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Author
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Topic: A study of 1John 3:9
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Barry44
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posted
Lessons from Israel not to sin:
1 Corinthians 10
1 I don't want you to forget, dear brothers and sisters, about our ancestors in the wilderness long ago. All of them were guided by a cloud that moved ahead of them, and all of them walked through the sea on dry ground. 2 In the cloud and in the sea, all of them were baptized as followers of Moses. 3 All of them ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all of them drank the same spiritual water. For they drank from the spiritual rock that traveled with them, and that rock was Christ. 5 Yet God was not pleased with most of them, and their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.
6 These things happened as a warning to us, so that we would not crave evil things as they did, 7 or worship idols as some of them did. As the Scriptures say, "The people celebrated with feasting and drinking, and they indulged in pagan revelry." 8 And we must not engage in sexual immorality as some of them did, causing 23,000 of them to die in one day.
9 Nor should we put Christ to the test, as some of them did and then died from snakebites. 10 And don't grumble as some of them did, and then were destroyed by the angel of death. 11 These things happened to them as examples for us. They were written down to warn us who live at the end of the age.
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oneinchrist
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I did a little further study/research on this verse from 1 John.....
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for His seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
and I believe this sounds like a reasonable explanation.......
Sin is never an expression of abiding in Christ. No believer ever sins as an expression of his new nature.
If a child of God falls into sin, it is an act against his nature. END
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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Carol Swenson
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The sons of God know that their Lord is of purer eyes than to allow any thing unholy and impure to dwell with him. It is the hope of hypocrites, not of the sons of God, that makes allowance for gratifying impure desires and lusts.
May we be followers of him as his dear children, thus show our sense of his unspeakable mercy, and express that obedient, grateful, humble mind which becomes us. Sin is the rejecting the Divine law. In him, that is, in Christ, was no sin. All the sinless weaknesses that were consequences of the fall, he took; that is, all those infirmities of mind or body which subject man to suffering, and expose him to temptation. But our moral infirmities, our proneness to sin, he had not.
He that abides in Christ, continues not in the practice of sin. Renouncing sin is the great proof of spiritual union with, continuance in, and saving knowledge of the Lord Christ. Beware of self-deceit. He that doeth righteousness is righteous, and to be a follower of Christ, shows an interest by faith in his obedience and sufferings. But a man cannot act like the devil, and at the same time be a disciple of Christ Jesus. Let us not serve or indulge what the Son of God came to destroy.
To be born of God is to be inwardly renewed by the power of the Spirit of God. Renewing grace is an abiding principle. Religion is not an art, a matter of dexterity and skill, but a new nature.
And the regenerate person cannot sin as he did before he was born of God, and as others do who are not born again. There is that light in his mind, which shows him the evil and malignity of sin. There is that bias upon his heart, which disposes him to loathe and hate sin. There is the spiritual principle that opposes sinful acts. And there is repentance for sin, if committed. It goes against him to sin with forethought.
The children of God and the children of the devil have their distinct characters. The seed of the serpent are known by neglect of religion, and by their hating real Christians. He only is righteous before God, as a justified believer, who is taught and disposed to righteousness by the Holy Spirit. In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil. May all professors of the gospel lay these truths to heart, and try themselves by them.
(Matthew Henry)
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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oneinchrist
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Hi Barry44,
Its nice to meet you.
I believe in taking all those warnings seriously..........whether the neglect of them leads to backsliding and/or falling away.
The Lord warns us to protect us from the evil one.
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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oneinchrist
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Hi Drew,
I have been looking at/studying your suggestion that John is making reference to the same "duality" that Paul speaks of(just in his own different wording)........and it does make sense to me that only "the new man" or the "new creation" could fit the bill of both "does not sin" and "cannot sin". Certainly we know the "old man" is fully capable of sin in word, thought, deed.
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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Barry44
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posted
The church is the body of Christ, He tells this church: I will spit you out of my mouth! These people were in the body and if He spews you out of His body, you are no longer part of Him. The words here are spirit not physical: And you don't realize that you are (wretched) and (miserable) and (poor) and (blind) and (naked).
15 "I know all the things you do, that you are neither hot nor cold. I wish that you were one or the other! 16 But since you are like lukewarm water, neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth! 17 You say, `I am rich. I have everything I want. I don't need a thing!' And you don't realize that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked. 18 So I advise you to buy gold from me—gold that has been purified by fire. Then you will be rich. Also buy white garments from me so you will not be shamed by your nakedness, and ointment for your eyes so you will be able to see. 19 I correct and discipline everyone I love. So be diligent and turn from your indifference.
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Bloodbought
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quote:
Originally posted by Caretaker:
There is a duality of identity within the Believer. One is the "old man", the sin nature. The other is the born again in Christ. The two are adversarial towards the other.
Galations 5:
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
Gal 5:26 Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.
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Barry44
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posted
quote:
Hi Barry44 and welcome.
I agree with your post. You say if a believer sins they need to repent and I agree. But let me ask you, do you believe that there are some believers who it is impossible to bring back to repentance? Heb 6:4.
Yes i do, there is backsliding and then falling away.
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Caretaker
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posted
There is a duality of identity within the Believer. One is the "old man", the sin nature. The other is the born again in Christ. The two are adversarial towards the other.
Galations 5:
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
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oneinchrist
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I would like to go over the verse again........1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for His seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
I continue to see the suggestion that John is just pointing out that born-agains do not willfully/continually practice(unrepentantly)sin as a lifestyle.
Now, I do believe that the first part of the verse already implies that(with the word "commit" in front of the word sin)......but I do not think that John is just paraphrasing/repeating the first part again in the second part. In other words, I do not think that "commit sin" and "cannot sin" can/ or are even intended to mean exactly the same thing.
Once again, I am still wondering.........What does it mean that a born-again "cannot" sin? The only One that I know cannot sin is Jesus/Holy Spirit.......but the verse does not use capital H in the word "he" in "he cannot sin, signifying that John is still talking about the same man(from the first part of the verse) who is born from above.
"and he cannot sin"
This leads me to believe that the word "sin" itself in "cannot sin" may have different meaning than the word "sin" in the first part("commit sin")
sidenote: I did notice that John calls sin the "transgression of the law" in another verse
Could this be the thing, that John is implying, that one who is born from above cannot do?..... Cannot deny Christ and cannot be a hater(be a transgessor of the law)
What do some of you think?
With love in Christ, Daniel
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Bloodbought
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barry44:
quote:
A born-again believer is eternally secure and cannot sin so as to cause him or her to lose their salvation, because the blood of Jesus Christ God’s Son cleanses us from all sin.
A born-again believer can sin as easy as anyone else, if they choose to give into temptation. In the new testiment paul is warning and correcting the churches of some major sins they were committing. I believe when your born again your sins are forgiven, you have a clean slate, but if you sin after that you have to repent of that sin. Example: The Bible says if you don't forgive your Father in heaven will not forgive you.
Hebrews 6
1 So let us stop going over the basic teachings about Christ again and again. Let us go on instead and become mature in our understanding. Surely we don't need to start again with the fundamental importance of repenting from evil deeds and placing our faith in God. 2 You don't need further instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And so, God willing, we will move forward to further understanding.
4 For it is impossible to bring back to repentance those who were once enlightened—those who have experienced the good things of heaven and shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the power of the age to come— 6 and who then turn away from God. It is impossible to bring such people back to repentance; by rejecting the Son of God, they themselves are nailing him to the cross once again and holding him up to public shame.
Hi Barry44 and welcome.
I agree with your post. You say if a believer sins they need to repent and I agree. But let me ask you, do you believe that there are some believers who it is impossible to bring back to repentance? Heb 6:4.
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Bloodbought
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by oneinchrist:
Hi Bloodbought,
You said:
A born-again believer is eternally secure and cannot sin so as to cause him or her to lose their salvation, because the blood of Jesus Christ God’s Son cleanses us from all sin.
In light of your above statement, how do you view these biblical accounts?
2 Timothy 4:7-10
7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith:
8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.
9 Do thy diligence to come shortly unto me:
10 For DEMAS HATH FORSAKEN ME, HAVING LOVED THIS PRESENT WORLD, and is departed unto Thessalonica;
Are we supposed to interpret this as.......Demas has not kept the faith; therefore, there is not laid up a crown of righteousness for him??
That is what it looks like to me.......but then how does that reconcile with your above statement?
What about this biblical account?
Acts 5: 1-5
1 But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession,
2 And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles' feet.
3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down and GAVE UP THE GHOST: and great fear came upon all them that heard these things.
Are we supposed to interpret this as Ananias was not born-again? or that Ananias' death was not a spiritual death? only physical?
Please understand me something Bloodbought........I am not trying to toy with you on your beliefs like some kind of Christian cop. I am simply trying to find non-contradictory explanations for things in scripture.
With love in Christ, Daniel
I would say that Demas never had the faith . He was double minded. He was a good help to Paul when things were going well, but when the test came he was not able to stand the heat. He let Paul down and went home because he was doing his work in the flesh. God’s work can only be done in the Spirit because it is God’s work
As far as Ananias and Sapphire, it seems to me that there are two Ananias’s
One influenced by the Lord,
Acts 9:10 And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias ; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord.
A woman named Sapphire and Satan influenced the other Ananias Acts 5:1-9. That is how Adam was influenced at the beginning.
There were also two Mephibosheth’s. One was blessed and the other was cursed.
2 Sam 21:7 But the king spared Mephibosheth, the son of Jonathan the son of Saul, because of the LORD'S oath that was between them, between David and Jonathan the son of Saul.
2 Sam 21:8 But the king took the two sons of Rizpah the daughter of Aiah, whom she bare unto Saul, Armoni and Mephibosheth; and the five sons of Michal the daughter of Saul, whom she brought up for Adriel the son of Barzillai the Meholathite:
9 And he delivered them into the hands of the Gibeonites, and they hanged them in the hill before the LORD: and they fell all seven together, and were put to death in the days of harvest, in the first days, in the beginning of barley harvest.
Do you think the Lord would put to death an unfaithful believer?
And like you I am simply trying to find non-contradictory explanations for things in scripture.
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Barry44
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posted
quote:
A born-again believer is eternally secure and cannot sin so as to cause him or her to lose their salvation, because the blood of Jesus Christ God’s Son cleanses us from all sin.
A born-again believer can sin as easy as anyone else, if they choose to give into temptation. In the new testiment paul is warning and correcting the churches of some major sins they were committing. I believe when your born again your sins are forgiven, you have a clean slate, but if you sin after that you have to repent of that sin. Example: The Bible says if you don't forgive your Father in heaven will not forgive you.
Hebrews 6
1 So let us stop going over the basic teachings about Christ again and again. Let us go on instead and become mature in our understanding. Surely we don't need to start again with the fundamental importance of repenting from evil deeds and placing our faith in God. 2 You don't need further instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And so, God willing, we will move forward to further understanding.
4 For it is impossible to bring back to repentance those who were once enlightened—those who have experienced the good things of heaven and shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the power of the age to come— 6 and who then turn away from God. It is impossible to bring such people back to repentance; by rejecting the Son of God, they themselves are nailing him to the cross once again and holding him up to public shame.
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oneinchrist
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posted
Hi Bloodbought,
You said:
A born-again believer is eternally secure and cannot sin so as to cause him or her to lose their salvation, because the blood of Jesus Christ God’s Son cleanses us from all sin.
In light of your above statement, how do you view these biblical accounts?
2 Timothy 4:7-10
7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith:
8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.
9 Do thy diligence to come shortly unto me:
10 For DEMAS HATH FORSAKEN ME, HAVING LOVED THIS PRESENT WORLD, and is departed unto Thessalonica;
Are we supposed to interpret this as.......Demas has not kept the faith; therefore, there is not laid up a crown of righteousness for him??
That is what it looks like to me.......but then how does that reconcile with your above statement?
What about this biblical account?
Acts 5: 1-5
1 But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession,
2 And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles' feet.
3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down and GAVE UP THE GHOST: and great fear came upon all them that heard these things.
Are we supposed to interpret this as Ananias was not born-again? or that Ananias' death was not a spiritual death? only physical?
Please understand me something Bloodbought........I am not trying to toy with you on your beliefs like some kind of Christian cop. I am simply trying to find non-contradictory explanations for things in scripture.
With love in Christ, Daniel
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barrykind
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posted
bill states
quote:
WildB
Advanced Member
Member # 2917
posted October 31, 2010 07:03 PM
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quote:
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Originally posted by powerhouse:
Pastor Lon Solomon said that the only way we can live the Christian life is to allow the Holy Spirit to walk out Christ’s steps in our lives. We can’t do it through works, but only through yieldedness.
Yield to the Spirit... for He has the right of way.
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welcome 2 the board. Talk right walk Christ and I will have your back.
Wow the boy now has a honorable mention,lol
Personal biography
Lon Solomon was born and raised in a Jewish home in Portsmouth, VA.
Lon holds a B.S. degree in Chemistry (1971) from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill; a Th.M. degree in Hebrew and Old Testament (1975, summa cum laude) from Capital Bible Seminary; an M.A. degree (1978) in Near Eastern Studies from Johns Hopkins University; and a Doctorate of Divinity degree (2005) from Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary.
[edit]Spiritual path
While in college, Lon’s life became a relentless search for meaning and purpose.[citation needed] He sought to fill the void he felt on the inside with fraternity life, partying, and gambling and developed a serious drinking problem. When all this failed to supply the inner peace he was seeking, Lon became deeply involved in drugs, both as a user and a distributor. He turned to “spiritual” things at this point, diving into psychedelics, Eastern religions, and even attempting a return to mainstream Judaism. But all this failed to resolve his inner turmoil, and he decided that suicide was the only reasonable way out.
It was at this time that Lon met a street evangelist, Bob Ekhardt, in Chapel Hill who began to talk to him about Jesus Christ. Bob Ekhardt challenged him to read the Bible. The Bible had the answers he was looking for in life. Matthew 11:28, "Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest", gave him the hope of knowing the purpose of his life, and Lon made the decision to accept Jesus as his personal Savior and Messiah in the spring of 1971.
Lon refers to his life as a marvelous example of God’s transforming power in action. Subsequent to his decision to accept Christ, Lon was able to quit the drug and alcohol abuse that had plagued his life for years. He went on to graduate from Capital Bible Seminary in Old Testament with highest honors. He then did his graduate work at Johns Hopkins University receiving a Master's Degree in Near Eastern Studies in 1979. He taught Hebrew and Old Testament at Capital Bible Seminary from 1975 to 1980.
WildB chews up lons and spits them out 2 make eye balls out of from the dust of the earth.
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WildB chews up lons and spits them out 2 make eye balls out of from the dust of the earth.
What do you mean bill?
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
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Bloodbought
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Carol Swenson:
Bloodbought,
I don't mean we are working for our salvation. I believe in Eternal Security.
I mean we are becoming more and more Christ-like, and that is the process of sanctification. Sanctification is progressive, and the more we learn the Word and submit to the Spirit, the more we progress, and gain victory over sin. Perfection is not possible for us, but we can live to please our Father as much as we are able to.
I also believe a true believer does not sin willingly. But I also know many believers struggle with certain sins. Some have a problem losing their tempers, some experience fears and doubts, some are addicted to pornography...none of us is perfect.
1 John 1:8 - 10 (NASB)
If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.
This is what I believe.
Salvation is a work of God’s free grace through faith, whereby all of our sins past, present and future are cleansed as we confess and repent of our sins and trust Christ to save us.
Sanctification is also a work of God’s free grace through faith, whereby we are enabled more and more to die unto sin and live unto righteousness. They are two sides of the one coin.
The free grace of God brings us to a living faith in Christ, so that we stand justified, just as if we had never sinned, and He enables us to live in a continual realisation that without Him we are a total failure. We fail Him daily in thought, word and deed and as believers we confess our failures, and the blood cleanses and keeps on cleansing until He presents us faultless before the Father. He ever lives to make intercession for us.
Salvation and sanctification are all of faith without works. We overcome every hindering thing through faith in Christ and this faith is His not ours. Those who have sinful habits should confess them to Christ, believing that He is the only remedy. To trust in any other remedy or try to overcome by ones own efforts is doubting Him.
A born-again believer is eternally secure and cannot sin so as to cause him or her to lose their salvation, because the blood of Jesus Christ God’s Son cleanses us from all sin.
God bless.
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powerhouse
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posted
Pastor Lon Solomon said that the only way we can live the Christian life is to allow the Holy Spirit to walk out Christ’s steps in our lives. We can’t do it through works, but only through yieldedness.
Yield to the Spirit... for He has the right of way.
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The Powerhouse Ministry
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Carol Swenson
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posted
Bloodbought,
I don't mean we are working for our salvation. I believe in Eternal Security.
I mean we are becoming more and more Christ-like, and that is the process of sanctification. Sanctification is progressive, and the more we learn the Word and submit to the Spirit, the more we progress, and gain victory over sin. Perfection is not possible for us, but we can live to please our Father as much as we are able to. I know Christ's perfect righteousness is imputed to us, but we still have a sin nature in this life.
I also believe a true believer does not sin willingly. But I also know many believers struggle with certain sins. Some have a problem losing their tempers, some experience fears and doubts, some are addicted to pornography...none of us is perfect.
1 John 1:8 - 10 (NASB)
If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.
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Bloodbought
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posted
From Carol,
quote:
All believers still sin, but they are working to gain victory over sin. They can do this because the Holy Spirit lives within them.
But why are they working to gain victory over sin since salvation is by grace through faith and not of works?
Sin has been dealt with at the cross and therefore our sins are already covered by the blood, so why would believers need to work to gain victory over sin?
We know that not one fragment of sin will enter heaven, so are you saying that salvation is a process, or do you believe it is a one time event?
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin. Personally I don’t believe that a believer can sin willingly.
Here again is the question by oneinchrist.
quote:
1 John 3:9
"Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for His seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin because he is born of God"
I have been studying this verse and have been having trouble understanding the second half of this verse.
I think I understand the first part........
"Whoever is born of God doth not commit sin" to mean that whoever is born of God does not live in a continuous course of sin because they are dead to the "lusts of men" , but alive to the "will of God"
but the second part......specifically...the "he cannot sin" part.........I dont understand it. I have seen various interpretations for it and I still am not getting it..........even when comparing scripture to scripture.
quote:
Do any of you have thoughts on this verse?.....that seem to make sense to you and flow with the rest of scripture.
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Carol Swenson
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posted
Sin is incompatible to our new nature, like poison is incompatible to our physical nature. When a true believer sins he feels miserable and seeks forgiveness and victory over that sin.
A Native American stated it this way, "I have two dogs fighting inside me, a good dog and a mean dog. Guess which one wins? The one I feed."
We nourish our new nature with prayer, the Word of God, and the Spirit of God. As we submit to Him, He gives us the victory.
John explained to his readers that true believers do not make a practice of sinning, nor do they become indifferent to God’s moral law. All believers still sin, but they are working to gain victory over sin. They can do this because the Holy Spirit lives within them.
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WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917
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posted
As we continue our series on True Spirituality, Pastor Stam effectively addresses the two natures in the believer. The conflict between these two natures explains the present warfare we experience within our members. The lesson that follows is a biblical guide on how to have victory over sin in your life.
The Two Natures in the Believer - Part 5
THE OLD MAN AND THE NEW
By Cornelius R. Stam
The believer who would be truly spiritual must recognize the fact that within him there are now two natures; that in addition to the fallen nature of Adam there is also the perfect nature of Christ, begotten of God through the Holy Spirit.
So real is the presence of both these natures in every child of God, that in Paul's references to the believer's experience, his personal pronouns refer sometimes to the one and sometimes to the other.
A good example of this is found in Romans 7, where the apostle says on the one hand: "I am carnal, sold under sin" (Ver. 14) and on the other: "I serve the law of God" (Ver. 25). Again he says, on the one hand: "In me...dwelleth no good thing" (Ver. 18) and on the other: "I delight in the law of God" (Ver. 22) referring on the one hand to the old nature, and on the other to the new. Surely the "I" who delights in the law of God is not the same "I" who is "carnal, sold under sin" (Ver. 14). Yet in both cases the apostle uses the first person pronoun, associating both conditions with himself.
That the apostle here refers to two natures in one person is clear from the qualifying clauses he employs. On the one hand he says: "In me [THAT IS IN MY FLESH] dwelleth no good thing" (Ver. 18) while on the other, he says: "I delight in the law of God AFTER THE INWARD MAN" (Ver. 22). Thus the "me" in Verse 18 refers to the old nature, while the "I" in Verse 22 refers to the new. In the former dwells no good thing, while the latter delights in the law of God.
THE OLD NATURE IN THE BELIEVER
The believer who would be truly spiritual must recognize the presence of the old nature within. It would be dangerous not to recognize a foe so near.
The old nature in the believer is that which is "begotten of the flesh." It is called, "the flesh," "the old man," "the natural man," "the carnal mind."
Just as "they that are in the flesh cannot please God" (Rom. 8:8) so that which is of the flesh, in the believer, cannot please God. "The flesh," as we have already seen, is totally depraved. God calls it "sinful flesh" (Rom. 8:3),1 warns that it seeks "occasion" to do wrong (Gal. 5:13) and declares that "the works of the flesh" are all bad (Gal. 5:19-21).
Nor is the old nature in the believer one which improves by its contact with the new. It is with respect to "the flesh" in the believer, even in himself, that the apostle declares that in it "dwelleth no good thing" (Rom. 7:18), that it is "carnal, sold under sin" (Rom. 7:14), that it is "corrupt according to the deceitful lusts" (Eph. 4:22), that it is at "enmity against God," and is "not subject to the law of God, NEITHER INDEED CAN BE" (Rom. 8:7).
"The flesh," even as it remains in the believer after salvation, is that which was generated by a fallen begetter. It is the old Adamic nature. It is sinful in itself. It cannot be improved. It cannot be changed. "That which is born [begotten] of the flesh is flesh," said our Lord (John 3:6) and it is as impossible to improve the "old man" in the believer as it was to make him acceptable to God in the first place.
The "old man" was condemned and dealt with judicially at the Cross. Never once is the believer instructed to try to do anything with him or to make anything of him, but always to reckon him dead, and so "put him off." But more of this later.
THE OLD NATURE NOT ERADICATED IN THIS LIFE
There are those who, with good motive, to be sure, strive to achieve the eradication of the old nature in this life. Such do not help, but hinder, the attainment of true spirituality.
First, the doctrine of eradication, far from taking a truly serious view of sin, takes a very shallow, superficial view of it. Those who teach it suppose that if we could get rid of the sins we recognize we should be perfect, not realizing that at our very best we all, having fallen into sin in Adam, constantly "come [present tense]2 short of the glory of God" (Rom. 3:23) and will continue to come short of it until we are changed to be "like Him." Thus "We, through the Spirit, WAIT for the hope of [perfect, personal] righteousness by faith" (Gal. 5:5).
Concerning those who feel that they have achieved the eradication of the old nature, the fact is that others can invariably testify that they have not! And generally those who claim to be without sin are guilty of one of the greatest of all sins—spiritual pride.
Certainly the doctrine of eradication is a flat contradiction of Scripture. The first epistle of John emphatically declares:
"If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us" (I John 1:8).
"If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His Word is not in us" (I John 1:10).
Paul also speaks of "the law of sin which is in my members" (Rom. 7:23) and urges constant reliance upon the Holy Spirit for overcoming power (Rom. 8:11-13; Gal. 5:16,25). Indeed, if the doctrine of eradication were Scripturally sound there would be no reason for Paul to instruct all believers to deal with the old nature, in such terms as: "reckon," "yield not," "put off," "mortify," etc.
But let us suppose for the moment that it were possible to achieve the eradication of the flesh; would that also dispose of our other two enemies, the world and the devil? Surely not, and having gotten rid only of the fallen nature of Adam, we would, like Adam before the fall, be as subject to temptation from without as he, and would as surely fall. But the Scriptures clearly teach that we all fell once in Adam:
"by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned" (Rom. 5:12).
THE NEW NATURE IN THE BELIEVER
It has been well said that if there is anything good in any man it is because it was put there by God. And something good—a new, sinless nature—has been imparted by God to every believer.
While there is still within us "that which is begotten of the flesh," there is also "that which is begotten of the Spirit," and just as the one is totally depraved and "cannot please God," so the other is absolutely perfect and always pleases Him.
Adam was originally created in the image and likeness of God, but he fell into sin and later "begat a son in HIS OWN likeness, after HIS image" (Gen. 5:3). It could not be otherwise. Fallen Adam could generate and beget only fallen, sinful offspring, whom even the law could not change. But "what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God, sending His own Son IN THE LIKENESS OF SINFUL FLESH, and for sin," accomplished, "that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit" (Rom. 8:3,4).
As Adam was made in the likeness of God, but fell, so Christ was made in the likeness of sinful flesh, to redeem us from the fall, that by grace, through the operation of the Spirit, a new creation might be brought into being, a "new man...renewed in knowledge after the image of Him that created him" (Col. 3:10) a "new man, which, after God is created in righteousness and true holiness" (Eph. 4:24).
John, who does not go as far as the symbol of the new creation in this connection, nevertheless refers to the impartation of the new nature to believers, when he says:
"Whosoever is born [begotten] of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born [begotten] of God" (I John 3:9).
"We know that whosoever is born [begotten] of God sinneth not..." (I John 5:18).
It is evident that the "whosoever," here, does not refer to the individual as such, but to that part of the individual which Paul calls the "new man," for we have already seen that John, in this same epistle, declares that if we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves and make God a liar. It is the new nature in the believer that cannot sin, for it is the new nature, not the old, that was begotten of God.
Thus in addition to our fallen Adamic nature we, through faith, have also become "partakers of the divine nature" (II Pet. 1:4). This is the "inner man" of which Paul speaks in Ephesians 3:16, and this "inward man" delights to do God's will (Rom. 7:22).
Let us thank God that the old nature is under the condemnation of death. Judicially it has already been dealt with. It was put to death representatively in Christ. Practically it will come to its end when our "earthly house...is dissolved" (II Cor. 5:1) or when we are "changed" (I Cor. 15:52) and "caught up...to meet the Lord in the air" (I Thes. 4:17), but the new nature—that which is begotten of God—will never die. In the first place it does not come under the condemnation of sin. In the second, it is that which is begotten, "not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the Word of God, which liveth and abideth forever" (I Pet. 1:23).
Paul, by the Spirit, gives particular emphasis to this fact as it affects believers in this present dispensation, for we are not only "begotten" of the Spirit and given the resurrection life of Christ, but we belong to the "new creation" (II Cor. 5:17; Eph. 2:10) which God will glorify "in the ages to come," in order to "show the exceeding riches of His grace" (Eph. 2:7).
We have now cleared the way for a consideration of the conflict between the old nature and the new, and of the means placed at our disposal to overcome the old.
THE CONFLICT BETWEEN THE OLD AND NEW NATURES
The epistles of Paul have much to say about the conflict continually going on between the old and new natures in the believer. God has a gracious purpose in permitting this conflict and it has its real advantages to the believer; also, abundant provision has been made for spiritual victory in any given case, but before considering all this, let us deal first with the fact of the conflict itself.
Concerning this conflict, the Apostle Paul writes, by inspiration:
"For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would" (Gal. 5:17).
Regarding this conflict in his own personal experience, he writes:
"For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do."
"For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
"But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members" (Rom. 7:19,22,23).
It has been taught by some that we need not experience this continual strife between the old nature and the new. They say: "Get out of the 7th of Romans into the 8th."
We would remind such that the Apostle Paul wrote Romans 7 and Romans 8 at the same sitting; that in the original the letter goes right on without interruption—without even a chapter division. Thus the same apostle who exclaims: "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus" (Rom. 8:1) refers in the same letter, only a few sentences before, using the present tense, to "the law of sin which IS in my members," and freely acknowledges the present operation of that law in his members, as we have seen above. How then shall we get out of the 7th of Romans into the 8th? Paul experienced both at the same time, and so do we, for while we are free from the condemnation of sin, sin itself nevertheless continues to work within us.
It is true indeed that no amount of striving can improve the old Adamic nature, but it is not true that there should be no strife between the old and new natures, otherwise the exhortations not to "yield" to the dictates of the old nature, but to "put off" the deeds of the old man and "mortify," or put to death, our earthward inclinations, would all be meaningless.
It is a simple fact that the conflict described in Romans 7 is experienced in the life of every believer. Else let those who contend that we should get out of Romans 7 deny it. If they have come to the place where they can consistently do the things that they would;3 where "the law of sin" no longer operates in their members; if in their experience they have been wholly delivered from its captivity; if they need not—up to this very day in their experience—acknowledge: "The good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do"; if they need not cry with Paul: "O wretched man that I am!" if they need not "wait" with Paul "for the hope of [perfect, personal] righteousness by faith," they should take their stand with those who teach sinless perfection and the eradication of the old nature. If, however, they are not prepared to make these claims, they should acknowledge the naked truth of Galatians 5:17 and Romans 7:22,23.
Should it be asked how we are to be blamed if we "cannot" do the things that we would, we reply that Galatians 5:17 was not written to teach us our helplessness, but rather our utter depravity. The Spirit is always present and willing to bestow needed help, but we are so inherently bad by nature that we never consistently succeed in doing the things that we would. Indeed, the flesh wages constant, relentless war to prevent us from doing them.
It is true that the believer has been made "free from sin" by grace (Rom. 6:14,18); that is, he need not, yea, should not, yield to sin in any given case (Rom. 6:12,13). It is also true that the believer is "free from the law of sin and death" (Rom. 8:2) for Christ bore the death penalty for him. But no believer is free from the presence of what Paul calls "the law of sin which is in my members;" that is, from the old nature, with its inherent tendency to do wrong. Nor is he free from the conflict with the new nature, which this involves. If we would be truly spiritual and deal in a Scriptural way with the sin that indwells us, we must clearly recognize its presence; we must face the fact that while, praise God, we are no longer "in sin," sin is still in us, and that though the "old man" is counted as having died with Christ, he is still alive and very active as far as our experience is concerned.
THE BLESSINGS OF THE CONFLICT
But this conflict should not discourage us, for it is one of the sure signs of true salvation. It is unknown to the unbeliever, for only the additional presence of the new nature, along with the old, causes this conflict, for "these are contrary the one to the other."
If we did not experience this conflict at all it could only mean that we were not saved, for with two natures so utterly incompatible dwelling within, conflict would be inevitable.If we know little of this conflict it can only mean that the old nature, in any of its subtle, deceitful forms, has attained the upper hand, for when the new nature asserts itself, as it should, the old nature is sure to "war" against it all the more fiercely.
But not only is the conflict within us a sure sign of salvation;it also creates within us a deep and necessary sense of our inward corruption, and of the infinite grace of a holy God in saving us and ministering to us daily in helping us to overcome sin. And in turn this again gives us a more understanding approach as we proclaim to the lost the gospel of the grace of God.
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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oneinchrist
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Member # 6532
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posted
1 John 3:9
"Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for His seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin because he is born of God"
I have been studying this verse and have been having trouble understanding the second half of this verse.
I think I understand the first part........
"Whoever is born of God doth not commit sin" to mean that whoever is born of God does not live in a continuous course of sin because they are dead to the "lusts of men" , but alive to the "will of God"
but the second part......specifically...the "he cannot sin" part.........I dont understand it. I have seen various interpretations for it and I still am not getting it..........even when comparing scripture to scripture.
The meaning that I had seriously considered to be acceptable was "he cannot sin(be against Christ). It does make sense to me that one cannot be against/in opposition to Christ(in the general sense) and yet at the same time have the Holy Spirit..........does this sound reasonable?
Do any of you have thoughts on this verse?.....that seem to make sense to you and flow with the rest of scripture.
The meaning to this verse could have an affect on how I view other scriptures.........that is why I desire to understand it.
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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