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Author
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Topic: Looking for a Church.
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Christ for the children
Advanced Member
Member # 159
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posted
Hello Theo, You can count on my prayers for you, and also for your family. I will tell you how I arrived at my church after leaving my former church which I attended faithfully for 18 years. One Sunday evening (after visiting several other churches) I went to the car with knowing which church to go to, "told God, YOU are in command and YOU are going to lead me to the church YOU want for me." I then began to drive and wound up at the church I'm now in (nearly 7 years now) and by the time service was over I told myself, "this is home!" I know that there is a church that God has for you, and I'll pray that you will listen to God and allow Him to show you that church. I will also pray that you will continue to seek guidance from the Lord, for He loves you and wants only the best for you. Some people at times speak first without thinking about what will become of the words they say. I simply ask that you forgive those who have hurt you in the past whether they seek your forgiveness or not. If you will, I believe you would feel much better about what happened. Not that you would return to that church (as I do not believe that's where God wants you), but that you would know in your mind that you have forgiven those that have caused hurt to you. "Father, I thank you for your love for us. That although we did not deserve it, You sent your Son to pay the price we should have paid. Be with Theo and his family right now, show him the church that You would have them attend. I thank you for allowing us to come to You in our time of need. In the name of Your Son Jesus I pray." Amen. Theo, rest upon the Lord, He wants to lead and guide you.
Posts: 120 | From: Florida | Registered: Jul 2002
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Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
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posted
BecauseHElives:
Theo
The first question I must ask is on what do you base your Faith in the shed BLOOD of JESUS for Salvation?
Theo:
On what do you base your Faith in the shed BLOOD of JESUS for Salvation?
Oh I get it....Holy cow.
Don't pray for me then. I guess only peoplpe who believe in a literal seven day creation can be saved. Pray that my flesh would be destroyed by Satan so that my soul could be saved.
Thanks for the encouragement.
I think fundamentalists get all the bad press they deserve
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My Dear Brother Theo;
I do not believe that BecauseHeLives was concerned about your belief in evolution/creation, but rather in your salvation. We love our Lord Jesus Christ, and have a heart for the lost. Brother you seem to support the other basics tenents of fundamentalist Christian Doctrine, as per your conversation with Helen, who has such a true loving heart for others. The question was simply do you base your faith in the shed blood of Jesus for your salvation? The trust in Jesus is what differentiates the believer from the non-believer, that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus Christ, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised Him from the dead thou shalt be saved.
Theo:
I actually never brought up theistic evolution at any sevice or church sponsored event. I only talked about it with one of the deacons at his home while I was helping him build an addition on his house.
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I am truly sorry that the disagreement escalated into a debate, and disfellowship. As long as the leadership and teaching is in agreement with the established doctrine of the Church, and other views not allowed to influence others, then there should be no problem in fellowship. This would appear in a similar vein as such disagreements as the KJV only controversy.
What is truly important is the person and mission of our Lord and Savior.
Father God we lift our dear Brother up in our hearts and in our prayers. Dear Father surround him with Your awesome love, draw him near, hold him close, lift him up, and lead him onward unto the glorious paths of Your perfect will for his life. Dear Father bless his family, and draw these precious ones into a fellowship according to Your perfect will and may You have the Lordship over their hearts and in their lives. Dear Father may You bring Your loving servants into their lives, and may You be praised, honored, and glorified, within the hearts, and lives of Your children. In the name above all names, our Lord Jesus Christ, we pray. Amen.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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Lost
Advanced Member
Member # 343
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posted
hey theo,
i will be praying for you to find a new church. it's too bad things happened the way they did. i don't have a church i can recommend but i will be praying that you and your wife find one that teaches God's Word straight from the Bible.
lost
and if you ever want to have a friendly discussion on the topic send me a pm or an e-mail. and i recommend www.answersingenesis.org for a good argument for the creationists. God bless.
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The Spirit and the bride say, "Come!" And let him who hears say, "Come!" Whoever is thirsty, let him come; and whoever wishes, let him take the free gift of the water of life. - Rev 22:17
Posts: 115 | From: Los Angeles/San Diego, CA | Registered: Aug 2002
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Amalthea
Advanced Member
Member # 318
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posted
I have mentioned this somewhere else in this site...the best way to find a new church is to go out and "shop".
When my husband and I were going on our "great church search" after our pastor let us down in a major way that I won't bring up here, we quite literally took months. Every Sunday we went to another church. A couple were close and we would visit a second time. However, the second we entered the church that we are members of now, we both felt an incredible feeling of "coming home". They were EVERYTHING we were looking for, and are still so supportive, 3 years later.
I will pray that you find what you are looking for.
Side note re: 7-day creation...one of God's days is NOT one of ours...remember that! ![[thumbsup]](graemlins/thumbsup2.gif)
God Bless.
Posts: 30 | Registered: Aug 2002
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HIM
Advanced Member
Member # 119
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posted
Hi Theo,
That pastor sounds unkind and I don't blame your wife at all for refusing to go there. It seems crazy to say she can go but not you. What are they thinking??? His unkindness bothers me more than the evolution issue, to be honest.
Anyway, yes, there are many many conservative churches out there. We had a service on 9/11 this year and invited other conservative churches to join with us. I think there were 8 of us in the end, including a local Presbyterian and a local Lutheran church. I'm not sure what you mean by 'mainline' but I think the only way to know is to find out about an individual church and its leaders.
And even on the women pastors issue - Willow Creek has women pastors but I think you'd agree that all its doctrine about salvation is conservative.
I think if you look at the ministries of a church it will give you an idea of whether they are compassion-oriented or not. My church has a big area called LifeCare, which runs the programs to help people who are divorced, who struggle with anger, etc. The 'community' aspect of my church is important and not just in a kind or paranoid "we'd better stick together against an evil world" way - more in a "we need each other and we enjoy being together and God has told us not to forsake meeting together, so we can encourage each other (Hebrews)" way.
love in Jesus
Helen
Posts: 89 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2002
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Theo
Community Member
Member # 564
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posted
Helen,
The Reason to Believe website highly influenced my position on theistic evolution. I basically agree with Hugh Ross on his geology and cosmology, but not his progressive creationism. I think it is a very good ministry though. Yes, my wife was very upset about what the Pastor said and for that reason she won't attend there anymore, even though they said she could because she does not believe in evolution. It's not so much what he said but that he refused to apologize. He said many other unkind things but no need to go into that, I guess.
You have caused me to consider that perhaps I could try to join another conservative church that doesn't take such a strong stance on the issue. One thing I find encouraging in visiting mainline churches is that most preach the gospel and believe one must accept Jesus death on the cross in order to be saved. In the fundamentalist circle I was in it was a common belief that the mainlaine churches did not preach that.
I was raised in a liberal mainline church my self that did not, I believe, preach the gospel and so I assumed all were like that. I am glad to know that there are more Christians in the world that I once thought. I feel kind of like Elisha, when he found that he was not the only one that did not bow his knee to Baal. But my wife and I both have a problem with female Pastors and infant baptism and various other issues.
So we would really feel more comfortable in what we are used to. My wife actually objects to female Pastors more than I do. I disagree with her on female deacons which I believe have biblical support but have to agree that the Bible really seems to imply that the Pastoral ministry is for men.
Thanks for the prayer and encouragement!
Posts: 7 | From: Northern MN | Registered: Oct 2002
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njclary
unregistered
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posted
Theo, What is it you are looking for? There are certain truth's that are inescapable. These Truths are what Christianity is all about. The most important being Believing that Jesus died for you on the Cross, and that You are to accept Him as Lord and Savior in your life. If you believe this and You are saved, then it is in doctrinal differences, and I would know how to pray for you.
But be careful, there are many lies disguised as truths, that will trip you up.
God Bless you
Joel
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HIM
Advanced Member
Member # 119
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posted
Theo, I'm sure my church doesn't require a letter from someone's previous church. Perhaps that's not as universal a requirement as you're thinking.
Also, I can't believe the pastor brought up your marriage, like that! I think that's totally inappropriate!
Have you looked at the Reasons to Believe website? You might like what they have to say. They are an evangelical Christian ministry that believes the earth is old.
I don't think that any of the leaders at my church would agree with you about evolution. But they wouldn't shame you over your beliefs, I hope. And I also think they would recognize you as a Christian saved by grace and hopefully they'd be happy to have you.
I hope you can find a church like that...
love in Jesus
Helen
Posts: 89 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2002
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Theo
Community Member
Member # 564
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
Theo
The first question I must ask is on what do you base your Faith in the shed BLOOD of JESUS for Salvation?
I didn't mean to come off as harsh, sir. I just was just a little frustrated that you seemed to want to debate me when this particular forum seems to be set up for prayer requests.
Thank you.
Posts: 7 | From: Northern MN | Registered: Oct 2002
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Theo
Community Member
Member # 564
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posted
Helen,
I find it very encouraging that there are Christians like you. I think I would get along pretty well in a church like yours. I get the impression that in your church the doctrinal statement means "This is what we teach here in this church." I guess in my church it was taken more to mean a bit more. I also appreciate your point about not stirring up trouble in the church.
I agree that that would be disruptive. I actually never brought up theistic evolution at any sevice or church sponsored event. I only talked about it with one of the deacons at his home while I was helping him build an addition on his house. I had just offered to help him as a friend. He was a person that seemed to have similar interests and we talked a little bit about geology and he let me borrow an ICR book since I had sais I tend to think the Earth is billions of years old. I read the book and soon after became convinced of evolution, partly due to the weak untrue arguments put forward in the book and other books by ICR. when I returned the book I told him what I thought and we had a little debate. I felt we had departed friends though.
The next day I get a call from the Pastor, that he had heard "I had fallen into some bad doctrine."
To make a long story short I had to meet with the deacon board and give an arguement for what I believe, which went really poorly. Kind of like an inquisition. The highlight of the meeting was when the Pastor said in front of all the deacons "You can't even keep your marriage together and you think you can discern the word of God?" (We had gone to him earlier for marriage conselling)Then I had to write a statement of "500 words or less" for the deacons to vote on.
I wrote it with a bit of sarcasm in it because I objected to the constraints on the length having read about 12 books both in theology and science in order to come to my position and also because of the fact that the pastor believed that even questioning the issue was a sin.
I was subsequently voted out of membership by the deacons. They said they love me but think I am being led by Satan. The deacons next step was to have the whole church vote on it at the next bussiness meeting, but my wife and I stopped attending. I called the Pastor after I recieved the letter. He said that he didn't want to talk about the subject and that I was "wasting the Lord's time".
So obviously I am looking for a new church. The only rub is that going to another conservative church would normally require a letter of membership in good standing from my previous church.
Thanks for praying.
Posts: 7 | From: Northern MN | Registered: Oct 2002
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HIM
Advanced Member
Member # 119
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posted
Hi Theo,
I don't know what 'voted out of membership' exactly means. At my church many people who are regular attenders never went through the membership seminor so they aren't members. And members aren't interrogated about every private belief; they need only show evidence of salvation and a desire to grow spiritually and they agree to uphold the teaching position of the church publically.
So I think you could be a member of my church and a theistic evolutionist and even discuss that privately with friends but you can't teach it in a Bible study class or make a big deal of "I think the church is wrong about this..."
So, I don't think my church can be much like yours. It is very conservative, though.
I expect you would be fine in most conservative churches if you didn't raise the subject. Who knows whether you'd be asked about it directly - that might be tricky.
But maybe you're looking for a church which doesn't freak if you are honest about your beliefs. I'm not sure what to suggest but I can do what you ask, and pray for you...
By the way, welcome to this site! ![[Smile]](smile.gif) There are some wonderful people here and I hope that you get to hear from some of them soon...
In Jesus' love
Helen
Posts: 89 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2002
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Theo
Community Member
Member # 564
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posted
On what do you base your Faith in the shed BLOOD of JESUS for Salvation?
Oh I get it....Holy cow.
Don't pray for me then. I guess only peoplpe who believe in a literal seven day creation can be saved. Pray that my flesh would be destroyed by Satan so that my soul could be saved.
Thanks for the encouragement.
I think fundamentalists get all the bad press they deserve.
Posts: 7 | From: Northern MN | Registered: Oct 2002
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becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87
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posted
Theo
The first question I must ask is on what do you base your Faith in the shed BLOOD of JESUS for Salvation?
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002
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Theo
Community Member
Member # 564
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posted
I am a new member here. I would like prayer for looking for a new church. I was recently voted out of membership in a Church for believing in theistic evolution. I had a private discussion with one of the decons on the subject and he went and told the Pastor and they and the deacons decided I was following Satan and voted for me to leave. They feel as though they tried to help me but all of them are ignorant of biology and couldn't even discuss the issue intelligently. I am finding it hard to find a church now since I am still conservative in my theology and am not comfortable worshipping in liberal mainline churches .
Thanks.
Posts: 7 | From: Northern MN | Registered: Oct 2002
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