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Author
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Topic: Study to shew thyself approved?
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Michael Harrison
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Member # 6801
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posted
YOu know, Jesus revealed who HE is when HE walked the earth. HE healed 'prolifically'.
- Joh 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.
The point is that HE didn't 'reveal' who HE was, at, and for that moment only. He was revealing HIS heart, that we, of whatever generation, may know, and trust. But that wasn't good enough for the Pharisees who saw the miracles happening! They could not deny them. But they ignored them in favor of another standard. Go figure! Yet, is it not convenient now, to claim that they 'don't happen. It is much easier than to 'watch' them happen and be in denial.
Jesus showed who HE is, and what HIS heart is. But callused people prefer bondage to 'strict adherence' for everybody that their own notion may be reinforced, rather than the revelation of the heart of Jesus that people may be consoled. It is the same spirit of the Pharisees, which both denies, and persecutes the truth.
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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WildB
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by yahsway:
In Acts 28:8-9
Here is a reference to divine healings in spite of the fact that Luke, a physician, accompanied Paul.
This fact is so troubelsome to critics of modern healing that some have come forth with the theory that the healings mentioned in v9 were the work of Luke who used medical remedies, although Luke is not mentioned by name.
The theory is based on the use of therapeuo, the Greek word for healing (v8). which some insist refers to medical therapy.
In fact however this word occurs 34 times in the NT. In 32 instances it clearly refers to divine healing. This observation is certainly not to oppose medical treatment or to say medicine or medical aid is wrong.
It is not.
However, it does clarify that this text is not grounds for the substitution of medical therapy for prayer.
God heals by many means: the prayer of faith, natural recuperative powers, medical aid or medicine, miricles. (Acts 3:16 1Cor 12:9, 28)
The Gifts of Healing
In the listing of spiritual gifts found in I Corinthians there are two occurrences of the phrase "gifts of healings." Note that both "gifts" and "healings" are plural, not singular. We could take this to mean a multiplicity of healings, but I think it's much more reasonable to interpret this phrase as meaning there are different kinds of healing and the corresponding gifts to go with them. This would be consistent with the three-part nature of man, as we observe the healings taking place in men's bodies, souls, and spirits. Since spiritual gifts are given for the common good, to build up the body of Christ, I believe that God intends to employ the gifts of healing in the church, but only in accord with the whole body of revealed truth. Let me explain.
The saving work of Jesus Christ is designed to regenerate our spirits and save our souls; so I believe that spiritual well-being and psychological stability are the heritage of every Christian, subject to delivery on demand, as we walk by faith. That is, spiritual and emotional prosperity are meant to be ours through our risen Lord, as we draw on the resources available to us through his indwelling presence. I was impressed with this in reading Paul's prayer in Ephesians. Paul prays:
... that you should know:
what is the hope of his calling,
what are the riches of his inheritance in the saints,
and what is the extremely "far out" greatness of his power toward us who believe, according to the energizing of the might of his strength--that power which he put to work in raising Christ from the dead and seating him... far above all authority...(Eph. 1:18-21, freely translated).
Paul exhausts his Greek vocabulary, using all the words he can muster to describe the liberating power God is exercising in our behalf--ending with an illustration: This is the kind of power which takes a dead man and makes him alive to rule over all! This is God's provision for our spiritual victory and emotional stability, available to us as we walk by faith.
Unredeemed Bodies
But in the physical realm, we have a different story. It's clear from the Scriptures that the redemption of our bodies is still in the future:
We know that the whole creation has been groaning in travail together until now, and not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the first fruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait for adoption as sons [literally son -placing: coming into the full possession of our inheritance in Christ], the redemption of our bodies (Rom. 8:22-23).
So our bodies are yet unredeemed, although they are potentially redeemed. The price has been paid in full for our total liberation, but we have yet to experience the total liberation of our bodies. That liberation is described in these terms, as still in the future: "...our commonwealth is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will change our lowly body to be like his glorious body... (Phil. 3: 20-21).
Ultimate Healing
Make no mistake--I have no doubt about God's ability to heal the human body (after all, he made it, with all its intricacies), but he has not made himself obliged to heal our bodies, short of that day when we will experience the redemption of our bodies.
All the emphasis we see on physical healing today seems to me to ignore the fact that the ultimate healing for the Christian is to die! Any other kind of healing (whether real or fancied) is only a holding operation, postponing, but not forestalling the ultimate. For the non-Christian, it makes some sense to grasp frantically at every straw to sustain physical life. But for the Christian this kind of scrambling seems to be a lack either of understanding or confidence in what God has said on the subject.
Perhaps you are thinking: "Sure, that's easy to say when you're healthy. I'll bet Bob doesn't know what it's like to face the reality of physical pain and sickness." A few years ago you would have been right about me, but through two recent hospital episodes I have experienced the transcendent glory of the spiritual over the physical. I've learned, in the process, that the Lord is Lord of the coronary department as well as every other area of life. He can sustain us even when our hearts are failing!
In this area of physical healing I want to be an utter realist--in accord with the realistic truth of God. And I see plenty of evidence in the Bible that though God can heal, it doesn't always suit his sovereign purposes to do so. We have the instances of Paul's illness (Gal. 4:15), that of Trophimus (2 Tim. 4:20), and of Timothy (I Tim. 5:23), in which it is clear that the Lord was not obliged to supply physical healing but chose rather to use these physical infirmities to achieve his own sovereign purposes.
The gifts of healing, then, are to be employed in the context of these conclusions:
· Healing in the spirit and soul of man is inherent in and available through the finished work of our risen Lord. Victory is promised in these realms.
· Physical healing is not available on demand, but is subject to the sovereign will of God in the fulfilling of his good purposes.
· Ultimate physical healing is promised to every Christian when we receive our resurrection bodies, at our departure to be with Christ, whether at death or through the Rapture (1 Cor. 15:51-52).
Understanding of these facts can be vital in counseling. When the facts about healing, as set forth in Scripture, are clearly understood, much suffering can be relieved simply because confusion and false expectations have been removed. False hopes, being based on something untrue, always yield disappointment, while hope based on truth "does not disappoint us, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit which has been given to us" (Rom. 5:5).
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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WildB
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Member # 2917
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Michael Harrison:
I mean, who attacked Paul? And who hacked? This servant of the Lord presented in simplicity all that needed to be considered, that Paul 'received' by revelation, who Jesus the Christ is. To say:
quote:
Not Biblical.For the verse that you hacked reads in total.
For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
is an opinion. Will it stand? One thing is for certain, I do not have to answer for you. You may however have to answer for having heard the truth, and rebuked it.
"I mean, who attacked Paul? And who hacked?"
You did and for a certain you will have to answer for your intentional deception...
Changeing Gods Word to fit ones agenda is really just another way of perpectuating the original great lie in the children of men.
But I assure you,
"We" henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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Michael Harrison
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Member # 6801
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posted
I mean, who attacked Paul? And who hacked? This servant of the Lord presented in simplicity all that needed to be considered, that Paul 'received' by revelation, who Jesus the Christ is. To say:
quote:
Not Biblical.
is an opinion. Will it stand? One thing is for certain, I do not have to answer for you. You may however have to answer for having heard the truth, and rebuked it.
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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WildB
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Member # 2917
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Michael Harrison:
People make scripture agree with what they 'want' to believe (even if they are in denial about this). The seriousness of it is, how does that make even the Christian different from the cults? But here is our model.
Paul said that he received it not, but by revelation! He did not study to show hissef approved by coming to his own well intended, 'best effort' conclusions.
Not Biblical.
Again you left out a few words.
For the verse that you hacked reads in total.
For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
Attacking Paul to make a point is just plain silly.
For he is the Apostle to the Gentiles.
Rom.11
[13] For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
What I find spooky, is the fact that most Christians who claim to ‘study to shew thyself approved’ can’t answer these questions without looking them up:
1.What is the mystery?
2.By whom was it revealed unto us by the Scriptures?
3.Does it make a difference?
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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Michael Harrison
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Member # 6801
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posted
Not 'my' will, but 'thy' will be done.
Matthew 6:10
Matthew 26:42
Only the devil would 'suggest' that someone tempt the Lord.
- Mat 4:7 Jesus said unto him, Again it is written, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.
Man does not lead God. Man does not 'determine'. But if man is not quenching the Spirit; if a man is yielded to the Lord, the Lord Himself will move. As it is written, man lives by the 'word' (which word is also the 'action' of God) of God. - Mat 4:3 And the tempter came and said unto him, If thou art the Son of God, command that these stones become bread.
Mat 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
He who will 'stop' the Lord from working, seeks his own glory.
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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yahsway
Advanced Member
Member # 3738
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posted
In Acts 28:8-9
Here is a reference to divine healings in spite of the fact that Luke, a physician, accompanied Paul.
This fact is so troubelsome to critics of modern healing that some have come forth with the theory that the healings mentioned in v9 were the work of Luke who used medical remedies, although Luke is not mentioned by name.
The theory is based on the use of therapeuo, the Greek word for healing (v8). which some insist refers to medical therapy.
In fact however this word occurs 34 times in the NT. In 32 instances it clearly refers to divine healing. This observation is certainly not to oppose medical treatment or to say medicine or medical aid is wrong.
It is not.
However, it does clarify that this text is not grounds for the substitution of medical therapy for prayer.
God heals by many means: the prayer of faith, natural recuperative powers, medical aid or medicine, miricles. (Acts 3:16 1Cor 12:9, 28)
Posts: 1238 | From: Tennessee | Registered: Aug 2004
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yahsway
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Member # 3738
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posted
Mark 16:15
And He (Yeshua) said to them (the disciples)
"go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature.
He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.
"And these signs will follow those who believe;(who are those who believe? Its not the disciples, they already believe and are being commissioned by Yeshua to go and preach to the world)
"And these signs will follow those who believe; In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues;
they will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hand on the sick, and they will recover".
The signs acredit the gospel message, and cannot be limited to the apostolic age, any more than the Lords commission to carry the gospel thruout the world.
The signs, therefore, confirm the ministries of Christ's ambassadors in EVERY generation. Casting out demons, speaking in tongues, and healing all appear in other passages in the NT, and there is no scriptual warrant for their cessation before the Lord returns.
Taking up serpents does NOT refer to handling snakes in religious ceremonies, but casting them away without being harmed (Acts 28:3-6)
The greek verb airo, "take up", can also mean "remove", "take away", "cast away" (Matt 14:12 Luke 11:52 1Corinth 5:2 Eph 4:31.
Similarly, a servant of the Lord may look for divine protection in matters pertaining to food and drink.
Many missionaries have testified to Yahweh Gods miraculous protection in heathen territories, where they experienced no ill effects from inpure food and drink.
All the signs listed in these passages have occurred repeatedly in Christian history.
Shalom
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WildB
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Member # 2917
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Michael Harrison:
People make scripture agree with what they 'want' to believe (even if they are in denial about this). The seriousness of it is, how does that make even the Christian different from the cults? But here is our model.
Paul said that he received it not, but by revelation! He did not study to show hissef approved by coming to his own well intended, 'best effort' conclusions.
Not Biblical.
Again you left out a few words.
For the verse that you hacked reads in total.
For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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WildB
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by yahsway:
That this coming of the Holy Spirit was not relegated to the apostles and their contemporaries is made clear by Peters statement in Acts 2:39
"The Promise is to you and to your Children, AND to ALL who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call."
These gifts did not cease with the last apostle/disciple.
Peters words clearly extend to every believer in Every Era and everywhere, full reason to expect the same resource and experience that was afforded the first believers who recieved the Holy Spirit at the birth of the Church.
If you really think so go and handel a snake or drink something deadly.
Mark 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
The GIFTS enumerated in Ephesians
4:7-16, have been given for the building
up of the Body of Christ, and of
these, only evangelists, pastors, and
teachers are in order during the
present dispensation. The sign gifts
of the Acts period were temporary in
character, and have ceased (I Cor.
13:8-13).
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That is all.....
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Michael Harrison
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Amen and Amen yahsway! I totally agree! ![[dance]](graemlins/dance1.gif)
That was a powerful selection of verses.
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yahsway
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That this coming of the Holy Spirit was not relegated to the apostles and their contemporaries is made clear by Peters statement in Acts 2:39
"The Promise is to you and to your Children, AND to ALL who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call."
These gifts did not cease with the last apostle/disciple.
Peters words clearly extend to every believer in Every Era and everywhere, full reason to expect the same resource and experience that was afforded the first believers who recieved the Holy Spirit at the birth of the Church.
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yahsway
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Amen and Amen MH! I totally agree!
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Michael Harrison
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posted
quote:
The result of the teaching ministry of the Spirit is that Christ is glorified. If He is not glorified, then the Spirit has not been ministering. Note also that it is not the Spirit who is glorified or who is supposed to be glorified in a religious service, but Christ. Further, if Christ is known only through the written Word, then He will be glorified when the Word of God is expounded in the power of the Spirit.
A good way to look at that word, 'glorify' (to glorify) is with the understanding that it means that we 'learn about HIM'. Therefore, when HE is glorified, people 'learn' something about Him, or are in awe of Him somehow. He is 'recognized', and upon recognition, HE is praised! Believe you me, HE is glorified in the circles wherein I run, for the events that occur there are not manufactured by man.
quote:
...therefore I said, that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you” (John 16:12-15).
Uh huh! To disclose means 'to revelate'. Therefore, by revelation, we know Him, and His.
quote:
He is simply saying that the gifts are no longer operative because the need for them has ceased; i.e., to authenticate the Gospel message.
It is funny. The Bible is a book of miracles, signs, and evidences of His very being, but they, for some, seem to have reached fever pitch just after the Crucifixion, and ended with the penning of the last epistle! The gifts, which are spoken of by the penning of the epistles are part of the revelation of 'who' HE is. HE therefore is pleased to manifest 'to' his, the 'gifts of His Spirit, for as long as this temporal world is here! And HE, and His gifts will be here:
- Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Not only is it elementary to be understood, but insomuch as the 'fruits' of the Spirit are to be borne by us, how are they different from the gifts? For the fruits of the Spirit are not to be mistaken as the fruits of our efforts! ! ! They would then be works. Rather, they are the manifestation of the Spirit in and through the believer, if he or she truly is believing. So also, are the 'gifts' a manifestation "OF The Spirit." Amen! So it stands to reason that if the gifts went away just because we got a few rolls of papyrus, that the 'fruit' went away too, because when we got the papyrus, we were left on our own, having a papyrus to read! And the behavior which is due (according to the papyrus), is up to us to produce, which we cannot. Therefore nothing has changed. The fruit, and the behavior are His, or we simply 'do not know Him', and we fake it.
So, in short, you guys who wrote all of that gloriously pious panoply, you need to go back to the School of the Holy Spirit!
Amen!
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Michael Harrison
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Here is something more regrettable: So many believe that certain of the benefits, or effects of the Kingdom of God's manifestation on earth, appeared only for a short period of time after the passing of our Lord. Though this has not perhaps been discovered, these same, huge in numbers, if pressed to consider, will no doubt hold that 'revelation' passed with them. How unfortunate. These miss the love and power of God, and prefer 'judgment' to justify themselves, and who they believe are correct!
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Michael Harrison
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People make scripture agree with what they 'want' to believe (even if they are in denial about this). The seriousness of it is, how does that make even the Christian different from the cults? But here is our model. Paul said that he received it not, but by revelation! He did not study to show hissef approved by coming to his own well intended, 'best effort' conclusions. So the bottom line is, go to Him who is able to show! Let Him determine if what you know is right. Offer up what you know to HIM. You find it expedient to go to the Bible, but He can be approached the same way, if you believe in Him. Do not come away with the wrong conclusion, lest it Tare you!
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