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Author Topic: God Wants Me to Be Rich
Michael Harrison
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quote:
Baptist evangelist Justin Peters, an outspoken critic
Hum! This tells me all that I want to know about Baptist evangelist Justin Peters.

quote:
who wrote his master's of divinity thesis on Benny Hinn
Why would anyone expend their passion so? It is wholly negative and plays into the hand of the persecutors, rather than to sound teaching, or edification of the church. Mote and Beam: should any desire to discover the filter which is scripture!


quote:
and has appeared frequently as an expert on Word of Faith pastors in documentaries and TV news stories, traces the movement's origins to the metaphysical cults of the late 19th and early 20th centuries (Aimee Semple McPherson's Foursquare Church, Phineus Quimby's New Thought Movement, Mary Baker Eddy's Christian Science)
I suspect that his 'tracing of the movements' is inaccurate. I will submit for evidence that a master's of divinity thesis is simply breeding ground for the equivalent counter mud-slinging scenario. I mean, is he more pious really? Already I do not recognize him.

quote:
in his seminar "A Call for Discernment". Peters further traces the movement's deviation from traditional Christian doctrine to Hagin's most controversial tenet of faith: If scripture cannot be found to justify a particular teaching, claim divine inspiration from a {vision/dream/other manifestation} of {God/Jesus/other heavenly figure}.

This is not so in the circles that I have run. So I cannot accept that Hagin 'claimed' divine inspiration from a vision, dream, or whatever, blatantly overriding, or contradictory to the word. I would more nearly believe that he was somehow misquoted. Nevertheless, if he did say something akin to this, I further suspect that he would recant, upon it's being brought to his attention, or offer a more reasonable explaination. Word of Faith is errant only to the extent that, or so long as it seeks to 'accumulate' worldly goods.

  • Luk 12:15 And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth.

All that any have to do is to meditate upon the word, to use it as a 'filter' for the actions which they produce. If the actions that they produce have a root in an improper interpretation, they will need to go for the root. I don't think someone is 'corrupt' because they 'misunderstand'. God our Lord is very patient with us. Yet

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Zeena
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Acts 8:20
Peter answered: "May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money!

Isaiah 53
Who hath believed our message? and to whom hath the arm of Jehovah been revealed?
For he grew up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. He was despised, and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and as one from whom men hide their face he was despised; and we esteemed him not. Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows; yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities; the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and Jehovah hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
He was oppressed, yet when he was afflicted he opened not his mouth; as a lamb that is led to the slaughter, and as a sheep that before its shearers is dumb, so he opened not his mouth. By oppression and judgment he was taken away; and as for his generation, who among them considered that he was cut off out of the land of the living for the transgression of my people to whom the stroke was due? And they made his grave with the wicked, and with a rich man in his death; although he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.
Yet it pleased Jehovah to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of Jehovah shall prosper in his hand. He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by the knowledge of himself shall my righteous servant justify many; and he shall bear their iniquities. Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he poured out his soul unto death, and was numbered with the transgressors: yet he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

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Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

But I trust that ye shall know that we are not reprobates.

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Betty Louise
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These WOF Preachers are shameless. I turn the channel when one Preacher told viewers to borrow money from a neighbor to mail in. [Embarrassed]
My mom was watching when one asked people to bring their seed money up and the preacher would pray for them. One man went up for prayer, without seed money. The preacher yelled out for the music to stop and announced he would not pray for anyone with out seed money. [Mad] .
I don't think Jesus charged for preforming miracles and yet this preacher was charging for prayers.
betty

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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

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kjw47
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Hi Friend, Gods word teaches-- For a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God, would be like putting a camel through the eye of a needle.( Matt 19:24 )
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Michael Harrison
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Uh, if God wants us to be rich, then what am I doing wrong. Cuz ahm in povertie 'e'. However, know what? I'm rich. I wouldn't trade either.

quote:
Word Faith or prosperity theology sees the Holy Spirit as a power to be put to use for whatever the believer wills.
That pretty much sez it! Some people are unaware that they are putting the power to use, according to the flesh. They are missing that He will put His desires into our heart by His Spirit.

  • Php 2:13 For it is God which worketh in [into, or within] you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

But these believers are still in the nursery. It is all the more reason for them to 'grow up' by surrendering to His will, rather than obeying the lusts of the flesh. After all, in His wisdom, His provision is better than anything we can:

  • Eph 3:20 Now unto him that is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us,

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WildB
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Deut.13
[1] If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder,
[2] And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;
[3] Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.


[4] Ye shall walk after the LORD your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him.

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That is all.....

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Carol Swenson
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TB125

Your point is well taken. The Holy Spirit is active in the lives of God's people today.

However, "Hagin tells us that Jesus appeared to him in Phoenix, Arizona and revealed the keys for people to get from God what they want."

http://www.dwaddle.com/focus/Pages/hagin.html

I hesitate to believe everyone who claims to have had a vision from God. I believe the prosperity gospel to be false. I also believe it's origins were not from the Doctrine of Eternal Security.

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TB125
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Carol,
Please be careful in regard to discounting the inspiration of the Spirit through "visions". Note that Paul was led by the Spirit to go to Macedonia through a "vision" that came to him "during the night". It was probably a "dream". See his account of this in Acts 16:9-10. He wasn't led to go there by something that he read in Scripture.

It is always good to test such "visions" or "dreams" or "inspired" directions against the teachings and record of God's work in Scripture, but I don't believe that God's work is limited by what is recorded in Scripture. Otherwise Abram would have never left Haran to go to the land of Canaan, which God indicated that he was going to give to Abram and his "offspring" (see Genesis 12:1-7).

The biblical record of God's inspired revelation ends with the book of Revelation, but I don't believe that the inspiring work of the Holy Spirit ended about 95 A.D. when John wrote that document from a fresh vision and audible message from an "angel" (see Rev 1:1-11). If that were the case, then no new sermons by any later evangelists or preachers or missionaries ("apostles" meaning one who is "sent out") would be acceptable as being "inspired" instructions or words of guidance for any later Christians.

Please note that I am not stating that such documents as the Book of Mormon or all sermons by every evangelist, preacher, or missionary since John are "inspired". All utterances, writings, teachings, sermons, ministries, activities, and travels of God's chosen ambassadors and witnesses and teachers need to be done in accord with the guidance and direction of the Spirit, but the work of the Spirit did not stop in 95 A.D. I hope that you understand my point! If you don't get back to me.

--------------------
Bob

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Carol Swenson
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Baptist evangelist Justin Peters, an outspoken critic of the Word of Faith movement who wrote his master's of divinity thesis on Benny Hinn and has appeared frequently as an expert on Word of Faith pastors in documentaries and TV news stories, traces the movement's origins to the metaphysical cults of the late 19th and early 20th centuries (Aimee Semple McPherson's Foursquare Church, Phineus Quimby's New Thought Movement, Mary Baker Eddy's Christian Science) in his seminar "A Call for Discernment". Peters further traces the movement's deviation from traditional Christian doctrine to Hagin's most controversial tenet of faith: If scripture cannot be found to justify a particular teaching, claim divine inspiration from a {vision/dream/other manifestation} of {God/Jesus/other heavenly figure}.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Word_of_Faith#Origins

http://www.puritanfellowship.com/2008/07/justin-peters-call-for-discernment.html

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WildB
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Hello Dale,

Again I post.


Eph.4
[30] And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.


I don't see the link to the prosperity preachers.

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That is all.....

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becauseHElives
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hello WildB,

I humbly disagree, the apostasy that now prevails in he greatest portion of the western church, is now a direct result of the "Once Saved Always Saved" message as taught in the last 50 some odd years....

you can not show in the history of the church, where what is being taught today has ever been accepted by any prior to the 1920's....

Charles Spurgeon,John Calvin,George Whitfield, Martian Luther all teacher's of "Once Saved Always Saved" never taught the trash that is excepted today in the western church that you can say a little prayer and live like you want and still be saved...

this teaching has lead to the kinds of lifestyles excepted as Christian in the Church today...

May the God of Holy Scripture have mercy on the souls of all that teach the trash being spilled out of most pulpits in our day that deceive people like Hanna Montana, Dolly Parton, and others that being a Christian does not entail a life of Holiness (Separation from this world)...

in Yahshua's love to all...
Dale

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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
Yahweh / God wants me to be transformed into the image of His Son , nothing more, nothing less...

Dear hen81 ,

the prosperity message is a direct result of the "Once Saved Always Saved" doctrine....


What? Once Sealed Always Sealed until the day of redemption has nothing whatsoever to do with what you are talking about.

Eph.4
[30] And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.


"Wealth and honor I disdain;
Earthly comforts, Lord, are vain,
These will never satisfy,
Give me Christ, or else I die."

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That is all.....

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KnowHim
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Prosperity Gospel Lie

 -

The God wants every Christian to be rich saying is a LIE!

Paul, who wrote much of the New Testament, supported himself in part by his tentmaking skills. Although some churches send him gifts at various times, he often provided for his own needs by the work of his hands. Yes Paul was rich – rich in the gifts of God. Money was not a priority in his life. Did you know that many of the apostles in the early church renounced worldly wealth as an obstruction to their relationship with the Lord.

God’s blessings sometimes include money, but most of the time His blessings are spiritual in nature. He gives gifts, such as peace, joy, love, patience, and hope. God is more concerned with your character then the size of you house or bank account. Matthew 6:33 tells us where we should place our focus: "But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you."

Be very, very wary of preachers who spend more time talking about God’s physical and monetary blessings then His spiritual blessings. God certainly is able to heal any sickness, but we don’t serve Him for what He can do for us. If this is why you are serving God you need to reevaluate if you have truly come to know Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Jesus was out to help others, not out to see how he could benefit self. It is true that rich people can be saved; they can take what God has blessed them with and use it to God’s glory, helping others and sharing the Good News of Jesus Christ with the world for FREE. God knows that the temptations that come with wealth and prestige are often more then most people can handle. Don’t be fooled by handsome preachers in thousand-dollar suits who promise health and wealth in this world; instead, seek God let Him decide how He wants to bless you. Then you will be truly rich.


Blessed are the rich?
http://www.jesusclips.com/view_video.php?viewkey=fb634e6a85bb9d9adf21&page=1&viewtype=&category=mr

Exposing Prosperity Preachers' Lies
http://www.jesusclips.com/view_video.php?viewkey=094e0b5cb1b01d712f70&page=1&viewtype=&category=mr

Osteen Said What?
http://www.jesusclips.com/view_video.php?viewkey=b0e6ecb5b568ff5058f0&page=1&viewtype=&category=mr

Many Videos about the Prosperity Gospel lies
http://www.jesusclips.com/search_result.php?search_id=Prosperity&search_typ=search_videos&x=39&y=9

http://imspeakingtruth.wordpress.com/2008/02/19/a-different-gospelpart-1/

http://ezinearticles.com/?The-Great-Prosperity-Gospel-Doctrine-Lie&id=681872

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Carol Swenson
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"What does the Bible say about the prosperity gospel?"

In the prosperity gospel, also known as the “Word of Faith” religion, the believer is told to use God, whereas the truth of biblical Christianity is just the opposite—God uses the believer. Word Faith or prosperity theology sees the Holy Spirit as a power to be put to use for whatever the believer wills. The Bible teaches that the Holy Spirit is a Person who enables the believer to do God's will. The prosperity gospel movement closely resembles some of the destructive greed sects that infiltrated the early church. Paul and the other apostles were not accommodating to or conciliatory with the false teachers who propagated such heresy. They identified them as dangerous false teachers and urged Christians to avoid them.

More here:

http://www.gotquestions.org/prosperity-gospel.html

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becauseHElives
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Yahweh / God wants me to be transformed into the image of His Son , nothing more, nothing less...

Dear hen81 ,

the prosperity message is a direct result of the "Once Saved Always Saved" doctrine....

the Gospel is not about the individual...and what we get out of Yahweh...but about Yeshua and individuals becoming transformed by the Power of HIS Grace....

it's not about an individual being healed, prospered or "Saved" but about Yahweh being glorified by the transformation of lives effected by the Grace brought forth at Calvary...

we need to pray for these deceived preachers of this prosperity message.... they are the enemy of the Cross and Yahshua said to pray for your / our enemies ...

Yahweh Bless,
and remember the Persecuted Church in your prayers...

love Dale

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

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hen81
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The statement below is the tagline of the article that follows. Are some religious leaders using the bad economy to enrich themselves?

Joel Osteen preaches the virtues of prosperity -- for himself as well as his congregation. A look at the man who may well be one of the biggest beneficiaries of the slumping economy.

http://www.walletpop.com/article/_a/god-wants-me-to-be-rich/20080724133909990001

What are your reactions to this story?

Fools’ Heaven – Love, Lust and Death beyond the Pulpit
http://www.therawreviewers.com/artman/publish/FoolsHeaven.shtml
http://DTPollard.com
http://myspace.com/dtpollard

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