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Author
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Topic: Did Christ Die The Second Death?
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Carol Swenson
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Member # 6929
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posted
Thunderz7
That is very interesting. The Old Testament is full of types, but I haven't heard that one before. Thank you for posting it.
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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Thunderz7
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Member # 31
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posted
Yeshua/Jesus was in the second death and overcame it with HIS resurrection.
HE was born innocent of the bloodline of Adam,
HE walked the perfect life, under the Law, to become the perfect sacrifice.
Not only was HE the spotless Lamb that was offered,
HE was also the two goats in Lev 16,
the goat for the sin offering for the people and the scapegoat;
Just as Aaron (the High Priest, recgonized as such by YHWH)laid hands on the scapegoat and had it led by the hand of a "fit man" (one standing ready, suitable),into the wilderness (Lev.16:21)
Jonh Baptist (the High Priest, recgonized as such by YHWH)laid hands on Jesus and the Holy Spirit led HIM into the wilderness(Mt.3:13-4:1)
T7
Posts: 1113 | From: Northeast Alabama | Registered: Jun 2002
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Eden
unregistered
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posted
The article posted by Carol Swenson said quote:
So great was this agony that His physical pain was hardly felt.
I doubt that; I'm sure He felt the pain of the nails as they were driven into His feet and wrists.
It is uncertain at which point God put the sins of the world on Jesus and withdrew His presence from Jesus, but I doubt that already happened while Jesus was still being nailed to the cross. So in that case Jesus would have felt every bit of the pain, and in any case He was being punished in our place and He would have had to feel "everything that we would have felt", had we undergone our own punishment.
love, Eden
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MentorsRiddle
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Member # 2108
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posted
Oh I agree with you.
The main reason I posted what I did was because I felt the Holy Spirit pointing that out to me and I felt led to correct it.
Who knows, maybe someone was visiting and needed to be told that? ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
I agree, Christ did take on our sins because he loved us so.
God-Bless and thanks again for the post!
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
--------------------
With you I rise,
In you I sleep,
kneeling down I kiss your feet,
Grace abounds upon me now,
I once was lost
but now I'm found.
The gift of God dwells within,
To this love I now give in.
Posts: 1337 | From: Arkansas | Registered: Sep 2003
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Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929
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posted
I see what you mean. When I read that I took it to mean, not that He became someone with a fallen nature, but that He bore our burdens and suffered the temptations (without sinning) and consequences of our fallen nature.
The way it is written, though, I can understand what you're saying.
On the cross He did become sin for us, and He was separated from God for awhile.
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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MentorsRiddle
Advanced Member
Member # 2108
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posted
Carol, this is a very good teaching and is one that has been debated for years and years – I think we can all agree on that.
Christ died for us, completely sinless and blameless, which broke the bonds that hold us to sin.
Now, through him who is Jesus Christ, we are free to accept the things of the spirit as a gift from God.
Because of Christ’s sacrifice we are now able to rise above this fallen nature to a more spiritual nature – somewhat restoring our original nature.
The only part of this teaching that I had a problem with was:
quote:
In coming like His brethren, He took upon His sinless nature our sinful fallen nature.
Jesus Christ never had the “fallen nature.”
He had the very same nature that Adam had in the Garden of Eden, before the fall.
Jesus could still be tempted, like Adam and Eve were tempted, but he resisted these temptations and rose above them – remaining a perfect man and divine being until he laid down his life freely, so that we may freely have a relationship with the father.
But other than that I thought this was a wonderful teaching.
God-Bless,
~Matt
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With you I rise,
In you I sleep,
kneeling down I kiss your feet,
Grace abounds upon me now,
I once was lost
but now I'm found.
The gift of God dwells within,
To this love I now give in.
Posts: 1337 | From: Arkansas | Registered: Sep 2003
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Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929
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posted
 Did Christ Die The Second Death?
The question is asked, "Did Christ die the second death?" No, He did not. Nowhere in Scripture is there found any explicit statement that "Christ died the second death."
What we do have is a vast body of evidence that He did indeed die the equivalent of the second death.
Is there a difference? Absolutely! To say that Christ died the second death, a death from which there is no resurrection, would be to say that Christ remains dead, our faith is vain and we remain yet in our sins (1 Corinthians 15:17-19).* That is certainly Bad News.
But the Gospel is filled with Good News. Christ is risen! In order to answer the question of the nature of Christ’s death, we must first be satisfied that what the Bible teaches about His life is true.
Hebrews 2:6-18 describes the nature in which Christ came to this earth as being "like unto his brethren." In coming like His brethren, He took upon His sinless nature our sinful fallen nature. He experienced everything to the full that the unrepentant sinner must experience. Otherwise we have no Savior. When we read that Christ was "tempted in all points like as we are, yet without sin," (Hebrews 4:15) we must also understand that He was made to be sin for us (2 Corinthians 5:21).
In taking upon Himself our humanity, Christ became the representative for the human race. In reality, the Bible speaks of only two men, the first and second Adams. The first Adam was tempted and fell to temptation. The second Adam was tempted on the very same points and was victorious. Thereby, a robe of righteousness was woven on the loom of heaven, the flesh of Christ.
It is true that Christ and the prophets spoke of His resurrection on the third day but somehow, in the end, in taking sin upon Him, He began to understand the depth of sin and depth to which He must go to save a lost race. Somehow, everything He had learned about His resurrection changed. His admonition to the disciples that the flesh is weak was something that He felt deep within Himself.
In Gethsemane, He questioned His mission, wondering if there were any possibility of finding a different way, a different answer to the sin problem. But no answer came. What He received instead was encouragement that His course was correct and that it was the only way to satisfy the just demands of a broken Law.
In Gethsemane, the "place of the press," His sweat came in great drops as blood. Sin was pressing the life from the Savior. It was not His own personal sin, but the sin of the world that broke the heart of the Son of God. We read in Isaiah 53 that He was "stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted."
By rights, Christ should never have been crucified, but stoned. He had been accused of blasphemy—of claiming to be God (Matthew 26:65; John 8:58). The punishment for blasphemy was stoning (Leviticus 24:16) but that would not have satisfied the Jewish leaders. They demanded confirmation that Christ was a liar, and in fact not God. They demanded crucifixion, a symbol of rejection by God, suspended between God and man, rejected by all (Deuteronomy 21:22, 23).
When Christ cried out in the garden, "O my Father, let this cup pass from me," (Matthew 26:39) this was no idle prayer. He understood the path which He must take and His soul was "exceeding sorrowful" (v. 38).
On the cross, when He cried out, "My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?"– these were not empty words. He felt eternally separated from God. He experienced the torment that the unrepentant sinner will experience. (Mark 15:34; Psalm 22:1). The wages of sin is eternal death. Christ died the equivalent of that death. He drank the cup to it’s bitter dregs (Isaiah 51:22) so that we will not have to drink it.
Christ died the equivalent of the second death for every man. That’s Good News! We do not need to die that terrible death of separation from the Father, though we can choose that end. The second death is for unbelievers (Revelation 21:8). It was never designed that way, for the Lord would not have any perish. Christ died for every man— even the unrepentant sinner. Unfortunately there will be many who choose death rather than life. It’s a choice we each must make. (Deuteronomy 30:19). Therefore, choose life.
If anyone dies the second death it will be because they have chosen it. They will have spurned the death of Christ. What they experience will be no different than what Christ experienced on the Cross. The fire will come as sweet relief from the knowledge of what they have done in their rejection of the Son of God. In all the history of the universe there has only been one real death— the death of Christ.
I have appreciated this passage from The Desire of Ages , p. 753
Upon Christ as our substitute and surety was laid the iniquity of us all. He was counted a transgressor, that He might redeem us from the condemnation of the law. The guilt of every descendant of Adam was pressing upon His heart. The wrath of God against sin, the terrible manifestation of His displeasure because of iniquity, filled the soul of His Son with consternation. All His life Christ had been publishing to a fallen world the good news of the Father's mercy and pardoning love. Salvation for the chief of sinners was His theme. But now with the terrible weight of guilt He bears, He cannot see the Father's reconciling face. The withdrawal of the divine countenance from the Saviour in this hour of supreme anguish pierced His heart with a sorrow that can never be fully understood by man. So great was this agony that His physical pain was hardly felt.
Satan with his fierce temptations wrung the heart of Jesus. The Saviour could not see through the portals of the tomb. Hope did not present to Him His coming forth from the grave a conqueror, or tell Him of the Father's acceptance of the sacrifice. He feared that sin was so offensive to God that Their separation was to be eternal. Christ felt the anguish which the sinner will feel when mercy shall no longer plead for the guilty race. It was the sense of sin, bringing the Father's wrath upon Him as man's substitute, that made the cup He drank so bitter, and broke the heart of the Son of God.
* In a technical sense, it would have been impossible for Christ to die the second death for that death will not literally occur until after the close of the millennium. (Revelation 20:14).
http://www.gospel-herald.com/christ_second_death.htm
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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