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Author
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Topic: Another Gospel
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Carol Swenson
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Member # 6929
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posted
becauseHElives
quote:
Carol we must preach the the whole counsel of Yahweh, not just that which feel good....
Then preach the whole council, not just the ugly. You're about as encouraging as stickery thorns for supper.
You and barry are like the men from Jerusalem who caused division in Paul's church at Antioch so that Paul rebuked Peter.
Did God not say He would write His law on our hearts? Of course we obey the moral law. There are 1050 commandments in the New Testament. Our salvation is NOT conditional on obeying them, but bearing the fruit of the Spirit is. Only by walking in the Spirit, not the flesh, are we able to obey these.
http://thechristianbbs.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=008211#000000
Jeremiah 31:33 (NASB)
33 "But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days," declares the LORD, "I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.
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WildB
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posted
Ecclesiastes 8:2 I counsel thee to keep the king's commandment, and that in regard of the oath of God.
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That is all.....
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WildB
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
quote:
Why do you always, always, always focus on ugliness, and sin, and the human condition? I point to the glory and majesty of our Lord and His Holy Spirit working in us and through us, then you come along and say to focus on people and on the evil things in life.
are you saying that Yahshua, Paul, John, James and the other authors had evil heart because they addressed the issues I address...
Carol we must preach the the whole counsel of Yahweh, not just that which feel good....
"Wherefore I take you to record this day, that I am pure from the blood of all men. For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God."--Acts xx. 26,27.
What is the oath of God?
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That is all.....
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becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87
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posted
quote:
Why do you always, always, always focus on ugliness, and sin, and the human condition? I point to the glory and majesty of our Lord and His Holy Spirit working in us and through us, then you come along and say to focus on people and on the evil things in life.
are you saying that Yahshua, Paul, John, James and the other authors had evil heart because they addressed the issues I address...
Carol we must preach the the whole counsel of Yahweh, not just that which feel good....
"Wherefore I take you to record this day, that I am pure from the blood of all men. For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God."--Acts xx. 26,27.
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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Carol Swenson
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posted
The Biblical Covenants
To understand the Word of God accurately one must become familiar with the eight BIBLICAL covenants. They fall into two classes:
(A) CONDITIONAL
A covenant which guarantees that God will do His part when the human requirements stipulated in that covenant are met.
(B) UNCONDITIONAL
Distinguished from a conditional covenant by the fact that its ultimate fulfillment is promised by God and depends upon God's power and sovereignty for its fulfillment.
Here is a cursory outline of them:
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1. The EDENIC covenant (conditional), Gen. 1:26-31;2:16-17
Made with Adam in which life and blessing or death and cursing depended on the faithfulness of Adam. Adam and Eve failed, died spiritually and physically and their sin plunged the whole human race into its pattern of sin and death.
2. The ADAMIC covenant (unconditional), Gen. 3:16-19
Here God declares to man, after the fall, what his lot in life will be because of his sin. It includes the promise of the Redeemer.
3. The NOAHIC covenant (unconditional), Gen 9:1-18
Made with Noah and his sons after the flood, introducing human government to curb sin, the normal order of nature reaffirmed (Gen. 8:22; 9:2) and the permission for man to eat the flesh of animals. Also His promise never to destroy all flesh again by water.
4. The ABRAHAMIC covenant (unconditional), Gen. 12:1-4;13:14-17; 15:1-7; 17:1-8
This covenant is one of the great revelations of God concerning future history. Abraham would have numerous posterity, personal blessing, his name would be great, and he, personally, would be a blessing. Through Abraham would come a great nation (Israel) and through him (via that nation) all the nations of the earth would be blessed (Messiah). Through Abraham's descendents (the Jews) came the prophets of God, the writers of God's written Word (the Bible) and Christ/Messiah according to the flesh.
5. The MOSAIC covenant (conditional), Ex. 20:1 - 31:18
It is contained in Exodus but amplified in many other portions of Scripture. It was given through Moses as its mediator for the purpose of governing Israel's (national) relationship with God. It was mainly made up of (a) the commandments, the express will of God, (b) the judgments, the social and civic life of Israel, (c) and the ordinances. It was temporary and would terminate at the cross of Christ. Though it had gracious elements it was basically a covenant of works. It could not impart life to the sinner in Adam (Gal. 3:21) but it served as a tutor which would lead those who were under its jurisdiction to the only One who could impart LIFE (Christ Jesus, Gal. 3:24).
6. The LAND covenant (unconditional), Deut. 30:1-10
It is erroneously called by theologians the "Palestinian Covenant." However, the Bible does not recognize the land by that name. It is the land of Israel because it was divinely covenanted to Abraham's descendents through Jacob (Israel). It is an unconditional promise regarding Israel's final possession of their ancient land.
7. The DAVIDIC covenant (unconditional), 2Sam. 7:4-16; 1Chron. 17:3-15
God promised David an unending, royal lineage, throne, and kingdom. Though God reserved the right to interrupt the actual reign of David's sons for chastisement, the perpetuity of the covenant cannot be broken. The Abrahamic covenant guaranteed the nation and the land. The Davidic covenant guarantees an everlasting Throne, King and Kingdom connected to that people (the Jews) and the land. Jesus Christ, the Son of David, is the rightful heir of this promised Throne (Matt. 2:2; Lk. 1:32-33) and on it He will reign over this literal, promised, earthly, future Messianic Kingdom from Jerusalem at His second advent.
8. The NEW COVENANT (unconditional) , Jer. 31:31-40
It is a new covenant with Israel in contrast with the old (Mosaic, "which they broke," Jer. 31:32). Christ Jesus is the Mediator (in His blood) of this new covenant which was inaugurated at the cross and is described in Scripture as, "enacted on better promises" (Heb. 8:6). The Mediator of this covenant has become, for all mankind, "the source of eternal salvation" (Heb. 5:9) to all who obey Him; as well as the cornerstone and Head of the Church (Eph. 2:20-22; Col. 1:18; Eph. 5:23) which is being built during this dispensation; individuals called out from both Jews and Gentiles alike.
Ultimately and literally, this new covenant with its unconditional and eternal blessings will be established with NATIONAL Israel at Christ's second advent to earth.
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Carol Swenson
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posted
becauseHelives
quote:
How many Christian believers are living careless lives, are not forsaking the world, not laying down their life, not taking up their cross, not following Jesus with their whole heart and mind, because there has been implanted in them the idea that no matter what they do they will go to Paradise when they die? There is a multitude of such misinformed believers. Through their sin and disobedience the Christians are destroying their own resurrection
Why do you always, always, always focus on ugliness, and sin, and the human condition? I point to the glory and majesty of our Lord and His Holy Spirit working in us and through us, then you come along and say to focus on people and on the evil things in life.
BAH! What is in your heart?
The good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth what is good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth what is evil; for his mouth speaks from that which fills his heart. (Luke 6:45)
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becauseHElives
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Member # 87
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posted
Carol, the change is from external to internal...
quote:
The New Testament covenant is one of blood but based on grace, it is unconditional .
The New Testament covenant is one of blood but based on grace,
true...
but unconditioned not true....
How many Christian believers are living careless lives, are not forsaking the world, not laying down their life, not taking up their cross, not following Jesus with their whole heart and mind, because there has been implanted in them the idea that no matter what they do they will go to Paradise when they die? There is a multitude of such misinformed believers. Through their sin and disobedience the Christians are destroying their own resurrection.
The blame lies at the door of those who, in spite of the many statements of the New Testament to the contrary, teach that salvation is unconditional with respect to the behavior of the individual.
The truth is, each Christian is permitted to remain in Christ on the condition he bear the fruit of righteous conduct. If he does not bear the fruit of Christ-likeness, God shall remove him from the Vine, from Christ. Our salvation indeed is conditional. Each of us shall appear before the Judgment Seat of Christ so his behavior in the world may be revealed and evaluated. We will be saved if we put our trust in the Lord Jesus, looking continually to Him, enduring faithfully throughout the many tribulations and testings that come upon us during our pilgrimage.
IS THE CHRISTIAN SALVATION CONDITIONAL?
While reviewing the footnotes of a Christian edition of the Scriptures, an edition that would be accepted by those who are fundamental and evangelical in their convictions, we came across two items of concern to us. They appear to contradict the express teachings of the Word of God.
These contradictions do not have to do with subtle points of theology, such as the threeness-oneness of the Godhead. If they did they would not cause us concern. No doubt some of the aspects of God will not be understood by us for many millennia to come.
Rather, these are contradictions of basic teachings of the Scriptures. The topic we are considering is the conditional nature of salvation.
The first of these statements, from the footnotes explaining Ephesians 2:8, is, salvation is unconditional. The grace of God is unconditional.
The Lord Jesus said, "but he that endureth to the end shall be saved" (Matthew 10:22). The footnotes of this popular edition claim (if we are understanding them correctly) that we are not saved on the condition we endure to the end but by an abstract, unconditional, eternal "grace" of God. Here is a denial of the written Word of God.
Are the footnotes reflecting that a period of apostasy has crept in on us?
Christian teachers answer by claiming that the four Gospel accounts do not apply to Christians, only to the Jews. Do such teachers have any idea of the ramifications of such a position? This would mean that the Sermon on the Mount, one of the historic possessions of the Christian Church, never has really applied to the Church. This would mean that the sayings of the Lord Jesus, which all true Christians treasure, are not for us but for the Jews.
Here is a grievous position. When the Lord said, "Abide in me," was He speaking to the Jews only? We personally could never accept that the Words of the Lord in the Gospels do not apply to Christian people.
It appears that the errors in theology prevalent today could be recognized easily by an alert high-school student. Since Christian scholars are intelligent and devout people, it must be true they are interpreting the Scriptures from an erroneous framework of understanding. They can perceive passages of Scripture only in terms of a manmade framework. They contradict the Scriptures and for some reason cannot see the discrepancies.
Let us consider the idea that salvation by grace is unconditional, meaning, as the writer explains, that our behavior subsequent to our profession of faith in Christ cannot damage our relationship to God.
There are several passages of Scripture that proclaim the contrary.
Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: . . . . (John 15:2)
The above passage is a clear statement that salvation, which has to do with our abiding in Jesus, depends on whether or not we bear fruit. Yet today’s scholars claim that salvation is unconditional. The Scriptures teach that salvation is conditional. The scholars state that salvation is unconditional. It is time for a reformation of our thinking.
A branch in Christ is a Christian.
Each Christian is permitted to remain in Christ on the condition he or she bear the fruit of righteous conduct. If he does not bear the fruit of Christ-likeness God shall remove him from the Vine, from Christ. This concept is reinforced by verse six of the fifteenth chapter of John.
It seems to us that an intelligent person, whose perception had not been colored by an outside framework of understanding would interpret John 15:2,6 to mean that Christians can remain in Christ on the condition that they bear fruit.
Again:
But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end. (Hebrews 3:6; and again in verse fourteen)
We are made partakers of Christ on the condition we hold fast to the hope of salvation or, as Jesus expressed it, if we "endure" to the end. Yet, our popular Christian edition claims in effect that this is not true.
The written Word of almighty God is not true?
Again:
I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not. (Jude 1:5)
"Having saved the people . . . afterward destroyed them."
Does this biblical type apply to Christians? If not, why did Jude take the trouble to put us "in remembrance"? Would not an unbiased reader conclude the Word of God is warning us that we must endure to the end if we would accomplish the will of God in our life?
The errors being set forth today do not have to do with subtle points of theology, the domain of professors and scholars. They are errors concerning the basic facts of our redemption.
The second item is found in the footnotes that comment on Hebrews 6:4-8. The footnotes contend that this passage is not referring to Christians who have neglected their salvation (which is one of the main exhortations of the Book of Hebrews—2:3) but to religious professors of faith in Christ who never have possessed eternal life. They have been Christians in outward show only.
From what could such hypocrites (according to the writer of the footnotes) "fall away," seeing they never had possessed salvation?
Here are the scriptural statements describing the "religious professors" whose experience, according to the footnotes, went no deeper than the external trappings of religious forms:
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, (Hebrews 6:4,5)
Let us examine carefully the criteria the writer of the footnotes must take into account when determining that these believers never have possessed eternal life but have been professors of religion whose Christianity consisted only of an outward show of formalities:
"Were once enlightened."
"Have tasted of the heavenly gift."
"Were made partakers of the Holy Ghost."
"Have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come."
These are the facts the commentator must consider when making his judgment that these backsliders never have possessed eternal life but have been Christians in external appearance only.
We would ask: What criteria does our commentator employ when deciding who is a genuine Christian? Is it some form of works? If it is righteous behavior that identifies a true believer, then our argument in the present article is shown to have merit.
Or is it a period of time? If so, how long must an individual partake of the Holy Spirit and taste the Word of God before he no longer is a mere professor?
If the criteria given in this passage are not an indication of true salvation, how, then, can any of us know if he is saved?
Why cannot an able scholar, as well as the devout readers of this edition, perceive the obvious discrepancy here? Is it because the framework of understanding Christians currently are employing will not permit the Word of God to mean what it says?
The reason we will not permit the Word of God to mean what it says is that the spirit of Satan is in us. Satan is determined that neither he nor anyone else has any reason to fear God; that a day of reckoning must never come no matter how badly anyone behaves.
Some of today’s theologians are misinterpreting the message of the Book of Hebrews. In their attempt to prove salvation is unconditional, that there is nothing a believer can do which will place his salvation in jeopardy, they are wrenching the Scriptures so they will mean what they want them to mean.
How many Christian believers are living careless lives, are not forsaking the world, not laying down their life, not taking up their cross, not following Jesus with their whole heart and mind, because there has been implanted in them the idea that no matter what they do they will go to Paradise when they die?
The number is legion. Through their sin and disobedience the Christians are destroying their own resurrection. The blame lies at the door of those who, in spite of the assertions of the New Testament, teach that salvation is unconditional.
It is our belief that the sinning believers and their teachers will stand together at the Judgment Seat of Christ. They will be rewarded together according to their conduct in the flesh. The watchmen did not sound the alarm. The blood of the guilty will be required at their hands.
Our salvation indeed is conditional. Both rewards and punishments shall be administered at the Judgment Seat of Christ, just as the Scriptures declare.
Contemporary Christianity is so weak in Kingdom righteousness and power it is unable to check the rush of civilization into the arms of Antichrist. The Christian answer to this lack of power appears to be, "Any moment now we all shall be caught away to a comfortable home in Paradise, so why should we be overly concerned about what takes place in the world?"
Christ taught that the saints are the light of the world, not of Heaven. When the Lord returns to earth we shall return with Him. Then the world will be our home. Our home is where Jesus is.
Each of us shall appear before the Judgment Seat of Christ so his behavior in the world may be revealed and evaluated. We will be saved if we put our trust in the Lord Jesus, looking continually to Him, enduring faithfully throughout the many tribulations and testings that come upon us during our pilgrimage.
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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Carol Swenson
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posted
THE NEW COVENANT
There are two major covenants in the Bible.
One is the Mosaic covenant which is a covenant of law, this was conditional. God said do this, obey and he will bless, failure to obey violated his conditions and punishment followed.
The New Testament covenant is one of blood but based on grace, it is unconditional . We receive the mercy and blessings of God not because of anything we do but because of what Christ did. As believers in the New Covenant we operate under grace by which good works are a result.
http://www.letusreason.org/Doct17.htm
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Carol Swenson
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posted
barrykind
quote:
There are conditions to keeping the contract!!!...
IF's, enduring to the end, etc., etc; its still about grace sir; for the Holy Spirit Convicts, and convinces of SIN......
Salvation is not a contract, it is a gift purchased for us by our Lord Jesus Christ.
John 15:3-5 (NASB)
3 "You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. 4 "Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it abides in the vine, so neither can you unless you abide in Me. 5 "I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing.
The New Covenant is unconditional, but if any condition can be attached to it then it is that we abide in Him.
The New Covenant is not about what we do, it's about what Christ did, and it's about submitting to the Holy Spirit of Christ within us. The Old Covenant and legalism is about doing certain things and not doing certain things in order to live a holy life pleasing to God. But the New Covenant is about resting in Christ, abiding in Christ, submitting to His Spirit, and HE does the work. Within us, He sanctifies us that we may bear the fruit of the Spirit. Through us He does the good works He has prepared beforehand "that we would walk in them." This is walking in the Spirit. I guess you could say it's our bodies, but His Spirit.
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them. (Ephesians 2:8-10)
We have nothing to boast, not even on the basis of the best of our good works. For they are all of grace. They are not gifts of ours to God, but they are gifts of God to us: works in which we may walk, and by walking in which we are blessed.
To try to do good works on our own, we cannot because our hearts are impure. Even if the deed is outwardly good, there is still sin in us. We can't improve ourselves, keep the law, or do good works...only His Spirit within us can do those things for the glory of God in Christ.
Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God. (Romans 7:4)
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WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917
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posted
Religiously u and Dale are VERY scary.
U chase away the baseball fans with your sillyness.
I will not allow that.
I will push u till I am banded.
for my sillyness.
OF GRACE!
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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WildB
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by WildB:
quote:
Originally posted by barrykind:
Bill states:
quote:
Oh Berry . Are you trying to put a file on me again that you will send to David?
LOL.
Your File in the BOOKS OF HEAVEN grow each post you make.
It is clear to all your LIBERALISM.
Have you written a letter to your State reps yet to have your portion of fed Tax that are use to KILL BABIES FIXED?
WILL YOU VOTE for those that can?
Humm?
Ive fought your spirit before, and i have not forgotten..Yahushua REBUKE you foul spirit!
For you know in another post the IRS nor the Fed govt has gotten not one penny from me for abortions, but i know where that spirt ; the lying spirit; is from and get the behind me satan!
Really? How do you feed your family?
AND
Do you drink city water?
Thank the LORDGOD of ISREAL for his GRACE this day.
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by barrykind:
Bill states:
quote:
Oh Berry . Are you trying to put a file on me again that you will send to David?
LOL.
Your File in the BOOKS OF HEAVEN grow each post you make.
It is clear to all your LIBERALISM.
Have you written a letter to your State reps yet to have your portion of fed Tax that are use to KILL BABIES FIXED?
WILL YOU VOTE for those that can?
Humm?
Ive fought your spirit before, and i have not forgotten..Yahushua REBUKE you foul spirit!
For you know in another post the IRS nor the Fed govt has gotten not one penny from me for abortions, but i know where that spirt ; the lying spirit; is from and get the behind me satan!
Really? How do you feed your family?
AND
Do you drink city water?
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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barrykind
Advanced Member
Member # 35
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posted
Bill states:
quote:
Oh Berry . Are you trying to put a file on me again that you will send to David?
LOL.
Your File in the BOOKS OF HEAVEN grow each post you make.
It is clear to all your LIBERALISM.
Have you written a letter to your State reps yet to have your portion of fed Tax that are use to KILL BABIES FIXED?
WILL YOU VOTE for those that can?
Humm?
Ive fought your spirit before, and i have not forgotten..Yahushua REBUKE you foul spirit!
For you know in another post the IRS nor the Fed govt has gotten not one penny from me for abortions, but i know where that spirt ; the lying spirit; is from and get the behind me satan!
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
Posts: 3529 | From: Orange, Texas | Registered: Jun 2002
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WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by barrykind:
Bill states:
quote:
WildB
Advanced Member
Member # 2917
posted October 28, 2010 04:26 PM
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quote:
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Originally posted by barrykind:
Bill states:
quote:
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posted October 28, 2010 01:51 PM
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I STAND IN WHITENESS THIS DAY OF OUR LORD, OCTOBER 28, 2010 against Dale....
I STAND against his "earthly ideas"...!
May the curse be on the GUILTY.
HERE I STAND!
quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
Carol , that is completely another Gospel....you don't see that!
Dale you are no longer worth of a response from Me,
For you have a FORM of Godliness but your denial of the POWER of GOD is no longer sillyness 2 me.
But a very serious misguided soul issue.
Repent while the day is yet called day.
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Bill are yo answering a post by Dale from another thread here?
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quote:
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Originally posted by barrykind:
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Why do you post this ? Its offensive and gay when followed by your spamming.
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That is all.....
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Posts: 3708 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004 | IP: Logged |
Bill where you said:
quote:
Why do you post this ? Its offensive and gay when followed by your spamming.
You made a statement sir and your called to answer for your flipant statement:
You like of understanding of the scriptures is absurd!
You do not debate, you make flipant statements, and run and hide behind the skirts of Betty and Carol...
You need to take responsibility for your actions, and use scripture for rebuttals, not you misguided thougts....
If you want to have an intelligent conversation of the doctrines of the bible, then use scripture to show your points, and leave your "mean" nature at the foot of the cross!
You repent sir!
Oh Berry . Are you trying to put a file on me again that you will send to David?
LOL.
Your File in the BOOKS OF HEAVEN grow each post you make.
It is clear to all your LIBERALISM.
Have you written a letter to your State reps yet to have your portion of fed Tax that are use to KILL BABIES FIXED?
WILL YOU VOTE for those that can?
Humm?
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That is all.....
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barrykind
Advanced Member
Member # 35
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posted
Bill.....................
Your false gospel of twisted grace is exposed!
The Berean Bible Society's "another Gospel" is now in the open and the "true" believers can see it is a cult...
Paul was in subjection the Yahushua the Messiah:
HaMashiach!
If you want deliverence then seek Yahushua while He may be found, sir you cannot escape by throwing railing accusations of me being "gay" or having "gay" ideals!....Its not spam to answer your rederick!
Please post things related to the True Gospel!
![[hug]](graemlins/hug.gif) ![[thumbsup2]](graemlins/thumbsup2.gif)
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
Posts: 3529 | From: Orange, Texas | Registered: Jun 2002
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barrykind
Advanced Member
Member # 35
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posted
Bill states:
quote:
WildB
Advanced Member
Member # 2917
posted October 28, 2010 04:42 PM
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quote:
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Originally posted by barrykind:
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Why do you post this fake simile/gay nudge hug ? Its offensive and gay when followed by your legalistic spamming!
OF A GRACE BBS.
Is your manhood now in question bill?
Its a gesture to me, of kinship, in the Lord!
In the New T., they even greeted one another with a Holy Kiss!
1.Romans 16:16 (Whole Chapter)
Salute one another with an holy kiss. The churches of Christ salute you.
2.1 Corinthians 16:20 (Whole Chapter)
All the brethren greet you. Greet ye one another with an holy kiss.
3.2 Corinthians 13:12 (Whole Chapter)
Greet one another with an holy kiss.
4.1 Thessalonians 5:26 (Whole Chapter)
Greet all the brethren with an holy kiss.
Your not getting off the hook by your lame "gay" accusations, you need to REPENT of your professed "mean" spirit...
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
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barrykind
Advanced Member
Member # 35
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posted
You made a statement sir and your called to answer for your flipant statement:
You like of understanding of the scriptures is absurd!
You do not debate, you make flipant statements, and run and hide behind the skirts of Betty and Carol...
You need to take responsibility for your actions, and use scripture for rebuttals, not you misguided thougts....
If you want to have an intelligent conversation of the doctrines of the bible, then use scripture to show your points, and leave your "mean" nature at the foot of the cross!
You repent sir!
[ August 18, 2018, 01:16 PM: Message edited by: Carol Swenson ]
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
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WildB
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by barrykind:
Why do you post this fake simile/gay nudge hug ? Its offensive and gay when followed by your legalistic spamming!
OF A GRACE BBS.
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barrykind
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posted
Sorry Bill edited post to say:
quote:
U Dont Know our Christ!
I have seen yours of Sabbaths, tithing and following the Law.
Our Christ is of Grace as is this board you SPAM with your sillyness.
I dont think i said anything about tithing?
I do believe in "Remembering" the Sabbath as YHWH told us too, its on my heart; cant help it..did not say anyone is going to hell if they dont remember it...thats between the individual and YHWH sir!
Look at Romans Bill......I feel the "law" is on my heart, Love YHWH with all your heart, and your neigbor as YOURSELF!
That is the totality of the "physical" law, transferring to the "spiritual" law.. i dont know how to make you guys see how i see it...
Our righteousness is as "FILTHY RAGS" SIR, as scripture states..study that out..thats "minstral rags"..to YHWH...
We could not ever keep the law...ALLLLLLLLL are guilty!
NONE made it, we ALLLLL deserve HELLLL!!!!!
Yahushua is the ONLY< ONLY ONLY one who kept the "LAW" in HIS humanity...righteous before YHWH, without spot or blemish......PERFECT SIR!!!!!
We are grafted in """""thats the Mystery" Paul recieved..............BUT LET US NOT BE HAUGHTY or high minded....If we were grafted in, we can also be cut out!!!!!
ROMANS SIR...study......
25I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
It is truly GRACE, and by the tender Mercies of YHWH..Thru HIS SON Yahushua's SHED BLOOD that we can be "saved".........................That is not of us "keeping" the law as Yahushua did for we cannot!!!!!!!
That is because of what Yahushua did for us....Grace grace grace..i know it , live it and love it.....
There are conditions to keeping the contract!!!...
IF's, enduring to the end, etc., etc; its still about grace sir; for the Holy Spirit Convicts, and convinces of SIN......
I post about the dangers of OSAS!..Once saved always saved"......flood of posts cryingout against it!...I post of "remember" the sabbath...flood of posts of against it, i post just what Yahushua [Jesus] said "he that loves me keep my commandments"...flood of posts against that..
i post warm, fuzzy stuff...No rebuttal, no comments.................
To me.............stam, Jc O'hair, bulinger i think is his name..........PREACH ANOTHER GOSPEL!!!
i proved over and over agian why i see this...Carol has posted she does not see "eye to eye" with the Berean Bible society...
I really believe its "ANOTHER GOSPEL"..
Other issues we have....like for instance:
Pre trib,post trib, mid trib; or even pan trib...is not another gospel ..its some misunderstanding about scriptute....
Bill i want to help you, and you could most likely help me in many ways...if you want no help then say so!
i do not think your knowingly living by another gospel, i think your sincere, but so are those guys that pour gasolene on their heads and lite a match...THEY are sincere but are sincerely WRONG>>>>
You bee mislead by the Berean Bible Society, and need to look at Romans, And John, James, and Jude; The other three gospels and study the Torah, and the Prophets...
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
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WildB
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by barrykind:
Bill states:
quote:
posted October 28, 2010 01:51 PM
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I STAND IN WHITENESS THIS DAY OF OUR LORD, OCTOBER 28, 2010 against Dale....
I STAND against his "earthly ideas"...!
May the curse be on the GUILTY.
HERE I STAND!
quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
Carol , that is completely another Gospel....you don't see that!
Dale you are no longer worth of a response from Me,
For you have a FORM of Godliness but your denial of the POWER of GOD is no longer sillyness 2 me.
But a very serious misguided soul issue.
Repent while the day is yet called day.
Bill are yo answering a post by Dale from another thread here?
quote:
Originally posted by barrykind:
Why do you post this ? Its offensive and gay when followed by your spamming.
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barrykind
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posted
Bill states:
quote:
U Dont Know our Christ!
What do you mean Bill?
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
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WildB
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posted
U Dont Know our Christ!
I have seen yours of Sabbaths, tithing and following the Law.
Our Christ is of Grace as is this board you SPAM with your sillyness.
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That is all.....
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barrykind
Advanced Member
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posted
bill states:
quote:
Berry , Please don't mess with me any more.
Im not playing any more.
Times are such.
Sir i was never playing, and i will pray if you want...im nobody, but the Lord hears the prayers of his saints..[body]..
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
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barrykind
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posted
My HUMBLE opinion is that if one does not Understand the parable of the sower, and you do not have a good handle on Romans...Your gonna get a little twisted up with Pauls writings.
Let us strive to help one another, but take not kindness for weakness;
There is many false gosples out there, and without ringing sounds of truth along with it it will not be recieved..study folks.its getting closer to the end.
It reminds me of a story Brother bert Clendenon told us one time; he said if a man dressed in a grass skirt, with a skull on a stick, with "witch doctor" attire on came into your church; immedieately they would escort him out, saying what a false prophet!
But take the same man give him a $1,500.00 Armante' suit and a limosine and they would stay after his sermon to see if he had any books, or tapes!!
Perspective...
watch and see how something is presented, study accompanying scriptures, and pray...we are in perilous times Brothers and Sister..
Keep watch and pray!!
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
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barrykind
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posted
wildb states:
quote:
BigC
I weep,
I don't like being mean,
but its the nature that God has put in me,
When things just aint right and the stalls need two bbee cleaned.
He shakes me to defence mode. Then moves me 2 Offence ....
Romans 5:20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound
Where in the world did you get that statment wildb???
Your stating God has put a "mean" nature in you?
Is that what you saying..........?
If so: what god?
It aint the God {YHWH} of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob!
You state:
quote:
I weep,
I don't like being mean,
but its the nature that God has put in me,
When things just aint right and the stalls need two bbee cleaned.
He shakes me to defence mode. Then moves me 2 Offence ....
Romans 5:20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound
[/QUOTE]
For the love of GOD man read Romans 6!
Romans 6
1What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
19I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
20For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.
21What fruit had ye then in those things whereof ye are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death.
22But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
23For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Your logic and statement sir is not according to scripture, God [YHWH] did not now nor at anytime :
"I don't like being mean,
but its the nature that God has put in me," [partial quote for emp. see above].
Yahweh puts HIS SPirit in you, your rotten flesh (as mine is); is just that God did not put thatnature in us, we were born, from the fallen Adam, and are SET FREE by the Spiritual ADAM Yahushua the Messiah [Jesus] [The Christ}., man you do not have to be "mean" nor walk in the flesh [the old nature], you can be FREE!!!
First off when Adam fell, Eve had eaten the fruit of the tree of Knowledge of good and evil.
Eve ws deceived by the serpent, and she gave to Adam [with her], who also ate..Adam was never deceived, he flat out disobeyed YHWH and sinned!
Now this is why a women has suffering in child bearing and Adam works by the "sweat" of his brow till he dies!
For that day that they did eat...THEY BOTH DIED, spiritually that day sir.
My point is when approached by YHWH, HE asked what hast thou done?
Eve said the serpent beguiled me, [passed the buck to satan]; Adam stated:
The women "you" gave me gave me and i did eat.....
Adam blamed YHWH, [buck passed] or tried to.
YHWH did not take that as an excuse and HE will not stand for it now....
Brother Bill; if you have a "old nature" problem, we can pray for you and you can pray; and YHWH is faithful to deliver from such; we will always have this "body of death" untilwe recieve our new bodies!
Romans 7
1Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
2For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
4Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
5For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
6But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
15For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
18For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
19For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
24O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
Notice here brother:
24O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
My heart is to help you Brother and i hope this does, my intent was for it to help.. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
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The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27
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WildB
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posted
brb pullin another slab of meat from the swamp,lol.
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That is all.....
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WildB
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posted
BigC
I weep,
I don't like being mean,
but its the nature that God has put in me,
When things just aint right and the stalls need two bbee cleaned.
He shakes me to defence mode. Then moves me 2 Offence ....
Romans 5:20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:
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That is all.....
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Carol Swenson
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posted
Paul always had a loving concern for his converts and a deep desire to see the churches he had founded glorify Christ (see Acts 15:36; 2 Cor. 11:28). He was not content to lead men and women to Christ and then abandon them. (For an example of his “after-care,” read 1 Thes. 2.)
When Paul heard that false teachers had begun to capture his converts and lead them astray, he was greatly concerned—and rightly so. After all, teaching new Christians how to live for Christ is as much a part of Christ’s commission as winning them (Matt. 28:19-20). Sad to say, many of the Galatian Christians had turned away from Paul, their “spiritual father” in the Lord, and were now following legalistic teachers who were mixing Old Testament Law with the Gospel of God’s grace. (We call these false teachers “Judaizers” because they were trying to entice Christians back into the Jewish religious system.)
So, Paul had a ministry as an apostle, and specifically as the founder of the Galatian churches. As such, he had the authority to deal with the problems in the churches. But there was a second source of authority.
His message
From the very beginning, Paul clearly states the message of the Gospel, because it was this message that the Judaizers were changing. The Gospel centers in a Person—Jesus Christ, the Son of God. This Person paid a price—He gave Himself to die on the cross. (You will discover that the cross is important in the Galatian letter, see 2:19-21; 3:1, 13; 4:5; 5:11, 24; 6:12-14.) Christ paid the price that He might achieve a purpose—delivering sinners from bondage.
“Liberty in Christ” is the dominant theme of Galatians. (Check the word bondage in 2:4; 4:3, 9, 24-25; 5:1.) The Judaizers wanted to lead the Christians out of the liberty of grace into the bondage of Law. Paul knew that bondage was not a part of the message of the Gospel, for Christ had died to set men free.
Paul’s ministry and message were sources of spiritual authority.
His motive
“To whom be glory forever and ever!” The false teachers were not ministering for the glory of Christ, but for their own glory (see Gal. 6:12-14). Like false teachers today, the Judaizers were not busy winning lost people to Christ. Rather, they were stealing other men’s converts and bragging about their statistics. But Paul’s motive was pure and godly: he wanted to glorify Jesus Christ (see 1 Cor. 6:19-20; 10:31-33).
Paul has now explained his authority. He is ready for a second step as he begins this battle for the liberty of the Christian.
He Expresses His Anxiety
“I am amazed that you are so quickly moving away!” This is the first reason for Paul’s anxiety: the Galatians were deserting the grace of God. (The verb indicates they were in the process of deserting and had not fully turned away.)
Paul strikes while the iron is hot. God had called them in His grace, and saved them from their sins. Now they are moving from grace back into Law. They are abandoning liberty for legalism! And they are doing it so quickly, without consulting Paul, their “spiritual father,” or giving time for the Holy Spirit to teach them. They have become infatuated with the religion of the Judaizers, just the way little children follow a stranger because he offers them candy.
“The grace of God” is a basic theme in this letter (Gal. 1:3, 6, 15; 2:9, 21; 5:4; 6:18). Grace is simply God’s favor to undeserving sinners. The words “grace” and “gift” go together, because salvation is the gift of God through His grace (Eph. 2:8-10). The Galatian believers were not simply “changing religions” or “changing churches” but were actually abandoning the very grace of God!
We must never forget that the Christian life is a living relationship with God through Jesus Christ. A man does not become a Christian merely by agreeing to a set of doctrines; he becomes a Christian by submitting to Christ and trusting Him (Rom. 11:6). You cannot mix grace and works, because the one excludes the other. Salvation is the gift of God’s grace, purchased for us by Jesus Christ on the cross. To turn from grace to Law is to desert the God who saved us.
But they were guilty of another sin that gave Paul great anxiety: they were perverting the Gospel of God. The Judaizers claimed to be preaching “the Gospel,” but there cannot be two gospels, one centered in works and the other centered in grace. “They are not preaching another gospel,” writes Paul, “but a different message—one so different from the true Gospel that it is no gospel at all.”
(Wiersbe)
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WildB
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posted
I STAND IN WHITENESS THIS DAY OF OUR LORD, OCTOBER 28, 2010 against Dale....
I STAND against his "earthly ideas"...!
May the curse be on the GUILTY.
HERE I STAND!
quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
Carol , that is completely another Gospel....you don't see that!
Dale you are no longer worth of a response from Me,
For you have a FORM of Godliness but your denial of the POWER of GOD is no longer sillyness 2 me.
But a very serious misguided soul issue.
Repent while the day is yet called day.
![[cool_shades]](graemlins/cool_shades.gif)
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That is all.....
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Carol Swenson
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Another Gospel
Paul the Apostle states in Galatians 1:6, "I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel." What Paul referred to here as "another gospel" was the danger of adding human works (specifically keeping of the Jewish Law) to the finished work of Christ.
If we find ourselves dealing with Christians who lack maturity, our attitude should be the same as Paul in Philippians 3:15,16, where he councils the readers to simply act in accordance with what they do know, and God will give them greater light. If we find ourselves dealing with personality conflicts, we should follow the advice given in Philippians 4:2 where fellow believers are exhorted to be like minded (the fact that these 2 sisters are told to be like minded without corrective teaching being given leads us to conclude this was a conflict of personality and not a conflict of doctrine).
But what if someone is preaching another gospel; one that combines human works with Christ's works? What should our attitude be in this case? Should we wait until these people are given greater light? Should we "bury the hatchet" and join with them in happy fellowship? Scripture gives us the answer in Galatians 1:8,9, which says, "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed."
These seem like very harsh words don't they? As Christians, are we not to be gentle, forgiving, forbearing and accepting of one another? Absolutely! But in the message of the Gospel, there can be no compromise. There are at least 3 reasons why there can be no compromise on the message of the Gospel. First, the Gospel is the core of Christianity, and when it is changed, the change will affect everything else. Secondly, if another Gospel is preached, men and women cannot be saved. Finally, and most significantly, to preach another gospel is an affront to the perfect work of the Lord Jesus Christ.
First, the Gospel is at the core of Christianity. Change the essence of the Gospel and you change the essence of Christianity. Add the requirement of human works to the Gospel and it no longer becomes the Gospel of grace. It no longer becomes a free gift. The redeemed man is no longer eternally secure. Eternal life is no longer eternal if Law keeping keeps us. It is a fearful thing to preach another gospel because it is a fearful thing to attack the very core of the Christian faith.
Secondly, if another gospel is preached, men and women cannot be saved. At it's heart, the Christian faith is about abandoning your own attempts to save yourself and accepting the finished work of Christ. If we preach another gospel, a gospel by which men and women, boys and girls cannot be saved, we do an unspeakably vile thing. We condemn people to a lost eternity because we preach a false faith that cannot save. It is a fearful thing to preach another gospel because it is a fearful thing to encourage others to trust a message that cannot save.
Yes, these are fearful consequences of preaching a different gospel. And yet there is another consequence that eclipses the others in its importance. The third reason why it is a fearful thing to preach another gospel is that it is an affront to the perfect work of the Lord Jesus Christ. With dignified simplicity and brutal clarity, the agony of the Saviour on the cross is portrayed in Psalm 22:14-17, "I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels. My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death. For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have enclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet. I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me." To preach another gospel, to add our works as an additional requirement for salvation is to state that this suffering by the Saviour was not good enough. To even imply such a thing is wicked. Psalm 29:2 says, "Give unto the LORD the glory due unto his name; worship the LORD in the beauty of holiness." To preach another gospel is to imply that the Lord Jesus's holiness and merit was insufficient to accomplish our salvation.
Surely we can see that it is a most serious matter to preach another gospel, especially a gospel that adds works as a condition for salvation. No wonder Paul said, "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed." If someone comes to us and is preaching another gospel, there is no room for a gentle, forgiving, forbearing and accepting attitude.
http://www.brethrenonline.org/articles/ANOTHGOS.HTM
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