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Author
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Topic: Thy Rod And Thy Staff They Comfort Me
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Ablorba
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Member # 14122
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posted
Psalms 23 gives me great pleasure as meditation and praise. Thank you for the detail.
--Sacramento Pine
Posts: 54 | From: Sacramento | Registered: Oct 2016
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Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sa:ji:sdo:de:
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quote:
Originally posted by Carol Swenson:
Thank you, but what does that have to do with this topic?
Apparently I misjudged the topic. I thought its purpose was to direct my attention to the shepherd spoken of at John 10:1-30. Sorry.
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No, it's okay. I was just wondering. Actually this topic was just explaining what a shepherd's rod and staff are used for. To me, it gives a richer depth to Psalm 23.
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sa:ji:sdo:de:
quote:
Originally posted by Sa:ji:sdo:de:
According to God's testimony-- as an expert witness in all matters pertaining to Christianity --people lacking eternal life are lacking it because they lack God's son; in other words: they are quite christless. His testimony applies to Christians as well as non Christians.
God's testimony is chipped in heaven's stone; and people who refuse to rely upon what God says are actually insinuating that He's a dishonest person of marginal integrity who can't be trusted to always tell the truth.
†. 1John 5:9-12 . . If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater; for the witness of God is this, that He has borne witness concerning His son. The one who believes in the Son of God has the witness in himself; the one who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the witness that God has borne concerning His son.
. . . And the witness is this, that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His son. He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.
Christ's testimony corroborates his Father's. Note the grammatical tense of Christ's "have" verb in the statement below: it's present tense rather than future, indicating that Christ's believing followers all have eternal life right now-- no delay and no waiting period.
†. John 5:24 . . I assure you, those who listen to my message, and believe in God who sent me, have eternal life. They will never be condemned for their sins, but they have already passed from death into life.
I gather from Christ's statement that people lacking eternal life, are lacking it because they don't listen to him, and they don't trust his Father.
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Psalms 40:7 Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me,
Hebrews 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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Sa:ji:sdo:de
Advanced Member
Member # 13749
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sa:ji:sdo:de:
According to God's testimony-- as an expert witness in all matters pertaining to Christianity --people lacking eternal life are lacking it because they lack God's son; in other words: they are quite christless. His testimony applies to Christians as well as non Christians.
God's testimony is chipped in heaven's stone; and people who refuse to rely upon what God says are actually insinuating that He's a dishonest person of marginal integrity who can't be trusted to always tell the truth.
†. 1John 5:9-12 . . If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater; for the witness of God is this, that He has borne witness concerning His son. The one who believes in the Son of God has the witness in himself; the one who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed in the witness that God has borne concerning His son.
. . . And the witness is this, that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His son. He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.
Christ's testimony corroborates his Father's. Note the grammatical tense of Christ's "have" verb in the statement below: it's present tense rather than future, indicating that Christ's believing followers all have eternal life right now-- no delay and no waiting period.
†. John 5:24 . . I assure you, those who listen to my message, and believe in God who sent me, have eternal life. They will never be condemned for their sins, but they have already passed from death into life.
I gather from Christ's statement that people lacking eternal life, are lacking it because they don't listen to him, and they don't trust his Father.
/
Posts: 1245 | From: Oregon | Registered: Jul 2016
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WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sa:ji:sdo:de:
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According to God's testimony-- as an expert witness in all matters pertaining to Christianity --people lacking eternal life are lacking it because they lack God's son; in other words: they are quite christless. His testimony applies to Christians as well as non Christians.
†.
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in other words? whose ? yours?
I will stay with the text-
Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
Romans 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
Hebrews 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
Hebrews 10:18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
Your over talk takes away from the Simplicity that is in Christ.
This over talk re-directs away from His shed Blood.
Is this not a false witness?
![[cool_shades]](graemlins/cool_shades.gif)
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929
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posted
Thank you, but what does that have to do with this topic? Please talk to us more.
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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Sa:ji:sdo:de
Advanced Member
Member # 13749
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posted
-An "expert witness" can be defined as: A witness, who by virtue of education, training, skill, or experience, is believed to have knowledge in a particular subject beyond that of the average person, sufficient that others may officially (and legally) rely upon the witness's specialized (scientific, technical or other) opinion about an evidence or fact issue within the scope of their expertise, referred to as the expert opinion, as an assistance to the fact-finder. According to God's testimony-- as an expert witness in all matters pertaining to Christianity --people lacking eternal life are lacking it because they lack God's son; in other words: they are quite christless. His testimony applies to Christians as well as non Christians. †. 1John 5:11-12 . . This is what God has testified: He has given us eternal life, and this life is in His son. So whoever has God's son has this life; and whosoever does not have this life, does not have His son. How many christless Christians am I talking about? Well, for starters: as of 2014 there were approximately 1.226 billion Roman Catholics worldwide who were taught that nobody, not even the Pope, obtains eternal life until they pass on. Well, if 1John 5:11-12 is true-- viz: if God knows what He's talking about --then all 1.226 billion of those Catholics in 2014 were christless. And that was a very serious situation. †. Rom 8:9 . . Whoever does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to Christ. This means that every time a Catholic in 2014 said: "the Lord is my shepherd" they were saying something about themselves that wasn't true. And that's only for starters. God's testimony effects not only Catholics, but everybody lacking eternal life; and that adds up to some pretty serious numbers. /
Posts: 1245 | From: Oregon | Registered: Jul 2016
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Carol Swenson
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Member # 6929
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posted
When the shepherd is afield with his flock in the high country, it is customary for him to carry a minimum of equipment. This was especially true in olden times where the sheepmen did not have the benefit of mechanized equipment to transport camp supplies across the rough country.
In the Middle East the shepherd carries only a rod and staff. Some of my most vivid boyhood recollections are those of watching the African herdsmen shepherding their stock with only a long slender stick and a rough "knob-kerrie" in their hands. These are the common and universal equipment of the primitive sheepman.
Each shepherd boy, from the time he first starts to tend his father's flock, takes special pride in the selection of a rod and staff exactly suited to his own size and strength. He goes into the bush and selects a young sapling which is dug from the ground. This is carved and whittled down with great care and patience. The enlarged base of the sapling where its trunk joins the roots is shaped into a smooth, rounded head of hard wood. The sapling itself is shaped to exactly fit the owner's hand. After he completes it, the shepherd boy spends hours practicing with this club, leaning how to throw it with amazing speed and accuracy. It becomes his main weapon of defense for both himself and his sheep. ...the rod, in fact, was an extension of the owner's own right arm. It stood as a symbol of his strength, his power, his authority in any serious situation.
The rod was what he relied on to safeguard both himself and his flock in danger. And it was, furthermore, the instrument he used to discipline and correct any wayward sheep that insisted on wandering away.
...an interesting sidelight on the word "rod" ... the slang term "rod" has been applied to hand-guns such as pistols and revolvers which were carried by cowboys, and other western rangement. The connotation is exactly the same as that used in this Psalm.
There is a second dimension in which the rod is used by the shepherd for the welfare of his sheep -- namely that of discipline. The club is used for this purpose perhaps more than any other.
If the shepherd saw a sheep wandering away from its own, or approaching poisonous weeds, or getting too close to danger of one sort or another, the club would go whistling through the air to send the wayward animal scurrying back to the bunch.
Another interesting use of the rod in the shepherd's hand was to examine and count the sheep. In the terminology of the Old Testament this was referred to as passing "under the rod":
And I will cause you to pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant: (Ezek. 20:37).
This meant not only coming under the owner's control and authority, but also to be subject to his most careful, intimate and firsthand examination. A sheep that passed "under the rod" was one which had been counted and looked over with great care to make sure all was well with it.
Because of their long wool it is not always easy to detect disease, wounds, or defects in sheep. For example at a sheep show an inferiour animal can be clipped and shaped and shown so as to appear a perfect specimen. But the skilled judge will take his rod and part the sheep's wool to determine the condition of the skin, the cleanliness of the fleece and the conformation of the body. In plain language, "One just does not pull the wool over his [judge's] eyes."
In caring for his sheep, the good shepherd, the careful manager, will from time to time make a careful examination of each individual sheep. As each animal comes out of the corral and through the gate, it is stopped by the shepherd's outstretched rod. He opens the fleece with the rod; he runs his skillful hands over the body; he feels for any sign of trouble; he examines the sheep with care to see if all is well. This is a most searching process entailing every intimate detail. It is, too, a comfort to the sheep for only in this way can its hidden problems be laid bare before the shepherd.
Finally the shepherd's rod is an instrument of protection both for himself and his sheep when they are in danger. It is used both as a defense and a deterrent against anything that would attack.
The skilled shepherd uses his rod to drive off predators like coyotes, wolves, cougars or stray dogs. Often it is used to beat the brush discouraging snakes and other creatures from disturbing the flock. In extreme causes, such as David recounted to Saul, the psalmist no doubt used his rod to attack the lion and the bear that came to raid his flocks.
Once in Kenya photographing elephants, I was being accompanied by a young Masai herder who carried a club in his hand. We came to the crest of a hill from which we could see a herd of elephants in the thick bush below us. To drive them out into the open we decided to dislodge a boulder and roll it down the slope. As we heaved and pushed against the great rock, a cobra, coiled beneath it, suddenly came into view ready to strike. In a split second the alert shepherd boy lashed out with his club killing the snake on the spot. The weapon had never left his hand, even while we worked on the rock.
"Thy rod ... comfort(s) me." It was the rod ever ready in the shepherd's hand that had saved the day for us.
We turn now to discuss and consider the shepherd's staff. In a sense, the staff, more than any other item of his personal equipment, identifies the shepherd as a shepherd. No one in any other profession carries a shepherd's staff. It is uniquely an instrument used for the care and management of sheep -- and only sheep. It will not do for cattle, horses or hogs. It is designed, shaped and adapted especially to the needs of sheep.
The staff is essentially a symbol of the concern, the compassion that a shepherd has for his charges. No other single word can better describe its function on behalf of the flock than that it is for their "comfort."
Whereas the rod conveys the concept of authority, of power, of discipline, of defense against danger, the word "staff" speaks of all that is longsuffering and kind.
The shepherd's staff is normally a long, slender stick, often with a crook or hook on one end. It is selected with care by the owner; it is shaped, smoothed, and cut to best suit his own personal use.
Somehow the staff is of special comfort to the shepherd himself. In the tough tramps and during the long weary watches with his sheep, he leans on it for support and strength. It becomes to him a most precious comfort and help in his duties.
There are three areas of sheep managment in which the staff plays a most significant role. The first of these lies in drawing sheep together into an intimate relationship. The shepherd will use his staff to gently lift a newborn lamb and bring it to its mother if they become parted. He does this because he does not wish to have the ewe reject her offspring if it bears the odor of his hands upon it.
...the staff is used by the shepherd to reach out and catch individual sheep, young or old, and draw them close to himself for intimate examination. The staff is very useful this way for the shy and timid sheep normally tend to keep at a distance from the shepherd.
The staff is also used for guiding sheep. Again and again I have seen a shepherd use his staff to guide his sheep gently into a new path or through some gate or along dangerous, difficult routes. He does not use it actually to beat the beast. Rather, the tip of the long slender stick is laid gently against the animal's side and the pressure applied guides the sheep in the way the owner wants it to go. Thus the sheep is reassured of its proper path.
Being stubborn creatures sheep often get into the most ridiculous and preposterous dilemmas. I have seen my own sheep, greedy for one more mouthful of green grass, climb down steep cliffs where they slipped and fell into the sea. Only my long shepherd's staff could lift them out of the water back onto solid ground.
Another common occurrence was to find sheep stuck fast in labyrinths of wild roses or brambles where they had pushed in to find a few stray mouthfuls of green grass. Soon the thorns were so hooked in their wool they could not possibly pull free, tug as they might. Only the use of the staff could free them from their entanglement.
Excerpts from:
A Shepherd Looks At Psalm 23
By Phillip Keller
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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