Christian Message Boards: Can Anyone Explain The Purpose For These "Camps"?

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Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is a very interesting video of "camps" that are being built around the United States of America.

I recommend that for those who wish to respond to my question, that those people click on the following link and watch this video before giving an answer. That way they will better understand the question.

http://www.infowars.com/?p=215

My question is simple. Does anyone have a logical explanation for what the places in the video are, why they exist, what they are being built for, who runs them, and why there are new things being added to them, ect. ect?

I am most interested to see what anybodies theories are.

Posted by Kindgo (Member # 2) on :

Maybe for people that won't surrender thier guns???? [Confused]

TRAINS FOR FEMA CAMPS
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...59844009925554

FEMA Camp Footage (Concentrations Camps in USA)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...80067987041351

Congress is kept away from Rex 84 FEMA camp Martial Law plan
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...33576534062071

Oliver North Questioned - Rex 84 Exposed During Iran Contra
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...84794934869193

Barbed Wire for America
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...92970816363499

Posted by becauseHElives (Member # 87) on :

Most people (Christians) included can not imagine people so wicked as to torture and detain others that will not conform to their agenda!

but it has happen before in many other places, Hitler's Germany being one of the most well know...

and it will happen here in America very soon I fear.

I look at George Bush's beady eyes and I see another Hitler…

But I also see the same thing when I see Bill, Clinton, Hilary Clinton, Obama, Senator Kennedy, or any of the other Politicians in Washington DC …

I am not a rapture escapist but I do pray Lord Yeshua please come quickly.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Bill Clinton's answer to a question about the FEMA CAMPS:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BJ05vt7iURE&feature=related

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

FEMA 1: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=4zr0_9P-gz8

FEMA 2: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=e3rl1FbDT2o&feature=related

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

One purpose of such camps might just be to house our homeless selves when -say -another Katrina hits -which is not a bad idea! Better than a nation full of angry, disgusted, and might I sadly add...unneccesarily dead -people. Did we not demand such forethought?

Can they eventually be used for things which are not in the best interest of U.S. citizens and their beloved country as described in the constitution, etc...perhaps even by other powers who might gain control of them? Sure -but no more or less than any other faciltity or resource.

I am not saying there are not people who would gladly detain and even 're-educate' those who oppose the powers-that-be and their present course -nor do I think it out of the realm of possibility that some -honorable or not -could have a hand in planning such facilites to detain those who participate in a possible enemy uprising from within or without -as refugee camps for foreigners ....or perhaps even eventual civil disobedience or unrest by those who disagree here or protest or riot violently -or for whatever reason. I, personally, have not seen any of these camps, but I have met some seriously freaked-out and disturbed individuals who have more power than the average person would feel comfortable with ..(and who knows who or what motivates them?) -but I know also that many decent people are trying to prevent any unforseen disaster from being any worse than it need be.

These times are stressful and dangerous -it is difficult for those in power to be as wary as necessary and as considerate of our comfort as we would like. Some are not honorable -some are very honorable. We should be concerned and express our concerns -and it is not wrong to be angry (but sin not) -but we should not give the dishonorable, the misguided, any potential enemy or Satan any place by freaking out ourselves.

You'd better believe there are enemies out there trying to take advantage of every last thing we do, say and think in order to bring us down -and your vision may be clearer than those in power about certain things -our leaders can be duped as others have been throughout history and our plans for security and cooperation can be turned against us -we should certainly be wary of how much power we give to others and of any plans involving powers which might not have our best interest at heart -we should very much be wary of any who might "destroy" "by peace"....

but...

God declared the end from the beginning -scripture says the only way any of the unpleasant parts he has purposed can be averted is by obeying him (though when men cause the unpleasantness, it is not wrong to plead the case -especially for the sake of another) We can't make others obey God -but we can do so ourselves -if we don't, we should see to our own faults first.

As a nation we should be certain we are honorable and not hypocritical -in industry, government, and security -then God will direct and secure our paths...
Isa 10:1-3 Woe unto them that decree unrighteous decrees, and that write grievousness which they have prescribed; To turn aside the needy from judgment, and to take away the right from the poor of my people, that widows may be their prey, and that they may rob the fatherless! And what will ye do in the day of visitation, and in the desolation which shall come from far? to whom will ye flee for help? and where will ye leave your glory?

as individuals we should remember...

Jam 1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

All that said....unless we all have spare rooms and a bunch of hospitality -we need SOME FACILITIES -and, due to human nature, they might need to be rather secure.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here are two videos of an "internment camp" in Texas:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TxYxTly-yo8&feature=related

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=mntQogvuRI8&feature=related

The privatized Hutto "jail", which is also administered by Homeland Security and Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), contains more than just people who came over the boarder illegally. In fact, here is an article about palestinian refugees and CHILDREN being held in that camp:

http://www.counterpunch.org/moses12192006.html

In fact, Most of them are families including pregnant women and children who have never been accused of any wrongdoing but are forced to endure squalid conditions inside literal concentration camps.

Allied to the burgeoning growth of the prison industry and future plans to detain American citizens on masse, new plans have revived the potential scope of the camp, and a new contract to intern 600 individuals was finalized with immigration authorities in December 2005.

The facility is euphemistically called a "Residential Center," yet charges of overcrowding and poor conditions are rife, with an estimated 645 people filling a facility that has only 512 beds, as this article from the Texas Civil Rights Review clearly states -

http://texascivilrightsreview.org/phpnuke/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=708

Innocent children should not be jailed and forced to live under traumatizing and dehumanizing conditions. Plain and simple. Suspicions will undoubtedly be cast as to whether the facility in Tyler is part of a wider agenda to set up a network of internment camps that will be used to forcibly detain American citizens under emergency provisions. And I think all Americans should be concerned when these camps are popping up everywhere.

People, please. The government can eventually use them for whatever they want to. How many need to be built before we all stop them?

Posted by IAAFOTL (Member # 6414) on :

WOW! None of those links are valid anymore....that makes one go hmmm......

quote:
Originally posted by Kindgo:
Maybe for people that won't surrender thier guns????

TRAINS FOR FEMA CAMPS
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...59844009925554

FEMA Camp Footage (Concentrations Camps in USA)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...80067987041351

Congress is kept away from Rex 84 FEMA camp Martial Law plan
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...33576534062071

Oliver North Questioned - Rex 84 Exposed During Iran Contra
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...84794934869193

Barbed Wire for America
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...92970816363499

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Well, here's one citizen who is up to speed on whats going on in the United States of America:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vFNAEYQkD3s

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is the actual United States Homeland Security document that outlines the plan to build "Detention Camps" all around the United States:

http://cryptogon.com/docs/endgame.pdf

It doesn't get any better than the actual document folks.

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

I don't theorize about conspiracy -I've seen it in action, but .....Consider L.A.

One incident sparked a horrific riot. Certainly, other factors brought the situation to the point of igniting, but..... for some time police could not even enter the riot zone. The anger felt over the mistreatment of one man led some to lash out in anger -then complete madness ensued -leaving about 51 PEOPLE DEAD -many injured -and much property destroyed -with no viable way for authorites to act. How many of you would have flagged down a FEMA van or hopped a FEMA train?

In such a situation, a camp like the ones shown -and even less-than-lethal military involvement -could have been to the benefit of even those who participated in the riot -not to mention those who had nothing on their minds but getting through another ordinary day -but who are now dead or injured -or whose family members are now dead or injured -or those who lost their property and livelihoods.

The potential exists for these to be used in almost any way -and some very well may have in mind to use them to potentially subdue a majority not in agreement with the path a minority has chosen for it. The potential also exists -should we ever be invaded -that the invading force could use them to detain us.

However -the camps do nothing of themselves.
It is what is happening in peoples' minds which should concern us most -even in our own mind. We do not want to be detained, but we also do not want to increase the likelihood of these camps being used to detain us. Those in Los Angeles might have started with good principles in their minds or hearts -equality and fair treatment -being right even to be angry -but what happened was not consistent with those principles. We are told...Eph 4:26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:
Eph 4:27 Neither give place to the devil.

We should certainly plead the cause of any who are mistreated. We should certainly be wary of those who lead us in directions we would rather not go as a nation. We can even be absolutely certain that where man is involved in a matter there will be corruption and foul play... and I know all too well how a facility which seems innocent and justified -and is so under normal circumstances -can be used for extremely sinister purposes... and that those who would do such -and conspire to do such -can be found in every part of society....

...but what should we do?

Eph 4:28-32 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth. Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers. And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

2Co 10:3-4 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh: (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)

Isa 1:16-17 Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil; Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.

Rom 13:1-3 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:

Now...we know the above is not the whole story -nor was it meant to be -some rulers are terrors to good works! However, our role is the same. We can be a force for positive change -but we are not to be rebels or incite riot. Meek does not mean weak. I can't remember the exact scripture -but one of the apostles was being mistreated by representatives of the Roman government -and in response he informed them they were violating his rights as a Roman citizen. Rome actually took such things rather seriously, as I understand it, and they might have found themselves in quite a bit of trouble. You can fight for your rights -better yet, those of another -and still turn the other cheek.

Even so... you can't believe what Christ says and also believe that things will not get worse.
No matter how far off one might think his return to be, what is prophesied between now and then is a downward spiral toward man nearly destroying all flesh on the planet -I will not say sooth -IF GOD DID NOT CUT THOSE DAYS SHORT WE WOULD DESTROY ALL LIFE!

We should be making things better -but understand that God will soon make it perfect.

Meanwhile -our orders have not changed.

Here is a link -with links therein to information about the camps with a bit less theatrics involved -(I like rock and roll or whatever they call it these days -but not as a background to news.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rex_84

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Good post Isaiah.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is a video that shows Oliver North being questioned about the "continuity of government" that could end up placing millions of Americans in FEMA concentration camps:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug0IL7k3elQ

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Congressman Henry B. Gonzalez (RIP), admitted that there are actual plans to detain American citizens in the case of what the government would consider to be "terrorism".

Congressman Henry Gonzales (D,Tx) stated:

"The truth is yes...the plans are here... whereby you could, in the name of stopping terrorism... evoke the military and arrest Americans and put them in detention camps."

Here is an article in The Federal Observer which covered Mr. Gonzales's comments:

http://www.federalobserver.com/archive.php?aid=753

Here is a little more info about Congressman Gonzales:

http://archives.cnn.com/2000/ALLPOLITICS/stories/11/29/bc.obit.gonzalez.ap/

Here is a video of Congressman Henry B. Gonzalez giving his famous speech about how there are plans right now, for the arresting of American citizens and the holding of American Citizens in detention camps:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpXh7DCptaQ&eurl=http://www.fight4truth.com/concentrationcamps.htm

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Congressman Jim McDermot made a speech about the "internment camps" and the rounding up of American citizens during Martial Law in the United States:

http://www.house.gov/mcdermott/sp030311.shtml

In the speech, Congressman Jim McDermot said:

"From 1982 to 1984, Colonel Oliver North assisted FEMA in drafting its civil defense preparations. Details of those plans emerged during the 1987 Iran-Contra scandal. They included executive orders providing for suspension of the Constitution, the imposition of martial law, internment camps, and the turning over of government to the President and FEMA."

Posted by Rogg (Member # 5394) on :

The odd thing about these camps being built in the name of terrorism, and that American terrorists will be the occupants, there are new laws that have been passed that would consider Christians as terrorists.

Mark 13:9
9."But watch out for yourselves, for they will deliver you up to councils, and you will be beaten in the synagogues. You will be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony to them.

Posted by becauseHElives (Member # 87) on :

YOUR GOVERNMENT AT WORK
Homeschoolers portrayed as terrorists

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=40563

people just don't get it, Yeshua and His True Church are the enemy of the "New World Order"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sm73wOuPL60&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5I7NFracPU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncql4Fqcp7k&feature=related

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Very good links Because. Thanks for posting them.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Daniel Hamburg is a former Democratic Congressman who was elected to the 1st Congressional District of California in 1992 and also subsequently ran for Governor of California, finishing in 3rd place.

Hamburg co-wrote a well-received recent article carried by the San Francisco Chronicle in which he outlined the program to incarcerate American citizens in internment camps, which have already been publicly built, during a time of declared national emergency.

Here is the article that former Congressman Daniel Hamburg wrote about these "prison" camps for American citizens.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?...4/ED5OUPQJ7.DTL

In the article, former Congressman Hamburg states that:

"Since 9/11, and seemingly without the notice of most Americans, the federal government has assumed the authority to institute martial law, arrest a wide swath of dissidents (citizen and noncitizen alike), and detain people without legal or constitutional recourse in the event of "an emergency influx of immigrants in the U.S., or to support the rapid development of new programs."

But I have already stated before that I think what the government claims these camps are for and what they are really for is two different things. They aren't permanently for illegal aliens because our government is currently pushing for the SPPA. A "north-american partnership" AKA North American Union AKA Open borders policy.

And again, they are not just being built in the USA, they are being built all over the World.

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

Those who obey the Father and Christ should certainly think and act differently than most, and do well by pleading -and acting lawfully -against anything which takes away the rights of the poor or vulnerable of his people, or which even threatens rights under the constitution. However, to say that Christ and his church are the enemy of the 'new world order' might give some the wrong impression.

We know that man cannot successfully rule himself, but we are not to be rebels against man's rule -except in a way which is acceptable. It is good to be a voice of reason and to fight for rights in a manner consistent with the commandments and scripture, as well as human law -but we are not to engage in unlawful civil unrest/disobedience. If our leaders ignore the constitution and the law -even God's laws -let God judge them for it -and as these things might have a negative affect on you and yours -as well as those others -be meek, not weak, in fighting for rights.

(Ghandi and M. L. King used nonviolent means, and accomplished much. Others have destroyed themselves and the credibility of their cause by unwise actions.)

Still, if one suggests, promotes or engages in unlawful civil unrest/disobediece or outright rebellion, we not only err, but give some good reason to incarcerate! Such would only further the cause they are against and would not work toward the goal of positive change. The situation in the world is deteriorating, but we should not. We should return good for evil. Many who do well will be persecuted severely -being considered enemies flasely -and have reward, but those who err in such a manner have no reward.

Daniel and his friends did not attempt to overthrow the king, but obeyed God even when threatened with death -though they disobeyed the king -quite politely -when it meant sinning and searing their conscience -and God saved them out of troubles.

To be a soldier for CHRIST is to NOT become entangled in the affairs of this world, though we can act rightly against wrongs.

2Ti 2:3 Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.
2Ti 2:4 No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.
2Ti 2:5 And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully.

and remember.....

Mat 10:16 Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and HARMLESS AS DOVES.
Mat 10:17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues;

...meanwhile, we should be certain we are striving to obey and please God -and making sure we are not deceived in our beliefs.

God already has a remedy for man's self-rule and tyranny -the rule of Christ on earth -and we should act as citizens of that kingdom now, though it has not yet come in power and glory. Men -influenced by Satan -will resist this, and hate the followers of God for what God is doing -but we should not give them good reason. Vengeance is God's -we are to be peacemakers. Let him deal with those who resist him.

Dan 11:32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.
Dan 11:33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.
Dan 11:34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.
Dan 11:35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

Unless we turn to God as a nation it is unlikely they will have a chance to use these camps at all -though someone else might.

Isa 10:1 Woe unto them that decree unrighteous decrees, and that write grievousness which they have prescribed;
Isa 10:2 To turn aside the needy from judgment, and to take away the right from the poor of my people, that widows may be their prey, and that they may rob the fatherless!
Isa 10:3 And what will ye do in the day of visitation, and in the desolation which shall come from far? to whom will ye flee for help? and where will ye leave your glory?
Isa 10:4 Without me they shall bow down under the prisoners, and they shall fall under the slain. For all this his anger is not turned away, but his hand is stretched out still.

Dan 11:14 And in those times there shall many stand up against the king of the south: also the robbers of thy people shall exalt themselves to establish the vision; but they shall fall.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Right, and Isaiah, honestly, I can take an enormous amount of punishment.

The only time I would probably ever really kill someone is if they were attempting to hurt a member of my family or someone else in front of me. If someone was attempting to kill someone who I know in front of me, I could not stand by and watch. If it was a family member, I would spill their blood in front of me before I would allow them to hurt my Mother or Sister and such.

I would accept full responsibility for my actions. No matter what the consequences.

When a soldier kills another soldier in battle, no-one second guesses what their fate will be. No-one says, "that soldier is going to hell for eternity now for killing his "enemy" combatant." Quite the opposite in fact. Instead, the soldier is praised by his fellow citizens for serving his country.

When a police-officer kills a criminal in defense in the "line of duty", he is given an award for his efforts, and is potrayed as a hero by his fellow countrymen.

I would expect no less from anyone else on this planet if I killed in defense of my family.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Ritt Goldstein, an investigative reporter for the Herald, writes that recent pronouncements from the Bush administration and national security initiatives put in place in the Reagan era could see internment camps and martial law in the United States:

http://www.arizona.indymedia.org/news/2002/08/3646

In the article, Ritt Goldstein writes:

America as you know it is changing dramatically. The democratic freedoms which long defined American life are under siege. Today's Bush administration is moving towards America's military pursuing law enforcement, internment camps are on the horizon, and a member of the US Civil Rights Commission previously broached Arab-American internment.

Hidden behind FEMA’s benevolent face as the body whose chief responsibility is disaster relief, another FEMA exists. It is a FEMA that few know has been “charged by the Bush Administration with leading the nation’s anti-terrorism effort”, and a FEMA whose history includes nightmarish episodes in this vein.

Here is another article by Mr. Goldstein that details plans for Martial Law in the United States which was published in the Sydney, Australia, Morning Herald:

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/07/27/...l?oneclick=true

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

That is a subject of some controversy -but most see it the way you do. Some who believe such killing does violate the commandment would not be going against their conscience to use less than lethal means -especially prayer, but acting is not out of the question... some will not -out of conscience -become armed policemen or soldiers, for example (nor can one who is a soldier for Christ be an asset who answers first to human government -this would cause the one to be innefectual in both roles -though the powers-that-be could gain serendipitous advantage should they not get in God's way and align themselves with God, rather than trying to manipulate God's people to their own ends -which brings the wrath of God on them -such as in Jeremiah, when the powers-that-were found his prophesying to be inconvenient to their plans -though obviously accurate -and said "report...and we will report it"* -that is -tell us privately and we'll go public with it as we see fit -rather than letting him prophesy openly of the only thing which could save Israel... God's plan is to declare to the people what will be before it happens and to give opportunity to repent -which could avert disaster -Man's plan is to gain exclusive knowledge for advantage, keep people in the dark and easily manipulated -which is part of the reason God has purposed disasters)

What if it happened when you were not around? Would it still be ok to kill them? ..not to be argumentative -just discussing ...and most people thinking something is right is certainly not any criteria to go by.

There are those who are expert not only at war, but the psychological -less openly confrontational -aspects thereof (not always limited to war), and one of their tactics is to coerce by threatening even loved ones, leaving the target little or no defense -putting themselves in a position where you could do nothing, but they could do anything they wanted. We are speaking of killing, but how many people would sin when commanded by men -rather then refusing, praying and trusting God -when their loved ones were not around -but threatened. The inventors of evil are quite crafty, and Satan is very crafty at breaking down one's faith. Cowards rarely leave you the option of kicking their butts, but if they did they might, however, wish they were dead. I do not will any harm, but would defend another if wise -simply not to death -but there is much more to the story -every situation is different. You sin or you don't. For those who believe killing is ok under certain circumstances, they do not sear their conscience, but I do not believe this is as God intends. Be angry -sin not.

There are examples of God telling men to go and kill -but they were just that -I do not see that we now have direct orders to do so.

People will kill -and continue to do so -increasingly -for whatever reason -until Christ rules. I am no judge -this is how I see it after much prayer and very much reason to be humanly justified in killing those who harm my loved ones! If my human nature had its way, there would be a goodly heap of bodies...but.. it is also one of their tactics to cause a person to do just that -and worse. Not to mention I have to deal with people who do harm to me and mine who are themselves threatened -along with their loved ones -though many of the cowards hide behind this excuse. It is difficult to know who to be angry with and who to be understanding with -which is also part of how they break people down.....But vengeance is God's -and the slain of the Lord will be many (Isa 66:16) -that said -I do what I can.

It's really a whole 'nother subject....

(Unfortunately, if rights are continually threatened, and justice scoffed at, we may well have widespread civil disobedience -and full camps. Men think they must control the situation on earth -this always leads to tyranny, corruption and abuse -and it doesn't look as though they will be turning anything over to God willingly. Sad that they ignore the people and build camps to potentially incarcerate them in the eventuality they might disagree. This is not democracy -this is not for, by and of the people. This is not America -even if there were no camps. To say we must be with the powers-that-be or with the terrorists is simplistic and stupid. It's tiring to worry about terrorists and your own government at the same time!
I have a great admiration for those who put themselves at risk to defend others and free a country from tyranny (though I do not believe many soldiers know to what ultimate end they are employed -nor do I think they would agree to it) -but I cannot put myself in the position to kill -it would not be of faith. There is an interesting example in the OT of Moses being overcome with anger at the abuse of his people, and killing a taskmaster -about which God was quite understanding -not saying he was pleased with the act, but he didn't make a great deal of it to Moses -but said he, too, felt for Israel. Moses did not, however, apprently, plan to do so, necessarily think it a viable option beforehand, nor would he probably advise others to do so.)

Not an easy subject...

..it has to do with how you read this verse -and how God intended it -the two might be different...

Luk 3:14 And the soldiers likewise demanded of him, saying, And what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do violence to no man, neither accuse any falsely; and be content with your wages.

-essentially, do not kill, bear false witness, or covet.

*Jer 20:8 For since I spake, I cried out, I cried violence and spoil; because the word of the LORD was made a reproach unto me, and a derision, daily.
Jer 20:9 Then I said, I will not make mention of him, nor speak any more in his name. But his word was in mine heart as a burning fire shut up in my bones, and I was weary with forbearing, and I could not stay.
Jer 20:10 For I heard the defaming of many, fear on every side. Report, say they, and we will report it. All my familiars watched for my halting, saying, Peradventure he will be enticed, and we shall prevail against him, and we shall take our revenge on him.
Jer 20:11 But the LORD is with me as a mighty terrible one: therefore my persecutors shall stumble, and they shall not prevail: they shall be greatly ashamed; for they shall not prosper: their everlasting confusion shall never be forgotten.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is a copy of an article written by Jonathan Turley of the Los Angeles Times, On August 14th, 2002 entitled Camps for Citizens: Ashcroft’s Hellish Vision:

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/CfCAHV.pdf

In the article, Jonathan Turley writes:

Atty. Gen. John Ashcroft’s announced desire for camps for U.S. citizens he deems to be "enemy combatants" has moved him from merely being a political embarrassment to being a constitutional menace.

Ashcroft’s plan, disclosed last week but little publicized, would allow him to order the indefinite incarceration of U.S. citizens and summarily strip them of their constitutional rights and access to the courts by declaring them enemy combatants.

The proposed camp plan should trigger immediate congressional hearings and
reconsideration of Ashcroft’s fitness for this important office. Whereas Al Qaeda is a threat to the lives of our citizens, Ashcroft has become a clear and present threat to our liberties.

The camp plan was forged at an optimistic time for Ashcroft’s small inner circle, which has been carefully watching to test cases to see whether this vision could become a reality.

The cases of Jose Padilla and Yaser Esam Hamdi will determine whether U.S. citizens can be held without charges and subject to the arbitrary and unchecked authority of the government.

Jonathan Turley's Blog:

http://jonathanturley.org/

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

Camps cramps! Worry about your relationship. But since we are on the subject, I used to hear this preacher who was yakking all about race wars in the U.S. It seemed ridiculous. Now however, with the possibility of Obama, it doesn't seem so remote. I have pondered that if he beats out Hillary, but loses the presidency, that there will be violence on the streets. Incredible! Having lived through some of the things that have happened in the sixties, this seems likely unless we draw near to God, and brother in Christ to brother.

The other thing i have considered is if Obama wins, it is harder to picture what may be, but it is disconcerting to consider that it might not be good. Especially, if some loonie takes him out, or tries, hell will turn loose.

I don't like to speak negatively about him, but sometimes the glitz and glitter of someone who appears charismatic as he does, without revealing more of his substance, is an indication of someone who has a face that does not reveal his inner thinking and motivation. I would like to hear from people who have been around him in years gone by.

It is good for the church to be prepared. Many good people will be blinded by their hopes, and will support someone who is not good for the country until something obviously ugly rears its head to reveal the truth. Then it will likely be too late.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Than you have to consider that "chaos in the streets" is exactly what certain members of our government are hoping for.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Nat Hentoff (born June 10, 1925) is an American historian, novelist, and columnist for the Village Voice, Legal Times, Washington Times, The Progressive, Editor & Publisher, Free Inquiry and Jewish World Review.

Nat Hentoff received his B.A. with the highest honors from Northeastern University and did graduate work at Harvard. He was a Fulbright fellow at the Sorbonne in Paris in 1950. From 1953 through 1957 he was associate editor of Down Beat magazine. He was awarded a Guggenheim Fellowship in education and an American Bar Association Silver Gavel Award in 1980 for his coverage of the law and criminal justice in his columns. In 1985 he was awarded an honorary Doctorate of Laws by Northeastern University.

Here is an article by Nat Hentoff in the Village Voice in which he also outlines General Ashcroft's plans for Detention Camps in the United States:

http://www.villagevoice.com/news/0236,hentoff,38006,6.html

In the article, Hentoff states:

"Now more Americans are also going to be dispossessed of every fundamental legal right in our system of justice and put into camps."

Here is more info about Nat Hentoff:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nat_Hentoff

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Anita Ramasastry is a law professor at the University of Washington School of Law in Seattle and a director of the Shidler Center for Law, Commerce & Technology. She is also a regular columnist for the online legal commentary Writ.

Ramasastry earned a B.A. in 1988 from Harvard University, a M.A. in 1990 from University of Sydney, and a J.D. in 1992 from Harvard Law School.

Here is a CNN news article about Ashcrofts plan for detention camps in America done by Anita Ramasastry:

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/LAW/08/columns/fl.ramasastry.detainees/

In the article, Anita Ramasastry states:

Attorney General Ashcroft and the White House are considering creating military detention camps for all U.S. citizens deemed by the administration to be enemy combatants.

The internees will be deemed enemy combatants. By whom? By the military alone -- without any right to judicial review in a federal court or otherwise.

The government's position is that its own decision as to who is an enemy combatant is binding on federal courts, and that it need not even offer the courts individualized facts to support particular detention decisions.

We now are faced with a scary prospect -- indefinite detention of multiple citizens because the government decides they are dangerous. The mere suggestion of camps or group detention facilities implies that the Executive is, in fact, considering using its newfound citizen-combatant detention program on a broader scale.

Here is more information about Anita Ramasastry:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Ramasastry

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is a Pacific News article published in 2006 about a $385 million contract for Halliburton subsidiary KBR to build concentration camps all across the United States:

http://news.pacificnews.org/news/view_arti...06fe03f4c9b3a77

In the article, it states that:

Almost no paper so far has discussed the possibility that detention centers could be used to detain American citizens if the Bush administration were to declare martial law.

Plans for detention facilities or camps have a long history, going back to fears in the 1970s of a national uprising by black militants.

After 9/11, new martial law plans began to surface similar to those of FEMA in the 1980s. In January 2002 the Pentagon submitted a proposal for deploying troops on American streets.

It is clear that the Bush administration is thinking seriously about martial law. A multimillion program for detention facilities will greatly increase NORTHCOM's ability to respond to any domestic disorders.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is another article from MarketWatch covering the same story about how the government is hiring Halliburton subsidiary KBR with a 385 million contract to build concentration camps all across the United States:

http://www.marketwatch.com/News/Story/Stor...77662-858254656

In the article, it states that:

The contract may also provide migrant detention support to other government organizations in the event of an immigration emergency, as well as the development of a plan to react to a national emergency (Which is whatever the government deems it to be), such as a natural disaster, the company said.

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

I saw a bumper sticker once that said..

"WHERE ARE WE GOING? ...AND WHY AM I IN THIS HANDBASKET?"

We may not know what exactly is going wrong all of the time -but we can certainly see that things are going wrong. Any way you slice it, it doesn't bode well for our future....

[wiggle7]

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is another article from Alternet covering the same story about how the government is hiring Halliburton subsidiary KBR with a 385 million contract to build concentration camps all across the United States:

http://www.alternet.org/rights/42458/

In the article, it states that:

The Military Commissions Act of 2006 governing the treatment of detainees is the culmination of relentless fear-mongering by the Bush administration since the September 11 terrorist attacks.

Because the bill was adopted with lightning speed, barely anyone noticed that it empowers Bush to declare not just aliens, but also U.S. citizens, "unlawful enemy combatants."

Bush & Co. has portrayed the bill as a tough way to deal with aliens to protect us against terrorism. Frightened they might lose their majority in Congress in the November elections, the Republicans rammed the bill through Congress with little substantive debate.

Anyone who donates money to a charity that turns up on Bush's list of "terrorist" organizations, or who speaks out against the government's policies could be declared an "unlawful enemy combatant" and imprisoned indefinitely. That includes American citizens.

Kellogg Brown & Root, a subsidiary of Cheney's Halliburton, is constructing a huge facility at an undisclosed location to hold tens of thousands of undesirables.

We can expect Bush to continue to exploit 9/11 to strip us of more of our liberties. Our constitutional right to dissent is in serious jeopardy. Benjamin Franklin's prescient warning should give us pause: "They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security."

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is another article from CounterPunch which talks about the $385 Million for concentration camps in the United States of America:

http://www.counterpunch.org/sigal03162006.html

In the article, it states:

The federal government has awarded a $385 million contract for the construction of 'temporary detention facilities' inside the United States as part of the Immigration Service's Detention and Removal Program. The contract was given to Kellogg, Root & Brown, a subsidiary of Halliburton. The camps would be used in the event of an "emergency", said Jamie Zuieback, an Immigration service official.

Here is another article from SourceWatch.com about the same $385 Million Dollar Contract to built the concentration camps in the USA:

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title...entration_camps

In the article, it states that:

On January 24, 2006, the U.S. Department of Homeland Security's (DHS) U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) component awarded an Indefinite Delivery/Indefinite Quantity (IDIQ) contingency contract to Halliburton subsidiary Kellogg Brown and Root (KBR) to "support ICE facilities in the event of an emergency"—in essence, American concentration camps

With a maximum total value of $385 million over a five-year term, consisting of a one-year based period and four one-year options, the competitively awarded contract will be executed by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, Fort Worth District. KBR held the previous ICE contract from 2000 through 2005.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is another article from Global Research that talks about the $385 million dollar deal to build concentration camps in the United States:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=DAL20060228&articleId=2045

In the article, it states that:

A recently announced contract for a Halliburton subsidiary to build immigrant detention facilities is part of a longer-term Homeland Security plan titled ENDGAME, which sets as its goal the removal of "all removable aliens" and "potential terrorists." Scott is author of "Drugs, Oil, and War: The United States in Afghanistan, Colombia, and Indochina" (Rowman & Littlefield, 2003). He is completing a book on "The Road to 9/11." Visit his Web site at:

http://socrates.berkeley.edu/~pdscott/index.html

The Halliburton subsidiary KBR (formerly Brown and Root) announced on Jan. 24 that it had been awarded a $385 million contingency contract by the Department of Homeland Security to build detention camps. Two weeks later, on Feb. 6, Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff announced that the Fiscal Year 2007 federal budget would allocate over $400 million to add 6,700 additional detention beds (an increase of 32 percent over 2006). This $400 million allocation is more than a four-fold increase over the FY 2006 budget, which provided only $90 million for the same purpose.

ENDGAME's crash program is designed to house additional detainees who have not been convicted of crimes.

Significantly, both the KBR contract and the ENDGAME plan are open-ended. The contract calls for a response to "an emergency influx of immigrants, or to support the rapid development of new programs" in the event of other emergencies, such as "a natural disaster." "New programs" is of course a term with no precise limitation. So, in the current administration, is ENDGAME's goal of removing "potential terrorists."

It is relevant that in 2002, Attorney General John Ashcroft announced his desire to see camps for U.S. citizens deemed to be "enemy combatants." In a speech to the Council on Foreign Relations, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld spoke of the harm being done to the country's security, not just by the enemy, but also by what he called "news informers" who needed to be combated in "a contest of wills." Two days earlier, citing speeches critical of Bush by Al Gore, John Kerry, and Howard Dean, conservative columnist Ben Shapiro called for "legislation to prosecute such sedition."

Since 9/11 the Bush administration has implemented a number of inter-related programs, which had been planned for secretly in the 1980s under President Reagan. These so-called "Continuity of Government" or COG proposals included vastly expanded detention capabilities, warrantless eavesdropping and detention, and preparations for greater use of martial law.

North's exercise, which reportedly contemplated possible suspension of the United States Constitution, led to questions being asked during the Iran-Contra Hearings. One concern then was that North's plans for expanded internment and detention facilities would not be confined to "refugees" alone.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is a 2006 Article from Global Research that gives a detailed description on the concentration camps that FEMA is currently constructing in the United States:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?con...&articleId=3010

In the article, it states that:

We are dangerously close to a situation where ~ if the American people took to the streets in righteous indignation or if there were another 9/11 ~ a mechanism for martial law could be quickly implemented and carried out under REX 84.

The Cheney/Bush administration has a plan which would accommodate the detention of large numbers of American citizens during times of emergency.

Existence of the Rex 84 plan was first revealed during the Iran-Contra Hearings in 1987, and subsequently reported by the Miami Herald on July 5, 1987:

" These camps are to be operated by FEMA should martial law need to be implemented in the United States and all it would take is a presidential signature on a proclamation and the attorney general's signature on a warrant to which a list of names is attached."

There over 800 prison camps in the United States, all fully operational and ready to receive prisoners. They are all staffed and even surrounded by full-time guards, but they are all empty. These camps are to be operated by FEMA should martial law need to be implemented in the United States and all it would take is a presidential signature on a proclamation and the attorney general's signature on a warrant to which a list of names is attached.

The camps all have railroad facilities as well as roads leading to and from the detention facilities. Many also have an airport nearby. The majority of the camps can house a population of 20,000 prisoners.

Currently, the largest of these facilities is just outside of Fairbanks, Alaska. The Alaskan facility is a massive mental health facility and can hold thousands of people.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is a 2008 KLTV News Article about FEMA planning to use TRAINS to move massive amounts of people during the next "Emergency Situation":

http://www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=785...nav=menu117_2_1

In the article, it states that:

After 2005's Hurricane Katrina, Amtrak was hired to be on hand if another hurricane struck -- to evacuate people with special needs.

Cannon says FEMA is now devising disaster plans for other Gulf Coast cities based on the New Orleans model.

City officials say Congress and FEMA should create a national plan to use trains in disasters.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is another 2008 WKYC News Article about how FEMA plans to use TRAINS to "evacuate" people during the next "National Emergency":

http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=83188

In the article, it states that:

However, an assistant administrator of the Federal Emergency Management Agency says it won't be easy. Glenn Cannon told a congressional subcommittee that rights of way for most railroads are privately owned by freight companies. And he says there's no congressional mandate to use railroads for evacuations.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is another 2008 WTOCTV News Article about FEMA and the trains:

http://www.wtoctv.com/Global/story.asp?S=7...07&nav=0qq64h3l

In the article it states that:

The expanded use of passenger trains to evacuate the sick and elderly in is under consideration.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Folks, DO NOT GET ON THOSE TRAINS.

Phil Schneider talked about FEMA trains to take people to camps over 10 years ago.

Phil Schneider was a geologist and structural engineer, who became known in the early 1990's for giving lectures about his alleged work inside top secret facilities being built by the United States government.

Here is a video of Phil Schneider talking about FEMA trains and the Gunderson Steel Fabrication company which he claimed was building prisoner cars (train cars) in the 1990's in preparation for their New World Order plans. He talks about shackles in the trains, ect:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8180572860678943465&q=schneider+phil

Phil Schneider was an extraordinarily brave man who knew that he was going to be killed because of the information he was revealing to the American public in the Spring/Summer of 1995. He was murdered on or about January 10, 1996 in Oregon. His ex-wife, Cynthia Drayer, was notified about a week after his death. Local police originally called it a natural death by stroke, but later changed it to suicide when an autopsy (insisted upon by Phil's ex-wife) revealed marks around his throat-indicating death by strangulation.

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

In the link above, the gentleman apparently said he was in a firefight with aliens.

I can't comment on what another may or may not have experienced, but for most that would probably do away with any credibility he had.

I do know that people have seen some rather unusual things, and that God has chosen our delusions, as the bible puts it-

Isa 66:4 I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not.

-and Ezekiel's "wheel" visions seem to suggest they might have something to do with focus on UFO's -as we wonder what is out there and forget him more and more -and I realize that when Christ returns, those who do not understand scripture might well consider him an alien invader....

..but it's not something we need to worry about.

I also think these camps are not something we need to worry about.

Don't get me wrong -I'm not saying some folks aren't up to no good, but God is in control..
..and just as we don't need to worry about an alien invasion -as we know that Christ will return and we will have peace, so we ought to realize that what will be from now until Christ returns HAS BEEN DECLARED FROM THE BEGINNING.
If God has decreed something will come to pass, it will. He either knows it will -or makes it so.

It is not wrong to make people aware and so help them better their situations and make better choices -even preventing great sorrows. To this end, we should repent so that God relents of what evils he has purposed for us(Jer 21:10 as an example), and help clarify what is indeed wrong with what we do so that we might repent. Also, if we worry too much about what could happen, we might not spend enought time reading about exactly what God said WOULD happen.

Widespread civil unrest is not out of the realm of possibility -nor is it imposible that the few imose their will on many, dealing harshly with those who resist -but God already knows where we will be from now until the end. If we change our ways, our lot may improve -certainly in the end, but even so -God said that many would fall -to try them -to purge them -and to make them white -that many would be killed by the sword, etc... The near future will not be comfortable for most, to say the least.

If there are some whose plans are less than honorable, and they impose their evil will for gain and inordinate control over the public -such should be worried God does not give them over to their enemies -and allow their own camps to be used to contain them..... but those who sincerely seek God need not worry -bad things will happen -but the end will be worth it.

Isa 10:1 Woe unto them that decree unrighteous decrees, and that write grievousness which they have prescribed;
Isa 10:2 To turn aside the needy from judgment, and to take away the right from the poor of my people, that widows may be their prey, and that they may rob the fatherless!
Isa 10:3 And what will ye do in the day of visitation, and in the desolation which shall come from far? to whom will ye flee for help? and where will ye leave your glory?
Isa 10:4 Without me they shall bow down under the prisoners, and they shall fall under the slain. For all this his anger is not turned away, but his hand is stretched out still.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Well Isaiah,

I will not let my beliefs in Aliens come between us and our work on spreading knowledge.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Well I'm not buying it at all. I think this is a nightmare scenario.

Trains for the sick and elderly? Lol. Are you serious? FEMA didn't do squat when the sick and elderly were drowning and dying in their wheelchairs during that hellish week of Huricane Katrina. Do you people really believe that FEMA is a loving, fuzzy, cuddly organization that cares so much about the sick and the elderly? For crying out loud they are now tied into the United States Department of Defense!

And another thing, the amount of train cars being built, and the amount of trains being built, can hold WAY WAY more people in them than just the sick and the elderly. Whats all the extra space for? Hmmm...could it be MORE people?

And where are these trains going to bring the people that are filled with them? Are they going to cruise past a homeless shelter and drop them off? lol. Hell no. There aren't even enough Homeless shelters to hold them all. Are they going to drop them in other cities? Yeah right. The cities that they were dropped in would be filled to their maximum capacity, and the economies of those cities would be strained with all the new people to feed and clothe. So thats not going to happen.

Hmmm....so what does that leave us with folks? Can we say, The over 800 FEMA concentration camps that can hold millions of people in total? Can we say, the same camps from the same videos I posted that are located RIGHT NEXT TO the train tracks?

I'm telling you what. There is no way in hell I'm getting on any FEMA train, and going to any camp where they are going to hold me "indefinately". F-ck that.

Straight from the article:

NEW ORLEANS (AP) - The Federal Emergency Management Agency may expand the use of passenger trains to evacuate the sick and elderly in advance of hurricanes across the Gulf Coast, a FEMA official said.

Glenn Cannon, a FEMA assistant administrator, told a congressional subcommittee meeting in New Orleans on Monday that his agency is looking at passenger trains as a method of getting people out of harm's way.

After Hurricane Katrina hit in August 2005, Amtrak was hired to be on hand to evacuate people if another disaster hit.

And then there is this very worrysome statement:

But, he said, turning railways into evacuation routes won't be easy.

Rights of way for most railroads are privately owned by freight companies, and there is no congressional mandate to use railroads for evacuations.

So what does that mean? Hmmm..does that mean that FEMA and/or the President and/or congress is going to physically change the laws so that they can take posession of most railways in our country for their own purposes? VERY, VERY, Scary folks.

Please look at this with an open mind and open EYES. We need to do something. It's all coming into fruition, and if we don't do anything we're going to be screwed in the end.

The mind is like a parachute folks. It works better when it's open.

http://www.wtopnews.com/index.php?nid=104&sid=1343646

Posted by becauseHElives (Member # 87) on :

The American Government is up to no good.

the treaties systematically given to the american people have destroyed a once great Nation.

NAFTA, GAT, the WTO, China Trade, and every other trade agreement have destroyed America financially

and now with the Trans-Texas Corridor being forced upon the American public, the Nation of America will be destroyed.

If Yeshua tarries His coming Christians in America will get to know first hand what "the Purpose for these "Camp" are for!

Yahweh have Mercy on us all!

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

There are numerous covert "concentration camps" located across America, and Canada for the hour of martial law and the seizure of this nation for the New World Order.

Some of these facilities are also incorporated into the military's DUMB's (deep underground military facilities).

These numerous camps have been established to house and supossably to ultimately terminate what they consistently referred to as "the resisters of the New World Order".

But what IS a resister of the New World Order? The definition they (our friendly US government) have applied will surprise you! A "resister" includes:

- A Christian (firm Bible believer)

- A Constitutionalist

- A Patriot

- A gun owner who refuse to relinquish 2nd
Amendment rights

- Anyone who adheres to the concepts of maintaining our national sovereignty, the
Constitution and rejects the concept of United Nations world government control in it's place is labled by the government as a "resister of the New World Order."

- Those radio broadcasters, lecturers, authors, and pastors who publicly come against the New World Order.

Have you ever listened to radio broadcasts exposing the NWO by people such as Alex Jones (www.infowars.com) or Texe Marrs, or Chris Gurner (on Patriot stations such as Genesis Broadcasting Network)? They are all telling America the truth about the New World Order and it's dark agenda for America via the UN/martial law. And each one knows that they are irrevocably marked for persecution under the NWO/martial law agenda our nation is now entering into. People like them are the more open and obvious examples of "resisters of the NWO."

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Even now, sitting silently in classified government computers are the names of millions of fellow American Patriots ALREADY PROFILED as "resisters of the NWO." According to many sources, such people have been marked for priority arrest, to be transported to these modern concentration camps (under FEMA or military jurisdiction,) to be interrogated, and ultimately, according to many different sources, to be terminated.

Interrogation? "Are you a member of the militia? Who is your leader? Where are your secret cells located? How many secret weapons caches do you have?" Or, "Who is your Pastor? Where are your food supplies hidden? How many belong to your prayer group?" Etc.

The CIA and the military have been secretly perfecting both mind control drugs and torture techniques designed to force compliance or to be used in interrogation sessions.

Some sources have even stated that under Martial Law those arrested can anticipate "...brutal rape, torture and death once they are arrested and taken to the camps!"

The camps stand to this day and will be activated under martial law. And are being built as we speak. Particularly hated by the NWO agenda are Christians who, for Bible-based reasons, will refuse to participate in their Luciferic based NWO. Former and current Satanists, who are the backbone of the NWO, have admitted this.

This is one of the main reasons why Christians will be considered a major target for arrest and removal as NWO takeover progresses in America. How many times can it be emphasized that it is time to wake up the churches in America?

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Many have stated that those "resisters of the NWO" who are not immediately terminated at the supposable many gassing/cremating or microwaving facilities across America and Canada may instead be diverted to facilities such as those located in deep underground military bases for human experimentation UNTIL THEY EXPIRE.

Remember Joseph Mengele and the Nazi doctors? Sadly, history DOES repeat itself.

It has also been said that the "resisters" could be turned over to Satanist covens for Human sacrifice.

A former high level Illuminati/Satanist named Doc Marquis once stated that when he was personally flown out to the FEMA gassing/crematory detention camp in the Mojave (it has a landing strip) he rejoiced as he was shown around this deadly compound.

Mr. Marquis stated:

"My sentiments? I rejoiced over the thought that Christians would be terminated in this place."

This is the end-time hour in which we live, friends. And in order to have mass beheading terminations of so many Christian resisters of the NWO, you must have the tools with which to do it.

For Christians who would raise eyebrows at this, I will simply refer them to the Bible as evidence:

Rev. 20:4

"And I saw the souls of them who were beheaded for the witness of Jesus and for the word of God..."

While it is true that many, including the Apostle Paul, have been beheaded for the witness of Jesus, if you read it you will see that it is SPECIFICALLY referring to this present time frame of the Kingdom of Satan on Earth (the Kingdom of the Beast or AntiChrist) and the period when the cashless society will be manifested with the mark (Digital Angel/Veri-Chip/RFID Chip?) in one's hand or forehead and it's blasphemous World religious system.

If you would like to purchase a book written by Doc Marquis then visit the following website:

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/002-3246399-7828050?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=Doc+Marquis

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

I did not mean to ridicule any person's beliefs -I just wrote what I was thinking at the time.

To believe there might be life in other places now is rather like believing the world was not flat way back when...God did not say we were absolutely alone in the universe -we may learn differently that we now believe- and people who see strange things -whether or not they make assumptions as to their origin -sometimes do not speak of them due to the very real possibility of being shunned, ridiculed, etc...that's all I was saying.

Whole cities have witnessed very strange events -Mexico City, for example. Something happened.

I was also pointing out that these things will have an effect on how people perceive what God is doing, and that God may well be doing them to influence human perception -to guide it -as our minds wander away from him he may well be using this to bring them back-in very dramatic fashion indeed.

God is quoted as saying "Isa 66:4 I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer......"

There is nothing to be more feared, by those who think up scenarios for which to be prepare, than facing beings from elsewhere with more advanced technologies and greater power.

These things may be part of how God gathers nations to Meggido -and to those who do not believe in Christ, what else could they perceive when he returns -and when they experience HIS ARMY?

Some believe the following refers to a human army -but this is not the case -this is God's army!

Joe 2:1 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand;
Joe 2:2 A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations.
Joe 2:3 A fire devoureth before them; and behind them a flame burneth: the land is as the garden of Eden before them, and behind them a desolate wilderness; yea, and nothing shall escape them.
Joe 2:4 The appearance of them is as the appearance of horses; and as horsemen, so shall they run.
Joe 2:5 Like the noise of chariots on the tops of mountains shall they leap, like the noise of a flame of fire that devoureth the stubble, as a strong people set in battle array.
Joe 2:6 Before their face the people shall be much pained: all faces shall gather blackness.
Joe 2:7 They shall run like mighty men; they shall climb the wall like men of war; and they shall march every one on his ways, and they shall not break their ranks:
Joe 2:8 Neither shall one thrust another; they shall walk every one in his path: and when they fall upon the sword, they shall not be wounded.
Joe 2:9 They shall run to and fro in the city; they shall run upon the wall, they shall climb up upon the houses; they shall enter in at the windows like a thief.
Joe 2:10 The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining:
Joe 2:11 And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it?

Sounds like a worst fear to me!

Zec 14:3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
Zec 14:4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

Zec 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Posted by mindheartbodysould (Member # 7101) on :

1 Kings 8:33

33 "When your people Israel have been defeated by an enemy because they have sinned against you, and when they turn back to you and confess your name, praying and making supplication to you in this temple, 34 then hear from heaven and forgive the sin of your people Israel and bring them back to the land you gave to their fathers.

Here God is telling Israel that they will indeed lose the waragainst Bin Laden or his followers. He is saying that the persons who fight will be captured, turn back and tell the person with the gun to their head the where abouts of the Leaders and will then get on their knees, pray and beg
the Leaders. NOT GOD>>>A SIN.......he then says to the
government go Israel to fogive the people and bring them back to hell. Where else is the land of a fighters father. A murderer is a murderer. If you shoot someone and
immediately are killed you dont have time to repent. Hence the land the government gave to the Fathers.

What God is not saying is that if you do not fight or stand upnow then you will not need to run and hide so you wontget captured. He is saying that you wont need to pray or beg to the wrong God and the Government of Israel can not take you all back to hell. Actions speak louder than words but words do speak.....read understand and listen.

I know I am good. But dont thank me just read your bible and understand the words.

That is what those camps are for. Do you remember the hollocaust. Its your ghettos

By the way I could tell you who Mambus is lol...that will catch some eyes.

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

[Roll Eyes]

1Ki 8:34 Then hear thou in heaven, and FORGIVE the sin of thy people Israel, and bring them again unto the land which thou gavest unto their fathers.(not hell)

Zec 10:6 And I will strengthen the house of Judah, and I will save the house of Joseph, and I will bring them again to place them; for I have mercy upon them: and they shall be as though I had not cast them off: for I am the LORD their God, and will hear them.
Zec 10:7 And they of Ephraim shall be like a mighty man, and their heart shall rejoice as through wine: yea, their children shall see it, and be glad; their heart shall rejoice in the LORD.
Zec 10:8 I will hiss for them, and gather them; for I have redeemed them: and they shall increase as they have increased.

...though he has and will chastise(d) them first...(Jer 24:9 And I will deliver them to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth for their hurt, to be a reproach and a proverb, a taunt and a curse, in all places whither I shall drive them.
Jer 24:10 And I will send the sword, the famine, and the pestilence, among them, till they be consumed from off the land that I gave unto them and to their fathers. )

Rev 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
Rev 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
Rev 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

So what does this mean for all of us who believe in the Supreme Creator/God and Jesus Christ? What will become of all of us when these people truly gain control of our entire country?

They are using the "security" factor to get us all to let them try and keep more on more tabs on the people here almost as if they are trying to eventually reach a point where we will all need ID cards that the government has for all of us to travel from place to place, so that they have our information and so that when their "Master Plan" or "Global Agenda" is put in place, they can find us when they need to.

Why in the world would the Illuminati/Satanists want to allow people who believe in God (at least for the next few years why they will still be in power) to roam free and continue to practice our beliefs?

What will they do to try and stop us all while they still have a chance?

There is obvious reason to believe that Satanists and the Illuminati do not want people who believe in the One True Supreme Creator - God - to be around on this planet for too much longer. I mean why would they? It brings people together, it totally goes against what they want, and it undermines their authority.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Perhaps several years ago, many people who believe in God/Christ would not give heed to such a message as this. Only in recent months are many believers suddenly waking up to the sobering reality that we may be facing end time persecution in our nation as never before. Terrorist events never thought possible to occur on our soil have happened. And now, on the wings of public outcry over the twin tragedies of September 11, 2001, draconian laws are being raced through Congress, supposedly in the effort to help curb terrorism, but suspiciously beginning to sound as if we are slowly being turned into a police state.

Many groups and civil liberties organizations are alarmed at what is unfolding in our nation. Are our liberties being sacrificed for "security?" And who can prove that surrendering vital liberties has EVER brought forth "security" or "protection? Some of the harshest dictatorships with the most stringent and oppressive laws in place have provided no genuine security for it's citizens, only oppression and greater controls over the people.

The emerging government/intelligence community definition of "terrorist" is vague, but perhaps quite deliberately. What IS the definition of a "terrorist?" Great penalties are now being dictated both against "terrorists" and those who "harbor terrorists." "Suspected terrorists" can now be detained indefinitely, without a warrant. The term "potential terrorist" is also being used as well.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Read the following carefully and decide if YOU might fit into their category of a "potential terrorist":

"US Attorney General Janet Reno has sent a confidential memo to the U.S. attorneys that an investigation would take place against "right wing and fundamentalist Christ believers."

It states that investigation and surveillance of right wing political groups and fundamentalists, religious organizations and individuals will take place in certain states. Dossiers on targeted individuals are to be compiled and retained in Washington, D.C. in the Justice Department.

Or how about this quote from former U.S. Attorney General Janet Reno herself?

"In the event of a wide spread uprising (as in martial law or a national disaster) these individuals must be viewed as "potential terrorists."

- Janet Reno, former U.S. Attorney General

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Now are you alarmed? With our nation in this present state of national disaster and increasing turmoil as biological warfare agents are being mailed out and reports of new threats surface continually, can you see that the above document refers to this time frame we are in?

Do you begin to understand the sobering implications of the term "potential terrorist?" Many Americans could nod their heads in agreement over the harsh new laws being enacted against "potential terrorists," naively thinking that the government's definition of such terrorists might be "wild eyed Moslem religious fanatics" intent on inflicting terror and pain on "the great Satan," America. But now you know there is a much broader definition of "terrorist" that the government has in mind! And that broader definition includes "right wing political groups, fundamentalist believers in God, religious organizations and individuals."

NOW that you realize this, can you nod your head in agreement over these laws being passed...when you realize they can be used against YOU??? Against your Church? Against your Pastor? Against your religious organization? Against your belief system?

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Right wing groups also include America's militias as well, not surprisingly. And note how they are now being targeted WITHOUT SUBSTANTIATION as "potential sources" for the anthrax scare! Today it is both Moslem extremists and America's militias being targeted: tomorrow will it be America's Spiritual people/Christ believers and other "potential terrorists"?

People are beginning to become alarmed when they begin to hear government sources being interviewed on national television following September 11th, who constantly used this term "potential terrorists." For most fellow Americans, the hidden meaning was veiled. But for researchers like myself, the term "police state" began to register in my mind. And with it, the indication of end time persecution that will accompany it for the Believers in America.

All that I have been hearing recently in various news reports tends to confirm the hidden government agenda of intense persecution of the Believers in America to come. And, how such persecution would be activated under the great national disasters anticipated to come to our nation (and tragically welcomed or actually encouraged by those elements who have long planned to use such circumstances to bring this persecution into operation and the New World Order into power).

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Those who study Bible prophecy have long known that great persecution of believers in Christ shall come to every nation, especially in the end times prior to Jesus Christ's return (In consciousness or physical form). Matthew 24 makes this abundantly clear.

Matthew 24:3 - "And as He sat upon the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately and saying, "tell us, when shall these things be? And what shall be the sign of Thy coming, and of the end?" (Note carefully the time frame they are speaking of, and realize that He is speaking especially of this end-time period prior to His return)."

Jesus begins to explain to them many things. He warns of false Christ's, wars and rumors of wars, of nation rising against nation. He warns them of famines and pestilences and earthquakes in many different places. But then He states that "All these are the beginning of sorrows."

He then begins to expound on the coming reality of end-time persecution.

Matthew 24:9 - "Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you, and YE SHALL BE HATED OF ALL NATIONS for My name's sake. And THEN shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another."

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Jesus speaks of false prophets arising and deceiving many.

Matthew 24:11 - He reveals that iniquity, or rebellion, will abound, and the love of many shall grow cold as a result.

(We know we are witnessing that hour in which rebellion is abounding and even glorified, both in America and throughout the world. Acts of rebellion which people were formerly ashamed of are now being paraded openly in public and glorified on televisions and movies and rap music.)

He concludes this passage describing the nature of end-time persecution before His return by stating, "BUT HE THAT SHALL ENDURE UNTO THE END, THE SAME SHALL BE SAVED ." Matthew 24:13

Note carefully that He did NOT say, "But he that is RAPTURED, the same shall be saved," but rather "He that shall ENDURE UNTO THE END, the same shall be saved." This is speaking of overcoming persecution and temptation and remaining faithful to Jesus Christ even unto death, and it is speaking clearly in the context of end-time persecution.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Only under a coming ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT that is against God and His Christ (the "New World Order" as it is often referred to today) can believers in Jesus Christ be simultaneously hated in every nation. Jesus declares that ALL NATIONS shall hate His followers in the end times prior to His return, and deliver them up to be afflicted (persecution) and to ultimately be put to death.

And when Jesus states "ALL NATIONS," He means "all nations." All nations must then include the United States of America, in order to fulfill His prophetic word which cannot be broken.

Many believers in Christ have lived under the present delusion that serious persecution unto imprisonment and martyrdom can NEVER take place in America. They point to America's God-fearing founders, the Constitution, First Amendment rights, etc., and many other factors to insist that end-time persecution of this nature can not happen on American soil. Or, they insist that before such persecution could ever take place, the "Rapture" will occur (even before they can "suffer the loss of a hangnail" for Jesus' sake) and they will be taken out from end-time persecution before it can come.

Both of these doctrines are deceptions. They have no foundation in the Word of God and in the words of Jesus Christ (Who IS the Word of God.)

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Jesus Christ declared firmly that end time persecution would come to His followers in ALL NATIONS. And that he that ENDURES TO THE END would be saved. (NOT he that is "Raptured!") In fact, He even warned that there would be times (undoubtedly of severe persecution) in which His disciples would long to see the hour of His coming, but that it would not necessarily occur at that desired time to rescue them.

Jesus spoke these words to give a foundation of understanding to His people, and to His believers who would face these tribulations in the end-times as well. He wants His people/people who have accepted God into their life in one form or another to be prepared for the things that they are called to suffer for His name's sake, so that no one might be overcome of evil nor unprepared to face such testing. He warns His people, so that they might begin to prepare themselves spiritually to endure and overcome what they are to face for His sake.

As people have traveled across America, they have been saddened and disappointed by the response of many pastors and many believers in God to this pertinent information. They have turned aside from the truth embodied in end-time prophecy, in order to embrace the doctrine of "the Rapture" or have said that "... because of America's Godly heritage in it's beginning, such incidents of persecution could NEVER happen in America."

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

People have repeatedly heard pastors lead their congregations to believe that before end-time persecution can come upon the Believers in America, the Rapture will come! Yet, this has not proven to be the reality in many nations in recent decades for people who believe in Christ. We know that millions died in Russia and the former Soviet Union for their faith and unwavering testimony of Jesus Christ. How many have died in China for their faith? How many in the Sudan? Indonesia? Nepal? Cuba? Africa? And all within less than the past one hundred years.

For such persecuted believers, there was no Rapture to save them from end-time persecution. Rather, the Words of Jesus Christ held true: "He that endureth unto the end, the same shall be saved."

Did you know that America is filled with unknown martyrs? Although the names of many of them will never be known to us except in eternity, Believers have been dying for their faith in America for many years. How?

Hard-core Satanism in America, has caused the reality of both children and adults often being targeted and abducted for sacrifice BECAUSE they were believers in Christ (or from homes of people who believe in Christ) and taken away to be brutally tortured and sacrificed. And just because you may have never heard of this means nothing!

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

I'm curious as to what people mean when they say "new world order" and "one world government" -biblically, anyway. I know the terms, etc... and understand that man without God would see this as a necessity, etc... but........

Which bible verses describe this new order, one government, etc....?????

I understand the plans of men, but which verses support this, explain who will be involved, etc...and do you believe it says it will be achieved???

I do not know if you are referring to the beast -which is one powerful government in the world which seeks control over the world -but does not achieve it -but rather lays waste to others for 3 1/2 years before being brought down -or if you refer to another.

Just curious.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Isaiah I think you hit it right on the money Bro. I think the Anti-Christ's government IS the New World Order.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

The news media in America IS CIA/Illuminati/government controlled, and they make sure that their people are in place throughout our nation to ensure blackout of such information to the average American.

America's Satanists are very well organized and operate under a high level of covertness to protect their names, reputations, and legally. In reports from SATANISM IN AMERICA TODAY, There have been instances documented in many accounts from former high level Satanists of people being targeted BECAUSE they were believers in Christ. They were stalked, abducted, and sacrificed for their faith.

As one previous Satanist admitted, "Satan was demanding Christ's followers for sacrifice, and by golly, we obliged him. They were targeted, stalked and sacrificed like all the rest..." (From a former CIA assassin, Satanist leader in one state, now a Christ follower/lecturer exposing the occult.)

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

One eye-witness account from the mountains of NC admitted that, as a Satanist, she participated in the abduction of a well known believer in Christ who was a witness/intercessor in that region that the local Satanists hated. She was abducted while walking home on a rural road at dusk. Their van pulled up next to her, men jumped out and seized her and she was thrown into the back of the van. Her mouth, hands and feet were then duct-taped and she was injected with a knock-out drug. When she revived, she found herself chained naked to a Satanic altar deep in the heart of the Great Smoky Mountains, in a massive cave known to all Satanists in that region.

She was then tempted to deny Jesus Christ as they offered to let her live IF she would work for them to infiltrate churches, spy on Christians, etc. According to this former Satanist' account, she refused. Her only reply was: "I BELIEVE IN CHRIST!" And they then proceeded to torture her most brutally, until she finally died. The former Satanist friend never forgot this. And her father, who participated in the martyrdom of this young woman, eventually became a Believer in Christ as well.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Other eye-witness accounts from the cases documented include followers of Christ being abducted and nailed to literal crosses and tortured to death. One abducted pastor pleaded with his Satanist persecutors to repent and accept Jesus Christ as Savior, even after he was nailed to such a cross. Finally wearying of his Christian witness, one Satanist took a knife and slashed his throat to silence him. He died on that cross for the testimony of Jesus Christ...in the heart of those mountains known as "the Bible Belt." (People, how little so many of you know about true persecution in America!)

From Indiana, we have the testimony of former high priestess Elaine, now a Christian exposing Satanism. Elaine's daughter Claudia, also being trained at one time to become a high priestess like her mother, admitted: "We Satanists in Indiana even invented a cross that would separate in the middle after the victim was crucified. We also designed wooden spikes instead of metal nails, because it would inflict more pain on the victim. After the victim was nailed to the cross, they were then torn to pieces as we separated the cross into two sections..." believers in God were frequently their victims, both adult and child.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Friends, how many times has this scene been repeated throughout the centuries, beginning with the early believers in Christ??? When Christ's followers were brought before Roman tribunals and questioned about their faith, they had a choice. Throw a pinch of incense on the altar to Caesar and declare him to be "divine" ("Caesar is lord") OR to boldly declare "I am a believer in Christ" And for their confession of "I am a follower of Christ" and refusal to bow the knee to Caesar, history records that they were brutally tortured and killed, not even young believers being spared.

Throughout the centuries such persecutions have been repeated worldwide...YET the believers have survived, overcome and even grown during such times. We faithful of God/Christ in America have this great potential to both overcome and to grow, even during the coming season of great persecution. For we, too, are called to be FAITHFUL UNTO DEATH and to be overcomers in the midst of tribulation.

However, the people of God are not being prepared realistically in America for end-time persecution and martyrdom to come in America. Most of Christs followers are NOT being prepared to "contend earnestly for the faith." In fact, many have compromised their witness and testimony of Jesus Christ even under normal circumstances. Often, when threatened to "leave your beliefs in God or Christ out of the workplace," they have consented and refused to be the witnesses for Christ God's Word calls them to be. Often compromise with any of Jesus's texts can begin quite slowly and subtly, but eventually lead to a tragic denial of Jesus Christ in the end. Of this we must beware.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

So many are sitting back and hoping for a "Rapture" to take them out before they could ever face end time persecution and martyrdom for His name's sake. Yet they have NOT ONE SCRIPTURE TO STAND ON that conclusively declares this expected scenario to be fulfilled!

NOT ONE SCRIPTURE! In fact, they have just the opposite, as revealed in Matthew 24 where it talks about false prophets deceiving people, which includes falsely teaching that such end time persecution will not overtake them, and that they shall escape by the "Rapture."

By the way, are we living in the time period close to the second coming of Jesus Christ? Of course! Many end-time Bible prophecies being fulfilled in this generation make plain we are living in the end-time period near to His return. But again, since Jesus plainly declared that NO ONE knows the day nor the hour, again it is presumptuous for North American Christians to believe that the "Rapture" will be based upon their desire to escape end-time persecution and hence avoid testing and refining. We are given no such promise that He will return just in time to escape prophesied end-time persecution.

Posted by Carol Swenson (Member # 6929) on :

The New Unger’s Bible Dictionary

Second Coming of Christ

The great event that will wind up this present age. Premillennialists believe that Christ will come to establish a visible earthly kingdom over Israel for at least 1,000 years. Amillennialists hold that the second coming of Christ will initiate the eternal state. The amillennialist rejects the future earthly program for Israel and mysticalizes the great OT prophecies concerning Zion and Jerusalem, etc., to refer to the Christian church. The postmillennialist believes that Christ will return to the earth after the Millennium. Premillennialists believe that the return of Christ consists of two events or stages. Pretribulation premillenialists hold that Christ will return for His church (1 Corinthians 15:51-55; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18), glorify it, and take it to heaven before a seven-year period known as the Great Tribulation (Jeremiah 30:5; Daniel 9:27; etc.). At the end of this cataclysmic seven-year period Christ will return in power and glory to judge the nations and set up His millennial kingdom. Midtribulationists believe that Christ will return in the middle of Daniel’s seventieth week. Posttribulationists reject the idea of a separate appearance of Christ for the church and have the church going through the entire Tribulation. Exhaustive inductive study of Scripture seems to favor the pretribulation-rapture view.

Posted by Kindgo (Member # 2) on :

I hate to be the bearer of good news, but the word of God clearly states that believers will escape the tribulation bloodbath. "For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ" (1 Thes 5:9). "Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth" (Rev 3:10).

In one regard, people who think the Church will go through the tribulation are somewhat correct. I believe there will be a huge number of "carnal Christians" that will find themselves left behind. By having the rapture before the tribulation, all those who find themselves facing the wrath of God will be without an excuse.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Kindgo, Friends,

Hear what happened to Chinese believers of Christ, prior to communist takeover in China, who were told by their pastors, "...you have nothing to worry about...before the communists can take over and persecute you, we will be raptured!" Yes, this was commonly taught in China in the churches at that time, as Christ's followers became uneasy over the rise of communism to power. Yet...there was NO "Rapture" to take out the Chinese believers in God when communism came to power. They instead found themselves arrested, imprisoned, tortured for their faith and martyred. And their persecutions and martyrdoms continue to this day. And reports began to come out of China of the Believers cursing their pastors and becoming angry at God because of this!

"Pastor! How could this happen! You said we would be raptured before we would ever be arrested and persecuted! How could you have failed to prepare us! How could God fail us?"

And the reality was, God did not fail them. Christ's words plainly revealed what would come under end time persecution to His people. God fails no one! But sadly, often His pastors DO. And such Pastors then become false prophets to His people. And tragically, God's people often PREFER false prophets in the pulpits of their Churches, whenever the truth is too hard to bear and is something their flesh does not want!

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Pastors often stated that they could never reveal such truth because they might then frighten and lose members (hence lose money through loss of tithes). Yes, 501-C-3 compromised Pastors have proven many times they love numbers and money MORE than the truth and more than the Souls of their congregations.

The members of these congregations falsely taught that "peace and plenty" was what the future held for America, and that they would be "Raptured" out of all persecution to come, even now cursing their Pastors and becoming angry at God as everything God's Word warned of begins to be fulfilled...this time on American soil.

(Friends, don't even bother to curse such Pastors: they are already under the laws of Karma for failing to prepare His people for this hour of testing! And the blood of those who fall away as a result of their false teachings will be upon the hands of such Pastors, who have prophesied falsely to them of "peace and prosperity" when prophecy revealed something quite different.)

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Nationwide initiative trains volunteers to teach congregations to "obey the government" during seizure of guns, property, forced inoculations and forced relocation.

A Pastor has come forward to blow the whistle on a nationwide FEMA program which is training Pastors and other religious representatives to become secret police enforcers who teach their congregations to "obey the government" in preparation for a declaration of martial law, property and firearm seizures, and forced relocation.

In March of this year the Pastor was invited to attend a meeting of his local FEMA chapter which circulated around preparedness for a potential bio-terrorist attack, any natural disaster or a nationally declared emergency.

The FEMA directors told the Pastors that attended that it was their job to help implement FEMA and Homeland Security directives in anticipation of any of these eventualities. The first directive was for Pastors to preach to their congregations Romans 13, the often taken out of context bible passage that was used by Hitler to hoodwink Christians into supporting him, in order to teach them to "obey the government" when martial law is declared.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

It was related to the Pastors that quarantines, martial law and forced relocation were a problem for state authorities when enforcing federal mandates due to the "cowboy mentality" of citizens standing up for their property and second amendment rights as well as farmers defending their crops and livestock from seizure. It was stressed that the Pastors needed to preach subservience to the authorities ahead of time in preparation for the round-ups and to make it clear to the congregation that "this is for their own good."

Other preachers and Pastors have stated that this program is a nationwide initiative and a literal Soviet model whereby the churches are being systematically infiltrated by government volunteers and used as conduits for martial law training and conditioning. The Pastor was told that over 1,300 counties were already on board.

It falls under the umbrella of the NVOAD program which is training volunteers in a "Peer to Peer" program in a neighborhood setting.

Pastors were told that the would be backed up by law enforcement in controlling uncooperative individuals and that they would even lead SWAT teams in attempting to quell resistance.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

"We get the the picture that we're going to be standing at the end of some farmer's lane while he's standing there with his double barrel, saying we have to confiscate your cows, your chickens, your firearms," said the Pastor.

The Pastor elaborated on how the directives were being smoke screened by an Orwellian alteration of their names.

"They're not using the term 'quarantine' - this is the term they're going to be using - it's called 'social distancing' don't you like that one," said the Pastor.

He also highlighted how detention camps had been renamed to give them a friendly warm veneer.

"Three months ago it was quarantine and relocation centers and now it's 'community centers' and these are going to be activated at the local schools," he said.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

The Pastor has outlined the plan to carry out mass vaccination and enforced drugging programs in times of crisis such as a bird flu outbreak.

"In the event of an outbreak or a bio-terrorist attack, there'd be a mass vaccination....they have a program nationwide 'Pills in People's Palm In 48 Hours'," said the Pastor who was told that Walmart had been designated as the central outlet of this procedure.

The Pastor said that many attendees believed in the necessity of the program and were completely unaware to the motivations behind its true purpose and were offered incentives to become volunteers such as preferential treatment and first access for themselves and their families to vaccines and food shipments in times of emergency.

Which roads to close off after martial law was declared had also already been mapped out.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

In another twilight zone Nazi-like spectacle, Pastors were asked to make a pledge or an affirmation during the meeting to fulfil the roles ascribed to them by FEMA. They were given assurances that they would be covered by full compensation in the event of resisters injuring them during property seizures and round-ups.

The Pastor said that his county had already succumbed to a tattle-tale like mentality where neighbors were reporting neighbors to the authorities for things like having chickens in their back yard. The brown shirt precedent has been set whereby people immediately turn to the authorities in fealty whenever their paranoid suspicions, fueled by zealous government and media fearmongering, are heightened.

The Pastor also said that the completion of the first stage of the program was slated for very soon. At this point all the counties within the United States would be networked as part of the so-called disaster relief program.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Here is actual KSLA NEWS footage of Pastors being trained to help crack down and round up American Citizens during Martial Law:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRIDNQNsUss

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

This is not a joke folks. IT IS REAL:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAv-LbARKyQ&feature=related

And the truth should be known to ALL Christians living in America:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgfihRJe71k&feature=related (Part 1)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFLf6rUVTUw&feature=related (Part 2)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sN2kwpQofTg&feature=related (Part 3)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ruymjp0vaiw&feature=related (Part 4)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gy0tzFZbMjg&feature=related (Part 5)

FEMA's Pastors folks. Not YOURS.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

Satanist hate crimes are rampant throughout our nation. Satanist infiltration into church organizations and ministries is widespread.

The Satanist/Illuminist subculture has successfully infiltrated America's schools, Universities, law enforcement, government, judicial and in fact penetrated every level of our society. They are networking furiously together to bring forth their New World Order/Luciferian based agenda. And they are destroying countless innocent lives in the process, and will destroy millions more in their bloody pursuit. Satanist recruitment into covens is at an all time high...recruiters even go out on Friday nights in college towns or cities and recruit kids on the streets, dressed fully in black robes!

And where is the Church??? God has commissioned His people unto whom he has entrusted power and authority to wage mighty Spiritual warfare against the works of the enemy. Even the Bible declares "Jesus Christ was manifested to DESTROY THE WORKS OF THE DEVIL." He did not commission the police...nor the local judge... nor the sheriff's department (they are all infiltrated by Satanists anyhow!) He has commissioned HIS PEOPLE to stand in the gap, to wage war against the enemy who is destroying countless lives across our nation continually.

Because God has not given us a spirit of FEAR, but of POWER, LOVE and a SOUND MIND, and has continually instructed us to FEAR NOT, we are to therefore march boldly forward with the power of God and CRUSH THE WORKS OF THE ENEMY.

People should be ashamed of the priests/pastors who have admitted that they are too afraid to deal with Satanism in their city...too afraid to stand up and do something about it.

It is time to make a difference...NOW!

Satan has already gotten away with murder unchallenged much too long...and wait 'til you see what they have in mind for YOU under coming martial law!!! Please...help make the difference.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

In the recent past since the double tragedy that destroyed so many lives in New York City and Washington, DC, we now see a foretaste of the persecution that is coming to this nation now surfacing in the form of new laws that already are threatening the civil liberties of all Americans. In fact, recently an FBI officer confronted researcher Al Martin (a man whose work in exposing the truth behind the government corruption and the New World Order, etc.) He was warned that within a year, he could be arrested for "seditious talk" for making such statements formerly protected under the First Amendment rights.

Could other believers in God also be arrested for "seditious talk" under the new laws to be enacted? Could Christ's followers witnessing in public or broadcasting on radio be labeled by THEIR definition to be "seditious talk?" Consider it a great possibility. But does this mean that we are to stop our belief systems? NEVER!

Remember: your liberties that come from believening Christ did NOT originate nor come from the US government! They come from Almighty God. It is God Himself that has given you this marvelous liberty through faith in Jesus Christ. The state did not give it to you, and the state cannot take it away. Now, we know it is a spiritual liberty, that we have been set free from the power of rebellion through faith in Jesus Christ. But what we experience in the spiritual must also be manifested into the physical realm as well, for it to be true liberty in the fullest sense.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

"Stand fast therefore in the LIBERTY wherewith Christ has made us free, and be not entangled again in the yoke of bondage." Galatians 5:1

People in America, will you not realistically prepare your hearts for the coming hour of the cup of testing, persecution and martyrdom that all of Christ's follwers in America may end up drinking of for prophecy to be fulfilled? And will you not also prepare yours hearts to RISE UP in FAITH AND VICTORY to OVERCOME THE ENEMY in this hour?

Your hidden persecutors are many, and they extend into the White House and the highest levels of our government and our military. Many people believe that Justice Department investigators have already defined you follwers of God as "resisters of the New World Order" and secretly condemned you to be arrested and put to death, your organizations and homes to be seized by FEMA and foreign troops and confiscated, and decreed persecution for all those who would offer resistance.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

The concentration camps throughout America are many, and thousands of boxcars with shackles are possibly waiting to transport countless souls to these camps to be persecuted and terminated for their faith and resistance to Satan's agenda for this nation.

FEMA officials have already boasted openly to various Pastors that, when martial law is declared in America, they are going to seize their belief organizations (all quite "legally") and turn them into command posts for their bases of operation! The foreign troops (Russian, German, Chinese and others) trained to arrest you (even at many of our own military bases such as Fort Polk, LA) and transport you to these detention camps number well over 2,000,000.
German Bundeswehr/Luftwaffe (Army/Air Force) soldiers are present in America and Canada by the thousands and are stationed in over one hundred bases and facilities, and have boasted openly, both in Germany and America, that they are in America for the hour of martial law. They have admitted to some that they will NOT have a problem performing what they have been sent to do: arresting and firing upon American citizens!

And to add to this, AWACS from Germany are now present in America, to patrol our airspace in anticipation of widespread uprising under coming martial law. The military has admitted that they will deploy chem-bio weapons to help weaken the resolve of the American Patriot to resist the UN/NATO New World Order takeover of our nation. CIA insiders have admitted that many of these detention camps are also termination camps, and the Church in America is one of the major targets of removal and elimination under martial law.

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

It is not inconceivable that, in the future, you will see uncompromised followers of Christ arrested, transported to boxcars filled with shackles, to be transported to one of the many documented gassing/crematory facilities to be persecuted and slain for their unwavering confession of their faith and refusal to compromise their beliefs in God. It is also conceivable that you will witness them being dragged out and tortured for the mass public executions anticipated of those deemed "resisters of the New World Order."

And if you deem yourself to be a committed believer in Christ, Constitutionalist, Patriot, etc. it is truly possible to find yourself among them. There may soon be coming an hour in which the blood of the martyrs of Jesus Christ will flow in the streets and detention camps of America.

There may soon be coming a time in which the skies above designated detention/ termination camps will be blackened with the smoke of cremated bodies of those end-time saints who will refuse to bow the knee to Satan and his New World Order, who will remain faithful unto God and Jesus Christ even unto death. And that such smoke will arise as sweet incense into the nostrils of the Lord of Sabaoth, as a true testimony of those who gave their lives for God and the testimony of Jesus Christ and "loved not their lives even unto the death." And it is not inconceivable that you may be among them!

Posted by GreenCandle (Member # 6763) on :

When you think about it....is there no better way even to this day than to transport mass amounts of people from one place to another by the use of boxcars and trains? Creepy.

The same tools the Nazis used back in the day are still the most efficient form of transportation for mass amounts of people.

Posted by Isaiah (Member # 6699) on :

What I meant is that the government of the person most refer to as "the antichrist" is not -SPECIFICALLY -this new world order of which you speak -NOT OUR PART OF IT, ANYWAY -WHAT IS HAPPENING, HOWEVER, IS CRAFT PROSPERING IN HIS HAND!

Certainly, those here who disregard the will of the people are a shady bunch of characters. I have had more experience with them than any would want -but rather than BEING that government, are being duped BY that government -though some who rub shoulders with -and suggest seemingly great ideas to -ours, are certainly of the enemy -having weaseled their way into our 'elite', et al, for the past fifty years or so. Behind those who now exert their will here is a large amount of darkly spiritual activity. It is present and pervasive in our government, military, industry, media, entertainment, and society. It is also increasingly unfied and organized, but not always -and not overall -by our own. Not all involved have direct ties to the occult or modern whitewashed witchcraft, but it is the driving force behind WHAT is happening, and HOW it happens. Many are moved to action by manipulation of their own passions and fears, not understanding the end results of their actions. This is the greater part of how WE are given into HIS HAND! Though this group has now exalted itself as protector and sold its dark ways as a means of protection, it will have exactly the opposite result! These people are wrong and in the wrong -they are a dividing force acting against their own for power -they will harm anyone who stands in their way and if they can not, they target their loved ones in any gruesome way thier mind can imagine -and when the heat is on they raise other groups to do their dirty work while appearing to be against it -they hijacked America, but they are quite un-American, extremely unconstitutional -AND OUR GREATEST VULNERABILITY.

The "enemy" -ultimately -is one who will rule one part of the world -and destroy most of the rest -US FIRST! He does not yet rule -but he certainly now acts. He will be mighty -but NOT BY HIS OWN POWER(Dan 8:23-25). Satan will give him darkly spiritual power. He will be able to understand DARK SENTENCES and CRAFT will prosper in his hand. This goes far beyond mere subtlety, human intuition, strategy, manipulation and spycraft -to the extent that we can hide nothing from him(Eze 28:3 God can, of course). Being possessed of the leader of demons, our involvement in the darkly spiritual will be turned against us, though we turn to it to thwart him. He will destroy WONDERFULLY -meaning also MIRACULOUSLY -as in... in ways normally beyond human ability!

It is the natural human reaction to want to fight such a threat, but God said it is HE HIMSELF that raises them against us -and gives us SPECIFIC REASONS WHY. We use the present troubles as an excuse to take away rights in the name of security, as government turns a blind eye to what the elite and underworld are doing to the people -because they can help the government or not -depending on how the government treats them! THIS SITUATION IS WHY IT IS HAPPENING, HOW IT IS HAPPENING, AND MUST BE UNDONE IF WE ARE TO SURVIVE AS A NATION! All human government will fall to Christ eventually, but this is a far greater prospect than being destroyed by the beast.(also, the enemy will certainly be waging a war of ideas and perceptions against us -we would do well to be above reproach in every way, so that their campaign may not be based in fact)

This is what we face...

Isa 10:1 Woe unto them that decree unrighteous decrees, and that write grievousness which they have prescribed;
Isa 10:2 To turn aside the needy from judgment, and to take away the right from the poor of my people, that widows may be their prey, and that they may rob the fatherless!
Isa 10:3 And what will ye do in the day of visitation, and in the desolation which shall come from far? to whom will ye flee for help? and where will ye leave your glory?
Isa 10:4 Without me they shall bow down under the prisoners, and they shall fall under the slain. For all this his anger is not turned away, but his hand is stretched out still.
Isa 10:5 O Assyrian, the rod of mine anger, and the staff in their hand is mine indignation.
Isa 10:6 I will send him against a hypocritical nation, and against the people of my wrath will I give him a charge, to take the spoil, and to take the prey, and to tread them down like the mire of the streets.
Isa 10:7 Howbeit he meaneth not so, neither doth his heart think so; but it is in his heart to destroy and cut off nations not a few.

Isa 1:5 Why should ye be stricken any more? ye will revolt more and more: the whole head is sick, and the whole heart faint.
Isa 1:6 From the sole of the foot even unto the head there is no soundness in it; but wounds, and bruises, and putrefying sores: they have not been closed, neither bound up, neither mollified with ointment.
Isa 1:7 Your country is desolate, your cities are burned with fire: your land, strangers devour it in your presence, and it is desolate, as overthrown by strangers.

Jer 18:7 At what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, and to pull down, and to destroy it;
Jer 18:8 If that nation, against whom I have pronounced, turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them.
Jer 18:9 And at what instant I shall speak concerning a nation, and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it;
Jer 18:10 If it do evil in my sight, that it obey not my voice, then I will repent of the good, wherewith I said I would benefit them.