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Topic: Apostasy Now
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bygrace
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posted
I am enjoying this thread...Ripp, you always back up everything with scripture and that is so refreshing! I have been sitting back taking in all this meat for the soul. I too have had questions/concerns in the area of true salvation and just "saying" they know Christ. I realize we all sin, but to repeating it over and over without remorse is a red flag.It is hard to watch someone and not say something about it...I feel I will be judged for keeping silent.
bygrace
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Ripp
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by WhiteEagle:
Ripp:
I went to the links you provided in the first post of this thread. This woman is selling her tapes, and the site is mostly an advertisement for her stuff.
Use the bottom link. The first two are from her article.
This one.
God bless. ![[Bible]](graemlins/bible.gif) ![[Cross]](graemlins/cross.gif) ![[Prayer]](graemlins/prayer.gif)
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WhiteEagle
Advanced Member
Member # 3728
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posted
Ripp:
I went to the links you provided in the first post of this thread. This woman is selling her tapes, and the site is mostly an advertisement for her stuff.
Posts: 1392 | From: Maine | Registered: Aug 2004
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Ripp
unregistered
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posted
hardcore wrote:
quote:
Basically I was trying to decide if our urgency was to make sure people were really saved before Jesus returns (which of course should always be the case anyway) or whether the urgency had more to do with grounding ourselves (and others) in the Word better so as not to be deceived during a greater deception and tribulation to come After all my roundy round thoughts, I've decided that it's both.
The closer we get to the tribulation, the more difficult it will be to stay strong in the Lord on a personal basis. The more persecution there is, the more people will give in. The spiritual battles being waged are only going to increase. That is why it is imperative that we all stay grounded in the Word and don the armor every day. Times are going to get rough guys, stay tough.
God bless.
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Ripp
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by mohawk:
Just a comnment, Ripp.
Isn't it interesting how those who once kept the torch burning (standing for what is right and scriptural) are now being persecuted, maligned and lampooned as "intolerant." And now we see it on a global scale--right is wrong, black is white... as usual, Ripp, you are callin' em!
Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Who put darkness for light, and light for darkness;
Who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes ,
And prudent in their own sight!
Woe to men mighty at drinking wine,
Woe to men valiant for mixing intoxicating drink,
Who justify the wicked for a bribe,
And take away justice from the righteous man!
Therefore, as the fire devours the stubble,
And the flame consumes the chaff,
So their root will be as rottenness,
And their blossom will ascend like dust;
Because they have rejected the law of the LORD of hosts,
And despised the word of the Holy One of Israel.
[Isaiah 5:20-24]
Resembles todays apostic church. It's going to get worse too. I pray that those that can see will be strong and hold on. Many will be deceived...
God bless.
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SoftTouch
Advanced Member
Member # 2316
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by hardcore:
Soft Touch - I hope you didn't think I was questioning your motives. That wasn't my intent.
Not to worry Sis, that thought didn't even enter my mind! ![[Smile]](smile.gif) I was moved to check my own motives (again, which is good) when I read your post, which is why I replied.
I agree that the urgency is both about reaching others for Christ and about grounding ourselves in the Word so we won't be decieved.
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
Posts: 3465 | Registered: Nov 2003
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mohawk
Advanced Member
Member # 2898
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posted
Just a comnment, Ripp.
Isn't it interesting how those who once kept the torch burning (standing for what is right and scriptural) are now being persecuted, maligned and lampooned as "intolerant." And now we see it on a global scale--right is wrong, black is white... as usual, Ripp, you are callin' em!
Posts: 223 | From: california | Registered: Feb 2004
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hardcore
Advanced Member
Member # 4492
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posted
Hey Guys (and Gals) ...
Thanks for the thoughtful answers.
Ripp - My initial intent wasn't to ask about rapture timing, but I guess my question was going to lead to that eventually, huh? I agree that we need to be ready regardless. Personally, I think we will be here longer than many believe.
Soft Touch - I hope you didn't think I was questioning your motives. That wasn't my intent.
I just got to thinking about all of this the other night. Specifically about the false teaching. I kind of had two thought trails going at once and they kept intersecting and then branching off again. It was too frustrating. So I decided to drag you guys into it. Ha! That was mean! Now I'm too tired to elaborate.
Basically I was trying to decide if our urgency was to make sure people were really saved before Jesus returns (which of course should always be the case anyway) or whether the urgency had more to do with grounding ourselves (and others) in the Word better so as not to be deceived during a greater deception and tribulation to come After all my roundy round thoughts, I've decided that it's both.
Okay. I'm going to bed.
Posts: 627 | Registered: Mar 2005
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SoftTouch
Advanced Member
Member # 2316
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posted
Brother Ripp that was an Excellent Article! Thanks for sharing that!
Sister Hardcore, your question got me to thinking about the answers for myself. What gives me this urgency? Why do I feel such an overwhelming drive to warn people of the dangers posed by False Teachers/Prophets? The answer for me is in this Scripture:
2 Thessalonians 2:1-12
1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
6And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Now I know I can't do God's job, and I'm not trying to ![[Wink]](wink.gif) He can do Anything without my help, but He has and does use His children to warn others of impending doom. If He didn't, then we wouldn't have much in our Bible today... only the fluffy feel good stuff.
When I see others running to have their ears scratched by False Teachers/Prophets it makes me want to Scream - LOOK OUT! You're Headed Towards Diaster!
These False Teachers/Prophets have so decietfully twisted the Scriptures that a careful examination of what they're teaching will show how they deny the diety of our Lord and Savior (thus preaching Another Jesus); and some have all but ignored the necessity of recognizing that we are retched sinners in need of a Savior (Jesus) (Thus preaching a different Gospel). I often resort to using articles written by others because they've done the research already. Perhaps if I were more mature I would not need to rely on the works of others but that's not the case at this moment. However, that doesn't mean that I should remain silent when I see Obvious danger either.
The warning to those who follow after these False Teachers/Prophets is to Open Up Their Eyes and Ears and more importantly their Bibles! Turn away from these False Teachers/Prophets and their False Doctrines and Return to their First Love - Jesus - and The LOVE of God's Truth before the Lord turns them over to that strong delusion.
Now grant it I am young and green, but that doesn't stop the need for these warnings to be given. When I see these particular teachers being talked about on this BBS, then that sense of Urgency hits me and I respond. Perhaps not always the right way, but I am being obedient to the Lord to Expose (warn others), Mark (name names), and Avoid (both myself and in warning others to do so).
Our time is indeed Short - either by Rapture, or having to deal with incredible tribulation. This intensifies the urgency within me.
Thank you Sister Hardcore for asking that question of Brother Ripp as it caused me to examine my own motives!
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
Posts: 3465 | Registered: Nov 2003
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TEXASGRANDMA
Advanced Member
Member # 847
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posted
It is like loving somebody. If you told your mate your loved them and then never wanted to be with them or talk to them again, your love would be worthless. But, if we truly love God, we want to read the Bible and spend time in prayer every day. We look forward to going to Church where with the brethern we can sing and praise the Lord.
I heard someone say once that he and God had an understanding, but he had not read the Bible since he was a child and had no desire to be in God's house. The fruit of his life did not reflect a relationship with God.
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
http://www.indieheaven.com/artists/mm (son-in-law)http://www.myspace.com/mireles
Posts: 4985 | From: Washington State | Registered: Jan 2003
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Itty-Bitty Girl
Advanced Member
Member # 4579
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posted
I understand now, Ripp...I can see much clearer.
In order for a person to be saved...they must know and obey God's word, they must be totally committed to God, or “living sacrifices,” they must be imitators of Jesus by not sinning, and like Jesus, they must carry out the Fathers will...in order to sow the good seed and produce a crop yeilding a hundred, sixty, or thirty times what was sown...
God is really goooooood! ![[thumbsup2]](graemlins/thumbsup2.gif)
Posts: 1051 | Registered: Apr 2005
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Ripp
unregistered
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by hardcore:
It is most definitely time for us to get our spiritual houses in order.
I'm curious Ripp - how do you see all of this (apostacy, lack of discernment, etc.) as it relates to the wrath to come, the rapture, etc.
In other words, your sense of urgency to "get the word" out comes from what basic belief? Being ready for Jesus to come or being ready to face the next round of persecution?
I know that's kind of a loaded question, so don't feel like you need to answer all at once. I'm just wondering where people like you and me "splt off" in our beliefs, or if we even "split" at all.
Well, that is a mouthful and I'll try to answer based on what I think you're asking.
It seems to me that the underlying question you're asking me is when I believe the rapture will occur. For me, the timing is becoming less important. I see evidence that could support one way or the other. I have my view but it's just my opinion. Whether it's a pre-trib mid-trib or post-trib, what's important is that we are ready. What difference does the timing of the rapture make if we're not ready?
I believe that my job, and the Body's for that matter, is not to bicker over the timing of the rapture but get people ready for His return. It's very difficult to understand fully, and I doubt that even the most learned theologians have all the answers. It has become a divisive subject and just serves satan's purpose. We are to watch, discern and be ready. I believe that's what is most important in these end times.
Are we close? Yes, I believe we are very close. All the signs that we are told to look for are here or very close. We have the Instruction Manual, and we're close to the final step of His plan, in my opinion of course.
So, whether a rapture or persecution is coming, we must be ready because:
quote:
"But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only. [Matthew 24:36]
But we should all see the approaching storm:
quote:
He answered and said to them, "When it is evening you say, "It will be fair weather, for the sky is red'; and in the morning, "It will be foul weather today, for the sky is red and threatening.' Hypocrites! You know how to discern the face of the sky, but you cannot discern the signs of the times. [Matthew 16:2-4]
I certainly see the storm headed our way. Whether rapture or persecution comes our way next, it's coming no less. Let's just make sure we are prepared for Him by living a life filled with the Spirit and doing His purpose. Everything else will fall in to place if we do that. I believe time is short and so yes it's very important to get the word out. No matter what your job is in the Body, we all must be extra diligent in these times. Our Lord is coming, of that there is no doubt.
God bless.
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hardcore
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Member # 4492
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posted
It is most definitely time for us to get our spiritual houses in order.
I'm curious Ripp - how do you see all of this (apostacy, lack of discernment, etc.) as it relates to the wrath to come, the rapture, etc.
In other words, your sense of urgency to "get the word" out comes from what basic belief? Being ready for Jesus to come or being ready to face the next round of persecution?
I know that's kind of a loaded question, so don't feel like you need to answer all at once. I'm just wondering where people like you and me "splt off" in our beliefs, or if we even "split" at all.
Posts: 627 | Registered: Mar 2005
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Ripp
unregistered
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Itty-Bitty Girl:
Hey Ripp, with all this falling away in exchange for a new gospel, who will be left standing?
...and are those left standing the ones that received the seed that fell on good soil? ![[spiny]](graemlins/spiny.gif)
Those are good questions, and not easy ones to answer. But let's take a look:
quote:
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. [John 3:16]
I have pondered what it means to be saved quite a bit and I still study the Word to gain wisdom in this area. There are elders here that might be able to answer your question better, but I will try.
I believe that when one is saved, they have accepted Jesus Christ as thier Lord and Savior, have repented of their sins, and now live for Him. I believe that it's in the heart where the decision is made. Many claim to know Jesus, but do they KNOW Jesus? There are many people who claim to be Christian, but where are their hearts? Do they live for Him or merely give Him a passing breath?
Let's look at another passage:
quote:
"Not everyone who says to Me, "Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. [Matthew 7:21]
There are many people who are not living for Jesus, yet claim their hearts are pure. If one is not willing to live for Jesus and become more like Him every day, have they really been saved?
I know that my life is now consumed by the Holy Spirit and the quest to find Jesus and live for Him the best I know how by listening to my Spirit. To do anything else would be to die in Spirit. My flesh is dying more and more every day as I give way to His will. I believe that you are either living for Him, or you are living for your flesh. I don't believe that there is a gray area. One of the reasons I believe this is because of the next passage:
quote:
And then I will declare to them, "I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!' [Matthew 7:23]
There are people who claim to know Jesus yet they are living in sin. It is my belief that they never came to know Him in the first place. How can one be saved yet still live in sin? Granted, we all sin, but a true repentant heart will ask for forgiveness and continue on their way to live for Jesus. Those who are not saved, will not notice that they are living in sin, or they refuse to change because their hearts are hardened. They never knew Him.
I don't know how many will be left standing, although that count goes down the more I learn about His Word. There are many deceptions in this dark world and we can't always tell a rose from a weed. But He knows. God will not be mocked.
quote:
Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life. [Galatians 6:7-8]
There are many that are living in the flesh yet claim to be in the Spirit. God knows their hearts. And we must always be on guard to watch for these false teachers and prophets:
quote:
For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. [Matthew 24:24]
They will even mingle among the believers:
quote:
But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them–bringing swift destruction on themselves. [2 Peter 2:1]
We must be extra cautious and test every spirit:
quote:
Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. [1 John 4:1]
We might not always recognize them because they will be very deceitful and crafty:
quote:
For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ. And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works. [2 Corinthians 11:13-15]
But this is just my opinion based on what I know about the Word of God. Go to the Word and check, re-check, check again. Pray on it, read more, stay in the Spirit and let Him lead you. You can trust the Word. Let the Word grow inside of you so that you may know the Truth. There will come a time when darkness will reach out and try and grab you, you must know the Truth in the Word of God. Put on your armor every day and live for Him. Lay your faith at the feet of Jesus. Let Him guide you. He is a beacon of light for those that will follow. Follow His footsteps and one day you will be in the kingdom of God. Let us pray that we will have lots and lots of company.
God bless and stay strong.
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Itty-Bitty Girl
Advanced Member
Member # 4579
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posted
Hey Ripp, with all this falling away in exchange for a new gospel, who will be left standing?
...and are those left standing the ones that received the seed that fell on good soil?
Posts: 1051 | Registered: Apr 2005
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Ripp
unregistered
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posted
Commentary on the News
Saturday, April 16, 2005
Jan Markell
As a part of my "Understanding the Times 2005" conference recently I shared a message on delusion in our generation. I am providing some brief paragraphs on it.
All messages by Gary Bauer, Walid Shoebat, Q & A, and my presentation will be available in about ten days in tape or CD form. Why am I surprised at what is happening? What the Bible predicts comes to pass whether we like it or not. For the believer it is temporary bad news heralding the ultimate in good news: The King is coming.
It is still troubling when we see that up is down, black is white, right is wrong, evil is good, good is evil, and everyone is doing what is right in his own eyes. Since the hoofbeats of the "four horsemen of the apocalypse" spoken of in Revelation can almost be heard, such events that stretch credulity will increase. Brace yourself.
While I am refraining from commenting on Catholic theology, I still was not ready for the events surrounding Pope John Paul's recent death. He brought together almost everyone in the world. Iranian mullahs greeted their most bitter enemies at the funeral. Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, "New Agers", Evangelicals, atheists, and more came together to honor this supposed "man of peace." It was a type and shadow of Revelation 13 and 17--the coming "one world religion" which will do the same. I am not suggesting a pope will be the antichrist and I do not believe the Bible supports that.
But there is something troubling when a few billion people laud a mere human being as the most influential man in the last one hundred years with press attention resulting in 35,000 stories and a TV audience of two billion. I do not think the world would stop and Fox News would air without commercial interruption if the president of the National Association of Evangelicals passed away. The delusion set in because of the longing for a "man of peace." "Peace, peace when there is no peace" as it says in Jeremiah 6. But the longing for peace is at an obsession level as forty nations equip themselves with weapons of mass destruction. So grieved was the world that a British paper called the pope’s death “global Calvary. No one can compare to him. His message was universal.” A greater “man of peace” waits in the wings.
It is strong delusion that puts extra pressure on Ariel Sharon and all of Israel because "now is the time to seize the opportunity for peace" since Arafat has passed and to remind Israel to "get off the land" no later than 2006. More delusion has America giving one of the most corrupt administrations on earth--that of Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas--$500 million dollars that will be spent on his cronies and himself, not his people. Rewarding terror, which is what this is, flies in the face of the Bush doctrine. It is strong delusion. Don't be surprised if Abbas gets the Nobel Peace Prize in the future though he has done nothing to promote peace nor will he ever. And while the Palestinians arm themselves with mortars and rockets, there is talk that Israel may be pressured to dismantle her nuclear capability.
Deception reigns when America calls Saudi Arabia one of our best allies when in reality she is plotting our overthrow through the spread of Wahhabism in foreign and U.S. mosques. Also when political correctness allows Muslims to gain high office, even in Homeland Security as reported by my radio guest Paul Sperry March 19 (hear it on "Radio Archives" at my Web site, www.olivetreeviews.org. His book: "Infiltration: How Muslims are Penetrating Washington.")
It is delusion and deception that prompts America to prop up the United Nations at the cost of $1 billion a year even when they have just pulled off the biggest scandal in the history of scandals, the "oil-for-food" debacle.
Stories come into my office daily about the deception, lack of discernment, and delusion that have come into some of our churches today. Some are preaching a watered-down gospel with "anything goes." We don't offend and we don't divide. And we don't warn the sheep who the wolves are out there to stay away from. For some--but not all--essential doctrine is an unimportant leftover from days gone by. It's even destructive.
At the same time, false theologies have gained a new stronghold. Demonstrating outside my conference were those with a sign saying, "Replacement Theology is Right!" That teaches that the Church is the new Israel. He could visit 90% of the churches in the Minneapolis/St. Paul area and they would all embrace that, so let 2,000 people who don't do our thing. The newest "pop theology" on the block is Preterism which teaches that all Bible prophecy is history: It happened in 70 AD with the destruction of Jerusalem.
The World and National Council of Churches are doing everything in their power to crush Israel, to praise terror groups like Hezbollah, and not say a word against terror nations committed to destroying Israel and America. Good is called evil, evil good (Is. 5:20). All discernment has died and delusion taken over.
Mysticism has come into the front door of our churches, not the back door. Practices that the Bible calls "divination" are welcomed in pulpits and are mainstream. Better raise up a "spiritual Better Business Bureau" because your spiritual health is at risk some places. (I talk about this in my video/DVD, "Mysticism: An Equal Opportunity Deceiver," available on the Web site.) We are now "signs and wonders"-oriented and experience focused. No one is immune from the temptations of these new practices that really aren't new. They began in the Garden when Eve was tempted with occultic power to see into the future.
Some Protestants are getting pulled into the Catholic celebration of Mary according to the March 21 issue of "Time" magazine. I never thought I'd live long enough to see that, frankly.
For those who still have eyes to see and ears to hear (and not all do), these are "signs of the times." We should look up and know our Redemption draws near" (Luke 21:28). We know our King is coming. When our foundations rock, lean on the "Rock of ages." When everything from our church, to our nation, to our dollar becomes unstable, remember, "God is the stability of our times" (Isaiah 33:6). He never changes.
As more people fall for lies because of the loss of discernment and the rise of delusion, stand for the truth. Great will be your reward in Heaven.
To learn more about deception, consult my Web site, www.olivetreeviews.org, then to the category of "Spiritual Deception." The category of "Prophecy Watch" will also be helpful.
Deception, Delusion, Discernment: 2005
Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. [2 Thessalonians 2:1-4]
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. [2 Timothy 4:3-4]
God bless.
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