|
Author
|
Topic: Scriptual Grounds for Divorce
|
God_is_on_His_throne
New Member
Member # 5295
|
posted
Thank you all for your feedback!
--------------------
"Love the Lord thy God with all thine heart"
Posts: 5 | From: Warren Ohio | Registered: Nov 2005
| IP: Logged | 
|
|
God_is_on_His_throne
New Member
Member # 5295
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by Titus:
Man oh man does that church sound like the one I escaped about 30 years ago. According to them, Christ's blood was not sufficient to atone for all sins, nor can one go to heaven UNLESS they have been baptised by a pastor, elder or deacon of their church and then one must attend their church until they die or Christ returns. They also teach that they are the only ones going to heaven and that all other denominations are nothing but a bunch of liars and that Billy Graham is a false prophet. I'm sure glad God rescued me from them. I still bump into people from this denimination and when I tell them I was baptised by an elder in one of their sister churches they are all cuddly and sweet until I tell them I left that church. They then get real quiet.
Titus
That sounds like us. There are so many creepy things that are happening and has happened that it makes me feel like, "where is God in all this"
The pastor's wife died last year, but at first he didn't tell the saints what was going on and the wife appeared to church with bruises and broken ribs. She also couldn't remember people. All these symtoms occured within a week's time. The minister also banned their daughter from coming to see her mother or the church because she stopped attending the church. :boohoo:
--------------------
"Love the Lord thy God with all thine heart"
Posts: 5 | From: Warren Ohio | Registered: Nov 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87
|
posted
This topic is titled “Scriptural Grounds for Divorce”
The betrothal period is the only time someone can be put away (divorced)
John the Baptist did not have to die, he only had to be silent about Herod
John said “ it is not lawful for you to have your brothers wife”
This was all about the issue of divorce
Yeshua said “Mat 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.”
11. But he that is least in the kingdom of heaven, is greater than he - Which an ancient author explains thus: - "One perfect in the law, as John was, is inferior to one who is baptized into the death of Christ. For this is the kingdom of heaven, even to be buried with Christ, and to be raised up together with him. John was greater than all who had been then born of women, but he was cut off before the kingdom of heaven was given." [He seems to mean, that righteousness, peace, and joy, which constitute the present inward kingdom of heaven.] "He was blameless as to that righteousness which is by the law; but he fell short of those who are perfected by the spirit of life which is in Christ. Whosoever, therefore, is least in the kingdom of heaven, by Christian regeneration, is greater than any who has attained only the righteousness of the law, because the law maketh nothing perfect." It may farther mean, the least true Christian believer has a more perfect knowledge of Jesus Christ, of his redemption and kingdom, than John the Baptist had, who died before the full manifestation of the Gospel.
The disciples understood something very serious was being said about marriage and divorce.
They answered Yeshua words with “if what you say is true, it would be better not to ever marry.
How do you repent of any sin?
You ask for forgiveness and don’t continue in that sin.
In all cases where restitution can be made, it must be done.
If you have something that does not belong to you return it. You can not keep it and use it as your own.
If you continue in a sin there is no repentance and with no repentance there is no salvation.
1Jo 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If you have put your faith in Yeshua/Jesus you are in the betrothal period and can be put away.
Please remember that I am against the “once saved always saved” doctrine that is so prevalent in our day.
I maintain that Salvation is a free choice.
Endnote
Another understanding of porneia which has gained some acceptance recently is that porneia here is a legal term. In Leviticus 18, various close-kin marriages were forbidden -- a man, for example, was not permitted to marry his aunt or his sister. According to this understanding, the Pharisees had asked a legal question, "Is it LAWFUL for a man to put away his wife for any cause?" Jesus then gave an answer with a legal exception. He said, in essence, "Anyone who puts away his wife, excepting the putting away of an unlawful wife (porneia), and marries another is committing adultery." Support for this view rests in that the term porneia is used in the Septuagint to refer to these unlawful relationships in Leviticus 18. Two New Testament examples of unlawful relationships include Herod, who married his brother's wife and was told "It is not LAWFUL for thee to have thy brother's wife" (Mark 6:18); and the man at Corinth, whose sin of having his father's wife was termed porneia (I Corinthians 5:1). This view, like the espousal view, is consistent with Jesus' basic position: no divorce, no remarriage. It seems a rather obvious exception, however, one that would hardly need mention either to the Jews or to modern readers. Furthermore, no early writer understood the exception clause in this way.
--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Titus
Advanced Member
Member # 4394
|
posted
Man oh man does that church sound like the one I escaped about 30 years ago. According to them, Christ's blood was not sufficient to atone for all sins, nor can one go to heaven UNLESS they have been baptised by a pastor, elder or deacon of their church and then one must attend their church until they die or Christ returns. They also teach that they are the only ones going to heaven and that all other denominations are nothing but a bunch of liars and that Billy Graham is a false prophet. I'm sure glad God rescued me from them. I still bump into people from this denimination and when I tell them I was baptised by an elder in one of their sister churches they are all cuddly and sweet until I tell them I left that church. They then get real quiet.
Titus
Posts: 27 | From: Indiana | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
WhiteEagle
Advanced Member
Member # 3728
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by God_is_on_His_throne:
Thanks for the advise. What about if I have family members there who are stuck thinking they will go to hell if they leave? This is one of the doctrines taught by the pastor teacher.
If that pastor is teaching that people will go to hell if they leave his ministry, then he is a false teacher and that ministry is a cult.
Remind your relatives that no man is the Head of the Church. Christ is the Head. Your relatives are to follow Christ, not a man.
A pastor is supposed to be a "shepherd of people", and lead them to Christ, who is the Head, and help people have a relationship with God, and teach the Bible, not use the Bible to control people.
That pastor is using the Bible to control people.
Cults manipulate people and control them, and one of the tactics is to make them believe that if they leave they will go to hell, or forever be lost to God.
Posts: 1392 | From: Maine | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged |
|
|
God_is_on_His_throne
New Member
Member # 5295
|
posted
Thanks for the advise. What about if I have family members there who are stuck thinking they will go to hell if they leave? This is one of the doctrines taught by the pastor teacher.
--------------------
"Love the Lord thy God with all thine heart"
Posts: 5 | From: Warren Ohio | Registered: Nov 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
WhiteEagle
Advanced Member
Member # 3728
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by God_is_on_His_throne:
Hello everyone! I am glad to have the opportunity to chat with those who want to learn more about God and do the right thing.
, "Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?" Wow, the minister was relentless and told the legal wife to just forgive her legal husband and don't be evil or bitter about the situation. She was also told not to go through the courts to get money from her legal husband, except it be miniscule. FYI, the minister had this woman on the floor screaming at her telling her, "Get a hold of yourself _____, for greater is He that is in you than he that is in the world!"
This is all true and not lies. Is this something or what?
Get out of that "church" immediately.
I would hazard a guess that that minister is crazy. Insane.
That woman had every right to fight for her monetary rights and for the rights of her children.
That is abuse in the church by a pastor who is a crazy person.
Posts: 1392 | From: Maine | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged |
|
|
epouraniois
unregistered
|
posted
Rom 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
Rom 5:14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
Rom 5:15 But not as the offense, so also is the free gift. For if through the offense of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
Rom 5:16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offenses unto justification.
Rom 5:17 For if by one man's offense death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)
Rom 5:18 Therefore as by the offense of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
Rom 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Rom 5:20 Moreover the law entered, that the offense might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:
Rom 5:21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
IP: Logged |
|
|
God_is_on_His_throne
New Member
Member # 5295
|
posted
You all are really helpfull. I feel so bad for this woman and her children. There has been other situations just as bad as this one. The woman feels that this is the only church she can hear God's word. Well, the minister teaches this in his sservices.
--------------------
"Love the Lord thy God with all thine heart"
Posts: 5 | From: Warren Ohio | Registered: Nov 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
yahsway
Advanced Member
Member # 3738
|
posted
So tell me, what is sin? Is it not transgression of the law?
Posts: 1238 | From: Tennessee | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged |
|
|
epouraniois
unregistered
|
posted
Seems to me is always questionable if the 'church' takes upon themselves the laws of Israel. I am not saying there aren't laws though, for it is written:
- Authorized Version 1769 -
1Tim 1:9
Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
1Tim 1:10
For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
1Tim 2:1
. I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, [and] giving of thanks, be made for all men;
1Tim 2:2
For kings, and [for] all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
1Tim 2:3
For this [is] good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
1Tim 3:7
Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
1Tim 3:8
. Likewise [must] the deacons [be] grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
1Tim 3:9
Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
1Tim 3:10
And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being [found] blameless.
1Tim 6:1
. Let as many servants as are under the yoke count their own masters worthy of all honour, that the name of God and [his] doctrine be not blasphemed.
1Tim 6:2
And they that have believing masters, let them not despise [them], because they are brethren; but rather do [them] service, because they are faithful and beloved, partakers of the benefit. These things teach and exhort.
1Tim 6:3
If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, [even] the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
1Tim 6:4
He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,
1Tim 6:5
Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.
1Tim 6:6
. But godliness with contentment is great gain.
IP: Logged |
|
|
HisGrace
unregistered
|
posted
That poor, poor woman. I believe that she was totally within her rights to legally rectify the situation.
That preacher should be reported to the parent association, to which that church belongs for humiliating the woman in front of the whole congregation and treating her in such a barbaric manner. Who will be next?
Above all, steps should be taken for justice to be restored to this woman, who must be totally devastated and perhaps may even turn against God and the church forever.
The Bible says that adultery is grounds for divorce.
Matthew 19:9 And I tell you this, a man who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery--unless his wife has been unfaithful."
IP: Logged |
|
|
SoftTouch
Advanced Member
Member # 2316
|
posted
quote:
Matthew 5: 32But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
1 Corinthians 7: 13And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.
14For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
15But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.
I believe the Minister was totally Wrong. First, just because the man went to church did Not mean he was truly born again (or the woman for that matter). His actions would definitely say otherwise.
Secondly, Jesus did give permission for Divorce under one circumstance – Adultry (which that husband Did commit – and worse). As far as I know, there is no other way to obtain a divorce except through a court. The woman had no other recourse left her except to do what she did to make sure her children were taken care of.
--------------------
Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
Posts: 3465 | Registered: Nov 2003
| IP: Logged |
|
|
TEXASGRANDMA
Advanced Member
Member # 847
|
posted
This minister is way out of line. He should be helping her get the money owed her. My sister's Pastor went to court with her when she divorced her drug crazed too lazy to work abusive husband. Since that time God blessed my sister with a Christian husband.
Even if he wanted to help her, yelling at her in front of the Church is sinful it itself.
betty
hubby said that the Minister should be told unless he is planing on providing a roof over the woman and her children and supporting her, than he should stay our of it
--------------------
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged |
|
|
God_is_on_His_throne
New Member
Member # 5295
|
posted
Hello everyone! I am glad to have the opportunity to chat with those who want to learn more about God and do the right thing.
I have a question and a situation of concern and would like your opinion on whether this church is right me, you, or anyone else? Please read below and with Godly advise respond. Thanks in advance.
Here is an interesting topic. A couple from Englewood NJ has been married for over 20 years and the husband who has not been the best husband or dad decides to have an affair and it results with a child. Now, this guy forges his wife's signature and illegally divorces her without her knowing about it until he married this other woman and his legal wife received a copy of the divorce papers with only a few days to agree, sign, and give the papers to her legal husband or court.
Immediately, the legal wife hired a lawyer to rectify this matter by setting the illegal divorce record straight, get money for their house that the husband had all of a sudden put on the market to sell, and get money for their children that the husband stopped supporting with the exception of $20 here and there. The wife's actions were pretty much stopped and threatened by the minister of the congregation that both the legal husband and legal wife attend. The minister told the wife in an open service quoting scriptures from the Bible, "Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?" Wow, the minister was relentless and told the legal wife to just forgive her legal husband and don't be evil or bitter about the situation. She was also told not to go through the courts to get money from her legal husband, except it be miniscule. FYI, the minister had this woman on the floor screaming at her telling her, "Get a hold of yourself _____, for greater is He that is in you than he that is in the world!"
This is all true and not lies. Is this something or what?
--------------------
"Love the Lord thy God with all thine heart"
Posts: 5 | From: Warren Ohio | Registered: Nov 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
|
Printer-friendly view of this topic
