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Author
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Topic: What does it mean to abide in Christ?
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Keeper
Advanced Member
Member # 7675
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posted
Well, that's better....now behave yourself ! ![[pound]](graemlins/pound.gif)
Posts: 481 | Registered: Apr 2009
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Eden
unregistered
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posted
Keeper wrote quote:
Eden..you are getting outvoted pardner. I don't agree with you either.
Getting outvoted by the triumvirate Found in Him, Carol Swenson, and Keeper is like ... ![[happyhappy]](graemlins/happyhappy.gif)
love, Eden
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Keeper
Advanced Member
Member # 7675
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posted
Eden..you are getting outvoted pardner. I don't agree with you either.
Here is a reason why...You can be saved and not do works, and you can be saved and do works.
If you are not saved, your works are not recorded in the book of life.
abide means: remain, dwell, continue or live in.
Scripture to back this is John 14:10, 15:1-11, 8:31, 15:10 and 1 John 2:6
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Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929
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posted
Found In Him I agree with you.
Where there is life, there is fruit.
John 15
The new community (followers of Christ) has been established and now must bear fruit for God, in contrast to Israel and its fruitlessness . As among the people of Israel, so among Jesus' disciples, there are those who bear fruit and those who do not (v. 2). What is this fruit? Some scholars suggest Jesus is referring to the fruit that comes from bearing witness to Jesus, that is, converts, the fruit of evangelism. Other scholars interpret this fruit as being the ethical virtues characteristic of the Christian life (Galatians 5:22). But something more basic, something that underlies both missionary work and ethical virtues, seems to be intended. The development of the image in the next section (vv. 7-17) suggests that bearing fruit refers to the possession of the divine life itself and especially the chief characteristics of that life, knowledge of God (cf. 15:15) and love (15:9-14). Jesus says when they bear much fruit they demonstrate that they are his disciples (15:8), and elsewhere he states love the evidence that one is a disciple (13:35; 14:21, 23) and is in union with God and with one another (17:21-23). Thus, the image of fruit symbolizes that which is at the heart of both Christian witness and ethics--union with God.
As it is the Father who draws people to Jesus, (6:44), so it is the Father who cuts off those who do not bear fruit and who prunes those who do bear fruit . In a sense, these two activities summarize chapter 13, with the cutting off of Judas (13:21-30) and the cleansing of the disciples (13:10). All judgment is in the hands of the Father, both among Christ's disciples and those outside that community. Indeed, some would see the persons referred to in verse 2 as ones outside the community of Christ. Those who believe that "true disciples are preserved to the end" assume that the disciple in verse 2 is not a true disciple, since a true disciple will persevere to the end. Jesus does not say "those who appear to be in me" but every branch in me.
Since fruit refers to sharing in the life of God and the activities that naturally come to expression when that life is present, this cutting off follows by definition. It is impossible to be united to God and remain ignorant of him and not manifest his own characteristic love . In such a case the branch is cut off and cast out to be burned (v. 6). The reference to being cast out may point to excommunication from the community, but the actual practice in 1 John does not seem to present active excommunication on the part of the community-- the antichrists (those who reject His teaching) seem to leave on their own (1 Jn 2:19).
(From Bible Gateway Commentary)
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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Found in Him
Advanced Member
Member # 7596
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posted
Well I'm sorry Eden that you and I just do not agree on this!
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
Posts: 1503 | Registered: Jan 2009
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Eden
unregistered
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posted
Hi, Found in Him, you wrote quote:
Therefore, abiding in Christ is not a special level of Christian experience, available only to a few; rather, it is the position of all true believers.
The difference between those abiding in Christ and those not abiding in Christ is the difference between the saved and the unsaved.
Hi, Found in Him, I don't think that abiding in Christ or not abiding in Christ" is the difference between the "saved" and the "unsaved".
Rather, I think abiding in Christ or not abiding in Christ is the difference between the "saved with lots of rewards" and the "saved without or with a few rewards".
That is, God commended His love toward us while we were yet sinners, in that Jesus died for us and by merely believing that Jesus died for us, we sinners receive the free gift of eternal life.
Okay, so then a saved sinner life begins. For some reason that I do not understand, the majority of Christians don't do a whole lot more than "go to church on Sunday" after believing that Jesus died in their place, but they are still saved because they believe that Jesus died for them ... but they have few or no REWARDS.
They have "salvation" but "no rewards".
And then there is the other class of saved sinners who for some reason unknown to me continue on in Christ and "abide in Christ" and "begin to bear fruit" of "working in the vineyard" and they "confess their sins before the Lord whereas they never used to do that before" and over time, they become somewhat "sweeter people" and "more honest" people than they were before they were saved.
And most of all, their moment-to-moment lives are "guided by the Holy Spirit" and as a result, overall "they are living a life that works and is abundant in goodnesses and favors from God".
So Found in Him, I think that it is not between the "saved" and the "unsaved", as you proposed, but between the "saved without rewards" and the "saved with rewards".
Because "salvation" is acquired just by believing that God "meant it when God said that Jesus died in my place".
So there are numerous Christians "WITH salvation" but "WITHOUT rewards" and there are some Christians "WITH salvation" and "WITH rewards", in my opinion.
love, Eden
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MentorsRiddle
Advanced Member
Member # 2108
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posted
That was a bery good poem ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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With you I rise,
In you I sleep,
kneeling down I kiss your feet,
Grace abounds upon me now,
I once was lost
but now I'm found.
The gift of God dwells within,
To this love I now give in.
Posts: 1337 | From: Arkansas | Registered: Sep 2003
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Keeper
Advanced Member
Member # 7675
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posted
Bery quickly, they figured me out,
I was without Jesus, and was in doubt.
My fruit was there but note was taken,
For it was not good, it was just makin.
My fruit is good, but a fruit of labor,
But it was the type you do for a neighbor.
Posts: 481 | Registered: Apr 2009
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MentorsRiddle
Advanced Member
Member # 2108
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posted
I think I've started something.
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With you I rise,
In you I sleep,
kneeling down I kiss your feet,
Grace abounds upon me now,
I once was lost
but now I'm found.
The gift of God dwells within,
To this love I now give in.
Posts: 1337 | From: Arkansas | Registered: Sep 2003
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Keeper
Advanced Member
Member # 7675
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posted
Bery Quickly....Gotta watch that fast food. When you partake of it you look and feel bad.
I learned some time ago that the subject here is so true. In my simple mind I had to figure a way to never forget. Whatever the situation I tell myself "It's all about Jesus" and that works for everything. I think the Spirit goes along with that.
Good posts. And I read them Bery Quickly too.
Posts: 481 | Registered: Apr 2009
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MentorsRiddle
Advanced Member
Member # 2108
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posted
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With you I rise,
In you I sleep,
kneeling down I kiss your feet,
Grace abounds upon me now,
I once was lost
but now I'm found.
The gift of God dwells within,
To this love I now give in.
Posts: 1337 | From: Arkansas | Registered: Sep 2003
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Found in Him
Advanced Member
Member # 7596
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posted
hehehe.. good one Carol! ![[roll on floor]](graemlins/6.gif)
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
Posts: 1503 | Registered: Jan 2009
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MentorsRiddle
Advanced Member
Member # 2108
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posted
quote:
There are proofs that one abides in Christ
Great post!
Some of those proofs are the fruit of our labour.
Do we produce good fruit or bad?
Those who do not abide in Christ will be noticible bery quickly by those who do.
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With you I rise,
In you I sleep,
kneeling down I kiss your feet,
Grace abounds upon me now,
I once was lost
but now I'm found.
The gift of God dwells within,
To this love I now give in.
Posts: 1337 | From: Arkansas | Registered: Sep 2003
| IP: Logged |
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Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929
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posted
Good post Found In Him!
Most of us are preoccupied with our performance as Christians, rather than being occupied with the person of Christ. We are more interested in the results we achieve than in simply resting in Him—abiding in Him. We want to appropriate His power, but fail to appreciate His person.
Abiding stresses the source of our life and strength, but we frequently ignore the person of Christ to seek the product of our union with Him.
Abiding is our obligation; fruitfulness is God’s concern. The True Vine is the Author, the Source and the Finisher of our faith. We should be seeking His fellowship, and leaving the fruit to Him.
That is the lesson which we need to learn today. We have become preoccupied with results. We want to have guidance, but we ignore the Guide. We seek God as the Giver, rather than the Gift, the Rewarder rather than the Reward. We seek His blessings rather than see Him as the Blessing.
There is no special formula or technique by which fruitfulness can be attained. It results from merely abiding. Abiding in its simplest terms is trusting—and obeying.
http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=623
Matthew 6:33 (KJV)
But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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Found in Him
Advanced Member
Member # 7596
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posted
"What does it mean to abide in Christ?"
Answer: To “abide” is to live, continue, or remain; so, to abide in Christ is to live in Him or remain in Him. When a person is saved, he or she is described as being “in Christ” (Romans 8:1; 2 Corinthians 5:17), held secure in a permanent relationship (John 10:28-29). Therefore, abiding in Christ is not a special level of Christian experience, available only to a few; rather, it is the position of all true believers. The difference between those abiding in Christ and those not abiding in Christ is the difference between the saved and the unsaved.
Abiding in Christ is taught in 1 John 2:5-6, where it is synonymous with “knowing” Christ (verses 2 and 3). Later in the same chapter, John equates “remaining” in the Father and the Son with having the promise of eternal life (verses 24 and 25).
The phrase “abiding in Christ” pictures an intimate, close relationship, and not just a superficial acquaintance. In John 15:4-7, Jesus tells His disciples that having salvation is essential, using the picture of branches united to a vine. Without that vital union with Christ which salvation provides, there can be no life and no productivity. Elsewhere, the Bible likens this union to that of a head and a body (Colossians 1:18).
There are proofs that one abides in Christ (i.e., proofs that one is truly saved and not just pretending). These proofs include obedience to Christ’s commands (John 15:10; 1 John 3:24); following Jesus’ example (1 John 2:6); living free from habitual sin (1 John 3:6); and the awareness of a divine presence within one’s life (1 John 4:13).
http://www.gotquestions.org/abide-in-Christ.html
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~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24
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