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Author
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Topic: When Faith Falters . . . What Next?
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renewedfaith
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Member # 11309
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posted
What I really mean is that there is no verse that says you become "unsealed." I don't doubt that God accepts us as his own. However, I am unaware of any verse that says your seal gets removed if you are a bad person and walk away.
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FPC
Posts: 8 | From: Los Angeles | Registered: Feb 2014
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Ephesian 1:12-14
quote:
to the end that we who were the first to hope in Christ would be to the praise of His glory. In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation-- having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of God's own possession, to the praise of His glory.
quote:
Eph 4:30
And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.[/QUOTE}
[QUOTE]2 Corinthians 1:22
And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
quote:
2 Cor 5:5
And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
I dare disagree. Being Sealed by the Holy Spirit is scriptural and in fact, if you are not SEALED by the Holy Spirit, you are not born again.
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renewedfaith
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posted
My problem with your "sealing" theory is that it's not based in scripture. Not trying to be confrontational, rather, just pointing out what is true.
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FPC
Posts: 8 | From: Los Angeles | Registered: Feb 2014
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First off, lets define my term.
When I use the term walk away. I mean reject the God they once professed to believe in.
In order for a true believer to do this, God would have to UNSEAL a person He once SEALED with the Holy Spirit.
I am not talking about merely taking a wrong path and falling into some sin.
I am talking about becoming UN_born_again
Impossible! A person cannot become un_born_again
In all God's Omniscience, ask yourself this> Why would a God who knows all things: past, present and future, Seal a person for eternal redemption, if He knows they will one day reject their salvation?
Is God ignorant of the this persons future rejection? NO. God knows all things.
Is God a kid who likes to play Indian-giver with His Children.. Give you it one day and take it back the next? NO
So what is left except to accept the truth, that God never sealed that person to begin with because God knew they were not sincere in the first place.
There are many many many people professing to be Christians.. but that's like professing there is a Chair in the room and never sitting in it. One can call themselves a Christian all they want. But we are told... it is written that
quote:
"Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' 23"And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'
That verse says basically, that there are many people out there doing what believers do , speaking what believers speak, going to church, getting involved in some ministry here or there.. yet they are deluded and deceived because God does not know them. They were never , ever born again. Its all about good works and playing church or looking good. Its not about a true relationship.
And when these types get tired of doing everything in their own strength and in their own power... they will falter, they will become discouraged, they will become weak and tired and walk away thinking to themselves.. " well.. All I did for God and I get nothing in return... what has he ever done for me?, and then decide that since the god they conjured up didn't do what they thought he should.. they are going to reject that they ever believed.
and they didn't.
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renewedfaith
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I like your observations, but only have one disagreement.
First, I agree that we must stand put, even when we doubt. From a practical standpoint, what is the alternative?
I disagree with your assessment that "Nobody who walks away and rejects the God they once professed {to be God, savior and Lord}, was ever regenerated spiritually." This is simply not true. Romans 8:38-39 tells us that "nothing" can separate us from the love of God. To prove that he meant "nothing" we are told that neither "Life nor death" nor "angels" nor "principalities" nor anything else can separate us from God. This being the case, how can you possibly suggest that people who "walk away" were never sealed? As Jesus said, "If any man comes to me, I will in no way cast him out." If any person had a shred of authenticity in their hearts, then they will not be cast out. Not my words, Jesus' words. I'm always curious why Christians believe that people have to be in a perfect relationship with God at all times to be saved. It's simply not true.
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FPC
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I cannot say I have ever doubted. I can say I have felt abandoned.
When I have felt abandoned by God.. which you may call doubting that he is there at all... I always remember the experiences of God in my life. The times He spoke with me about things to come; that did come. The way he sent an angel to draw me back from a pit of torment. the way he spoke quietly to me while walking down an old country dirt road. Also many other events where there were no other explanations but God's hand.
The thing I do when I feel like God is no where to be found, is to Stand firm in what I do know.
Long ago I read a book.. I cannot remember the name, but in the book a quote by C.S.Lewis was used. ( I will paraphrase since I do not have that book anymore)
quote:
Satan's cause is never in more danger than when a human, no longer desiring, but still intending to do Gods will, looks around upon the face of the earth where every trace of Him seems to have vanished;; asking why he has been forsaken, yet still obeys. C.S. Lewis
yes, I do believe that often times, God seems to have vanished. It's liken to a parent stepping back from a baby just learning to walk and waiting for the baby to walk unassisted.
This is when we must NOT lean on our own understanding... our own feelings... and the absence of seeing with our eyes or hearing with our ears, and just believe God's word which says " I shall never leave you nor forsake you" and " Nothing can separate you from the love of God"
Every desert is just preparation for a mighty work yet to come and a testing of us to see if we will stand. Not because God does not know, or needs to know... But that we need to know.. we need to learn and build our trust and faith in God.
Now.. This slightly touches on other doctrinal issues which I wont go into here... yet I will say this.
Nobody who walks away and rejects the God they once professed {to be God, savior and Lord}, was ever regenerated spiritually. God will not be mocked and He knows those who are sincere and those who are not. He will not seal a person with His Spirit who never was sincere to begin with. And many do walk away saying they once believed but do no more. Don't be deceived. They were not of Him.
DeeperStill
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renewedfaith
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Have you ever been hit with the thunderbolt of doubt? I distinctly remember the first time in my Christian life when I suddenly wondered, “What if God doesn’t exist?” This thought troubled me deeply for years. I also was scared that I was going to Hell for thinking this thought. It’s a debilitating thought when it first hits.
I finally learned that doubt is merely a test of our faith. There is absolutely nothing wrong with questioning God’s existence. God knows that we deal with doubt. He is there to HELP us, not reject us. I’ve run into many Christians who have lost faith, or, who don’t want to lose faith, but can’t seem to overcome their doubts. I finally decided to do something about it. I wrote a book called “iDoubt: When Faith Falters.” It’s free (yes, 100% free - - no strings attached, no credit card numbers) to download at Smashwords.com. One critic on Amazon stated that it was one of the 5 best books that she had ever read and that she had been looking for a book like this for 40 years. I hope it helps you or any other friends who doubt. There is hope, even when it appears there isn’t.
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FPC
Posts: 8 | From: Los Angeles | Registered: Feb 2014
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