Christian Chat Network

This version of the message boards has closed.
Please click below to go to the new Christian BBS website.

New Message Boards - Click Here

You can still search for the old message here.

Christian Message Boards


Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply
| | search | faq | forum home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Christian Message Boards   » Bible Studies   » Bible Topics & Study   » Jesus Is Our Sabbath Rest

   
Author Topic: Jesus Is Our Sabbath Rest
Betty Louise
Advanced Member
Member # 7175

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Betty Louise     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Carol,
Thank you for sharing this with all of us.
Betty

--------------------
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Posts: 5051 | From: Houston, Texas | Registered: May 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929

Icon 8 posted      Profile for Carol Swenson     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
This tract is being written because we as Christians are living in a very peculiar time. In these last days prior to the return of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, there is such confusion among so many well meaning and Christian-minded people, and one great point of confusion and contention is regarding the Sabbath.

I have personally been confronted by people who condemned me and my ministry because I did not keep the Sabbath the way they were trying to keep it. There is extremism in any belief system, and that extremism occurs when proponents of a belief system do not accept the whole council of God. In this tract, we will look at the whole council of God on the subject of the Sabbath, which will bring forth a clear understanding of what it is and how it must be kept.

We will now go back to the origin of the Sabbath at the time of the creation as told at the beginning of the book of Genesis. In Genesis 2:1-3 we read, "Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made."

One thing that should be immediately noticed is that all of the preceding six days end with the following words, "And the evening and the morning were the (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, or 6th) day." We do not find these words of finality or summation ending the seventh day, because in a perfect world, everyday thereafter would be a condition of Sabbath or rest and repose. That day was open-ended! Only sin could take away that condition of Sabbath or rest that was meant for everyday, and sadly, that is exactly what happened. Later, we will see how our Lord Jesus restored the perpetual and continual Sabbath to our souls.

The first time we see the word "Sabbath" is in the book of Exodus, and in Exodus 20:8-11, we find that it is given as one of the Ten Commandments as follows: "Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it."

One primary point that must be noted regarding the Sabbath commandment is that it has nothing to do with going to church! It has only to do with the cessation from work. Nothing more and nothing less. Sinful man was ordered to do nothing on the seventh day. Thus, one day each week he would not be out there committing sin after sin after sin. It was a "do nothing" day, established as such until the Savior would come to give us victory over sin every day of the week and establish rest for our souls by his spirit dwelling within. This could be made possible only through a New Covenant established by the blood of the Lamb of God!

The Old Testament is replete with examples of Sabbath commandments, but in every example, it is under the Old Covenant of a single day of rest, which by the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ has given way to a Sabbath, where every day is one where we cease from our old works. The Old Covenant, according to Hebrews 8:13, is no more! It reads as follows: "In that he saith, a New Covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away."

In Galatians 3:24-25, we are exhorted "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are NO LONGER UNDER THE SCHOOLMASTER." Thus, the law could lead us to Christ but no further! Those who think that they are keeping the Sabbath as a day must remember that James 2:10 says, "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all." The only one who has ever kept the Sabbath perfectly is Jesus Christ. Man cannot do what He did in keeping the law. The Lord Jesus took the law to Calvary as well as the sin of the world. It was there that the law and all transgressions met, and He bore the sin of many. See Isaiah 53.

Is there a Sabbath after Calvary? Yes! Hebrews 4:9-10 says, "There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his." There are two words not found in those verses, "Sabbath" and "day." It is because our rest is no longer a calendar day each week, but every day, which includes the seventh, and thus we keep the Sabbath by living a godly and blood-washed life every day. For we have ceased from our old works. Some people who haven't come to an understanding of what covenant they are under will point out that Paul often went into the synagogues on the Sabbath. If we look at those incidents, however, we see that it was to bring those who hear out of the synagogue and that system of death. Here is what Paul the Apostle said about the seventh day as found in Romans 14:5-6: "One man esteemeth one day above another, another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord, and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it."

We know that the Sabbath law is fulfilled in Jesus Christ and He abides within us. The seventh day Sabbath was not eliminated but fulfilled, and our Savior added six more days to that rest and gave us the timelessness of eternal life. Thus, the seventh day is kept holy with all the other days. We can worship our Lord any day and every day. We know that Sunday is not the Sabbath but rather one of seven days, any of which can be used for worship. Acts 20:7 says, "And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight."

It is my humble prayer that all who read this will realize the joy of keeping all seven days of the week holy and thus fulfill the sacred commandment; for it is not our works but the finished work of Christ that has established the eternal timeless Sabbath of the New Covenant by the power of His blood.

Pastor David J. Meyer

Last Trumpet Ministries International
PO Box 806
Beaver Dam, WI 53916

http://www.lasttrumpetministries.org

Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Betty Louise
Advanced Member
Member # 7175

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Betty Louise     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Matthew 22:37-40 (New International Version)

37Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' 38This is the first and greatest commandment. 39And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' 40All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments."

--------------------
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Posts: 5051 | From: Houston, Texas | Registered: May 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
plankeye p
Advanced Member
Member # 8254

Icon 1 posted      Profile for plankeye p     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hello Caretaker, Carol and Betty

I will start by saying I apologize if I have offended any one with any of my earlier post.
I’m not out to argue about what I believe. I am simply stating my beliefs and why I believe them. So Caretaker I was not coming out “swinging” earlier. I was simply trying to give evidence from scripture supporting what my beliefs are. Which I will do one last time before moving on. I really do not care for the going back and forth with each side undermining the others views, posting long cut and paste articles from some theologian that believes the same way we believe. I prefer speaking from the heart. Cause the bottom line is if you are witnessing to someone in person you are not going to be able to give them theologian x’s dissertation on whatever the subject matter is. All you have is what’s in your heart at that given moment. So I always try to just speak plainly whats in my heart.

What i’m going to do is state why I believe the Ten Commandment law is still valid. Why I believe it has not been “nailed to the cross” or done away with or changed in any way shape or form. (Just my beliefs as I read the bible.)

“The Word of God declares the Law of Moses fulfilled and obsolete.” - Caretaker
I agree. (See we do agree on some things, no need for anybody to be swinging at anybody else.)

However I do not see where the word of God says that the Ten Commandments are given by Moses. They were written with Gods own finger. The Ten Commandments reveal God’s character. God does not change.

Which leads me into the next statement. “We are under Christ's Law of Love “ - Caretaker
Once again we agree. (Bet you never thought we agreed so much)

Where I think we differ in opinions is, I say the Ten Commandments are that very “law of love" that you speak of. How so? Back to the character of God. God is Love!

But when the Pharisees had heard that he had put the Sadducees to silence, they were gathered together. 35Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying, 36Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. - Matthew 22: 34-40

Notice verse 40: on these two commandments hang ALL THE LAW...
All of God’s law is hinged on love. First towards God and next towards man.

If you see where the law of love differs from that please show me. Because i have no other way of seeing it.

Lets look at the Ten Commandments
The first Great commandment that Jesus spoke of:

#1 - Have no god before me.
If I love God I will not place anything as a god before Him.

#2 - Don’t bow down to worship any idol thing.
If I love God, I will not worship any idols.

#3 - Don’t take the Lord’s name in vain.
If I love God, I won’t do that.

#4 - Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy.
No comment on this for now, because for some reason out of all the commandments this one causes the most controversy.

The second is like unto the first, love your neighbor like yourself.

#5 - Honor your father and mother.
If I love my neighbor (father,mother) I won’t dishonor them. Or any one else for that matter.

#6 - Do not murder.
If I love my neighbor i wont murder him.

#7 - You must not commit adultery.
If i love my neighbor (wife,husband) I wont be having sex with anyone else. If you are married I would think this would be one that you would not want to be done away with.

#8 - You must not steal.
If you love your neighbor you wouldn’t steal from him.

#9 - Don’t bear false witness.
If you love your neighbor you wont lie in him.

#10 - Do not covet.
If you love your neighbor you wont covet what is his.

Listen to King David psalm 119: 9-11
BETH. Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word.
With my whole heart have I sought thee: O let me not wander from thy commandments.
Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.

Psalm 19: 9-11
The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.
More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward.

David desired not to wander from the commandments. He said they are to be desired more than fine gold, that they were sweeter than honey.

So why do we today want to make them not apply to us? Maybe because we like David cannot keep them in our own strength.

That is why I thank God for Jesus the only one who was able to keep them.

Just to clear up any misunderstandings anyone may have about people who keep the Sabbath, we do not put any hope in sabbath-keeping as a means of salvation. God is not putting a burden on me when he tells me to keep the sabbath holy. The sabbath is a delight. I don’t keep the 7 day sabbath because it saves me. I keep it because I love God. And don’t get me wrong, when I say I keep it don’t think I am saying I do it according to Gods standard. I cant. Just like I can’t keep any of the commandments up to his standard.

THAT IS WHY I AM SOOOO HAPPY ABOUT JESUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Peace
p.i.p.

ps. this will be the end of me “defending” my sabbath keeping. However if you see any holes in my reasoning (from scripture of course) please point them out to me and we can further discuss them.

--------------------
i am what "I AM" says i am

Posts: 26 | From: Gainesville, FL | Registered: Aug 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929

Icon 18 posted      Profile for Carol Swenson     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
AMEN Betty! [Prayer] AMEN Caretaker! [Prayer]

God bless us all!

Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Caretaker     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Betty Louise:
I am so happy we can worship any day. Some of the times I feel closest to God is in private prayer in the middle of the day on a week day. Thank God, that He doesn't say come back another day. God never takes a day off and He is willing to listen to our prayers 7 days and 24 hours a day. I would like to think that God loves to hear us worship Him at 2 in the morning or 2 in the afternoon just as much as He desires our worship at Church.
Many a night when I wake up in pain and can't go back to sleep I begin to pray for others I know who are suffering. How blessed we are that God is always willing to listen to the prayers of His children.

I know I can get frustrated when people try to question by faith because I worship on Sunday, BUT for today, I am going to just pray for everyone who comes to this board that God will show His love to each of us in a special way today. God bless and keep us all!
betty

Amen my precious Sister in Christ!!!!

What a Friend we have in Jesus, all our sins and griefs to bear!
What a privilege to carry everything to God in prayer!
O what peace we often forfeit, O what needless pain we bear,
All because we do not carry everything to God in prayer.

Have we trials and temptations? Is there trouble anywhere?
We should never be discouraged; take it to the Lord in prayer.
Can we find a friend so faithful who will all our sorrows share?
Jesus knows our every weakness; take it to the Lord in prayer.

Are we weak and heavy laden, cumbered with a load of care?
Precious Savior, still our refuge, take it to the Lord in prayer.
Do your friends despise, forsake you? Take it to the Lord in prayer!
In His arms He’ll take and shield you; you will find a solace there.

Blessed Savior, Thou hast promised Thou wilt all our burdens bear
May we ever, Lord, be bringing all to Thee in earnest prayer.
Soon in glory bright unclouded there will be no need for prayer
Rapture, praise and endless worship will be our sweet portion there.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Betty Louise
Advanced Member
Member # 7175

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Betty Louise     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I am so happy we can worship any day. Some of the times I feel closest to God is in private prayer in the middle of the day on a week day. Thank God, that He doesn't say come back another day. God never takes a day off and He is willing to listen to our prayers 7 days and 24 hours a day. I would like to think that God loves to hear us worship Him at 2 in the morning or 2 in the afternoon just as much as He desires our worship at Church.
Many a night when I wake up in pain and can't go back to sleep I begin to pray for others I know who are suffering. How blessed we are that God is always willing to listen to the prayers of His children.

I know I can get frustrated when people try to question by faith because I worship on Sunday, BUT for today, I am going to just pray for everyone who comes to this board that God will show His love to each of us in a special way today. God bless and keep us all!
betty

--------------------
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Posts: 5051 | From: Houston, Texas | Registered: May 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Carol Swenson     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
AMEN Caretaker! [thumbsup2]
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36

Icon 15 posted      Profile for Caretaker     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The Word of God declares the Law of Moses fulfilled and obsolete.

The believer is not Lawless for we are under the Law of Christ, the Law of Love and Faith which pre-dates Moses and goes so far beyond the obsolete Ten plus 600+ Commandments given to the Jews on Sinai.

Is it wrong to keep the Sabbath? Absolutely not.

It is wrong to declare that a Believer must keep the Sabbath and that there is more righteousness in doing so. It is also wrong for those who declare that Sunday worship and failure to keep the Sabbath is the Mark of the Beast.

It is a blessing for those who honor God on the Sabbath, or on Sunday or any other day of the week. For Jesus is our Sabbath 24/7.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929

Icon 15 posted      Profile for Carol Swenson     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Galatians 5:13 - 14 (NLT)

13 For you have been called to live in freedom, my brothers and sisters. But don’t use your freedom to satisfy your sinful nature. Instead, use your freedom to serve one another in love. 14 For the whole law can be summed up in this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”

Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
plankeye p
Advanced Member
Member # 8254

Icon 1 posted      Profile for plankeye p     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Betty Louise:
Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster [to bring us] unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

The purpose of the law was to convict us of sin so that we turned to Jesus for salvation. If the law could save, then Jesus would not have died for our sins. Only Jesus walked this earth and kept the law perfectly. The rest of us cannot. We cannot be saved by the law. We must be saved by grace, but if we choose to say one iota of the law can save then we must keep all the law. We either accept salvation by grace or attempt to keep every law. Read the book of Leviticus and see how hard it would be to keep every law.
Promoting works as way to obtain salvation is false Gospel and a lie from the devil.
Salvation by grace is the only way.
betty

Amen sister! I agree with you 100%.

Please don't mis understand me. I am saved because I have faith in Jesus' atoning for my sins. That's it!
Now do I still believe that i'm required to keep the law? Yes. Am capable of keeping the law? Not hardly. That is why my faith is in Jesus. The wages for my sin (transgression of the law) is death. But Jesus paid my penalty with His perfect life. So I accept His sacrifice. But let's say I didn't. Then I have to pay the price for my own sins (transgression of the law). The wages if sin (transgression of the law) is death.

If you agree with that than you agree that the law has not been done away with.

Got people coming through the door
p.i.p.

--------------------
i am what "I AM" says i am

Posts: 26 | From: Gainesville, FL | Registered: Aug 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929

Icon 15 posted      Profile for Carol Swenson     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Galatians 5:18 (NLT)

But when you are directed by the Spirit, you are not under obligation to the law of Moses.

Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Betty Louise
Advanced Member
Member # 7175

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Betty Louise     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster [to bring us] unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

The purpose of the law was to convict us of sin so that we turned to Jesus for salvation. If the law could save, then Jesus would not have died for our sins. Only Jesus walked this earth and kept the law perfectly. The rest of us cannot. We cannot be saved by the law. We must be saved by grace, but if we choose to say one iota of the law can save then we must keep all the law. We either accept salvation by grace or attempt to keep every law. Read the book of Leviticus and see how hard it would be to keep every law.
Promoting works as way to obtain salvation is false Gospel and a lie from the devil.
Salvation by grace is the only way.
betty

--------------------
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Posts: 5051 | From: Houston, Texas | Registered: May 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36

Icon 15 posted      Profile for Caretaker     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by plankeye p:
Hello becauseHelives,
First I would like to commend you on your perseverance on this thread. It seems to me that you could go round and round on this topic forever and no one is willing to change there view. I learned on a different board that for the most part we are not going to change another persons belief. We cant do it. That's the job of the Holy Spirit. Still I admire your perseverance, I just fear you might be wasting your time trying to do what you do not have the power to do.

That being said, I'll throw my two cents in and continue to watch from the sidelines.

I believe that it is absolutely ridiculous for a christian to say the law does not exist or has been done away with or changed.

Why?

Basically if the law does not exist, sin does not exist.

1 John 3:4
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.(KJV)

Everyone who sins breaks the law; in fact, sin is lawlessness.(NIV)

Everyone who sins is breaking God's law, for all sin is contrary to the law of God. (NLT)

My question is: is there still sin in the world today? Of course there is. Is adultery a sin? Of course it is. How do we know? Exodus 20:14

It just does not get any simpler than that.

The law was given by God. Written with His own finger.

Malachi 3:6
For I [am] the LORD, I change not...

Hebrews 13:8
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever

Does God change? No. So why would He change His law? Beats me.

But Jesus nailed the law to the cross. But Heb. 13:8 says He's the same yesterday today and tomorrow.

Matthew 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Jesus did not do away with the (Ten Commandment) law.

Matthew 5:28
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

If anything He "kicked" the law "up a notch".
I won't ask how many of the men in here have committed adultery in his heart today. Maybe thats why we want the law done away with.

Jesus came to fulfill the law.

Luke 4:16
And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read.

Jesus came to fulfill the law.

I'm going to stop now.
Peace
p.i.p.

Before you come out swinging you might try a bit of reading first.

There was God's Law prior to the Mosaic Covenant. Abraham would have been found guilty under the Law of Moses for attempting to sacrifice Issac, but under God's Law it was accounted to him as faith.

The Mosaic Covenant was fulfilled in Christ and was declared obsolete in the Word of God. We are under Christ's Law of Love and not shackled in bondage to a Law that was ONLY for the Children of Israel and ONLY until it was fulfilled by Messiah, including the Ten out of the 600+ Commandments.

Hebrews 8:

[9] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
[10] For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
[11] And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
[12] For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
[13] In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Gal. 3:

[24] Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[25] But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
[26] For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
[27] For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
[28] There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
[29] And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Betty Louise
Advanced Member
Member # 7175

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Betty Louise     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?

--------------------
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Posts: 5051 | From: Houston, Texas | Registered: May 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Betty Louise
Advanced Member
Member # 7175

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Betty Louise     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
This board has never been a Sabbath Worship board. I have been on this board for many many years and I know that David is against promoting Sabbath worship. Yet, ever few years we get people pushing Sabbath Worship.

This board has always promoted pre-trib rapture, but again we get people occasionally who come here for the prime reason to start division.


Making Sabbath worship a requirement for salvation is promoting Judaism and as Paul says: people who do so should be accursed.
betty

--------------------
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

Posts: 5051 | From: Houston, Texas | Registered: May 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
plankeye p
Advanced Member
Member # 8254

Icon 1 posted      Profile for plankeye p     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hello becauseHelives,
First I would like to commend you on your perseverance on this thread. It seems to me that you could go round and round on this topic forever and no one is willing to change there view. I learned on a different board that for the most part we are not going to change another persons belief. We cant do it. That's the job of the Holy Spirit. Still I admire your perseverance, I just fear you might be wasting your time trying to do what you do not have the power to do.

That being said, I'll throw my two cents in and continue to watch from the sidelines.

I believe that it is absolutely ridiculous for a christian to say the law does not exist or has been done away with or changed.

Why?

Basically if the law does not exist, sin does not exist.

1 John 3:4
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.(KJV)

Everyone who sins breaks the law; in fact, sin is lawlessness.(NIV)

Everyone who sins is breaking God's law, for all sin is contrary to the law of God. (NLT)

My question is: is there still sin in the world today? Of course there is. Is adultery a sin? Of course it is. How do we know? Exodus 20:14

It just does not get any simpler than that.

The law was given by God. Written with His own finger.

Malachi 3:6
For I [am] the LORD, I change not...

Hebrews 13:8
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever

Does God change? No. So why would He change His law? Beats me.

But Jesus nailed the law to the cross. But Heb. 13:8 says He's the same yesterday today and tomorrow.

Matthew 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Jesus did not do away with the (Ten Commandment) law.

Matthew 5:28
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

If anything He "kicked" the law "up a notch".
I won't ask how many of the men in here have committed adultery in his heart today. Maybe thats why we want the law done away with.

Jesus came to fulfill the law.

Luke 4:16
And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read.

Jesus came to fulfill the law.

I'm going to stop now.
Peace
p.i.p.

--------------------
i am what "I AM" says i am

Posts: 26 | From: Gainesville, FL | Registered: Aug 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36

Icon 15 posted      Profile for Caretaker     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
We are not under the Ten Commandments and the 600+ other COMMANDMENTS of the Mosaic Covenant, which was nailed to the Cross at Calvary, fulfilled in Christ. Which commands Sabbath keeping.

We ARE under God's eternal Law of Love and Faith which predates Moses and goes so far beyond the Ten Commandments. Jesus is our Sabbath Rest 24/7 and praise the Lord if you honor God on Saturday, Sunday, or any other day of the week. The critical is to truly honor God in your heart and in your life 24/7, not being required to keep some obsolete ordinances which were not given to believers.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929

Icon 19 posted      Profile for Carol Swenson     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
if what you are trying to say were true, then as a believer I can lie, cheat, steal, bear false witness,dishonor my mother and father use Yahweh's name in vain all I want, because the 10 Commandments are abolished.

becauseHElives, this is foolish. How does abiding in Christ as our Sabbath equal all that immoral behavior?
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36

Icon 15 posted      Profile for Caretaker     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:


In this short section, we have seen several dozen commands. Most of them are easy to understand. They are plain, and yet very demanding. They demand all our time, all our emotions, all our thoughts and all our actions. In this life, we will never achieve all they ask.

We might briefly contrast these clear commands with the idea of a Christian Sabbath-day command. The New Testament has space for all sorts of commands, from obvious things to subtle things, but it never commands the Sabbath. This would be odd if the Sabbath were an important command. We find sweeping statements that make the old covenant law obsolete, but unlike other commands, we never find the Sabbath commanded again or made an exception to the rule. Paul and John say a lot about the godly behavior that springs from Christian faith and love, but the Sabbath is simply never commanded.

Paul dealt with numerous problems of Christian living, and he listed numerous sins that characterize people who will not inherit the kingdom of God, but he never mentions Sabbath breaking. In describing sins of the gentiles (Rom. 1), he says nothing about the Sabbath. If the Sabbath is essential, it is certainly surprising that no one is ever criticized for ignoring it.

In the first-century Roman Empire, slaves would have found it particularly difficult to keep the Sabbath. Some of them had unconverted, harsh masters (1 Pet. 2:18). Some parts of the Roman Empire didn't even use a seven-day week. But Peter and Paul did not have to answer questions about how slaves could keep the Sabbath. Why not? Because slaves didn't have to keep the Sabbath. For one thing, first-century Jews did not believe that gentiles had to keep the Sabbath. For another, the decision at Jerusalem, recorded in Acts 15, was that converted, Spirit-filled gentiles were not required to become circumcised and keep the law of Moses. Little is said about the Sabbath because it was not a problem.

Instead, the Sabbath was a neutral matter, neither commanded nor forbidden. People were free to rest on that day if they chose, or to use the day in other ways, as long as they did what they did to the Lord (Rom. 14:5-6).

Likewise, the New Testament does not say that any other day ought to be a day of rest. There is no command to keep the first day, either as a day of meeting or a day of rest. It is neither commanded nor forbidden. Christians are free to work these things out for themselves. We are commanded to assemble together for worship, but we are not commanded when (Heb. 10:25).

The important thing is not which day we observe, but whether we have faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. He is the test commandment, the center of faith, the standard by which we will be judged.


http://www.wcg.org/lit/law/otl/otl13.htm

The Ten Commandments along with the REST of the 600+ commandments of the Mosaic Covenant was fulfilled on Calvary, and is abolished. It was only for Israel and ONLY until Messiah fulfilled them.

Heb. 8:

[8] For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
[9] Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
[10] For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
[11] And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
[12] For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
[13] In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87

Icon 18 posted      Profile for becauseHElives   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
He alone satisfies the requirements of the Law
Yahshua satisfied the blood offerings...the believer no longer has to continually offer up the blood of bulls and goats....but Yahshua has not done away with ....

I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that you present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable to God, which is your reasonable service. 2 And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.


if what you are trying to say were true, then as a believer I can lie, cheat, steal, bear false witness,dishonor my mother and father use Yahweh's name in vain all I want, because the 10 Commandments are abolished.


I am sorry to be the one to tell you but those 10 Commandment are not what was abolished....

what is abolish is the handwriting of ordinances

Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ (Col 2:14-17 KJV).

The handwriting of ordinances -- First of all, we should know that when Christ died on the cross, the Bible says, "Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split" (Matthew 27:51). This shows that Christ's death fulfilled all the sacrifices of lambs or oxen, that had been offered as sin offerings for atonement from Adam sinned. Therefore, the sacrificial system in the earthly sanctuary was no longer necessary, thereby abolishing the ceremonial laws. Thus, the "handwriting of ordinances" which Paul refers to here do not relate to the Ten Commandments which were written by the finger of God (Exodus 31:18) and which cannot be changed (see Exodus 20:1-17), but as the Bible's original wording says, the "handwriting in the decrees" (see also Deuteronomy 31:24). This relates to Col. 2:16, "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ" (KJV). Please read it in the context, and see the meaning in relation to the sacrificial system found in Numbers 28-29. God spoke to Moses, who wrote down these instructions for the priests on how to offer offerings every morning and evening, sabbath, new moon, and feast. These are the "handwriting of ordinances" which is also referred to as the Mosaic Law.

Paul indicated that Christ's crucifixion fulfilled the sacrifice for atonement, so that the Mosaic Law concerning the priesthood, sanctuary service, and circumcision were abolished and nailed to the cross.

This text is parallel to Ephesians 2:15, which says, "Having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace."

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36

Icon 15 posted      Profile for Caretaker     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Amen Sis!!

[thumbsup2]

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929

Icon 15 posted      Profile for Carol Swenson     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
How Is Jesus Our Sabbath Rest?

The key to understanding how Jesus is our Sabbath rest is the Hebrew word sabat, which means “to rest or stop or cease from work.” The origin of the Sabbath goes back to Creation. After creating the heavens and the earth in six days, God “rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had made” (Genesis 2:2). This doesn’t mean that God was tired and needed a rest. We know that God is omnipotent, literally “all-powerful.” He has all the power in the universe, He never tires, and His most arduous expenditure of energy does not diminish His power one bit. So, what does it mean that God rested on the seventh day? Simply that He stopped what He was doing. He ceased from His labors. This is important in understanding the establishment of the Sabbath day and the role of Christ as our Sabbath rest.

God used the example of His resting on the seventh day of Creation to establish the principle of the Sabbath day rest for His people. In Exodus 20:8-11 and Deuteronomy 5:12-15, God gave the Israelites the fourth of His Ten Commandments. They were to “remember” the Sabbath day and “keep it holy.” One day out of every seven, they were to rest from their labors and give the same day of rest to their servants and animals. This was not just a physical rest, but a cessation of laboring. Whatever work they were engaged in was to stop for a full day each week. (Please read our other articles on the Sabbath day, Saturday vs. Sunday and Sabbath keeping to explore this issue further.) The Sabbath day was established so the people would rest from their labors, only to begin again after a one-day rest.

The various elements of the Sabbath symbolized the coming of the Messiah, who would provide a permanent rest for His people. Once again the example of resting from our labors comes into play. With the establishment of the Old Testament Law, the Jews were constantly “laboring” to make themselves acceptable to God. Their labors included trying to obey a myriad of do’s and don’ts of the ceremonial law, the Temple law, the civil law, etc. Of course they couldn’t possibly keep all those laws, so God provided an array of sin offerings and sacrifices so they could come to Him for forgiveness and restore fellowship with Him, but only temporarily. Just as they began their physical labors after a one-day rest, so, too, did they have to continue to offer sacrifices. Hebrews 10:1 tells us that the law “can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship.” But these sacrifices were offered in anticipation of the ultimate sacrifice of Christ on the cross, who ”after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down on the right of God” (Hebrews 10:12). Just as He rested after performing the ultimate sacrifice, He sat down and rested—ceased from His labor of atonement because there was nothing more to be done, ever. Because of what He did, we no longer have to “labor” in law-keeping in order to be justified in the sight of God. Jesus was sent so that we might rest in God and in what He has provided.

Another element of the Sabbath day rest which God instituted as a foreshadowing of our complete rest in Christ is that He blessed it, sanctified it, and made it holy. Here again we see the symbol of Christ as our Sabbath rest—the holy, perfect Son of God who sanctifies and makes holy all who believe in Him. God sanctified Christ, just as He sanctified the Sabbath day, and sent Him into the world (John 10:36) to be our sacrifice for sin. In Him we find complete rest from the labors of our self-effort, because He alone is holy and righteous. “God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God” (2 Corinthians 5:21). We can now cease from our spiritual labors and rest in Him, not just one day a week, but always.

Jesus can be our Sabbath rest in part because He is “Lord of the Sabbath” (Matthew 12:8). As God incarnate, He decides the true meaning of the Sabbath because He created it, and He is our Sabbath rest in the flesh. When the Pharisees criticized Him for healing on the Sabbath, Jesus reminded them that even they, sinful as they were, would not hesitate to pull a sheep out of a pit on the Sabbath. Because He came to seek and save His sheep who would hear His voice (John 10:3,27) and enter into the Sabbath rest He provided by paying for their sins, He could break the Sabbath rules. He told the Pharisees that people are more important than sheep and the salvation He provided was more important than rules. By saying, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath” (Mark 2:27), Jesus was restating the principle that the Sabbath rest was instituted to relieve man of his labors, just as He came to relieve us of our attempting to achieve salvation by our works. We no longer rest for only one day, but forever cease our laboring to attain God’s favor. Jesus is our rest from works now, just as He is the door to heaven, where we will rest in Him forever.

Hebrews 4 is the definitive passage regarding Jesus as our Sabbath rest. The writer to the Hebrews exhorts his readers to “enter in” to the Sabbath rest provided by Christ. After three chapters of telling them that Jesus is superior to the angels and that He is our Apostle and High Priest, he pleads with them to not harden their hearts against Him, as their fathers hardened their hearts against Jehovah in the wilderness. Because of their unbelief, God denied that generation access to the holy land, saying, “They shall not enter into My rest” (Hebrews 3:11). In the same way, the writer to the Hebrews begs them—and us—not to make the same mistake by rejecting God’s Sabbath rest in Jesus Christ. “There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his. Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience” (Hebrews 4:9-11).

There is no other Sabbath rest besides Jesus. He alone satisfies the requirements of the Law, and He alone provides the sacrifice that atones for sin. He is God’s plan for us to cease from the labor of our own works. We dare not reject this one-and-only Way of salvation (John 14:6). God’s reaction to those who choose to reject His plan is seen in Numbers 15. A man was found gathering sticks on the Sabbath day, in spite of God’s plain commandment to cease from all labor on the Sabbath. This transgression was a known and willful sin, done with unblushing boldness in broad daylight, in open defiance of the divine authority. “And Jehovah said to Moses, ‘The man shall surely be put to death’” (v. 35). So it will be to all who reject God’s provision for our Sabbath rest in Christ. “How shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation?” (Hebrews 2:3).

http://www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-Sabbath.html

Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator


 
Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:

Contact Us | Christian Message Board | Privacy Statement



Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.5.0

Christian Chat Network

New Message Boards - Click Here