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Topic: Who is Elihu?
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bluefrog
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posted
LARRY...Thanks Pardner.
I hope you took it the way I meant it when I pulled your chain (so to speak).
It was an interesting study and may not be over yet. Nevertheless, we appreciate you and your interests.
I have been researching a subject for a few years that I may introduce too, but I still don't know if I know the answer or not.
Anyway, HUGS !
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Caretaker
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Larry Parker:
To All,
Bluefrog said, “LARRY...Awright, when you started this you said you would let us know what the deal was. I’m waiting.”
So here it is. The Elihu article was the result of my studies in the book of Job. I posted it to encourage you to look at the book in a different light, and also to see what kind of response I would get.
I don’t expect, nor do I ask, everyone to agree with my conclusions. I have been wrong in the past and change my mind from time to time as I study the Bible. I’ve been a Christian for over fifty years and am still growing in Christ.
You have been thinking about the Bible and that gives me joy. You have also given me answers to think about. You are my brothers and sisters in Christ and I love every one of you. I may not meet you here, on earth, but I will rejoice with you one day in heaven.
Blessings, Larry
Thank you for the opportunity to examine the Word in the Book of Job. It was an interesting and worthwhile study, with many great points illuminated by all.
One needs to examine within not only the context of a particular passage, but of the Word as a whole.
2 Tim. 3:
14: But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15: And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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Larry Parker
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posted
To All,
Bluefrog said, “LARRY...Awright, when you started this you said you would let us know what the deal was. I’m waiting.”
So here it is. The Elihu article was the result of my studies in the book of Job. I posted it to encourage you to look at the book in a different light, and also to see what kind of response I would get.
I don’t expect, nor do I ask, everyone to agree with my conclusions. I have been wrong in the past and change my mind from time to time as I study the Bible. I’ve been a Christian for over fifty years and am still growing in Christ.
You have been thinking about the Bible and that gives me joy. You have also given me answers to think about. You are my brothers and sisters in Christ and I love every one of you. I may not meet you here, on earth, but I will rejoice with you one day in heaven.
Blessings, Larry
Posts: 22 | From: Barstow, California | Registered: Nov 2008
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Michael Harrison
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posted
Yea! Larry, I will assert that you make the mistake of thinking Elihu is speaking of himself. I do not know why you come to that conclusion>
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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oneinchrist
Advanced Member
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posted
Larry,
I do believe there is another option other than that Elihu is the pre-incarnate Jesus or Elihu is a liar.
In my bible, Job Chapter 36 is under the heading "Elihu proclaims Gods Goodness". The other option that it doesnt appear has been considered is that Elihu may have been talking about God in this verse you speak of in Job 36:4........................
"For truly my words are not false; One who is perfect in knowledge is with you".
It is interesting to note that the word "my" is not capitalized (as it appears that Elihu is referring to himself) but the word One, on the other hand, is capitalized(which would seem to indicate that Elihu is speaking about God).
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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Eden
unregistered
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posted
Larry Parker wrote quote:
The word “perfect” in the book of Job is translated from the Hebrew word “tamiym.” It does mean Integrity but “tamiym” also includes, "without blemish, complete, full, perfect, without spot, undefiled." Can any of us, other than Christ, claim to be “tamiym?”
Regarding the part I bolded, yes, some of us CAN claim to be "tamiym".
Genesis 25:27
And the boys grew: and Esau was a cunning hunter, a man of the field; and Jacob was a plain man, dwelling in tents.
The word translated "plain" in the English KJV is the Hebrew word "tamiym" or "tam", for short.
And there are others:
Job1
1 There was a man...whose name was Job, and that man was perfect {Hebrew, tam} and upright, one that feared God, and one who avoided evil.
Psalm 37
37 Mark the perfect {Hebrew, tam} man, and behold the upright; for the end of that man is peace.
Prov. 29
10 The bloodthirsty hate the upright {Hebrew, tam}.
Cant. 5:2 ...Open to me, my love, my dove, my undefiled {Hebrew, tam}...
So let me repeat what you said, Larry Parker quote:
The word “perfect” in the book of Job is translated from the Hebrew word “tamiym.” It does mean Integrity but “tamiym” also includes, "without blemish, complete, full, perfect, without spot, undefiled." Can any of us, other than Christ, claim to be “tamiym?”
The answer is, "yes we can".
love, Edenstein the Ephraimite, von ze Bilhah or ze Zilpah
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bluefrog
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posted
LARRY...Awright, when you started this you said you would let us know what the deal was.
I'm waiting.
rivet
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Caretaker
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posted
It is imperative to not just take one word or verse and interpret it out of context. The evidence is very thin that Elihu was in fact a Theophony.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
No man has seen God at any time. (John 1:18, Exodus 33:20, John 5:37, 1 John 4:12). That is, no man has seen the Omni-Present Spirit of God that even the heaven of heavens cannot contain. However, God did manifest Himself as a Theophony or Christophony in the Old Testament through His creation. The angel of the LORD or angel of God as He was sometimes called was a Theophony proclaiming the Word of God among God's people. The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob manifested in the burning bush to Moses. (Exodus 3:1-4). The bush was not God, but temporarily housed the Spirit or Word of God to Moses as the Jehovah LORD. If God had housed permanently in this bush, we would all be worshipping the burning bush as God today. But as a temporary manifestation of God or as a theophony, God spoke to Moses out of the burning bush which was a type of Christ that would be of the lowliest creation, the bramble bush being a form of creation. "And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM." (Exodus 3:14a). The I AM is the God of glory, the one and only Spirit of God. Another example is that of Jacob that wrestled a man, the angel of the LORD, all night. This angel had substance as a man and the wrestling match was on. This was not a play act, but was in reality a full wrestling match. Jacob prevailed and had power with God as a prince. Jacob believed that he had seen God face to face and lived, which no other man had done. "And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved." (Genesis 32:30). This was a Theophony or Christophony as a temporary manifestation of God.
Was Jacob mistaken? Did he or did he not see God and live? Yes, he did see God face to face as the angel of the LORD, as a man in the form of a Theophony. "Man" used here is "'iysh" which is man extant; i.e. a certain man which points to Christ. This is the man from heaven, not an "adam" or merely an "enowsh", but an "iysh" as a type of Christ. This is the LORD Jehovah in a temporary manifestation as a man that literally wrestled with Jacob all night long. Referencing this to Jesus as the Word: "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven." (John 3:13). Jesus as the Spirit of God, the Word took on a body of flesh in the incarnation as God manifested in the flesh. Look who spake to Jacob. "He found him in Bethel, and there he spake with us; Even the LORD God of hosts; the LORD is his memorial." (Hosea 12:3-5). Yes, Jacob did see the Word as the Expression of God as a man or the angel of the LORD in a Theophony, but he did not see the Omni-present Spirit of God. There are many other occasions in the Old Testament that people saw a Theophony or Christophony as a temporary manifestation God as a man or angel.
Theophony
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Job 33:
1: Wherefore, Job, I pray thee, hear my speeches, and hearken to all my words.
2: Behold, now I have opened my mouth, my tongue hath spoken in my mouth.
3: My words shall be of the uprightness of my heart: and my lips shall utter knowledge clearly.
4: The Spirit of God hath made me, and the breath of the Almighty hath given me life.
5: If thou canst answer me, set thy words in order before me, stand up.
6: Behold, I am according to thy wish in God's stead: I also am formed out of the clay.
Job 36:
1: Elihu also proceeded, and said,
2: Suffer me a little, and I will shew thee that I have yet to speak on God's behalf.
3: I will fetch my knowledge from afar, and will ascribe righteousness to my Maker.
4: For truly my words shall not be false: he that is perfect in knowledge is with thee.
Jesus was not created but was the Creator:
Col. 1:16
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Job 36:4
Perfect
Strong's Number: 08549 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
~ymt from (08552)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Tamiym TWOT - 2522d
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
taw-meem' Adjective
Definition
1. complete, whole, entire, sound
1. complete, whole, entire
2. whole, sound, healthful
3. complete, entire (of time)
4. sound, wholesome, unimpaired, innocent, having integrity
5. what is complete or entirely in accord with truth and fact (neuter adj/subst)
Job 38:
1: Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
2: Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?
3: Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me.
4: Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
5: Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6: Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
7: When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
The LORD spoke to Job out of the whirlwind.
Elihu was a prophet of God and spoke the truth of God perfectly.
2 Peter 1:
21: For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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Larry Parker
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The Beauty of Holiness 777,
The word “perfect” in the book of Job is translated from the Hebrew word “tamiym.” It does mean Integrity but “tamiym” also includes, "without blemish, complete, full, perfect, without spot, undefiled." Can any of us, other than Christ, claim to be “tamiym?”
Blessings, Larry
Posts: 22 | From: Barstow, California | Registered: Nov 2008
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Eden
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posted
Hi, TheBeautyofHoliness777, you wrote quote:
Larry after reading your post and replies I decided to do more research on Elihu for there was something about him that stood out in his sayings to Job. He was young yet he had much wisdom and understanding about the attributes of God. The other three had to sit silent and listen to him.
I liked that paragraph.
love, Edenstein the Ephraimite
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The Beauty of Holiness777
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posted
"Perfect" in this case means a man of integrity in sentiments is with thee.
Elihu was talking about himself as opposed to the dishonest reasonings of the others that spoke against Job.
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In God I'am Complete.
I am a "Spiritual Being" living in a physical body.
{Prayer - a force that reaches people and places when we can't}
Posts: 192 | From: God's Universe | Registered: Sep 2008
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Larry Parker
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The Beauty of Holiness 777,
You said,
“In answer to your question no Elihu was not a liar nor was he the pre-incarnate Christ. Hebrews 1:1 says; God, who at sundry (different) times, and in diver manners (different ways) spoke in times past to the fathers by the prophets.”
If, as you say, Elihu was not a liar. How can he say “One who is perfect in knowledge is with you." and "Truly I am as your spokesman before God..." and not be pre-incarnate Christ? Your Hebrews quote only says that God speaks to the fathers by the prophets, it does not answer my question.
Yes God speaks through man but He also said in Matt. 19:17 “…No one is good but One, that is, God.” If no one is good but God than it would be correct to say that no man is perfect but God. Therefore, if Elihu were only a prophet he could not say “One who is perfect in knowledge is with you" and not be corrected by God.
Blessings, Larry
Posts: 22 | From: Barstow, California | Registered: Nov 2008
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bluefrog
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posted
Usually in passages like this there is a message. I can't figure out what the message is.
Duhhhh
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The Beauty of Holiness777
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posted
Larry wrote
quote:
To all,
Elihu said, One who is perfect in knowledge is with you." and "Truly I am as your spokesman before God..."
Only God is perfect. Only Jesus is our mediator before God.
That makes Elihu a liar or pre-incarnate Christ. If he is a liar, why didn't God rebuke him as he did Job and his three 'comforters'.
Larry after reading your post and replies I decided to do more research on Elihu for there was something about him that stood out in his sayings to Job. He was young yet he had much wisdom and understanding about the attributes of God. The other three had to sit silent and listen to him.
After doing more research on Elihu who was a descendant of Abraham who also came from the land of Ur as did Abraham; it seems Elihu was a "young prophet" and he knew about the covenant of Abraham.
In answer to your question no Elihu was not a liar nor was he the pre-incarnate Christ.
Hebrews 1:1 says;
God, who at sundry (different) times, and in diver manners (different ways) spoke in times past to the fathers by the prophets.
Michael Harrison wrote :
quote:
The Spirit was not "in" prophets of old, but was on, or upon them.
This too is true. Elihu was speaking to Job under the inspiration of God. He was a man or prophet used by God to prepare God's own revelation of Himself to Job.
You have given more enlighten on the book of Job and on Elihu. Thanks ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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In God I'am Complete.
I am a "Spiritual Being" living in a physical body.
{Prayer - a force that reaches people and places when we can't}
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Michael Harrison
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posted
1Jn 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
This is a paramount reason why I believe in the KJV. The key phrase in this sentence is, "is come." This translates into understanding that HE 'is' come, in the body of Christ, which is the church of believers. So, church is a corporate entity and is made up of individuals. Therefore, Jesus Christ 'is' come insomuch as He is in the individual believer, and therefore corporately, in the church which is made up of individuals. This is true to a lesser or greater extent according to the faith and understanding of the believer, and therefore the church, corporately. And that reality is based, quite simply, on the understanding that:
Joh 3:30 He must increase, but I must decrease.
...for it to be properly realized.
The Spirit was not 'in' prophets of old, but was on, or upon them. Nevertheless, God was manifest to His people by His Spirit, and that will have been, then as now, according to faith, and yieldedness. Therefore the person of Christ may have been manifested to Job through Elihu in such manner. In other words, the personality of God worked through Elihu. What a blessing to discover. It is as stated by this verse:
Gal 4:7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
Notice that it says that we are an heir of God. In the worldly sense this would imply that we are heirs of what He hath! But in the spiritual, we are heirs of "Who HE IS," as well. And "Who HE IS," is what HE does.
Amen! To Him be the glory for ever and ever.
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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Larry Parker
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posted
To all,
Elihu said, “One who is perfect in knowledge is with you.” and “Truly I am as your spokesman before God...”
Only God is perfect. Only Jesus is our mediator before God.
That makes Elihu either a liar or pre-incarnate Christ. If he is a liar, why didn’t God rebuke him as He did Job and his three ‘comforters’?
God bless,
Larry
Posts: 22 | From: Barstow, California | Registered: Nov 2008
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Eden
unregistered
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posted
Michael Harrison wrote quote:
What purpose would it accomplish for Elihu to be Christ incarnate? Yet, I could consider it true to the extent that the Apostle Paul was Christ incarnate.
The Lord Jesus will ALWAYS be the ONLY ONE who holds the position of Only Begotten Son.
But secondly, the Lord Jesus also became the First Begotten Son.
What is the difference between being The Only Begotten Son and The First Begotten Son?
As The Only Begotten Son, our relationship to Jesus is that to us, Jesus is the Son of God:
John 1:18
No man has seen God at any time, but the only begotten Son who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.
Mark 3:11
And unclean spirits, when they saw Him, fell down before Him, and cried, saying, You are the Son of God.
But as First Begotten Son, Jesus is the first among many brothers and sisters and so under this title, we relate to Jesus as our BROTHER and NOT as our God:
Revelation 1:5
And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. To Him who loved us, and washed us from our sins in His own blood.
The point of all this is that if Elihu was Christ Incarnate, that would be TOTALLY different than for instance, CHRIST BEING FORMED IN PAUL. Magnitudes bigger. Epiphany bigger.
But when you asked "what the purpose would be of such an appearance", there would seem to have been little purpose merely "to convince some nice guy like Job of better things than the 3 had told him".
There would be NO NEED to send the PRESIDENT OF THE WHOLE WORLD to do that job for Job, would there? But in any case, Elihu was there and I vote that he is the son of Barachel the Buzite:
Job 32:6
And Elihu the son of Barachel the Buzite answered and said, I am young, and you are very old; therefore I was afraid, and did not dare show you my opinion.
An epiphany is not afraid and an epiphany dares to give His opinion, for therefore He came.
love, Eden
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The Beauty of Holiness777
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You have the right to your conclusion (even though it may make one wonder) but, it just don't add up with scripture. When Jesus came to the World He came as "Jesus" and that was the only name HE came in. Elihu was just an messenger (not sent by God) but a man (used) by God to prepare God's own revelation of Himself to Job. (He was in the right place at the right time and God used him for he stood up for the righteousness and justice of God).
Elihu is also said to have been a distant kinsman of David. He was a young man of coverage and conviction that was more concern about speaking for God than pleasing men.
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In God I'am Complete.
I am a "Spiritual Being" living in a physical body.
{Prayer - a force that reaches people and places when we can't}
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Michael Harrison
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What purpose would it accomplish for Elihu to be Christ incarnate? Yet, I could consider it true to the extent that the Apostle Paul was Christ incarnate. Yet, Paul was Paul. He just had Christ in his person - through faith. That is exactly how he was an 'ambassador' for Christ. It was 'by' Christ. More accurately, he was so by the 'faith of' Christ, operating in Paul.
The Old Testament is full of ambassadors. The prophets were so. King David was. Heretofore, that is to say, back in the 'old' days, only "The Angle of the Lord," was observed on earth, but not Christ 'incarnate'. I think he was perhaps the metaphor of Christ, only the term metaphor is not strong enough here. For a metaphor is something equal to, but not the thing itself. But with Paul, we see Paul, but he was the 'interface' with Jesus. That is how closely they are related.
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oneinchrist
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posted
Hi Larry,
"His Name shall be Jesus" said God the Father. I personally do not believe that Jesus would have shown up under any other name. In the old testament it is also thought that Jesus could have been the High Priest Melchisidek (with no name) that came to Abraham with the bread and wine offering and it is also thought that Jesus could have been the fourth image(with no name) seen in the fiery furnace by the King in the book of Daniel.
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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Larry Parker
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posted
Each year when I read the book of Job I have wondered about Elihu. He was not included among Job’s friends in the second chapter: “Now when Job’s three friends heard of all this adversity that had come upon him, each one came from his own place; Eliphaz the Temanite, Bildad the Shuhite, and Zophar the Naamathite. For they had made an appointment together to come and mourn with him, and to comfort him.”2 If Elihu was one of Job’s friends, why was he not included in their appointment to come together? In fact, the Bible doesn’t mention Elihu at all until he begins his speech to Job and his friends, in chapter thirty-two. There is no additional reference to him after he is finished. Questions flooded my mind. “Who is Elihu? Where did he come from? Why didn’t Job give a rebuttal to his speech as he did his three ‘other’ friends? Was everything Elihu said correct? If anything he said was untrue, why didn’t God rebuke him as He did Job and his three ‘comforters’?”
In order to understand Elihu and who he is we must first be reminded of the fact that Jesus Christ incarnate, in the New Testament, is in fact God Himself revealed in the flesh. “Jesus said to him, ... He who has seen Me has seen the Father.…”3 When the disciples were with Jesus they were face to face with God. However, in the Old Testament before Jesus’ incarnation, there was a problem. God will not manifest Himself to humans in all of His glory. His glory is so intense we would be vaporized. He said: “’...You cannot see My face; for no man shall see Me, and live.’”4 Therefore, each time God appeared to a man face to face, before Jesus’ incarnation, He appeared in a human body as Jesus Christ preincarnate. Theologians call that materialization a theophany (manifestation of God to a person). When Jacob, the son of Isaac says, “...’For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved’”5 it is clear to me that he had wrestled with preincarnate Jesus.
HE IS ONE WHO IS PERFECT
One year as I was reading through the book of Job once more, the following verse of Elihu’s speech seemed to jump out at me. “For truly my words are not false; One who is perfect in knowledge is with you.”6 I thought, “Only the man Christ Jesus could say he is perfect in knowledge and not be corrected by anyone.” “Could Elihu be preincarnate Jesus?” I looked back at Job 33:6 “Truly I am as your spokesman before God...” Well, that sure seemed to support the idea. The Bible says, “For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus, who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”7 Could I be onto something? However, when I read that Elihu was the son of Barachel the Buzite, of the family of Ram,8 I had second thoughts. If his father and family line were named, how could he be the preincarnate Messiah?
I decided to look up Elihu’s father and family line in Strong’s Hebrew lexicon. To my excitement I found that the name Barachel means God blesses. Barachel is only mentioned in the Bible as the father of Elihu. And Buzite has no meaning other than he is an ancestor of Elihu. The family of Ram means high or exalted in the lineage of David. It looked promising as I decided to sleep on it. During the night I awoke and began thinking about Elihu once again. The thought came to me that I had not looked up the meaning of the name Elihu itself and I should. I went back to sleep determined to do so first thing in the morning. When I did I could hardly contain myself as I read from the Hebrew lexicon, “Elihu = He is our God.” I also realized that when Elihu says he “…is perfect in knowledge”9 and that God is, “…perfect in knowledge.”10 Elihu, by inference, is telling Job and his friends that he is equal with God. When I inserted the definitions instead of the words for Elihu, Barachel, Buzite, and Ram, I came up with, He is my God, the Son of God blesses, from the family of high or exalted in the lineage of David. To me, that makes Elihu, Jesus Christ preincarnate. I realized that some Bible translators must also be aware of that fact when I read Job 36:4 in, The New King James Version.
The word “One” in that verse (referring to Elihu who is speaking) is capitalized.11 Before I could be 100 percent sure of who Elihu was however, I had to deal with four other statements in the book of Job, which at first seem to conflict with my new insight:
1. “For I do not know how to flatter, Else my Maker would soon take me away.”12
2. “The Spirit of God has made me, And the breath of the Almighty gives me life.”13
3. “...I also have been formed out of clay.”14
4. “…I was afraid, And dared not declare my opinion to you.’”15
If Elihu has a Maker, how could he be Jesus, who has no beginning? How could he be made of clay and given life from the breath of the Almighty? The answer is in the fact that Elihu (preincarnate Jesus) was talking about His incarnation when He referred to His Maker forming and breathing life into His body. God the Father made His Son Jesus a body through the impregnation of Mary by His Holy Spirit. He breathed life into that body, just as He does for every human. (In this case, His son Jesus.) If Elihu said he was afraid, how could he be Jesus in whom there is no fear? I needed to see what the Bible had to say about being afraid. In all of the Old Testament, twenty different Hebrew words were translated into the English word afraid, for a total of one hundred and fifty times. They range in description from just being disturbed or alarmed, to having great terror. The word used in Job 32:6 is “zachal” (zaw-khal) and is used only once in the Bible. It more correctly means to shrink back. Elihu was not saying that he was afraid, as we know the word, only that he “held back speaking” because of his youthful appearance.
HE DID NOT WANT TO RAISE FEAR
Jesus, preincarnate, appearing in the story of Job, would probably look the same as Jesus, incarnate, when He was with the disciples. Therefore, it would make sense that He would appear as a young man, just as He describes Himself. His appearance was such as not to arise fear in Job or his friends.16 When Elihu tells them that God will provide a Mediator and a ransom to restore His righteousness in them, He was talking about Himself.17
In chapters thirty-two through thirty-six, Elihu expresses anger at Job for justifying himself rather than God. His wrath was also against Job’s three friends because they had found no answer, and yet had condemned him. Elihu challenges Job to debate, lists his complaints and answers them. (All this is similar to the way God speaks to Job and his friends from the whirlwind.) After having told them he is their spokesman before God, Elihu also tells them he is perfect in knowledge and that God is disciplining Job. I never could understand, until now, how Job could say “...now my eye sees you.”18 He did not just hear the disembodied voice of God speaking to him “out of the whirlwind”19 he actually saw Him, as Elihu.
COULD IT HAVE HAPPENED THIS WAY?
The following scenario is admittedly hypothetical. It is based on what I have said in the above and on the following facts gleaned from other scriptures. “...Jesus... was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and His clothes became as white as the light,”20 “...And He [preincarnate Jesus] did a wondrous thing while Manoah and His wife [Samson's parents] looked on: as the flame went up toward heaven from the altar, it happened that the Angel of the Lord ascended in the flame of the altar.…”21 – And now, let me take a few lines to speculate.
Job had been drained of his verbal combating with Eliphaz, Bildad, and Zophar. He didn’t know how to convince them he was innocent. They simply refused to believe how God would allow him to suffer so much unless he had committed some heinous sin. Wearily, he raised his head to the sky as if imploring The Almighty to give him the right words to say next. Out of the corner of his eye, a young man stood to his feet. The belabored patriarch turned to look. He appeared to be about thirty years old. Job was puzzled, he didn’t remember seeing him arrive at the gathering. For days now Job had been arguing with his friends. How could he have missed noticing him before? Perhaps it was because he had blended in with the many servants attending to his friends. Who was he? What could he possibly say to the group assembled there, who were obviously many years his senior? Would his words make any difference?
When Elihu stood to his feet, he fixed his eyes on Job. There was sternness and yet strangely, compassion, coupled with great love in his gaze. Job could actually feel it. It was as if warm oil began flowing from his head to his feet. He felt an extraordinary quietness settle over him. The pain in his body, which hadn’t let up for so long it was as if he had always had it, began to leave. With great relief from his suffering, and puzzlement, he listened to what the young Elihu had to say.
“It is because I am young in years and you are very old that I held back speaking until now…”22 With that introduction Elihu tells Eliphaz, Bildad, and Zophar, he is angry with them because they had condemned Job without finding an answer to his tribulations. He tells the patriarch, Job, his anger is aroused against him as well, because he had justified himself rather than God. After he challenges Job to debate, quotes his complaints and answers them, Elihu prepares Job and his friends for what is about to happen, by telling them, “Hear attentively the thunder of His [God’s] voice, And the rumbling that comes from His mouth.”23
When Elihu reminds Job and his friends of the greatness of God, his face begins to take on a strange glow that grows brighter as he continues. By the time he points out that God is perfect in knowledge, his whole body is shining. Job and his friends begin to realize they have been, without knowing it, in the presence of God. They can’t keep their eyes off Elihu (Jesus) as He slowly begins to ascend from the ground. A great wind starts to whirl around Him as He becomes brighter and brighter, and rises higher and higher. To the amazement of the group of men, Eleihu now shines brighter then the afternoon sun. Fear creeps into their hearts as they turn their eyes away from the intense light. They knew, without doubt, they had been looking into the face of God Himself. Concluding Elihu’s speech about God, Jesus preincarnate, speaks the words from Job 37:24: “Therefore men fear Him; He shows no partiality to any who are wise of heart.”
The wind around Elihu has now become a great whirlwind, and He (Jesus/God) speaks, now in the first person from within its core. “WHO IS THIS WHO DARKENS COUNSEL BY WORDS WITHOUT KNOWLEDGE?”24 “WHERE WERE YOU WHEN I LAID THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE EARTH? TELL ME, IF YOU HAVE UNDERSTANDING.”25 God goes on, and continues to lecture until Job repents. “I have heard of You by the hearing of the ear, but now my eye sees You. Therefore I abhor myself, and repent in dust and ashes.”26 God instructs Eliphaz, Bildad, and Zophar, who had backed off, cowering in the distance, to offer a burnt offering and ask Job to pray for them. Notice! God makes no mention of Elihu, nor would He, for it is He, Elihu/Jesus/ the Lord God who is speaking.
I would love to hear your comments on my conclusions. What do you think?
God bless all,
Larry
Posts: 22 | From: Barstow, California | Registered: Nov 2008
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bluefrog
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Who is Elihu ?
He was a man who liked to talk a lot.
He spent a good while telling Job how it was.
His name means: God is Jehovah; or, my God is He.
Maybe he was a congressman.
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The Beauty of Holiness777
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Unlike Job's other three antagonizing friends which were older than Elihu he spoke with more wisdom and understanding than the rest. It's amazing how Job listen to him and didn't argue with his words as he did the other three.
Elihu talked more about God's Providence, and his speech contradicted what the other three had stated; that Job was being punished because of sin. The other three had no real answers to Job's problem, they only caused more misery.
Elihu spoke with truth showing no favor to anyone showing that even the aged are not always wise.
Another amazing factor is how God's angry was kindled against Job's three friends for they spoke of the things of God that was not right; and it was Job who had to pray for them for God's mercy. But Elihu's name was not mention for he talked only of the justice and righteousness of the Almighty God asking Job to wait on God.
Though He slay me yet will I trust Him. (Job 13:15)
Job 23:8-10
Behold, I go forward, but I cannot perceive Him;
On the left hand, where He doth work, but I cannot behold Him;
He hideth himself on the right hand, that I cannot see Him
But He knoweth the way that I take.
The book of Job is awesome and a great one to go by in times of trouble, tests, and trials.
Just because we are in the "Will of God" doesn't mean we will never be in the storms of life. He is our anchor and we must trust Him inspite of.
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In God I'am Complete.
I am a "Spiritual Being" living in a physical body.
{Prayer - a force that reaches people and places when we can't}
Posts: 192 | From: God's Universe | Registered: Sep 2008
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The Beauty of Holiness777
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Elihu was a descendent from Nahor who is said to be somehow related to the linkage of Abraham.
Elihu- meaning "My God is Yahweh or He is my God who does not change." He was a son of Barachel was was a descendent of Buz, Buz was the younger brother of Uz and both wer sons of Nahor (Abraham's brother). Which if one studied the linkage of Job would have probably made him be in some way related to Job as well.
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In God I'am Complete.
I am a "Spiritual Being" living in a physical body.
{Prayer - a force that reaches people and places when we can't}
Posts: 192 | From: God's Universe | Registered: Sep 2008
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MentorsRiddle
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You have peaked my interest.
I must admit, I have not paied attention to that name before, which supprises me.
here is what I found on him:
1. Elihu, son of Barachel the Buzite, of the family of Ram
From the words Elihu spoke, it almost sounds as though he is a messenger from God. Which I know is not the case... but that is just how it sounds.
Please enlighten me a little, if you may, as to who this character is and the role he plays.
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With you I rise,
In you I sleep,
kneeling down I kiss your feet,
Grace abounds upon me now,
I once was lost
but now I'm found.
The gift of God dwells within,
To this love I now give in.
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Larry Parker
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When Job suffered the loss of his children, wealth and health, three of his friends heard about it and came to comfort him (Job 1:11). Eliphaz, Bildad and Shuhite are called Job’s three comforters. However, rather than comfort him they each accused Job of sins that resulted in his suffering. After their accusations and Job’s rebuttals, a forth man, Elihu, spoke up. You will be surprised to fine that a close look at the scriptures clearly shows us who this forth man was. I’ll let you know in farther postings. Meanwhile does anyone out there know the answer?
Posts: 22 | From: Barstow, California | Registered: Nov 2008
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