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Author
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Topic: The hate that just roles from this section...
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Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
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posted
quote:
Listened to a pastor a few months ago, explain what the real problem is. He said: The leaders of the church have forgotten how to disciple others for the work of God.... I would have to agree. Every church I have gone to has no disciple program. Nothing to help a Christian grow.
And the ones who really want to do something are not trained and get frustrated. And fall away. And the ones who would have benefited from them, never learn from them. So people just fall of the narrow path because there is no one to guide them.
The reason the false doctrine people are making it so big, is because not only of the false doctrine that sounds to good to be true. But because they will meet the people one on one. Or they have people that will do it. This fills a void that most churches teaching the right thing will not do.
Just yesterday in the local news paper. Headlines was: Preachers getting tired of water down sermons. Sermons that only preach heaven, and never mention hell.
I could not agree more.
God bless you;
When mention is made of watered-down sermons I am reminded of contrast and Jonathen Edwards, "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God", and the dangling-over the very pits of Hell.
When you mention shepherding I am reminded of Apollos and how Aquila and Pricilla took him under their "wing" and taught him the way of God more perfectly:
Acts 18:
24: And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.
25: This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.
26: And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.
27: And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
28: For he mightily convinced the Jews, and that publickly, shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was Christ.
How many lambs come to Christ with a brief "sinner's prayer", and then never sit under Godly teaching and instruction. A seedling when first planted must be nurtured, watered, fed, and pruned as needed. As the seedling takes root in the good soil it grows tall and straight and eventually produces good fruit. But the nursery work is critical or the seedling will die, or be stunted, grow crooked, and produce little fruit.
The Mega-Churches produce great volumes of "believers". The television ministries produce great volumes of "believers". They and their proponents brag about the millions and millions who they bring to Christ.
The concern arises that as the messages are often fluff, and the only messages of instruction more fluff. That the preachers are very shallow in theology, having usurped the position to which they are not Biblically called nor grounded for, that the Godly teaching and true doctrines are lacking. The new "believer" is allowed to grow crooked, or the faith is superficial at best and when trials come the "faith" dies.
The only hope for a new "believer" is to sit at the feet of an Aquila and Pricilla and learn the ways of God more perfectly. It is imperative that one be taught Truth from the Word, the true context of its entirity, and the pathway of Christ more perfectly.
Mentoring. Accountability. Fellowship. Unity in the Faith. Apologetics. Exegesis. Hermeneutics.
God has given His adopted children a beautiful rose garden of faith but He has not removed the thorns. The thorns provide us with cautions and we learn the proper perspectives and ways to handle lifes trials which we will encounter.
1 Thess. 5:
12: And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you;
13: And to esteem them very highly in love for their work's sake. And be at peace among yourselves.
14: Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men.
15: See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men.
16: Rejoice evermore.
17: Pray without ceasing.
18: In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.
19: Quench not the Spirit.
20: Despise not prophesyings.
21: Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
22: Abstain from all appearance of evil.
23: And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24: Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it.
Those who have matured in the faith can stand with Brother Paul in his statement:
Romans 8:
35: Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36: As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37: Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38: For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39: Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
God bless you for your insight and wisdom, and heartfelt desire for God's perfect will and eternal love for His precious children.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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ikester7579
unregistered
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posted
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God bless you;
I am glad that you had the discernment to shake the dust off your sandels. To withdraw from false teaching.
The Word declares that there will be a rise in apostasy.
How many Mormons are there?
How many JWs?
Unlike yourself, there are far too many who do not know the Word and do not have the spiritual discernment to recognize the true from the counterfeit. Too many are being led astray with glitz and glitter, the dramatic and the promise of perfect health through faith and enormous worldly wealth.
Not everyone who uses the name of Jesus, who holds the Word in their hand, who teaches and leads others, is teaching and expounding the Truth.
The "Exposing" section was established so as to remove the discussions of the counterfeit from the Bible Study section, as several did not want to hear words spoken against certain televangelists, WOF, Positive Confession, etc.
It would be helpful to teach us what teaching you found to be in error that caused you to withdraw.
It would be helpful to have a thread on the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
It would be helpful to have a thread on the Kingdom Hall of the Jehovah's Witnesses.
It is important for Believers like you, and me and each of us to be so familiar with the Truth of God's Word, that the counterfeit just sticks-out like a sore thumb.
So often those involved in cultish teachings will come into a Christian forum, and it is imperative that Believers like yourself to be able to stand together against that which is false. Otherwise the false can lead the young-ones astray.
May God bless each of His precious children. [/QB]
Listened to a pastor a few months ago, explain what the real problem is. He said: The leaders of the church have forgotten how to disciple others for the work of God.... I would have to agree. Every church I have gone to has no disciple program. Nothing to help a Christian grow.
And the ones who really want to do something are not trained and get frustrated. And fall away. And the ones who would have benefited from them, never learn from them. So people just fall of the narrow path because there is no one to guide them.
The reason the false doctrine people are making it so big, is because not only of the false doctrine that sounds to good to be true. But because they will meet the people one on one. Or they have people that will do it. This fills a void that most churches teaching the right thing will not do.
Just yesterday in the local news paper. Headlines was: Preachers getting tired of water down sermons. Sermons that only preach heaven, and never mention hell.
I could not agree more.
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Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
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posted
quote:
You change the man that is head of it (through prayer), the congregation will change as well. Also, if the man does not want to change. God can make him mess up (through sin or a comment) which will make people leave. That's what happened at my church. The pastor started doing stuff he sould not, I left before it got bad. But he made several bad comments after I left, and now the church is only 1/3 of what it used to be.
What does God's word say about praying for your enemies? Something about pouring coals upon their head?
Question: Why do you think God is allowing this man to preach?
Is God to weak to do anything about it?
God bless you;
I am glad that you had the discernment to shake the dust off your sandels. To withdraw from false teaching.
The Word declares that there will be a rise in apostasy.
How many Mormons are there?
How many JWs?
Unlike yourself, there are far too many who do not know the Word and do not have the spiritual discernment to recognize the true from the counterfeit. Too many are being led astray with glitz and glitter, the dramatic and the promise of perfect health through faith and enormous worldly wealth.
Not everyone who uses the name of Jesus, who holds the Word in their hand, who teaches and leads others, is teaching and expounding the Truth.
The "Exposing" section was established so as to remove the discussions of the counterfeit from the Bible Study section, as several did not want to hear words spoken against certain televangelists, WOF, Positive Confession, etc.
It would be helpful to teach us what teaching you found to be in error that caused you to withdraw.
It would be helpful to have a thread on the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
It would be helpful to have a thread on the Kingdom Hall of the Jehovah's Witnesses.
It is important for Believers like you, and me and each of us to be so familiar with the Truth of God's Word, that the counterfeit just sticks-out like a sore thumb.
So often those involved in cultish teachings will come into a Christian forum, and it is imperative that Believers like yourself to be able to stand together against that which is false. Otherwise the false can lead the young-ones astray.
May God bless each of His precious children.
--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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ikester7579
unregistered
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by wparr:
What about prayer for the great multitudes that are being mislead and deceived by these false teachers?
That's more where my prayers are focused and aimed.
2 Peter 2:1-3
(1) But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
(2) Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned;
(3) and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
This seems to indicate that the false teachers judgement and destruction was determined long ago.
You change the man that is head of it (through prayer), the congregation will change as well. Also, if the man does not want to change. God can make him mess up (through sin or a comment) which will make people leave. That's what happened at my church. The pastor started doing stuff he sould not, I left before it got bad. But he made several bad comments after I left, and now the church is only 1/3 of what it used to be.
What does God's word say about praying for your enemies? Something about pouring coals upon their head?
Question: Why do you think God is allowing this man to preach?
Is God to weak to do anything about it?
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KnowHim
Admin
Member # 1
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by wparr:
What about prayer for the great multitudes that are being mislead and deceived by these false teachers?
That's more where my prayers are focused and aimed.
2 Peter 2:1-3
(1) But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
(2) Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned;
(3) and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
This seems to indicate that the false teachers judgement and destruction was determined long ago.
Amen!
![[thumbsup2]](graemlins/thumbsup2.gif)
Posts: 3276 | From: Charlestown, IN | Registered: Jun 2002
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KnowHim
Admin
Member # 1
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by ikester7579:
quote:
Originally posted by David:
No Betty is not a Moderator but I am and what she said is the truth.
We put this section here for those who want to know about false teacher and who they are. So if it is bothering you please just don't come here and read this section.
It does get a little out of hand, and we do need to only expose these false teachers and not go beyond that.
So I guess asking for people to pray about the people spoke of in here is out of the question?
No and you assuming people don't pray for them is not right. Go ahead and pray for them and I am sure others will be doing the same.
We all need pray, so you can pray for us also.
Thank you,
David
Posts: 3276 | From: Charlestown, IN | Registered: Jun 2002
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Itty-Bitty Girl
Advanced Member
Member # 4579
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posted
ikester7579, please do not do this.
Offering us suggestions as to what we should do here, gets you nowhere. Calling exposing false teaching gossip, gets you nowhere.
In this section, we speak the truth and expose those false teachings and teachers who corrupt the word of God.
If you got a problem with that, you are more than welcome to leave, no one is forcing you to be here.
No one is forcing you to read the posts.
The only hate that I see rolling from this section is in your own posts, ikester7579.
Stop hating on this section, please.
Posts: 1051 | Registered: Apr 2005
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wparr
Advanced Member
Member # 891
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posted
What about prayer for the great multitudes that are being mislead and deceived by these false teachers?
That's more where my prayers are focused and aimed.
2 Peter 2:1-3
(1) But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
(2) Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned;
(3) and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
This seems to indicate that the false teachers judgement and destruction was determined long ago.
Posts: 1203 | From: Eagle Nest, NM | Registered: Jan 2003
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ikester7579
unregistered
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by wparr:
As I asked you in an earlier post.
Why do you ASSUME that no one here prays for the false teachers discussed here?
I don't see any call to prayer. Setting an example of what to do is what we are supposed to do.
Example:
Dear Lord, Please forgive me of my sins. I come before you in prayer for Joel Olsteen who has been led astray. I pray that you will raise the curse of being a reprobate so that Joel can see the light of truth, and repent of his ways.
I cannot see how you are using what Joel is doing, but if it's a plan to bring more in for the harvest, I pray that Joel will be one of them. For it is your will that none parish in the lake of fire. But it is still their choice, and I respect that you give us choices. And that your will is not forced upon us.
And I pray in agreement with anyone here who may have prayed for Olsteen, for it is also said that any two gather in your name, you are with them, and it shall be done.
In Jesus name I ask this, Amen.
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wparr
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Member # 891
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posted
As I asked you in an earlier post.
Why do you ASSUME that no one here prays for the false teachers discussed here?
Posts: 1203 | From: Eagle Nest, NM | Registered: Jan 2003
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ikester7579
unregistered
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posted
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Originally posted by David:
No Betty is not a Moderator but I am and what she said is the truth.
We put this section here for those who want to know about false teacher and who they are. So if it is bothering you please just don't come here and read this section.
It does get a little out of hand, and we do need to only expose these false teachers and not go beyond that.
So I guess asking for people to pray about the people spoke of in here is out of the question?
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KnowHim
Admin
Member # 1
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posted
No Betty is not a Moderator but I am and what she said is the truth.
We put this section here for those who want to know about false teacher and who they are. So if it is bothering you please just don't come here and read this section.
It does get a little out of hand, and we do need to only expose these false teachers and not go beyond that.
Posts: 3276 | From: Charlestown, IN | Registered: Jun 2002
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ikester7579
unregistered
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posted
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Originally posted by TEXASGRANDMA:
the purpose is to warn others, who get caught up getting all thei spiritual food from cotton candy Preachers. The problem I have with your thread. This is a spot for exposing false teaching. If you have a problem with this subject, you should not read threads here.
betty
I am curious, are you a mod?
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TEXASGRANDMA
Advanced Member
Member # 847
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posted
the purpose is to warn others, who get caught up getting all thei spiritual food from cotton candy Preachers. The problem I have with your thread. This is a spot for exposing false teaching. If you have a problem with this subject, you should not read threads here.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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ikester7579
unregistered
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posted
Ok, I see. It's ok to do unto others, but it's not ok to point out what's being done.
quote:
Luke 6:41-42
(41) "Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?
(42) "Or how can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take out the speck that is in your eye,' when you yourself do not see the log that is in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take out the speck that is in your brother's eye.
Apply unto others what is not applied unto self.
I see no productive things coming from what's being posted here.
quote:
Are you looking in the mirror as you post this?
As a matter of fact I am. And I have no problem admitting to it. I don't have so much pride that I refuse to see my own faults.
quote:
Romans 2:1
Therefore you have no excuse, everyone of you who passes judgment, for in that which you judge another, you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things.
Are you practicing the same thing that you are judging others for?
Sure was. I was giving a dose of reality. How do you think I was able to hit the nail on the head so well? I used to get caught up in doing things like what I see going on here, until one day I realized that the only thing I accomplished by doing this was wasting time.
People will chose who they wish to follow, and what doctrine they chose to believe. The only thing God asks us to do is expose the false teachings. If someone refuses to see it, then we have done all we can do. Then we turn to prayer. ![[Prayer]](graemlins/prayer.gif)
Did Jesus chase those who refused to see truth? No, He went to those who wanted truth because if He would have wasted time with those who refused it, those hungry for it would have never heard it.
The rest that we do makes us take up attitudes that separate us from God and one another. That's when the main sin we are exposing becomes part of us by not handling it the way we should. When we try and do what only God can do (change someone from within), then we hinder the plan of God. How do I know? Been there do that. Got no where until I gave it to God.
Can you change a reprobate? I know I can't, for there is no way I can go around a curse God has laid upon someone.
rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
tit 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.
But I can pray the curse of the reprobate be broken, so that they are able to see the light. Other wise I'm wasting time. And if God does not see fit to do it, who am I to think I could some how go beyond His power to achieve something that is not within His will?
Example: How many times did God seek to punish His people, and one of His Prophets would try and appeal to Him not to do something? Did they try and stop it themselves? Or did they pray to the one they knew was the only one who could?
The reason we do not feel peace about what someone is doing (teaching false doctrine), is because we refuse to give it to the peace maker. For all we know, God maybe using Joel Olsteen for another purpose we cannot see. One where a false doctrine so huge has to be allowed to lead so many astray, before we all wake up to it (His out pouring promised in His word). For a huge falling away must take place before the out pouring can begin. And Oslteen maybe the one who brings the falling away about. And if so, are we wasting time trying to change the unchangeable?
Do we not think that God does not know what goes on with Joel Olsteen? So why do you think it happens? It happens for two reasons:
1) Either we are reaping what we have sown, by allowing so many false doctrines, false translations (plus all types of sin) to exist. And how we want God's word to always be about love, with no judgement (which draws millions of people).
2) God has a bigger plan in place we cannot see.
Or maybe it both.
So my question would be: How far do we take something that seems to have no conclusion (something we cannot fix ourselves), when we could just lay it in the hands of God through prayer, and be done with it?
For can we go around God's plan, or a curse (reprobate)? I think not. Unless God sees fit. Which requires us to do what?
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wparr
Advanced Member
Member # 891
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by ikester7579:
Do we correct in love, or hate?
I believe that some of us are to lazy to get on our knees and pray about things we cannot control or change.
So would it be a work of the spirit, or a work of the flesh that make one do this?
Are you looking in the mirror as you post this?
Luke 6:41-42
(41) "Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?
(42) "Or how can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take out the speck that is in your eye,' when you yourself do not see the log that is in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take out the speck that is in your brother's eye.
Romans 2:1
Therefore you have no excuse, everyone of you who passes judgment, for in that which you judge another, you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things.
Are you practicing the same thing that you are judging others for?
To knowingly allow someone to be deceived by false religion or teaching shows a LACK of Scriptural compassion and love.
If you saw a baby about to drink poison, wouldn't you try to stop it?
What about a baby Christian taking in spiritual poison with false gospel teaching???????
Posts: 1203 | From: Eagle Nest, NM | Registered: Jan 2003
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TEXASGRANDMA
Advanced Member
Member # 847
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posted
excuse me but you are making no sense at all.
If you don't like this section, then leave and close the door on the way out.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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ikester7579
unregistered
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posted
Maybe we should get a gun and shoot the people we talk about in here. For our words are doing the same job, so why don't we put our money where our mouth is? Why don't we apply the hate we are typing to a more physical level? Or is it easier to stay in the comfy of our computer chairs and spit out our hate for one another across the net? ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
What does God's word say about the power of the tongue (it contains the power of life and death)? Does lowering ourselves to that level of another make us become part of their sin? Sure it does when we react in a way that is not Godly. So does two sins make it right? Or is two sins wrong?
Do we correct in love, or hate?
I believe that some of us are to lazy to get on our knees and pray about things we cannot control or change.
The gossip test:
1) How many people did you talk to today about a person you are obsessed with?
2) How many phone calls did you make to where the main discussion was this obsession?
3) How many posts do you make about your obsession on a daily bases?
4) How much time do you spend on a daily bases thinking, or taking action about your obsession?
5) Does your obsession get you into arguements?
6) Does your obsession make everyone else wrong, because you are so obsessed you are always right?
7) Do you find yourself using only parts of God's word that support your cause, and ignore all the rest?
8) Does reading this post make you put the poster in the same category as the one you are obsessed with?
9) Is your obsession making you post more on this person than any other subject you have ever posted?
10) Would you say that all of your threads have ended Godly, and have a Godly conclusion?
etc...
So would it be a work of the spirit, or a work of the flesh that make one do this?
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