is not context but pretext, seeking to gather individual scriptures to substantiate your theological corruption.

B. The True God

We believe in one living and true God who is the Creator of heaven and earth;
who is eternal, almighty, unchangeable, infinitely powerful, wise, just and
holy.

We believe that the one God eternally exists in three Persons: the Father, the
Son, and the Holy Spirit; and that these three are one God, co-equal and
co-eternal, having precisely the same nature and attributes, and worthy of
precisely the same worship, confidence, and obedience. Matthew 3:16, 17;
Matthew 28:19, 20; Mark 12:29; John 1:14; Acts 5:3, 4; II Corinthians 13:14.

C. God the Father

We believe in God the Father, Creator and Sustainer of all things, perfect in
holiness, wisdom, power and love. We believe that He concerns Himself
mercifully in the affairs of men; that He hears and answers prayer; that He
sent His Son into the world; that He saves from sin and death all who come
to Him through His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. Genesis 1:1; Psalms 7:9;
Matthew 5:48; John 3:16; Acts 13:17-25; Acts 14:15-17; Acts 17:24-28.

D. The Person and Work of Jesus Christ

We believe in the deity of Jesus Christ, that He was conceived of the Holy
Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary, lived a sinless life, and is fully God and fully
Man. We believe that our redemption has been accomplished solely by the
blood of our Lord Jesus Christ, who was made to be sin, and made a curse for
us, dying in our place that we might be forgiven. We believe that He died not
only for our sins, but also for the sins of the entire world. We believe that He
was raised from the dead in bodily form and that He ascended into heaven,
where He sits at the right hand of God the Father interceding for us.

We believe in the personal, bodily, imminent and pre-millennial return of our
Lord Jesus Christ for His Church and His subsequent millennial reign over
restored Israel and the kingdoms of the world. Luke 1:30-35; 2:7; John 1:1-4;
Romans 9-11; Philippians 2:5-11; Colossians 1:13-19; Hebrews 1:1-3; I Peter
3:18; I Corinthians 15:3-7; Hebrews 7:25; Acts 1:11, 15:14-17; I
Thessalonians 4:13-18; I John 2:2.

E. The Holy Spirit

We believe that the Holy Spirit is not merely an influence, but a divine Person;
that He is the source and power of all acceptable worship and service and is
our abiding Counselor and Helper. We believe that the baptism of the Holy
Spirit occurs at the moment of conversion and is that act whereby believers
are united with Christ as part of His body; that the Holy Spirit permanently
indwells all believers in Christ; that He will never depart from the Church nor
from the weakest believer; that by His indwelling the believer is enabled to
live a godly life. John 14:16,17; 16:13-15; Acts 1:8; 5:3,4; Romans 8:9; I
Corinthians 6:19; 12:13; Galatians 5:22,23.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Aaron
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Ha. I was going to post that next Eden. [Wink]

quote:
Originally posted by Brotherbrown:
I take it in context. Context, context, context.
Verse 14 sets the context. He glorifies Christ by taking Christs words from the Word of God.
John 16:14
14 "He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.

Maybe if you said "context" one more time your rationale would come true?

Alas, I fear you are beyond reason.

Aaron

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Brotherbrown
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quote:
Originally posted by Aaron:
quote:
Originally posted by Brotherbrown:
13 "However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.

Sounds like future tense to me.

quote:
but whatever He hears He will speak
That's present tense.

Not to mention the fact that Paul did not follow Jesus around and thus hear him speak things. Nevertheless, Paul met Jesus on the road to Damascus and Jesus said things to Paul.

So, I wonder, do you discount Paul and his testimony?

Aaron

I take it in context. Context, context, context.
Verse 14 sets the context. He glorifies Christ by taking Christs words from the Word of God.
John 16:14
14 "He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.
(NKJ)

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Eden
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Hi, Brotherbrown. You said above that the Holy Spirit will only speak to us what Jesus said. Here is what you said:

John 14:26 (NKJ)
26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.

Okay. But note that the Apostle John writes later that Jesus DID SO MANY OTHER THINGS that SO MANY BOOKS would have to be written that even the whole world could not contain them:

John 21

25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written.

So what was actually written in the Bible is very little compared to what Jesus actually did, and presumably compared to what Jesus also said since Jesus would NOT have been silent during all those non-written things that He did.

So is it not true therefore that the Holy Spirit would tell us stuff that we have NEVER heard before because Jesus did vastly more than is actually recorded?

Indeed, John says that what IS recorded is ENOUGH to get saved by, but John assures us that a LOT MORE happened than just what is written:

John 20

30 And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book.

31 But these are written, that you might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you might have life through His name.

with love,
Eden

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Aaron
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quote:
Originally posted by Brotherbrown:
13 "However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.

Sounds like future tense to me.

quote:
but whatever He hears He will speak
That's present tense.

Not to mention the fact that Paul did not follow Jesus around and thus hear him speak things. Nevertheless, Paul met Jesus on the road to Damascus and Jesus said things to Paul.

So, I wonder, do you discount Paul and his testimony?

Aaron

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Caretaker
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The Holy Spirit of God moves in the heart and life of the Believer, and illuminates His Word, so we are able to understand the true context of scripture.

http://www.biblebb.com/files/mac/sg90-31.htm

II. THE HOLY SPIRIT ILLUMINATES SCRIPTURE

A. Illumination Defined

Having intimacy with God is a wonderful thing but it must be a two way conversation: we speak to Him in prayer and He speaks to us through His Word. Illumination is the ministry of the Spirit whereby He opens our minds to God's Word and makes it come alive to us as God speaks through its pages. That's why we should always pray with an open heart and an open Bible.

B. Illumination Illustrated

1. 1 John 2:20, 27 -- John said,"You have an anointing from the Holy One, and you all know [truth].... The anointing which you received from Him abides in you, and you have no need for any one to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you abide in Him." The Holy Spirit abides within every believer as the resident Truth Teacher.

The Greek word translated "anointing" (chrisma [chrisma]) literally means "ointment" or "anointing oil." An ointment is placed onto and absorbed into one's skin. John's analogy pictures the Spirit as the One who resides within the believer and permeates his life with God's truth.

2. 2 Corinthians 1:21 -- Paul said, "He who establishes us with you in Christ and anointed us is God, who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge."

3. 1 Corinthians 2:9 14 -- Paul said, "Things which eye has not seen and ear has not heard, and which have not entered the heart of man, all that God has prepared for those who love Him. For to us God revealed them through the Spirit; for the Spirit searches all things, even the depths of God. For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the spirit of the man, which is in him? Even so the thoughts of God no one knows except the Spirit of God.

"Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things freely given to us by God, which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words. But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God."

The Spirit enables the believer to understand Scripture. He is able to do that because He was the author of Scripture. Second Peter 1:20 21 says, "No prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God."

To illustrate the Holy Spirit's unique qualification for revealing the Word, Paul compared the Spirit's knowledge of God's mind to a man's knowledge of his own mind (1 Cor. 2:11). God's Spirit knows God's thoughts and revealed them in Scripture. Also He illuminates those thoughts in the minds of believers (1 Cor. 2:12).


* If God's Spirit Is Sufficient, Why Do We Need God's Word?

The sufficiency of God's Spirit in meeting our needs does not mean we can neglect God's Word. Quite the contrary. The Spirit works through the Word to accomplish God's purposes in our lives.

In my opinion Psalm 19:7 9 is the single greatest treatment in the Bible of the sufficiency of Scripture: "The law of the Lord is perfect, restoring the soul [transforming the whole person]; the testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple [imparting skills for every aspect of daily living]. The precepts of the Lord are right [they establish a right path to follow], rejoicing the heart; the commandment of the Lord is pure, enlightening the eyes [enabling the believer to see truth clearly]. The fear of the Lord is clean [untouched by sin], enduring forever; the judgments of the Lord are true; they are righteous altogether."

David there used six synonyms to describe Scripture: law, testimony, precepts, commandment, fear, and judgments. "Law" refers to God's standards for man's conduct. "Testimony" refers to His self-disclosure. "Precepts" refers to life principles. "Commandment" refers to non-negotiable, non-optional demands. "Fear" refers to instruction on worship. And "judgments" refers to God's verdicts on man's behavior.

Scripture is sufficient to supply all God wants us to know about Himself and His will for our lives. But Scripture must be illuminated by the Holy Spirit if we're to understand it. God's Spirit working through God's Word provides a supernatural resource that exceeds anything conceivable on the natural plane. That's why Scripture is "more desirable than gold, yes, than much fine gold; sweeter also than honey and the drippings of the honeycomb" (v. 10).

David prayed, "Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be acceptable in Thy sight, O Lord, my rock and my Redeemer" (v. 14). Is that your prayer? That can happen only when you follow the command of Joshua 1:8: "This book of the law shall not depart from your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night, so that you may be careful to do according to all that is written in it."


Conclusion

When we became Christians, God's Spirit convicted us of our sins, brought us to repentance, and regenerated us. He then indwelt, baptized, sealed, gifted, and separated us from sin. In the ongoing process of sanctification, He gives us access to and intimacy with God, who supplies all the resources we need for physical and spiritual life. The Spirit also illuminates our understanding of God's Word so we are transformed by its principles as He applies them to our lives.

What unimaginable gifts the Spirit has given to us! We are not left to flounder around seeking solutions to spiritual needs on the natural plane. God's Spirit is sufficient for every need. Our responsibility is to be filled with the Spirit and to walk by the Spirit each day (Eph. 5:18; Gal. 5:16, 25).

It's necessary to be reminded of those basic truths because we often forget the source of our spiritual power. Many Christians have been drawn away from depending upon the Spirit's ministry, focusing instead on some supposed fast answer, quick fix, or panacea for their problems. But the truth is, if you want a godly life you must move into the presence of God through prayer and allow His Spirit to minister to you and transform you through His Word. That's how sanctification takes place.

____________________________________________

1 John 5:
20: And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

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Brotherbrown
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quote:
Originally posted by Aaron:
quote:
Originally posted by Brotherbrown:
Because the Spirit does only quote verses.

Who convinced you of this?

By this standard neither the Old or the New Testaments could not have been written.

The Spirit does not simply quote verses. The Spirit moves and scripture is produced when saints respond to His work.

"All Scripture is given by inspiration of God..."

Aaron

The Word of God convinced me of this.
Verse 26 says that the Holy Spirit will teach me by bringing to remembrance(quoting verses) what Jesus has already said to me. So when I read He is speaking to me. And when I remember the Holy Spirit is teaching me.
John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
(NKJ)

This one is real plain, the Holy Spirit is not allowed to speak to me any other way. He can only take from the verses and declare them to me.

John 16:13-14
13 "However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.
14 "He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.
(NKJ)

And as far as All scripture go see if you can find the scripture in the old testament. It only shows up in one verse and that verse is speaking about the future.

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Aaron
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quote:
Originally posted by Brotherbrown:
Because the Spirit does only quote verses.

Who convinced you of this?

By this standard neither the Old or the New Testaments could not have been written.

The Spirit does not simply quote verses. The Spirit moves and scripture is produced when saints respond to His work.

"All Scripture is given by inspiration of God..."

Aaron

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Brotherbrown
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I was hoping to find some help in here.
All I can say is this. I hope you all are not gambling eternal life on what you have told me so far. I'm beting my eternal life on the Word of God.
What I have seen so far is that you worship in the flesh and not in the Spirit. Because the Spirit does only quote verses.

John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
(NKJ)

John 16:13-14
13 "However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.
14 "He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.
(NKJ)

2 Cor 5:5
5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.
(NKJ)

James 3:1-2

1 My brethren, let not many of you become teachers, knowing that we shall receive a stricter judgment.
2 For we all stumble in many things. If anyone does not stumble in word, he is a perfect man, able also to bridle the whole body.
(NKJ)

James 3:17
17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy.
(NKJ)

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Brotherbrown
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FIND THE INNER MAN-CRUSIFY THE OUTER PERSON
(SPIRIT, MIND OF INNER MAN. SOUL, BODY OF INNER MAN)
1 Pet 4:19
19 Therefore let those who suffer according to the will of God commit their souls to Him in doing good, as to a faithful Creator.
Matt 22:16
16 And they sent to Him their disciples with the Herodians, saying, "Teacher, we know that You are true, and teach the way of God in truth; nor do You care about anyone, for You do not regard the person of men.
Rom 7:22
22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man.
Gal 5:24-25
24 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
John 6:63
63 "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.
John 4:48
48 Then Jesus said to him, "Unless you people see signs and wonders, you will by no means believe."
Matt 12:38-39
38 Then some of the scribes and Pharisees answered, saying, "Teacher, we want to see a sign from You."
39 But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah.
1 Tim 4:9-11
9 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance.
10 For to this end we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe.
11 These things command and teach.
1 Tim 4:13-16
13 Till I come, give attention to reading, to exhortation, to doctrine.
14 Do not neglect the gift that is in you, which was given to you by prophecy with the laying on of the hands of the eldership.
15 Meditate on these things; give yourself entirely to them, that your progress may be evident to all.
16 Take heed to yourself and to the doctrine. Continue in them, for in doing this you will save both yourself and those who hear you.
1 Pet 4:19
19 Therefore let those who suffer according to the will of God commit their souls to Him in doing good, as to a faithful Creator.
Eph 3:14-19
14 For this reason I bow my knees to the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
15 from whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
16 that He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with might through His Spirit in the inner man,
17 that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; that you, being rooted and grounded in love,
18 may be able to comprehend with all the saints what is the width and length and depth and height--
19 to know the love of Christ which passes knowledge; that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.
2 Cor 4:16-18
16 Therefore we do not lose heart. Even though our outward man is perishing, yet the inward man is being renewed day by day.
17 For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, is working for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory,
18 while we do not look at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen. For the things which are seen are temporary, but the things which are not seen are eternal.
Eph 4:21-24
21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus:
22 that you put off, concerning your former conduct, the old man which grows corrupt according to the deceitful lusts,
23 and be renewed in the spirit of your mind,
24 and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness and holiness.
Col 3:10
10 and have put on the new man who is renewed in knowledge according to the image of Him who created him,
1 Pet 2:4-5
4 Coming to Him as to a living stone, rejected indeed by men, but chosen by God and precious,
5 you also, as living stones, are being built up a spiritual house, a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
1 Pet 2:11-12
11 Beloved, I beg you as sojourners and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts which war against the soul,
12 having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles, that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation.
(NKJ)
xxxx Your inner man consists of your spirit(the mind of your inner man) and your soul(the body of your inner man). All affections come from your soul and all decisions come from your spirit. Not all ideas but all decisions. All ideas come from the different beings in you. You get one opinion from your guardian angel. And you get one opinion from the devil. Then you choose who to agree with. But if you have the Holy Spirit He will give you a verse to show you who is who.
All your emotions dwell in your outer person (body). All emotions are unclean spirits.

2 Cor 6:17
17 Therefore "Come out from among them and be separate, says the Lord. Do not touch what is unclean, and I will receive you."
(NKJ)

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Thunderz7
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quote:
xxxThere is a milk and a meat understanding to every verse. This is why we shouldnt be fighting one another over what a verse means. It is sad to me to see people arguing over what a verse means. One could have the milk understanding and one could have the meat understanding. I have been through them both and know from experiance that both meanings are necassary. But with out knowing of the milk and the meat to many just want to try to prove someone wrong. Which is the wrong spirit to be sharing the Word of God.
Every verse has more than one meaning. Every verse is a spiritual principle that the Holy Spirit uses to teach us by.

/Every verse does have multiple applications, and it goes past milk and meat;
Eden has spoken much of late on spirit, soul and body;
every scripture has application to each part of a man.

the body - is the outter court
the body - is world conscious

the soul - is the inner court
the soul - is self conscious

the spirit - is the Holy of Holies
the spirit - is GOD conscious

T7

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Brotherbrown
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Well this is the way it was explained to me with scripture. The time lines are minnimum time lines.
Paul was called.
Gal 1:18
18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and remained with him fifteen days.
(NKJ)

Paul found the Holy Spirit and walked after the Holy Spirit for 11 years minus the three years he was in the milk.
Gal 2:1

1 Then after fourteen years I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and also took Titus with me.
(NKJ)

Some do abide in the milk their whole life. Its sad but true.

Heb 5:12-14
12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food.
13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
(NKJ)

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Thunderz7
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I have no problem with your thoughts on milk and meat;
you are giving scripture and your thoughts on those scriptures;
I find more agreement than disagreement in your opinion of milk and meat from these scriptures.
Probably more disagreement than agreement in your application of the Holy Spirit and apostles in relation to milk and meat.
Still no real problem, as you are giving your thoughts on these scriptures.


As before though I am having a problem with this.

quote:
xxxThe milk is about 3 to 4 years long, and in that time you should know that the Holy Spirit is in you. There are 9 gifts of the Holy Spirit and you will receive one or more of them gifts as evidence that the Holy Spirit is in you. Then when you are sure, the Holy Spirit will take you into the meat of the Word one verse at a time. You should know what love is by this time. The milk took you to love and the Holy Spirit. Now the Holy Spirit will lead you with that love as the first step in the meat. And the Holy Spirit will lead you inside yourself with that love, to crucify the flesh(feelings & emotions)(unclean spirits). And this should last for atleast 11 years.
You said before, this was not your time line but you got it from another website;
but this is at least the second time you posted it and another mentiion has been made of it.

It is someone's man made attempt to put a time limit on GOD;
putting GOD in a box;
in has no scriptural backing;
GOD created time, HE is not subjest to it, nor is he subject to some man's opinion.
This time frame is not Biblical.

T7

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Brotherbrown
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MEAT (SOLID FOOD)(DOER OF THE WORD)(APOSTLE)

John 4:34
34 Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.
(KJV)
Luke 9:62
62 But Jesus said to him, "No one, having put his hand to the plow, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God."
Luke 6:46-47
46 "But why do you call Me 'Lord, Lord,' and do not do the things which I say?
47 "Whoever comes to Me, and hears My sayings and does them, I will show you whom he is like:
Heb 5:13-6:3
13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
1 Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God,
2 of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
3 And this we will do if God permits.
James 2:17-18
17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18 But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.
James 2:26
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
Phil 4:9
9 The things which you learned and received and heard and saw in me, these do, and the God of peace will be with you.
1 Cor 14:20
20 Brethren, do not be children in understanding; however, in malice be babes, but in understanding be mature.
Matt 13:11
11 He answered and said to them, "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.
Matt 13:16-17
16 "But blessed are your eyes for they see, and your ears for they hear;
17 "for assuredly, I say to you that many prophets and righteous men desired to see what you see, and did not see it, and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
Matt 11:12-13
12 "And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffers violence, and the violent take it by force.
13 "For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
1 Cor 13:8-11
8 Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.
9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part.
10 But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
1 Cor 2:12
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.
1 Cor 2:14-15
14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one.
1 Cor 2:13
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
1 Cor 2:9-10
9 But as it is written: "Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, nor have entered into the heart of man the things which God has prepared for those who love Him."
10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God.
Gal 5:24-25
24 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
Gal 5:1
1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage.
Gal 5:4
4You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
1 Pet 1:13-15
13 Therefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and rest your hope fully upon the grace that is to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;
14 as obedient children, not conforming yourselves to the former lusts, as in your ignorance;
15 but as He who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct,
Gal 1:12
12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ.
Rom 16:25
25 Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began
Matt 13:35
35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying: "I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things kept secret from the foundation of the world."
Luke 8:17
17 "For nothing is secret that will not be revealed, nor anything hidden that will not be known and come to light.
1 Cor 6:12
12 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful. All things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
Luke 6:47
47 "Whoever comes to Me, and hears My sayings and does them, I will show you whom he is like:
2 Pet 2:20-22
20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.
21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.
22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: "A dog returns to his own vomit," and, "a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire."
Heb 2:1-3
1 Therefore we must give the more earnest heed to the things we have heard, lest we drift away.
2 For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward,
3 how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed to us by those who heard Him,
(NKJ)

Heb 6:1-2
1 Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God,
2 of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
(NKJ)
Heb 5:14
14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil
Matt 8:11-12
11 "And I say to you that many will come from east and west, and sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.
12 "But the sons of the kingdom will be cast out into outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

ELEVEN MORE YEARS IN THE MEAT TO COME TO REVELATIONS
Gal 2:1-2
1 Then after fourteen years I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and also took Titus with me.
2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated to them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to those who were of reputation, lest by any means I might run, or had run, in vain.
Rom 6:8-10
8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him,
9 knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him.
10 For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God.
(NKJ)

xxxThere is a milk and a meat understanding to every verse. This is why we shouldnt be fighting one another over what a verse means. It is sad to me to see people arguing over what a verse means. One could have the milk understanding and one could have the meat understanding. I have been through them both and know from experiance that both meanings are necassary. But with out knowing of the milk and the meat to many just want to try to prove someone wrong. Which is the wrong spirit to be sharing the Word of God.
Every verse has more than one meaning. Every verse is a spiritual principle that the Holy Spirit uses to teach us by.

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Brotherbrown
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MILK (HEARER OF THE WORD)(DISCIPLE)
Matt 13:34-35
34 All these things Jesus spoke to the multitude in parables; and without a parable He did not speak to them,
35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying: "I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things kept secret from the foundation of the world."
Mark 4:34
34 But without a parable He did not speak to them. And when they were alone, He explained all things to His disciples.
John 16:27
25 "These things I have spoken to you in figurative language; but the time is coming when I will no longer speak to you in figurative language, but I will tell you plainly about the Father.
26 "In that day you will ask in My name, and I do not say to you that I shall pray the Father for you;
27 "for the Father Himself loves you, because you have loved Me, and have believed that I came forth from God.
1 Cor 3:1-3
1 And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ.
2 I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able;
3 for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men?
1 Tim 1:6-7
6 from which some, having strayed, have turned aside to idle talk,
7 desiring to be teachers of the law, understanding neither what they say nor the things which they affirm.
Heb 5:12-13
12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food.
13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
1 Pet 2:1-2
1 Therefore, laying aside all malice, all guile, hypocrisy, envy, and all evil speaking,
2 as newborn babes, desire the pure milk of the word, that you may grow thereby,
John 14:22-25
22 Judas (not Iscariot) said to Him, "Lord, how is it that You will manifest Yourself to us, and not to the world?"
23 Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.
24 "He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me.
25 "These things I have spoken to you while being present with you.
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
John 16:7-11
7 "Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you.
8 "And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
9 "of sin, because they do not believe in Me;
10 "of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more;
11 "of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.
John 16:1-3
1 "These things I have spoken to you, that you should not be made to stumble.
2 "They will put you out of the synagogues; yes, the time is coming that whoever kills you will think that he offers God service.
3 "And these things they will do to you because they have not known the Father nor Me.
Jude 1:19
19 These are sensual persons, who cause divisions, not having the Spirit.
(NKJ)Gal 4:1-5
1 Now I say that the heir, as long as he is a child, does not differ at all from a slave, though he is master of all,
2 but is under guardians and stewards until the time appointed by the father.
3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world.
4 But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law,
5 to redeem those who were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as sons.
1 Cor 13:11-12
11 When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known.
Heb 5:13-6:3
13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
1 Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God,
2 of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
3 And this we will do if God permits.
Phil 3:12-17
12 Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me.
13 Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead,
14 I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.
15 Therefore let us, as many as are mature, have this mind; and if in anything you think otherwise, God will reveal even this to you.
16 Nevertheless, to the degree that we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us be of the same mind.
17 Brethren, join in following my example, and note those who so walk, as you have us for a pattern.
(NKJ) MILK THREE YEARS TO FIND THE HOLY SPIRIT QUOTING VERSES
Luke 13:7-9
7 "Then he said to the keeper of his vineyard, 'Look, for three years I have come seeking fruit on this fig tree and find none. Cut it down; why does it use up the ground?'
8 "But he answered and said to him, 'Sir, let it alone this year also, until I dig around it and fertilize it.
9 'And if it bears fruit, well. But if not, after that you can cut it down.' "
Gal 1:15-19
15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb and called me through His grace,
16 to reveal His Son in me, that I might preach Him among the Gentiles, I did not immediately confer with flesh and blood,
17 nor did I go up to Jerusalem to those who were apostles before me; but I went to Arabia, and returned again to Damascus.
18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and remained with him fifteen days.
19 But I saw none of the other apostles except James, the Lord's brother.
(NKJ)
XXThere is a milk understanding of the Word and there is a meat understanding of the Word of God. And the devil is always there trying to stir up trouble. Trying to say that one or the other has to be wrong. This just isnt so. Those in the milk can only handle so much. And through sharing the Word some in the milk might pick up on the meat understanding of one verse and the milk understanding of the others verses. But the devil is always there trying to say someone is wrong, this just isnt so. We as in the brotherhood should be witnessing this to beginners(young christians).

Luke 6:46
46 "But why do you call Me 'Lord, Lord,' and do not do the things which I say?
(NKJ)

Matt 7:21-23
21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.
22 "Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?'
23 "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'
(NKJ)

Matt 16:25
25 "For whoever desires to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake will find it.
(NKJ)

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lonlesol
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quote:
xxxThe milk is about 3 to 4 years long, and in that time you should know that the Holy Spirit is in you. There are 9 gifts of the Holy Spirit and you will receive one or more of them gifts as evidence that the Holy Spirit is in you. Then when you are sure, the Holy Spirit will take you into the meat of the Word one verse at a time. You should know what love is by this time. The milk took you to love and the Holy Spirit. Now the Holy Spirit will lead you with that love as the first step in the meat. And the Holy Spirit will lead you inside yourself with that love, to crucify the flesh(feelings & emotions)(unclean spirits). And this should last for atleast 11 years.
What?!...Who are you to decide how many years this would take for each individual?...This makes absolutely no sense to me...We are all different, therefore not everyone spiritually learns/grows at the same pace... [Confused]
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Brotherbrown
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HOLY SPIRIT
FRUITS OF THE HOLY SPIRIT
Rev 2:29 (MILK & MEAT)
29 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches."'
2 Tim 1:7
7 For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind.
Phil 1:9-11
9 And this I pray, that your love may abound still more and more in knowledge and all discernment,
10 that you may approve the things that are excellent, that you may be sincere and without offense till the day of Christ,
11 being filled with the fruits of righteousness which are by Jesus Christ, to the glory and praise of God.
2 Cor 9:10
10 Now may He who supplies seed to the sower, and bread for food, supply and multiply the seed you have sown and increase the fruits of your righteousness,
1 Cor 14:20
20 Brethren, do not be children in understanding; however, in malice be babes, but in understanding be mature.
Matt 3:8
8 "Therefore bear fruits worthy of repentance,
Col 1:5-6
5 because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel,
6 which has come to you, as it has also in all the world, and is bringing forth fruit, as it is also among you since the day you heard and knew the grace of God in truth;
Gal 5:22-23
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
23 gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
GIFTS OF THE HOLY SPIRIT (MILK)
1 Cor 12:4-11
4 There are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
5 There are differences of ministries, but the same Lord.
6 And there are diversities of activities, but it is the same God who works all in all.
7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to each one for the profit of all:
8 for to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, to another the word of knowledge through the same Spirit,
9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healings by the same Spirit,
10 to another the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another discerning of spirits, to another different kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues.
11 But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually as He wills.
1 Cor 13:9-13
9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part.
10 But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known.
13 And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
1 Cor 14:20
20 Brethren, do not be children in understanding; however, in malice be babes, but in understanding be mature.
Heb 5:12-14
12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food.
13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
(NKJ)
VOICE OF THE HOLY SPIRIT (MEAT)
John 16:13-14
13 "However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.
14 "He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.
2 Cor 5:5
5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.
John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
James 2:26
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
James 3:17
17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy.
1 Cor 14:7-8
7 Even things without life, whether flute or harp, when they make a sound, unless they make a distinction in the sounds, how will it be known what is piped or played?
8 For if the trumpet makes an uncertain sound, who will prepare himself for battle?
1 Cor 14:10-12
10 There are, it may be, so many kinds of languages in the world, and none of them is without significance.
11 Therefore, if I do not know the meaning of the language, I shall be a foreigner to him who speaks, and he who speaks will be a foreigner to me.
12 Even so you, since you are zealous for spiritual gifts, let it be for the edification of the church that you seek to excel.
John 6:63
63 "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.
Gal 5:17-18
17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish.
18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
James 3:17
17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy.
(NKJ)

xxxThe milk is about 3 to 4 years long, and in that time you should know that the Holy Spirit is in you. There are 9 gifts of the Holy Spirit and you will receive one or more of them gifts as evidence that the Holy Spirit is in you. Then when you are sure, the Holy Spirit will take you into the meat of the Word one verse at a time. You should know what love is by this time. The milk took you to love and the Holy Spirit. Now the Holy Spirit will lead you with that love as the first step in the meat. And the Holy Spirit will lead you inside yourself with that love, to crucify the flesh(feelings & emotions)(unclean spirits). And this should last for atleast 11 years.

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