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Author
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Topic: Yes or No?
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Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
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posted
I have been considering this for the last 4 days, and finally cast a no to both do to the witness aspects.
1) Going off by themselves.
2) Still traveling as a couple even in a tour group.
(Would be quite different if the Church was sponsering a tour made-up of members of the Church where there would be accountability to the group)
1 Thess 5:
22: Abstain from all appearance of evil.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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HisGrace
unregistered
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posted
Eduardo you said,"YOUR poll forgets the company of believers being of the same sex."
The original poll was intended to get views on how everyone felt about a couple of the same sex travelling together where there would be sleeping arrangments involved. Because of its appearance of possible wrongdoing, I'm still concerned about if God would approve, since the couple would be opening themselves up to speculation even for the best of Christians, not to mention non-believers or new young Christians who may have confusion about moral issues. It's the influence. I think it would be a tragedy to cause someone to fall.
Also, there is the risk that this travelling arrangment may work for some couples, but may not work for others.
WWJD? - You know, come to think of it, I don't think Jesus would want to cast doubt on anyone's mind. I don't think he would have done it?
I've heard Billy Graham say that he never, ever let himself get into a situation where he was alone with a woman one-on-one. Can you imagine if the press got a hold of something to which he was wrongfully accused by some unbalanced woman. It could totally ruin his ministry.
I found your comments very interesting, Eduardo, and have enjoyed the dialogue that has been created by the opening query.
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Eduardo Grequi
Advanced Member
Member # 3984
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posted
To travel abroad on an airplane,train, bus with a fellow believer whether the believer is male or a female is a pretty interesting question: Since I truly believe we live in the end of time, then take heed of Mathew 24. In the end of time, man will sleep with mankind and forsake what is good- Well I really do believe if the people use public transportation and eat in public respected places then the wicked world (who will anyway look and accuse the believer of evil and sinister sins) will have a less of chance to accuse the believer of sin. YOUR poll forgets the company of believers being of the same sex. Back in the days of early America and that wasn't too long ago-it was the law for a woman under the age of 40 to have a chapparon at all times and it usually was another woman, but for a man their word were their honor. DO YOU KNOW WHY? It goes back on the day the woman was tempted by the Serpent and she yielded to the temptation and sin occur with the woman. That is why back then the woman's word was not trusted unless she had a witness. Remember the day of the resurrection of the Christ. Was it a mixed company or people of the same sex company?
MATHEW 24:36-39
But if that day and hour no man knoweth, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. But as the day of NOE were so shall also the coming of the SON of MAN be. FOR as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that NOE entered into the ark. And knew not until the flood came and took them all away: so shall also the COMING of the SON of MAN be.
Why mention this now because that is what we are facing in soceity. A soceity of faltered marriages. gay/lesbian lovers, people seeking their own pursuit of happiness apart from the Lord Jesus Christ. If you look at what I originally written I said it would be okay to travel heterosexually. The big and annoying sin that is in accusation state of today is the gay issue. EVEN to this very day you see two men together you prejudge them to be gay.
This has happen to me a whopping 120 times at least. I scolded a brother and friend in the Lord to have prejudge me to be gay. He apologized and I forgave him. It took 3 months for me to even consider to have anything to do with him. He fell down and said I am sorry. I told him take your prejudgement and give it to the Lord for falling into the world scorn. One day his wife approached me and asked me why haven't I come around. I told her to go ask your husband. And if he is a man at all he will tell you the truth. Now get this when I am in the company of women it doesn't happen.
So my Dear Brethern where is the bondary? It is one of those gray areas that is laid before us. If with in your heart the Spirit tells you no, then it is no; but if the the HOLY SPIRIT tells you yes it is okay, then DO NOT QUENCH THE HOLY SPIRIT for that too is sin.
CHRISTIANS must be slow to judge (Mt 7:7). Gather your facts and not your assumptions. To assume a person is a drunk, or homeless is to assume you would rather have a well articulate dressed person sitting at your dinner table. I could tell you stories on stories that happen to me in my profession as a nurse but then Jesus could come in the middle of it. It spands 2 1/2 decades almost thirty years now and I have be born again longer than that.
![[clap2]](graemlins/clap2.gif) ![[1zhelp]](graemlins/1zhelp.gif) ![[Prayer]](graemlins/prayer.gif)
Posts: 771 | From: Belvidere, IL | Registered: Oct 2004
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redkermit
Advanced Member
Member # 4059
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by David:
WOW, I can't believe that 6 people so far think it is OK.
Read the Bible, stay away from temptation. Don't open pandoras box.
We are a diverse group of people. Many people do things that others would see as wrong. I'm sure if I followed you around for a couple days, I would see something and think, wow, I can't believe he does that.
I say that, but I do agree that it is best not to put yourself in a situation that could lead to those temptations. On the other hand, I have a great female friend who is a children's pastor. She moved to Chicago, and a couple years ago I drove there to visit her. She had not been there long at the time, so she did not have a place of her own yet and was staying with people from the church. I stayed at their home also. Some would probably say I shouldn't have done that, but we are very close friends, and having the accountability/witness of other people in the household, it was no problem for me.
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I would rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God than dwell in the tents of the wicked. (Ps. 84:10b)
1 John 2:6
Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.
Listen Online:
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Posts: 604 | From: Michigan | Registered: Nov 2004
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LaurieFL
Advanced Member
Member # 3794
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by David:
WOW, I can't believe that 6 people so far think it is OK.
Read the Bible, stay away from temptation. Don't open pandoras box.
I believe if you read my post carefully that the situation which I described is hardly a one-on-one trip somewhere. However, I can't see the harm in a group of people taking a guided, chaperoned trip. I know of trips like that conducted by churches for singles groups or teen groups and I am quite certain there are platonic friendships between the opposite sex on those trips. The group aspect, supervision,and accountability all make a situation like that "okay" to me.
Two people taking a cruise in two adjoining cabins or flying alone to a spot and having separate rooms does not seem "okay" to me, although I do know of some older folks (like 75 years old+) who are widowed who do stuff like that and I never once thought there was any hanky panky going on.
Posts: 700 | Registered: Aug 2004
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HisGrace
unregistered
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posted
Agreed. Once again as Laurie so aptly put -
"We are to remember that we are told to avoid the appearance of evil."
The devil never avoids an opportunity to craftily sneak up on us. Even if doesn't lead to falling into temptation, nothing is worth the potential of ruining our reputation by what it looks like.
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KnowHim
Admin
Member # 1
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posted
WOW, I can't believe that 6 people so far think it is OK.
Read the Bible, stay away from temptation. Don't open pandoras box.
Posts: 3276 | From: Charlestown, IN | Registered: Jun 2002
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HisGrace
unregistered
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by redkermit:
I had a friend that had a platonic relationship & they decided to save money by moving in together. Guess what? They were tempted and succombed to the temptation.
There you go. I grew up in a small town and there was a gentleman who had a live-in housekeeper. Naturally there were rumours flying around about them. As a teenager, I bought into these rumours and believed them to probably be true. She professed to be a Christian, and to me, these rumours cast a shadow over her witness. Never did find out the absolute truth.
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redkermit
Advanced Member
Member # 4059
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by HisGrace:
When I put in the "temptation" choice I put it in as a remote possiblity that they may yield to temptation. As I was writing it, I realized that if they are really good friends, like a brother and sister, that wouldn't happen, but put it in as an option anyway in case someone might think it could happen. Am I making sense? Maybe I should have left it out.
I don't think the possibility is necessarily "remote". I voted yes ONLY because of the stipulation that there are separate accommodations. I think given time and situation, any male/female friendship can be tempted. I had a friend that had a platonic relationship & they decided to save money by moving in together. Guess what? They were tempted and succombed to the temptation. Granted, living together is different, but by putting yourself in the environment where you are not accountable to anyone else, except each other, can be dangerous. Not to mention the other points you made about how others see it.
I had more to say, but lost my train of thought when I was interrupted by a customer phone call. Guess that's what I get for doing this at work!
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I would rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God than dwell in the tents of the wicked. (Ps. 84:10b)
1 John 2:6
Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.
Listen Online:
www.wmuz.com
www.997flr.org
Posts: 604 | From: Michigan | Registered: Nov 2004
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HisGrace
unregistered
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by NGCapnJack:
I have a question for you:
What's wrong about it??? If you say you may be led into temptation.. well by this reasoning, too much food in my house will lead me into temptation of being gluttonous. There is nothing wrong with temptation, and you can never really stay away from it, the only important thing is that you can resist it.
Besides, if she truly is a friend, then there is no attraction involved and if she is tempted to do things without any attraction, what does that say about her?
When I put in the "temptation" choice I put it in as a remote possiblity that they may yield to temptation. As I was writing it, I realized that if they are really good friends, like a brother and sister, that wouldn't happen, but put it in as an option anyway in case someone might think it could happen. Am I making sense? Maybe I should have left it out. ![[updown]](graemlins/updown.gif)
Anyway, I voted "No", because if I were in that situation, I would be concerned that even though this person would be a really good friend, people have a way of letting their imaginations run away with them, and I would be concerned that they would speculate that maybe I had fallen into sin, and thus be looked upon with less respect.
There is a scripture in the Bible that says that something may not be a sin for you, but would be a sin for someone else. Therefore, you may be a wrong influence on them by doing it, thus making them think that it is ok. God wants us to be concerned about our testimony to others.
However, I did vote "Yes" for the bus tour, because they probaably would be sharing accommodations with someone of the same sex, and there would be witnesses that everyone remains as a group.
Just read your post Laurie. "The appearance of evil" is the best way to put it.
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LaurieFL
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Member # 3794
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posted
We are to remember that we are told to avoid the appearance of evil. That said, I should think that if the traveling were done with a group, such as some of these groups that go to Europe for two weeks and such, then that would be clearly not a "couple" type thing, if separate accommodations were in place for everyone.
Posts: 700 | Registered: Aug 2004
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Eduardo Grequi
Advanced Member
Member # 3984
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posted
It would be okay, but remember do not let the good you intended be evil spoken of. Nowadays the world says behind your back if they see to men together camping etc.. they are Queers.
When they see a man and woman together, the world could say they are sleeping together.
But remember to pray and aked God for guidance for it is He you must serve.
Posts: 771 | From: Belvidere, IL | Registered: Oct 2004
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NGCapnJack
Advanced Member
Member # 4238
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posted
I have a question for you:
What's wrong about it??? If you say you may be led into temptation.. well by this reasoning, too much food in my house will lead me into temptation of being gluttonous. There is nothing wrong with temptation, and you can never really stay away from it, the only important thing is that you can resist it.
Besides, if she truly is a friend, then there is no attraction involved and if she is tempted to do things without any attraction, what does that say about her?
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Arr matey, May the Lord Bless yer soul. ![[thumbsup2]](graemlins/thumbsup2.gif)
"The LORD is my Shepherd" (Psalm 23). ![[Cross]](graemlins/cross.gif)
Posts: 30 | From: Canada | Registered: Jan 2005
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HisGrace
unregistered
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posted
1.Should a mature single male/female Christian couple who are "just friends" go travelling on a vacation together, keeping in mind that there would be separate accommodations.
2.Is it ok if they are on a tour bus with others?
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