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Topic: ParaboliclySpeaking
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Hitch
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quote:
Originally posted by Caretaker:
Within the proper context of the passage, Jesus is referencing the tares and the wheat.
The tree will grow large but the birds which consistantly symbolize evil will roost in its branches.
Leaven is evil and the leaven in the meal will corrupt the meal as is readily apparent today, in the widespread apostasy and corruption within the Body of Christ today.
Matthew 13:
31
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field:
32
Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.
33
Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.
In the first parable we see the grain of mustard seed, which was sown, and is least of seeds but when mature becometh large. We see the birds of the air come and sit among the branches. In the surrounding verses we see tares among the wheat, we see the good catch being separated from the bad, in the net. In Rev. 18:2 we see reference to a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. In Matthew 13:4 we see the reference to the fowls coming and devouring them up. We see in Rev.19:21 that all the fowls were filled with their flesh. On many occasions we see the reference to birds as being a rather negative symbol. The birds seems to connote satan and demons of influence among the branches.
In the second parable of the leaven, we see three measures eventually leavening the whole. Leaven seems to be a consistently negative symbol throughout scripture, a symbol of corruption, false doctrine, sin. The leaven must be hunted down and removed from the household for Passover. The Children of Israel were to eat unleavened bread.
The Bible teaches that the closer we get to Christ's return, the more apostasy will abound and many will depart from the faith, following doctrines of devils. Many teachers reference the first parable as being the growth of the church and the Christians nestled safely amongst the boughs. They teach that the leaven represents the Holy Spirit, and that it will grow within the believer and change him over to be conformed to the image of Christ.
In my humble opinion the symbols of the Word must be interpreted consistently throughout. Being surrounded by the necessity of separating the believers from the deceivers amongst them, the two parables speak of the danger of the apostasy of the Body.
So agrees Dr. G. Campbell Morgan , in God's Methods With Man p 56;
Speaking of the leaven in M13; 'as everywhere esle in Scripture, is a type not of good but of evil;and if you carefully search your Bible, you will find that in no single instance is there variation from this principle".
Not to forget dear ol' Cy;
"The symbols have ,in Scripture ,a meaning, fixed by inspiried usage. Leaven is the principle of corruption working subtly, is invaribale used in a bad sense".
SRB p 1016
Hmmmmmmm,
13Besides the cakes, he shall offer for his offering leavened bread with the sacrifice of thanksgiving of his peace offerings.
14And of it he shall offer one out of the whole oblation for an heave offering unto the LORD, and it shall be the priest's that sprinkleth the blood of the peace offerings.
17Ye shall bring out of your habitations two wave loaves of two tenth deals; they shall be of fine flour; they shall be baken with leaven; they are the firstfruits unto the LORD.
Are 'first fruits' evil as well? and peace offerings?
As usual the great Dispensational Truths of the 'rightly divided Word 'fail when the light is turned on.
The Children of Israel were to eat unleavened bread.This is a gross misinterpretation of Scripture. There is no evidence whatever that leavend bread was forbiden Israel in the normal daily lives as implied in the this quote. In reality the opposite is true. Leavend bread was the norm as evienced by the special restrictions on its use on some occasions.
The 'fouls of the air' is another catagory.
To say' On many occasions we see the reference to birds as being a rather negative symbol. Is on par with the nonsense wrt the leaven. Many times in Scripture birds are symbolic of good even up to and including the Holy Spirit. In fact they 'good' references probably out number the 'evil'.
Regardless in Scripture there is no cut and dried pattern inwhich all the symbols used are always used the same way. The devil is as a roaring lion,,,, Jesus is the Lion of the Tribe of Judah. The owl is asociated with Molech and the dove is a harbringer of spring and the Holy Spirit.
Dispensationalism cant help but overstate its case,and in so doing exposes its weakness. To the point of twisting the great positive outlook our Lord gave of the Kingdom in His earliest days of ministry to a dark and corrupt 'spheare of profession'. And denying the most obvious truth of the parables,namely gradualism in Kingdom growth.
Take care
Hitch
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Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
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posted
Within the proper context of the passage, Jesus is referencing the tares and the wheat.
The tree will grow large but the birds which consistantly symbolize evil will roost in its branches.
Leaven is evil and the leaven in the meal will corrupt the meal as is readily apparent today, in the widespread apostasy and corruption within the Body of Christ today.
Matthew 13:
31
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field:
32
Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.
33
Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.
In the first parable we see the grain of mustard seed, which was sown, and is least of seeds but when mature becometh large. We see the birds of the air come and sit among the branches. In the surrounding verses we see tares among the wheat, we see the good catch being separated from the bad, in the net. In Rev. 18:2 we see reference to a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. In Matthew 13:4 we see the reference to the fowls coming and devouring them up. We see in Rev.19:21 that all the fowls were filled with their flesh. On many occasions we see the reference to birds as being a rather negative symbol. The birds seems to connote satan and demons of influence among the branches.
In the second parable of the leaven, we see three measures eventually leavening the whole. Leaven seems to be a consistently negative symbol throughout scripture, a symbol of corruption, false doctrine, sin. The leaven must be hunted down and removed from the household for Passover. The Children of Israel were to eat unleavened bread.
The Bible teaches that the closer we get to Christ's return, the more apostasy will abound and many will depart from the faith, following doctrines of devils. Many teachers reference the first parable as being the growth of the church and the Christians nestled safely amongst the boughs. They teach that the leaven represents the Holy Spirit, and that it will grow within the believer and change him over to be conformed to the image of Christ.
In my humble opinion the symbols of the Word must be interpreted consistently throughout. Being surrounded by the necessity of separating the believers from the deceivers amongst them, the two parables speak of the danger of the apostasy of the Body.
--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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Hitch
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Matt 13:31-33
31 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and sowed in his field:
32 Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof.
33 Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.
(KJV)
Were Scofield and his followers correct in their assumption that these parables portray a negative overview of the Gospel in history?
If 'leaven; is always evil and represents evil's subtle work is Jesus saying ;The kingdom of heaven is like unto evil? If the mustard tree is a 'monstrocity' as Pentecost once put it is Jesus saying that ;When the the kingdom is grown it becomes a monstrocity?
If Scofield is incorrect Jesus has presented a positive overview of the Gospel in history and thousands of books and papers based on that theory are 180 degrees contrary to Christ and His intentions in rendering His view of the kingdom. This means that the much talked about dark days of apostacy and the before the fact cultural retreat of the modern church have no basis in the parables. Rather the converting power of the proclaimed Gospel combined with the earthly ministry of the Holy Spirit spell doom and descending influence ,not for the church but, for antichrist.
If the 'leaven' is a positive influence, ie the positvie influence of the Gospel in history then Jesus has predicted at some point the whole will be 'leavened'. If the 'mustard tree' is not a monstrocity,but an illustration of greatness following small beginings then the historical and cultural influence of the positive aspects of the Gospel must prevail .
Carpe Vinum
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