Christian Message Boards: What does it mean to crucify the flesh?

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Posted by helpforhomeschoolers (Member # 15) on :

Hi: I was reading some of the threads and I found particularly interesting the one on abiding.

Ga 5:24 And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

So I wondered if we could discuss what it means to have crucified the flesh. How do you see this? What does it look like to you. If you say that you are Christ's.... how have you crucified your flesh?

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

well, I find that this flesh thing literally needs to be beaten down! It wants to speak loudly and I hate that! I understand why fasting is not a bad idea...the flesh seems to quiet down [Smile]

I refuse to let it control me, but we do have to wear this earth suit for now.

Romans 8

9You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. 10But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. 11And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.

12Therefore, brothers, we have an obligation—but it is not to the sinful nature, to live according to it. 13For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live, 14because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship.[g] And by him we cry, "Abba,[h] Father." 16The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God's children. 17Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory.

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

quote:
So I wondered if we could discuss what it means to have crucified the flesh. How do you see this? What does it look like to you. If you say that you are Christ's.... how have you crucified your flesh?

homeschoolers, it simply is a faith thing. It is in the understanding, the revelation. And everything we have is by revelation - through faith. And that is what we are after, the faith; the understanding.

And that is the negative side. If we look at it from the positive side, we are looking rather at overcoming. Again, that is by faith. And faith is 'of' Christ. Therefore we need the 'Faith of Christ', to rise above our sinful state. That is what HE promises.

But so many try to overcome when they should be looking for faith. And living faith is the life that IS Christ. For Christ believes in Himself, and what HE does.

2Ti 2:13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

Victory is through faith. Overcoming is through faith. So the question really becomes, do we really understand faith? For a lot of what we think we believe becomes a substitute for faith. But it is not faith. For:

Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Substance means that we have something that even if we cannot touch it, or feel it, it is there. It is something, if you will, 'that we know'.

And scripture says that:

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

This also qualifies one as to whether he is Christ's or not, for it says that it is the result. If we have crucified the affections and lusts, we are Christ's. We are "Standing on the rock, not sand."

But mind thee, we do not crucify the affections and lust by our will, nor by our effort, but:

Zec 4:6 Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts.

It if faith in the finished work 'and working' of Christ that accomplishes this.

Gal 3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

So, what is believing? It is faith. And what is the result? It is a very real victory, and not wishful thinking, nor is it the concept of, "Someday when I get to heaven, I shall know victory." Jesus didn't plan on your waiting till then.

Posted by helpforhomeschoolers (Member # 15) on :

Ok so if I am following then for you Found In Him, your answer to the question... "How do you crucify your flesh?" might look something like...

"I crucify my flesh by beating it down and refusing to let my earthly body control me."

Is that correct? If so how is that working for you? If I dont get it and its not correct, could you give me a one line answer? I crucify the flesh this way... to me it means I respond X way to the flesh ...

Do you know what I mean?

Michael... What would your one sentence answer look like from a personal perspective?

I really am interested here in dialog. I am not so much interested in the group's various theological statements about crucifying the flesh as I am what it means for each of you personally and in practice.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

quote:
Originally posted by helpforhomeschoolers:
Ok so if I am following then for you Found In Him, your answer to the question... "How do you crucify your flesh?" might look something like...

"I crucify my flesh by beating it down and refusing to let my earthly body control me."

Is that correct? If so how is that working for you? If I dont get it and its not correct, could you give me a one line answer? I crucify the flesh this way... to me it means I respond X way to the flesh ...

Do you know what I mean?

Michael... What would your one sentence answer look like from a personal perspective?

I really am interested here in dialog. I am not so much interested in the group's various theological statements about crucifying the flesh as I am what it means for each of you personally and in practice.

I don't have just one sentence or quote for you. We "walk" the christian walk. This suggests a continual process. The bible says to walk in the spirit and you will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh.

Flesh is weak and is in conflict with the spirit. The Spirit Of God, The Word of God and prayer and fasting are my personal answers to overcoming or crucifying the flesh.

The battle or temptation is found in our thinking...so I try to keep my focus on Jesus.

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

It simply means that spiritually our flesh body is crucified with Jesus.

The old body being spiritually dead the new body turns toward God's will.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

I know you requested personal testimony for crucifying the flesh homeschoolers, but I found the following post and there is a lot of good stuff in it..

http://www.geocities.com/dcheddie/walking1.html

welcome to the board-- I'm new here too!
jeannie

Posted by Copper25 (Member # 7464) on :

Romans 8:13) For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Galatians 5:24) And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Galatians 5

19) Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20) Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21) Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Make no mistake, by the grace of God one has to abandon these acts because anyone in the current doing of such actions is not walking in the Spirit but is living by the flesh. AND Romans 8:13)"if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die" is the sharp two edged sword that leaves one with no choice but instead an ultimatum, flee from the workings of the flesh mentioned in Galatians 5:19-21), crucifying those works and not do them, Or die in them, Galatians 5:21) "as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God."

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

quote:
Michael... What would your one sentence answer look like from a personal perspective?

quote:
homeschoolers

One sentence? What your heart sees! [hug]

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

quote:
It simply means that spiritually our flesh body is crucified with Jesus.

The old body being spiritually dead the new body turns toward God's will.

Bluefrog, I am going to be blunt. I hope you take it in stride! Your body doesn't have a will! [happyhappy]

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

Well I guess I have questions then.

I believe in confessing faults and being real.

Am I the ONLY one who struggles with the flesh? Can we be real here?

The flesh = junk
The spirit = fruit

right??

The flesh-- at least mine-- wars with my spirit for example:

I DO NOT win with the battle of patience all the time. (obviously)
I DO NOT feel joyous 100% of the time.
I DO NOT always want to be gentle, meek or kind.
AND GOD KNOWS there are some people that are HARD to love.

IS THERE ANYONE ELSE LIKE ME?

Christ lives in me and I understand that this is a process....I have walked 20 years with Him and I AINT ALL THAT YET!

He wants fruit in our lives...that is the opposite of what our flesh wants to throw at people.

What I find is loud flesh that needs shut up!

Just pray for me I guess...

I can't wait to shed this mess. Come Lord Jesus please

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

MICHAEL...I am going to be blunt.

I didn't say my body had a will I said:...God's Will. There you go skimming again. However, my person does too have a will. Matter of fact I have two wills. The will to do something and the will concerning my estate. And a third will... when my wife says to do something I say I will. Shall I go on? I need to get outa here, it's just gettin silly now.

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

FOUND IN HIM...Very Good. I knew I was gonna like you. No, you aren't alone and I understand every thing you said.

I think a lot of our personality or spirit is involved in our Christian expectations, don't you. Thank God he gave that to us and Thank God He has a sense of humor.

He knows what is best for us and put it in writing. Once introduced to the Word and we become a part of the family it is hard to believe that with knowledge we just ignore His teachings. The goal we strive for is to please the Lord and show our love for and to Him. To think that God wants a bunch of dry unhappy robots is not acceptable to me. When have you ever seen someone like that lead anyone to Jesus?
I just recently found my very first who talks the talk but don't know if anything has come of it. So, I guess I still don't know of any.

When I first became a Christian, no one ever offered to help me. It was like my beginning in life. After birth my dad made it clear that children are to be seen, not heard...go out and play. Finally, both my Christian life and my human life got a late start but made it anyway.

With the love letter (bible) that God left for me and our talks growing up has been pretty good.
I'm sure He gets put out with me from time to time. He knew that would happen so to keep me around He knew what to do and did it. It makes me cry.

Posted by becauseHElives (Member # 87) on :

Hello Linda, good to have you back [thumbsup2]

...to try an answer your question....

What does it mean to crucify the flesh?

in one sentence....

Not to respond in any situation contrary to the Spirit of Yahweh !

There is much to say on this but for this moment that is all the Spirit wants me to say.... [Bible]

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

Thank you bluefrog for being real.

I can't wait to shed this skin but until then I guess I will just do my best to shut it up and let Him do the rest.

Maybe I'm just a late bloomer (talking about the fruit of the Spirit) [Smile]

nice try right?

Posted by helpforhomeschoolers (Member # 15) on :

Hey Dale! Thanks it was so nice to log in here today and see so many of you still here fighting the good fight! There is much to say on this topic.

FoundInHim.. PAUL was like you! He described a WAR between the law in his members and the law of his mind. And he told the Philippians that he was pressed between the desire to leave this earth and be with his LORD and to stay where he knew he was needed.

Dale.. I love your answer, but how... how is it that you manage to not do anything that is contrary to the Spirit of Yahweh? Are you just particularly good at being good or what?

Posted by becauseHElives (Member # 87) on :

Linda ask...

quote:
Are you just particularly good at being good or what?

I keep a close watch on this heart of mine
I keep my eyes wide open all the time
I keep the ends out for the tie that binds
Because I'm His, I walk the line

I find it very, very easy to be true
I find myself alone when each day is through
Yes, I'll admit that I'm a fool for Yahshua
Because I'm His, I walk the line

As sure as night is dark and day is light
I keep Yahshua on my mind both day and night
And happiness I've known proves that it's right
Because I'm His, I walk the line

He's got a way to keep me on His side
He gives me cause for love that I can't hide
For Him I know I'd even try to turn the tide
Because I'm His, I walk the line

I keep a close watch on this heart of mine
I keep my eyes wide open all the time
I keep the ends out for the tie that binds
Because I'm His, I walk the line

Romans 8:1 “There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Yahshua, who walk not after the flesh, but Walk the Line.”

To walk (Walk the Line) after the Spirit is to walk under the authority and under the obedience of the Word. If you walk contrary to the Word you are walking according to the fleshly mind and that brings condemnation because you are in disobedience to the Word. Therefore, it continues, “For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.” When you walk in the fleshly mind, you will make wrong decisions that lead to sin and sin leads to death.

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

HELP FOR HOMESCHOOLERS...Subject: What does it mean to crucify the flesh ? You had asked BECAUSE HE LIVES...How is it that you manage to not do anything that is contrary to the Spirit of Yahweh? Are you just particularly good at being good or what?

I see where he answered your question. I know you didn't ask me the question but me thinks that the following might be of some help on the subject....

Hebrews 10:12-18
12 But this Man, after He had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;
13 From henceforth expecting till His enemies be made His footstool.
14 FOR BY ONE OFFERING HE HATH PERFECTED FOR EVER THEM THAT ARE SANCTIFIED.
15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us; for after that He had said before.
16 THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THEM AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAITH THE LORD; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR HEARTS AND IN THEIR MINDS WILL I WRITE THEM;
17 AND THEIR SINS AND INIQUITIES WILL I REMEMBER NO MORE.
18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.

Now, let's boogie over to 1 John, Chapter One...
1 John 1:9-10 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

Now, Chapter 2 verse 1...My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not.
(what he is saying here is Don't Sin, not that we Don't Sin) And if any man sin, (see, what did I tell ya?) we have an advocate (betcha that's Jesus) with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; (see, I knowed it !) [youpi]

Posted by oneinchrist (Member # 6532) on :

Hi HelpforHomeschoolers,
Personally, I do believe that Paul wanted us to understand the "crucifying of the flesh" from a few perspectives. What I mean by that is---in relation to "conversion and baptism into Christ" I believe that having been "crucified in the flesh" or "crucified with Christ" involves a once and for all reckoning of ourselves dead to sin and alive unto God......in other words..... Because of what Jesus has accomplished, I now declare sin to be my enemy and God my friend. In a sense, Paul is metaphorically describing the mechanics of repentance with the words "crucified the flesh with its passions and desires", whereas Jesus uses the words "deny yourself". I think Jesus and Paul are essentially saying the same thing though.......that we need to be renouncing self-centered ambition and putting the interests of the kingdom first and foremost.

But there also is a continual/ongoing perspective that I believe Paul wanted us also to understand.......that the flesh continues to war against the spirit; therefore, there is also a need for an ongoing "crucifying of the flesh". The answer to this is to KEEP oneself grounded in the Word, LEARN how to become dependent on God through prayer, and to REMAIN focused on Kingdom priorities......then, hopefully in time we learn to hate the things God hates and to love the things he loves.

With love in Christ, Daniel

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

Does God love Mother in Laws ?

Never mind, I know what your gonna say. Guess I have a spiritual battle goin on. Rivit !

Posted by WildB (Member # 2917) on :

quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
Hello Linda, good to have you back ...

Ditto

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

Crucifying the flesh is an interesting topic to discuss for us born in such a situation. One asks, "What does that mean exactly?"

Like so many other figures of speech, it could mean several things. We are working on those meanings right here.

Apparently, all of us on our keyboards were born in a flesh body and that flesh body was born in sin. To keep on keepin on we need to keep our flesh bodies so why would we crucify them? It wouldn't surprise me if someone in the past has done just that and killed themselves. Remember Ham, who saw his father in his nakedness ? Men have killed their children having done just that.
Anyhoo, when one is saved, it just means that we want to shed our past in a flesh body and that we were saved because of the crucified body of Christ, the only one ever who could do it for real.

Figures of speech are spice for the tongue and music to the ear. lol Why would anyone want to go put their foot in their mouth ? It's done all the time...been there, done that.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

quote:
Originally posted by bluefrog:

Apparently, all of us on our keyboards were born in a flesh body and that flesh body was born in sin.

Christ, the only one ever who could do it for real.

Hi Bro Bluefrog,

Your words help me!!!! Please read below. I think I was getting stuck on Romans 7:24

Thank you.

Romans 7
21So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22For in my inner being I delight in God's law; 23but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. 24What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? 25Thanks be to God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God's law, but in the sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.
Romans 8
1Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus,[a] 2because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death.

Ahhhh! Grace & Mercy... it's in Him!

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

This kind of sums it up.

Galatians 2
17"If, while we seek to be justified in Christ, it becomes evident that we ourselves are sinners, does that mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! 18If I rebuild what I destroyed, I prove that I am a lawbreaker. 19For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!"[d]

AMEN!

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

Galatians 2 (Amplified)

17But if, in our desire and endeavor to be justified in Christ [to be declared righteous and put in right standing with God wholly and solely through Christ], we have shown ourselves sinners also and convicted of sin, does that make Christ a minister (a party and contributor) to our sin? Banish the thought! [Of course not!]

18For if I [or any others who have taught that the observance of the Law of Moses is not essential to being justified by God should now by word or practice teach or intimate that it is essential to] build up again what I tore down, I prove myself a transgressor.

19For I through the Law [under the operation of the curse of the Law] have [in Christ's death for me] myself died to the Law and all the Law's demands upon me, so that I may [henceforth] live to and for God.

20I have been crucified with Christ [in Him I have shared His crucifixion]; it is no longer I who live, but Christ (the Messiah) lives in me; and the life I now live in the body I live by faith in (by adherence to and reliance on and complete trust in) the Son of God, Who loved me and gave Himself up for me.

21[Therefore, I do not treat God's gracious gift as something of minor importance and defeat its very purpose]; I do not set aside and invalidate and frustrate and nullify the grace (unmerited favor) of God. For if justification (righteousness, acquittal from guilt) comes through [observing the ritual of] the Law, then Christ (the Messiah) died groundlessly and to no purpose and in vain. [His death was then wholly superfluous.]

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

When Jesus came to be with us as humans we read that He also was tempted. He was tempted but never gave in. Can you imagine going an entire life time never doing what is considered sin and then topping it off being crucified ? That is something to think about.

So, what was it that Jesus was tempted to do ? Betcha ya never gave much thought to it. He was tempted to NOT AVOID SINNING.

When we are tempted to sin, we respond one of two ways. We either sin or we rebuke the sin in the name of Jesus and walk away from it. It we chose to sin, we have disrupted our relationship with God until we repent (change our mind) of it and ask for forgiveness. Keep in mind that if you really want to sin then you just did.

Have you ever had someone boast that they have never been tempted by God ? That person usually feels that because they are so pure that God just passes them by. However, it may be that God knows they would fail. We can't outsmart Him. If a person says they have never sinned, then God is a liar.

Hebrews 5:7-9
7 Who in the days of His flesh, when He had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto Him that was able to save Him from death, and was heard in that He feared.
8 Though He were a Son, yet learned He obedience by the thing which He suffered:
9 And being made perfect, He became the Author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey Him.

I forgetted...Hebrews 2:18 For in that He Himself hath suffered being tempted, He is able to succour (help) them that are tempted.

One more thang...When we are tested by God, and I doubt that it is often at all, it is nothing that He feels we can't handle if we have faith in Him working with us. I am certain that God would not give us cancer, tempt us to be a pervert, cause a car wreck...junk like that, but some people preach just that.

So, if you love Jesus and you know He loves you, and you admit that the old flesh still has a little life left in it (less each day) but you are making a truly love effort to glorify Jesus then consider this. When you get to your wit's end, you will find God lives there. rivit.

Remembher..Moses started out as a basket case.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

quote:
Originally posted by bluefrog:
[QB]

One more thang...When we are tested by God, and I doubt that it is often at all, it is nothing that He feels we can't handle if we have faith in Him working with us.

But lately it's really getting to me that I loose my temper, get angry and Bla bla bla you know. It's like being in a whirlwind of guilt. I know that I haven't been feeling well, I had surgery and it affected nerves (terribly). I'm not making excuses, it just seems like I can't control my actions these days. This seems to be getting me into trouble by the way.

I don't like it. Lately I feel like it is just too much. I'm sure glad He knows what He's doin-- at least that makes one of us. [Smile]

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

FOUND IN HIM....I am so sorry to hear that. That doesn't sound like a test from God by the way. Nerves can be overactive for many reasons, even the thyroid gland. Drugs used in surgery can be a problem, so they say. So many thangs.
Including certain experiences with others.

Anger in nervousness toward another usually means that the "another" wins. Forgiveness is the winner in that race. With that winner (forgiveness) then "another" looses.

You could go to a shrink. They can mess with your mind and nerves to the point where with their drugs (only thing keepin them in business) you won't care, you'll hate everyone you ever knew, and you won't have any money left to worry about... Speak to Jesus about it, out loud with your mouth, ask Him to fix you, not if it is His will though because it is already. If you ask if it is His will...you question it, so don't.
Then thank Him and expect it by acting on it.
Walk from that talk with Him believing it is done and Think Happy. Think cool, calm and collected. Hey...it works for me.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

quote:
Originally posted by bluefrog:

You could go to a shrink. They can mess with your mind and nerves to the point where with their drugs (only thing keepin them in business) you won't care, you'll hate everyone you ever knew, and you won't have any money left to worry about... Speak to Jesus about it,

LOL!

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

quote:
Michael... What would your one sentence answer look like from a personal perspective?

quote:
homeschoolers

My personal perspective can only be His personal perspective, else I abide and in and respond in the flesh! (Thas one sentence! [happyhappy]

)

==== His Love ===== [Kiss]

~~~====<

>====~~~~

If it isn't Jesus, it's dead!

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

Let me try another 'one sentence' attempt (this one doesn't count). And let me base it on:

Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

When you 'walk in the Spirit' you 'do not' fulfill the lusts of the flesh. Therefore, if one fulfills the lusts of the flesh, he/she does not walk in the Spirit: That simple! So he/she does not understand what it therefore means to walk 'in' the Spirit, because the verse 'qualifies' it. If one walks in the Spirit, the lusts of the flesh are not fulfilled. Else he does not walk in the Spirit!

(Do I really have to stick to one sentence? Did I fail? Can I get an 'E' for effort?)

[Prayer]

IT's all about FAITH!

Posted by Betty Louise (Member # 7175) on :

I don't believe we never ever give in to the flesh.
There are times, that we do good, but there are going to be times, that we give in to the flesh.
As Paul said that he did what he did not want to do and other times, he did not do what he wanted to do.
betty

Posted by Copper25 (Member # 7464) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Betty Louise:
I don't believe we never ever give in to the flesh.
There are times, that we do good, but there are going to be times, that we give in to the flesh.
As Paul said that he did what he did not want to do and other times, he did not do what he wanted to do.
betty

James 1:12) "blessed is the man that endureth temptation", think about it, the world promotes every way of the flesh but aren't we required to endure temptation as Jesus did in matthew 4.

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

Throughout the bible God tells us to be perfect.
He says it over and over in hopes that we will listen. Those who believe it is possible, I have a little news for ya:

1 John 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

If'n ya have a problem with that, go to 1 John 1 and read the 10 verse chapter. If you are still in doubt about your not being perfect, get married. If that doesn't do it marry someone who has been married before. If that don't do it, what are you doing here ?

Posted by Betty Louise (Member # 7175) on :

Jesus was the only one to ever be perfect.
betty

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

Jesus was our only way to reach that goal. Through Him we were and continue to be made perfect only by his blood.
Makes me feel pretty disgusting but He thought it was worth it.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Betty Louise:
Jesus was the only one to ever be perfect.
betty

OH I like Miss Betty Louise!... She wins the prize of the day award for BEST ANSWER!!!

[thumbsup2]

Posted by Betty Louise (Member # 7175) on :

Found in Him,

I like you too. Thank God that He saves imperfect people because this old lady has lots of flaws. [hug]

God bless you, Found in Him. [hug]

betty

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

quote:
I don't believe we never ever give in to the flesh.
There are times, that we do good, but there are going to be times, that we give in to the flesh.
As Paul said that he did what he did not want to do and other times, he did not do what he wanted to do.
betty
quote:
Betty Louise

Betty Louise, the problem is that people calling themselves 'believers' are in a perpetual state of giving in to the flesh, though they do not recognize it. And Paul points this out. So all things being relative, these do not realize that they are short of the true goal of HIS, and are comparing with the wrong things to measure themselves, such as for example, each other, rather than His word. That is how they come to the conclusion that they 'give in' occasionally, without seeing their 'separation' from God on a daily basis.

Because to them, giving in is something outrageous in comparison to what they generally know to be right and wrong. But they cannot see that minute to minute their life is more like, "You honor me with your lips, but your heart is far from me." For hourly their life is filled with denials of Him. And if one asks Him to show him this, it will be a real eye opener.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Betty Louise:
Jesus was the only one to ever be perfect.
betty

OH I like Miss Betty Louise!... She wins the prize of the day award for BEST ANSWER!!!

[thumbsup2]

[/QUOTE]

Posted by Betty Louise (Member # 7175) on :

Michael,
You see to have appointed yourself as judge and jury. You cannot see any of us nor do you know how we live. The problem with Christians who convinced themselves that they can live perfect lives, they are in for a great disappointment when they fail, and they surely will fail. The Bible says that pride goeth before a fall.
betty

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

I love ya Sister Betty!

[hug]

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

Betty, I have only your 'words' to go on. Your 'confessions' (plural, meaning everyone's) are in your statements. I have judged no one. I have only pointed the way to something we all need!

But a guilty conscience is not a friend. It excuses one's self, and accuses another. Tell me it isn't so, if you can; or have you no children who have put you through this?

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

STOP IT! The Lord Jesus Christ loves her and DOES not CONDEMN her!

Here is a word to go on Michael--

John 4
21Jesus declared, "Believe me, woman, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth."

Go learn what that word means.

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

quote:
The problem with Christians who convinced themselves that they can live perfect lives, they are in for a great disappointment when they fail, and they surely will fail.

Scripture says that 'pride' goeth before the fall. But if one's source of inspiration is not one's self, from whence cometh the pride?

Mind you, in spite of grace, I still have failures which chasten me. But you are not hearing what I am writing the way I am writing it. And I never hear anyone tell Paul that he is being judgmental. Why? It is because what he is saying is instructional. It is authoritive. It is essential. But those who want to justify themselves in spite of what is 'essential' try to rebuke those who simply reiterate what is already written.

Whatever I say seems to sound critical. It is not. It is comparitive. I am not faulting anyone for being 'human'. I certainly am one of those [happyhappy]

And what no man, or woman seems to be able to hear is that 'I do not 'do' it'. I cannot. Thefore, if it is going to be 'done' it has to be 'done' by someone, and that is Christ. So I either 'accept' it and benefit thereof, or I try to 'do' it, in which case I would have bragging rights, and that would lead to the 'pride' you claim for me to have, or I simply accept defeat!

Most settle for that. How do you say that I am wrong when I say that God's word says that we don't have to? Perhaps it is only because you are complacent in your condition, and it is easier to find fault with he who exhorts. But my conscience dear, is clear. I wrong no one.

Posted by Betty Louise (Member # 7175) on :

Michael,

I have no guilty conscious. Every day, I pray and ask God to forgive of my sins.
betty

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

And all I am saying Betty is that one does not have to accept that he is going to sin. That leads one to go right ahead and do it. In other words, at the end of the day there is no requirement that one would need to 'repent' and ask forgiveness. For there is no requirement to sin. After all, look at what it causes; things we wish we could take back; things we wish we could undo.

And here is the more major point: We can get forgiveness always. But the consequence will remain. For example, a man can commit hidious crime, and repent, and be forgiven, even saved. But he will still go to jail. So the reason I elaborate, dear one, is that as long as we simply let it keep happening, we are not "Gathering with Him," But, "Scattering abroad." In other words, we cause harm to ourselves, others, and to the testimony of God our Lord.

Is that mean to say, or spiteful? Is that carrying a big stick, or supposing myself better than anyone? I am only testifying that there is victory. And where will those stand who diminish this testimony? Are they 'righteous' before God in this matter?

And all I am saying is to let God do it, lest we sin. There is opportunity for God! But if we allow not that opportunity, we will be most unhappy. That is not mean to say. In fact, you'd think most people would want to hear it, but they don't.

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

Here is a good point. Most people are willing rather to accept that they can be forgiven, and let that cover them for their own comfort. But they are not willing to "Take His yoke," which is light, and come to understand that they don't have to fail, no matter the difficulty. And who wouldn't want to rejoice the heart of the Lord in this manner?

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

Found in Him, you have a problem deeply agitating you which you are hiding. Your spirit is suffering terribly! I wish you comfort!

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Michael Harrison:
Found in Him, you have a problem deeply agitating you which you are hiding. Your spirit is suffering terribly! I wish you comfort!]

Yeah well you know Michael, IF I have a problem deeply agitating me, and IF I'm hiding one, I would go straight to My Lord Jesus Christ where I would be comforted and never He leaves me suffering terribly.

I'm keeping my Peace tonight Michael
Good night.

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

sickum !

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

Teddy Roosevelt said:
"Don't hit at all if you can help it; don't hit a man if you can possibly avoid it; but if you do hit him, put him to sleep." New York City, February 17, 1899
[thumbsup2]

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

What are you doin up this time of night ?

I have been communicating with my two senators.

I am so proud of them, Tom Coburn and James Inhofe, Republicans from Oklahoma. They are fighting this spending madness like a couple of junk yard dogs. I think they are loosing their political correctness. I guarantee you that it is a good thing I'm not there.

The best congress could do about this bail out/stimulant bill is NOTHING. Just wait, you'll see.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

quote:
Originally posted by bluefrog:
What are you doin up this time of night ?

I have been communicating with my two senators.

I am so proud of them, Tom Coburn and James Inhofe, Republicans from Oklahoma. They are fighting this spending madness like a couple of junk yard dogs. I think they are loosing their political correctness. I guarantee you that it is a good thing I'm not there.

The best congress could do about this bail out/stimulant bill is NOTHING. Just wait, you'll see.

My congressman Mr. Mike Pence is against it too. I was proud to see him on Fox news the other night. He stands for what he believes-- That's what it's gonna take! I emailed him in support of his efforts.

It's nice to see more Americans start to come out of this love affair with Obama and see that the dude doesn't have a clue.

I'm always up this late.

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

quote:
"Don't hit at all if you can help it; don't hit a man if you can possibly avoid it; but if you do hit him, put him to sleep." New York City, February 17, 1899

Perhaps you have never seen the nail prints in HIS hands.

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

Theodore Roosevelt said:
A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college education.

I'm sure he knew the Lord with the nail scared hands-- Theodore Roosevelt was a devout man.

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

Michael Harrison said that "You can know the Bible, and be 'devout', and not know the Lord."

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

Can you please tell Michael Harrison that he is not a judge, jury or discerner of others hearts?

Thanks

Posted by Betty Louise (Member # 7175) on :

Michael, Knock it off. Stop being judgmental.
betty

Posted by Found in Him (Member # 7596) on :

[hug]

Posted by bluefrog (Member # 7448) on :

Awwwww, how sweet ! [Big Grin]

Me thinks we have two tough ole' birds now.

Posted by Betty Louise (Member # 7175) on :

Found in Him,

I love you too. [hug]

betty

Posted by Michael Harrison (Member # 6801) on :

Are you judging me betty?

quote:
Michael, Knock it off. Stop being judgmental.
betty

Posted by Eden (Member # 5728) on :

Michael Harrison wrote

quote:
And all I am saying Betty is that one does not have to accept that he is going to sin. That leads one to go right ahead and do it.

I think the Bible makes it clear that we are BORN sinners, that we are CONSTITUTED sinners, that there is a natural inclination in us TO SIN.

Jesus died on the cross for our sins, but that sin nature is still in us too. But God provided for that too by crucifying the sinner on the cross with Jesus.

So God dealt with our sins, and God dealt with the sin factory, or the sinner which is us.

Romans 7:23
But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

When a man or woman is saved by faith in Jesus, the Spirit comes in and comes alongside and begins to war against the flesh tendencies in us, but the flesh fights back against the Spirit:

Galatians 5:17
For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that you cannot do the things that you would like to do.

Michael Harrison, just because the Spirit has come into a Christian does not mean that that Christian will no longer sin or "be in the flesh"; it is clear from the above verse that the Spirit and the flesh are at war, with both of them winning some battles, but hopefully the Spirit wins the war.

The thing that continues to amaze me about your statements is that YOU RARELY ever describe yourself as STILL BEING A SINNER also...yes, the Spirit may be operating in you also, warring against YOUR flesh, but you hardly ever acknowledge that YOU YOURSELF ARE ALSO STILL A SINNER.

So let me repeat what you wrote, Michael Harrison

quote:
And all I am saying Betty is that one does not have to accept that he is going to sin. That leads one to go right ahead and do it.

Yes, one DOES have to accept that one is going to sin at some point, maybe even TODAY! And it is illogical to think that after the Spirit has come into a Christian, that the Christian is suddenly INCLINDE TO LEAD ONE RIGHT AHEAD AND GO DO IT, is completely CONTRARY to the Word of God, because the NATURE of the Spirit of God is NOT TO SIN BUT to NOT SIN. So why would a Christian be inclined to "just go ahead and sin since one is going to sin at some point anyway"?

That is complete hogwash. Once the Spirit of God comes in and begins to war against the flesh in a Christian, that Christian is "going to either sin less" or "definitey be aware that he or she has indeed a sin problem", just as the Word of God says.

And that includes you, Michael Harrison, if the Spirit of God is in you, the Spirit of God is "fightin' fur ya". But only the Lord Jesus from heaven ever lived the 100% sinless life, but not you and not me, "not in this life".

love, Eden