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Author
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Topic: Has God Abandoned the Church?
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PapaJim
Community Member
Member # 6067
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posted
Yes, the church is NOT a building but a body of believers banded together with the common purpose of Glorify and worship our Lord.
My wife and I "wandered the wilderness" for 9 years searching for a church home. We survived many tests and times of discipline and then, through His Grace, we were delivered.
Our church body closely resembles the early church though we are not there yet...but God is truly "in the house".
Our pastor prefers not being called pastor. He is truly a servant-leader as are our elders. They are there to serve God and minister to His children. Everything is done for His Honor and Glory and none take credit for the work. Though we suffer the same trials and temptations as others, none face them alone. We are banded together as a family under the Banner of our Lord and Savior.
It is a true joy watching our pastor prepare for the message. He will nervously pace the whole church (in an office park) and those that don't know him would think this man is unprepared and is about to embarrass himself.
Then, he steps behind the podium. One can literally see him step aside and God puts on His "working suit". The message that is then delivered is one of power and love directly from the Word with no apology or dilution.
We have no collection plate...just a small, black box that sits on a table in the back of the church.
We have a ministry over the Internet (among others) that is having a profound effect around the world.
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May God bless your day abundantly and your joy be eternal
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Posts: 9 | From: South Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87
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posted
ihabiab, truly hit the nail on the head....
Yahweh has not abandoned the Church, but the Church has abandoned Yahweh.
Individualism is not a Church...
I just got my big toe cut off in an accident, I can live without it but I sure do miss it.
Wparr, you hang in there, ministry is needed where ever you find it.
And Yahweh never calls anyone one at anytime to compromise, for the sake of unity...
Its better to lose a hand or a foot to save the body...
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002
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ihabiab
First Post
Member # 6058
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posted
The actual light on this posted so long-ago subject would be that it's not the church or the home church that we are suppose to "go to" but how they truly lived in the book of acts.
Study it yourself to truly find out. It was an ekklesia which is literally an intentional community of believers with "all things in common" (ever wonder how anyone could have ALL THINGS in common in a church or housechurch?)
The word people nowadays call church is actually kurios not ekklesia, it was a translation error (intentional or unintentional i do not know) that has stumped the body of Christ's growth. "the church" nowadays it actually a divided structure, not a body.
We will never reach the full unity that Christ intended until we are functioning continually together. (just think- what if all the members of your physical body were separated all week and would just come together 1-6 times a week.(as if that were even possible) there would be much confusion about how to even function together.Praise God!
You can e-mail me at ihabiab@yahoo.com
Posts: 1 | Registered: Sep 2006
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epouraniois
unregistered
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posted
So much talk about man made churches, I just wonder what you all think about the subject these verses bring into view, which I inquire from the perspective that God is now building the church in heaven and not on the earth, as it is written. Keeping in mind that the word Bethel means house of God:
Mat 24:5
'For many shall come in my name, saying, I (Christ) am Christ; and shall deceive many'.
Amo 8:11 – 12
'Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD: And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the LORD, and shall not find it'.
Amo 3:14
'That in the day that I shall visit the transgressions of Israel upon him I will also visit the altars of Bethel: and the horns of the altar shall be cut off, and fall to the ground'.
Amo 4:4
'Come to Bethel, and transgress...'
Amo 5:5
'But seek not Bethel...Bethel shall come to naught'.
Amo 5:6
'Seek the LORD, and ye shall live; lest he break out like fire...and there be none to quench it in Bethel'.
Amo 7:13
'But prophesy not again any more at Bethel: for it is the king's chapel, and it is the king's court'.
Mat 23:38
'Behold, your house is left unto you desolate'.
Exo 20:25
'And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it'.
Col 3:2
'Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth'.
Col 2:6 - 10
'As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:
Rooted and built up in him, and established in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving. Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power'
With all the Biblical warnings concerning Satan's infiltration of the churches, the kingdom becoming man's kingdom, Satan's kingdom, that to know Him would rather be the much larger of concern, that when we read there is only one hope, then finding out what that one hope is should be the greatest concern for the Christian individual. I am not trying to be harsh or judgmental, only calling attention to what the Bible says about the church and the many churches of this world, which He says He left desolate...
Luk 22:31
'And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat'
God has not abandoned the church, He has moved it from the earthly sphere to the heavenly, as it is written.
For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
Col 3:3
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TEXASGRANDMA
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Member # 847
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posted
I do not know every missionary my Church supports, but God does. When I worked volunteer in the Christian food ministry, I did not know the people who came in for food, but I was pleased as punch to be there for them.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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Thunderz7
Advanced Member
Member # 31
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posted
A large building with many church members does not make a Church.
Born again believers are the Church.
Two or two thousand makes no difference.
A giant cathedral, a home meeting, or a truck stop are all Church if born again believers fellowship and have commumion with one another in true worship of YHWH.
Without that it's not Church, just church.
A group of 20 meeting in a home may not be able to support all the missionaries;
but they can give support to one they know well,who has labored among them, who's doctrine and teaching they know and agree with.
It would be totally irresponsible to support missionaries you know nothing about.
T7
Posts: 1113 | From: Northeast Alabama | Registered: Jun 2002
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Miguel
Advanced Member
Member # 47
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posted
The assembly have it is purpose the problem that it is today in the year 2005 is that more and more they want to create a building that fit 1200 people and pleasure them with 45 minutes of the word of God and 3 hours of entertainment. (Ps don’t forget the caffe lounge) The good old way of having small assemblies was that the pastor had a better understanding of the flock and be able to nurture them in biblical sounded principals not doctors visits. There is nothing wrong to give the people of God a reason to celebrate apart from the world, God made celebration! The problems lies in how is this celebration done and how much time all this events takes away from the duty of the pastor because he wants or have to be involve in every decision made robbing him from his original duty (The Word Of God), not just going to college and learn what other mans have been teaching and know I am a pastor! No, it is more than that; it is the duty of the pastor to bring good sound doctrine in a hermeneutic way from the Word of God not from few studies magazine or from J.J best selling book in how to become a Christian. Godly Recourses are good but they are not what brings life, the Word of God does. You hear a sermon that is about an hour or more you are already grumbling, but place and event and you see how many of the ones that could not be under the hearing of the Word for one hour are the last one to come out of the event (Go figure that one out). Now the assembly is not confined to any particular country or outward organization, but comprehending all believers throughout the whole world. It will continue through all ages to the end of the world. It can never be destroyed. It is an “everlasting kingdom ” a Spiritual kingdom and in here is where most believers fail trying to make a building of four walls their paradise, but they would said to me that we need to bring the Gospel and I will answer to them that yes we need to bring the Gospel not a half million dollars or more building with all the lattes gadgets!
Mar 16:15 And He said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
The world is coming unto the assemblies preaching their ways and easy life.
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Romans 9:11-24
Our Eschatology may vary even our Ecclesiology may be disputed among us but our Soteriology most assume a singularity and exclusivity which in biblical term is known as Quote; "The Narrow Way" and Quote!
Posts: 2792 | From: Stockton,Ca | Registered: Jun 2002
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BORN AGAIN
unregistered
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posted
TEXASGRANDMA, sorry about the church-hopping. I din't realize that you had moved in the last year and that you were looking for a new church. because it had seemed that over the last year you had been going from church to church, but moving to Wash explains it.
God bless, ![[Cross]](graemlins/cross.gif) BORN AGAIN
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shadowmaker
Advanced Member
Member # 3696
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posted
That first part of my post was a quote from Wparr. You didnt offended me Betty, I was simply saying some churches do go dry. I must have misunderstood your post, but I wasnt offended by any means. I think Wparr is the one who got offended.
Merry Christmas
Brad
Posts: 272 | Registered: Jul 2004
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wparr
Advanced Member
Member # 891
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posted
Actually Betty I was the target not ShadowMaker
Sorry I get overly sensitive on that.
When I started going to the chapel every Sunday to do the services, a "brother" from my church came up to me and said "it's a shame you have to goto Denver on Sundays"
When I asked him why his reply was
"Because it's Sunday, you're suppose to be in church on Sundays, not doing things like that"
Other people have treated me like a traitor because I started doing ministry outside the church.
So I admitt I get a little touchy in that area.
Sorry to accuse you Betty of trying to discourage me.
Posts: 1203 | From: Eagle Nest, NM | Registered: Jan 2003
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epouraniois
unregistered
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posted
The head of my church is no man, but the living, risen, ascended Christ,
And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church - Eph 1:22
Christ is the head of the church - Eph 5:23
And he is the head of the body, the church - Col 1:18
"The ox knoweth his owner;
And the *** his master's crib;
But Israel doth NOT KNOW,
My People doth not consider."
See how the Lord Jesus confirms this in Luke 19:42-44, as He weeps over Jerusalem. All is summed up in the opening and closing words:
"IF THOU HADST KNOWN!
even thou, at least in this thy day, the things that belong unto thy peace."
And then, turning to the reason for that judgment, He adds: "Because thou KNEWEST NOT the day of thy visitation."
And what is to be the acme of Israel's glory in the day of her restoration?
Ah! then it shall come to pass that "they shall no more teach every man his neighbor saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all KNOW ME, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD" (Jer. 31:34).
And what shall be Creation's glory: and the peace and joy of the whole earth? This sums up all:
"The earth shall be full of the KNOWLEDGE OF GOD,
As the waters cover the sea" (Isa. 11:9).
And what is the secret of our being able to glory only in the Lord, and to enjoy His blessing in this the day of our visitation? It is given in Jer. 9:23,24:
"Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom,
Neither let the mighty man glory in his might,
Let not the rich man glory in his riches:
But let him that glorieth, glory in this,
THAT HE UNDERSTANDETH AND
KNOWETH ME."
We are thus brought round, and brought back to the one great duty, which should henceforth absorb our hearts and minds, and fill our days and years; viz., to be instant in our study of the Word of God, which is given to us with the one great, express, commanding purpose--the revelation of Himself, in order that we may
GET TO KNOW HIM.
Study to shew thyself approved
unto God...
2 Timothy 2:15
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wparr
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Member # 891
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by shadowmaker:
(Revelation 3:20)
Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.
This verus, doesnt it mean asking Jesus into your heart not standing outside the door of the church? Wouldnt "opens the door", be talking about hearing the word of Jesus, accepting it, and opening the door of your heart? I dont think Jesus is going to come and sit down and have dinner with you.
The way I understand that verus is, Jesus is talking about an unsaved person. Hes saying I m knocking on the door, will you accept me? If you do hear my voice and chose to accept it, I will come into your heart. The "dine" here, wouldnt that mean the word of God and not food? So, he comes into your heart and feeds you the word of God.
This is what it means to me, am I wrong?
Merry Christmas,
Brad
Have to put that verse in context.
Who did Jesus tell John to write that letter to?
Revelation 3:14-22
(14) "To the angel of the church in Laodicea write: The Amen, the faithful and true Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God, says this:
(15) 'I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot; I wish that you were cold or hot.
(16) 'So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth.
(17) 'Because you say, "I am rich, and have become wealthy, and have need of nothing," and you do not know that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked,
(18) I advise you to buy from Me gold refined by fire so that you may become rich, and white garments so that you may clothe yourself, and that the shame of your nakedness will not be revealed; and eye salve to anoint your eyes so that you may see.
(19) 'Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent.
(20) 'Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.
(21) 'He who overcomes, I will grant to him to sit down with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.
(22) 'He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.'"
Jesus said To the angel (messenger)
To the Church (called out people - Christian congregation)
AT Laodicea .
So it was targeted towards Christians, not the lost.
A very common misunderstanding of that verse.
But is it JUST for the Church at Laodicea?
NOPE it's for ALL Christians who have an ear to hear
Posts: 1203 | From: Eagle Nest, NM | Registered: Jan 2003
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TEXASGRANDMA
Advanced Member
Member # 847
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posted
ShadowMaker,
I have no issues with you working in a ministry separate from your Church. Hubby and I worked for 5 years as volunteers at a Christian ministry not at our Church, but we also worked at our local Church.
Yes, I was trying to encourage us to have a home Church, but not trying to say we could not work in ministries separate from the Church.
I apologize if I offended you.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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wparr
Advanced Member
Member # 891
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posted
TEXASGRANDMA said
quote:
a suggestion:
Make it your New Year's Resolution to find a Church home and began to work for Jesus in your Church home. God has a place for everyone in His work.
This is what I was refering to
Posts: 1203 | From: Eagle Nest, NM | Registered: Jan 2003
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TEXASGRANDMA
Advanced Member
Member # 847
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posted
BA,
I don't understand the Church hopping. We have been going to the same Church since last January. Now it did take a year to find a Church home in Washington, but it was because our Church home in Texas we had been members, for 10 years. We both love Pastor Trent so very much that we compared every Preacher in Washington to him, and truth is no one is just like Pastor Trent. We finally realized that is was not fair to expect our new Pastor to be the same exact man.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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shadowmaker
Advanced Member
Member # 3696
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posted
(Revelation 3:20)
Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.
This verus, doesnt it mean asking Jesus into your heart not standing outside the door of the church? Wouldnt "opens the door", be talking about hearing the word of Jesus, accepting it, and opening the door of your heart? I dont think Jesus is going to come and sit down and have dinner with you.
The way I understand that verus is, Jesus is talking about an unsaved person. Hes saying I m knocking on the door, will you accept me? If you do hear my voice and chose to accept it, I will come into your heart. The "dine" here, wouldnt that mean the word of God and not food? So, he comes into your heart and feeds you the word of God.
This is what it means to me, am I wrong?
Merry Christmas,
Brad
Posts: 272 | Registered: Jul 2004
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shadowmaker
Advanced Member
Member # 3696
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posted
"So do you to discourage me from serving at the truck stop chapel because it's "not the local church" which is where you think I should be serving???
I KNOW KNOW KNOW that God has called me to serve Him thru the truck stop chapels.
I'm going to STOP letting the enemy use christians to discourage me from serving where and how God wills.
Which side of the battle are YOU on
To encourage me (of God)
or
To discourage me (of the enemy)"
Come on Wparr, she didnt say anything like that at all. Did she say, "stop going to the truck stop"? No she didnt. Did you try to discourage your work in the truckstop, no. Isnt a "chapel" a church? So, technically you are going to church, its just in a truck stop. Some people shes come into contact with, must have stopped going to church and are only meeting in homes. Meeting in homes in small groups is ok, but I agree, you should go to church if possible. The reason people in China, Korea etc meet this way, is bc they have no choice. They ll be jailed and possibly killed for just meeting in homes. We attend a church of 800-1000 and we meet in homes every week too. It allows us to worship and meet people in a church that size, that we normally wouldnt have.
Now I will disagree with Betty on God not working in a church. I do believe that a church can go dry, guess thats a good word. I believe that happens when people take control of a church and dont use it for Gods work. I know of 2 churches now that have seemed to do this. Which is a discussion in itself.
Merry Christmas
Brad
Posts: 272 | Registered: Jul 2004
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epouraniois
unregistered
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posted
Maybe slightly off topic, and I can't recall where, but isn't there a lot of verses which speak of remaining seperate, that the attributes of the chosen and faithful does not rub off onto those without, but that the bad contaminates the good?
Anyone know where those verses are, I seem to recall something about every man woman and child being wholly defiled within a 30 year period just from hanging around those with other traditions.
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BORN AGAIN
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posted
Hey, sister TEXASGRANDMA, I like your Topic, excellent.
you do seem to do a lot of church-hopping, don't you? And that may be okay, why not, right? if enough people are church-hopping, we can rotate the Body through the community churches.
one reason why I think churches are good, sister TEXASGRANDMA, is because the Holy Spirit is inside every bornagain Christian, and when the Holy Spirit comes next to another person or a group of persons or a whole assembly or congregation of persons with the Holy Spirit inside of them.
that could start a fire, you know
good Topic, BORN AGAIN
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JohnL
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Member # 462
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posted
Just a thought. Why not go to both a large congregation and a home church, possibly splitting the tithes 2/3 to 1/3?
I agree that a big church can do a lot more in world outreach and in serving domestic needs. For instance, some of the big Houston churches probably did a lot to help the hurricane survivors both from Katrina and Rita.
However, it seems that for the last generation or so, there needs to be more of a localized church serving localized needs, more than to project missionary finances and efforts to the far reaches of the world, -- ultimately, for the US and Canada to return to their christian roots, with localized personal neighborliness, rather than an impersonal, megachurch. By splitting time between both, smaller churches and bigger churches, people can bring more of the personal, old-time religion back to the big churches.
John
Posts: 119 | From: Portland, OR | Registered: Sep 2002
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wparr
Advanced Member
Member # 891
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posted
(Revelation 3:20)
Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.
Why is Jesus standing OUTSIDE the Church knocking on the door.
That means He's NOT inside of that one (and many many many others today)
Things that make you go
HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
Posts: 1203 | From: Eagle Nest, NM | Registered: Jan 2003
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wparr
Advanced Member
Member # 891
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posted
CHURCH IS PEOPLE
NOT a place.
Have you read The Book of Acts????
Home Fellowships is HOW God grew and functioned The Church.
Look at China and N Korea, and India, and Pakistan
It's Home Fellowships that are growing the Body of Christ
NOT church "social clubs"
So do you to discourage me from serving at the truck stop chapel because it's "not the local church" which is where you think I should be serving???
I KNOW KNOW KNOW that God has called me to serve Him thru the truck stop chapels.
I'm going to STOP letting the enemy use christians to discourage me from serving where and how God wills.
Which side of the battle are YOU on
To encourage me (of God)
or
To discourage me (of the enemy)
Posts: 1203 | From: Eagle Nest, NM | Registered: Jan 2003
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epouraniois
unregistered
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posted
I think we could look at the word 'comprehend' which occurs in that great prayer in the central portion of Ephesians which concerns the church. The word is built upon the word in verse 3:16 is the all inportant word 'strengthened'. The prayer says 'That he would grant you...to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man', that is the new nature which God puts in the believer, so that "17, 'That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith'. So there is the question of an indwelling Christ, too few Christians know about the indwelling Christ, but it is a part of the doctrinal section of this epistle which was written to the saints and faithful at Ephesis who represent the church who is the body of Christ of which He is the Head which is seated with Him in heavenly places at the right hand of the Father. This is a special group, and it is a special message. It is a message that is called a mystery. And it is a mystery that had been 'hid in God', and hid 'from ages and from generations',
but now, after that event of that all day meeting with the chief of the Jews in Rome there at the end of Acts, we are given a but now we are being told about being strengthened in the inner man, 'that Chrsit may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love"
That word 'grounded' has the idea of the foundation of a building, themelioo, and in the context it has dwelling in us. There is also the idea of being builded in us and walking in Him. The goal of this prayer is found in v19, but it takes all these steps to get to where we are filled unto all the fullness of God. That is the goal we have in mind, as members of this church announcement. All this is involved in those words, rooted and grounded. Resurrection power is involved in this question of rooted and grounded, and resurrection power in its fullness must be entered into this inner man before the Christ can enter into the inner man. But Love must be the root, love is what enables us to "be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height; And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fullness of God".
And this is talking about the church. The name of this church receiving this doctrine found in Ch.1: "the church, Which is His body, the fullness of Him that filleth all in all.
The verses of the prayer of the church now being formed:
Eph 3:10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might
be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord: 12 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him. 13 Wherefore I desire that ye faint not at my tribulations for you, which is your glory. 14 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, 15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named, 16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man; 17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, 18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height; 19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fullness of God. 20 Now unto him that is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us, 21 Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.
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TEXASGRANDMA
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posted
a suggestion:
Make it your New Year's Resolution to find a Church home and began to work for Jesus in your Church home. God has a place for everyone in His work. Jesus is coming soon and we need to work for Him while we still can. Even the most untalented person can send a thinking of you card to an elderly person, or call them on the phone to encourage them.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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TEXASGRANDMA
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posted
bump
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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TEXASGRANDMA
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posted
God has not abandoned the Church. Jesus, Himself, gave this promise:
Mat 18:20For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
The Church was commissioned by Jesus, to represent Him on earth. Jesus has not given up on the Church. I have heard people say that they have quit Church and only meet with a small group in their homes. While Bible Studies are great and meeting with fellow Church members in your home is also good for the soul, to abandon the Church is wrong.
The Church serves a purpose. 20 people meeting in a home cannot support all the missionaries. 20 people meeting in a home cannot support the needy.
We should not abandon Churches, but work to make Churches better. Churches are still the place where hurting people come. Without Churches there is no place for the lost to come for help.
I like Churches that are small the best, but we are going to a larger Church at the moment. (about 500). Just going from a Church of 65 to a 500 Church, I have seen how much more a bigger Church can work for God in the world.
Not everyone is cut out for a large Church, and I was never comfortable attending Lakewood Church, but there is a Church for everyone to work for God.
Don’t give up on the Church, God hasn’t.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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