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Author
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Topic: What is the soul?
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Carol Swenson
Admin
Member # 6929
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posted
At death the souls of believers (i.e., the believers themselves, as ongoing persons) are made perfect in holiness and enter into the worshiping life of heaven (Heb. 12:22-24). In other words, they are glorified. Some, not believing this, posit a purgatorial discipline after death that is really a further stage of sanctification, progressively purifying the heart and refining the character in preparation for the vision of God. But this belief is neither scriptural nor rational, for if at Christ’s coming saints alive on earth will be perfected morally and spiritually in the moment of their bodily transformation (1 Cor. 15:51-54), it is only natural to suppose that the same is done for each believer in the moment of death, when the mortal body is left behind. Others posit unconsciousness (soul sleep) between death and resurrection, but Scripture speaks of conscious relationship, involvements, and enjoyments (Luke 16:22; 23:43; Phil. 1:23; 2 Cor. 5:8; Rev. 6:9-11; 14:13).
Posts: 6787 | From: Colorado | Registered: Dec 2007
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Michael Harrison
Advanced Member
Member # 6801
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posted
Whoa! That was awesome to be put into only a few paragraphs.
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917
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posted
Spirit, Soul, and Body
Man is made up of three parts; he is a tri-unity--like God. He is comprised of body, soul, and spirit. The Greek word for body is soma; soul is psuche, from which we get "psyche," and spirit is pneuma. We need to observe the relationship of these three parts of man in counseling so as to more easily identify the source of the problem. The body we can easily identify. It is the realm of world-consciousness, the seat of the five senses with which we make contact with the world around us. The soul and spirit are not quite so easily distinguishable, but the Scripture makes it clear they are distinct and different: "For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and spirit..." (Heb. 4:12a).
Without wanting to be arbitrary, but still endeavoring to make a distinction between soul and spirit, I find the following definitions to be helpful, even though, admittedly, there seem to be areas in which soul and spirit blend and/or overlap. This is particularly true when we observe that our mind, emotions, and will function both in the realm of the spirit and of the soul. If we keep in mind the fact that there always remains an element of mystery about these distinctions, seeking to define soul and spirit still has practical value. So this is what I've settled on: The soul is the realm of self-consciousness and is composed of mind, emotions, and will. The spirit is the realm of God-consciousness. The spirit of man is designed to be the place where God lives and reigns.
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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Hawkins
New Member
Member # 7127
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
Many modern Christians think that they have an immortal soul dwelling inside of them which goes somewhere upon death.
Deceit smelled.
Many ancient Christians think that they have an immortal soul dwelling inside of them which goes somewhere upon death.
Posts: 5 | From: Hong Kong | Registered: Apr 2008
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Michael Harrison
Advanced Member
Member # 6801
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posted
Luk 16:20 and a certain beggar named Lazarus was laid at his gate, full of sores,
Luk 16:21 and desiring to be fed with the crumbs that fell from the rich man’s table; yea, even the dogs came and licked his sores.
Luk 16:22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and that he was carried away by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: and the rich man also died, and was buried.
Luk 16:23 And in Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
Luk 16:24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am in anguish in this flame.
Luk 16:25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and Lazarus in like manner evil things: but now here he is comforted, and thou art in anguish.
Luk 16:26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, that they which would pass from hence to you may not be able, and that none may cross over from thence to us.
Jesus made this up just to scare people? Because after all, He knew that everyone would really be saved. ![[Mad]](mad.gif) This is the real devil's lie. And the devil's liar's have no fear of what will happen to them. ![[cool_shades]](graemlins/cool_shades.gif)
The soul of those who reject Jesus will suffer eternally. Get ahold of it in the fear of God, that you might have the sensibility to repent.
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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Keith
unregistered
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posted
Good post Eden. Of course, you are attacking one of Satan’s pet lies, the original one. You should expect great opposition if you persist. Yet, by all means do so.
This false doctrine of the immortality of the soul leads to the false doctrine of eternal torment of the wicked. A lie which personally attacks the character of God and undermines the entire gospel of Jesus Christ. This is why the Devil loves it so, it makes God out to be crueler than he could ever be. Thus he will fight tooth and nail to keep it alive, especially among those who claim to be Christ's.
It makes the gospel preach thus,- I love you so much that I died for you, now worship me or I will roast you alive in fire from now to eternity. This is forced worship, and has nothing to do with love.
Y. b. in C. Keith
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Michael Harrison
Advanced Member
Member # 6801
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posted
That was a total waste of meaningless brilliance! Did you ever do 'math' in school?
- Rom 8:10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the spirit is life because of righteousness.
- 1Th 5:23 And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
If you subtract Rom 8:10 from 1 Thes 5:23, what do you have? One! And since the body and spirit are subtracted from "spirit, soul and body," that leaves only soul.
For crying out loud, perhaps all that they comprehended way back then was simply 'a being'. Therefore they had a word for 'a being', that did not elaborate. Or did God forget to give you a brain? What do you get if you subtract a brain from a 'being'? ![[thumbsup2]](graemlins/thumbsup2.gif)
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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Eden
unregistered
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posted
WHAT IS THE SOUL?
Many modern Christians think that they have an immortal soul dwelling inside of them which goes somewhere upon death. But that idea doesn’t come from the Hebrew and Greek scriptures (the Bible), but comes from ancient pagan Greek philosophy. So the Greek philosopher Socrates stated, "[Upon death] the soul ... departs to the invisible world." But the Bible doesn't teach that a person has an immortal soul dwelling inside of him or her, but teaches that the whole physical person is the soul and that, because the whole physical person is the soul, the soul is mortal and can die.
In the Old Testament (OT), the English word soul is the Hebrew word nephesh, which, besides soul, is also translated into a number of other English words, among which are: living creature; living soul; person; man, the pronouns I, you, s/he, and we; and as stated above, as soul. Likewise in the New Testament (NT), the Greek word psykhe is used in exactly the same way as the OT Hebrew word nephesh. In the OT, this Hebrew word nephesh occurs about 750 times, while in the NT the Greek word psykhe occurs about 102 times.
Now it will surprise many Christians to learn that in the OT, the word nephesh (which is translated in English as soul and in many other ways) can also refer to animals. Below from the OT are Genesis 1:20 and 1:24 which show that nephesh is also used for animals:
1:20 Then God said, Let the waters teem with swarms of living creatures [Hebrew, nephesh].
1:24 Then God said, Let the earth bring forth living creatures [nephesh] after their kind: cattle ... and beast of the earth.
The above verses show that the word nephesh applies also to animals. Now let's see this same word nephesh applied to humans, as in Genesis 2:7:
2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul [nephesh].
Both man and animals are thus nephesh. Indeed, the word nephesh is believed to come from the root meaning to breathe so that literally a nephesh could be translated as a breather. And for this reason the same Hebrew word nephesh is used in the OT for persons as well as for animals, because both animals and humans are breathers. And so Gen.2:7 said:
2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul [nephesh; literally in Hebrew, a breather].
Note further from the above verse that man became a living soul [nephesh]. Note that it doesn’t say that man has a soul dwelling inside of him but that the whole man became a living soul or a nephesh. And that is why the word nephesh is also translated by so many other English words besides soul, such as living creature; living soul; person; man, the pronouns I, you, s/he, and we.
Now, if the word nephesh refers to the whole person or the whole animal, a nephesh should therfore also have all the normal physical functions which one attributes to a person or an animal, and indeed that is the case. And so the OT says that a nephesh can be hungry for food and drink; a nephesh can fast; a nephesh can kidnap another nephesh; a nephesh can work; a nephesh can be refreshed by cold water; a nephesh can be put in irons; and a nephesh has blood. Below are some OT verses showing that a nephesh has all these normal physical functions attached to it:
In Leviticus 7:20, the nephesh eats:
7:20 But the person [nephesh] who eats the flesh of the sacrifice ... shall be cut off from his people.
In Psalm 107:9, the nephesh is thirsty and hungry:
107:9 For [the LORD] satisfied the thirsty soul [nephesh]; and the hungry soul [nephesh] He has filled with what is good.
In Proverbs 19:15 a nephesh is idle:
19:15 … an idle man [nephesh] will suffer hunger.
The nephesh touches in Leviticus 5:2:
5:2 Or if a person [nephesh] touches any unclean thing, whether a carcass of an unclean beast ...
The nephesh can kidnap in Deuteronomy 24:7:
24:7 If a man [nephesh] is caught kidnapping any of his countrymen ...
A nephesh works in Leviticus 23:30:
23:30 As for any person [nephesh] who does any work on this same day ...
The nephesh is refreshed by cold water in Proverbs 25:25:
25:25 Like cold water to a weary soul [nephesh], so is good news ...
The nephesh can be laid in irons in Psalm 105:18:
105:18 They afflicted his feet with fetters, He himself [literally in Hebrew, his soul
(nephesh)] was laid in irons.
The nephesh has blood in Genesis 9:5:
9:5 And surely I will require your lifeblood [literally in Hebrew, the blood of your soul (nephesh)].
It is clear from the above scriptures that the functions ascribed to a nephesh are functions ascribes to the whole physical person, to the whole body and not just some immortal soul dwelling inside of us somewhere, as the pagan Greek philosophers would have us believe.
Turning now to the Greek New Testament (NT) and the Greek word psykhe, which is the NT equivalent of the Hebrew word nephesh, we find that the Apostle Paul (whose Hebrew name was Saul and who was from the tribe of Benjamin) quotes Genesis 2:7 in 1 Corinthians15:45 of the NT, saying:
15:45 So also it is written, The first man, Adam, became a living soul [in Greek, psykhe].
Note from the above verse that Paul says that man became a living soul (Greek, psykhe) and that therefore the word psykhe is the Greek equivalent of the Hebrew word nephesh and further showing that as late as NT times, the Israelites knew nothing of a soul dwelling inside of them, but knew that the entire man was a soul [in Hebrew, nephesh, and in Greek, phykhe].
The Lord Yahshua (Jesus) Himself uses the word psykhe to refer to the whole body, as in Matthew 6:25, where Yahshua responds to man’s anxiety over lack of food and clothing:
6:25 For this reason I say to you, do not be anxious for your life [Greek, psykhe].
Or in Matthew 8:35, Yahshua says, referring to a man who dies for the gospel’s sake:
8:35 Whoever loses his life [psykhe] for My sake and the gospel's shall save it.
And Acts 20:10 Paul says about a man who seems to be dead:
20:10 ... Do not be troubled, for his life [psykhe] is in him.
The above verses further show that the word psykhe is used in the NT in exactly the same way as nephesh was used in the OT, and that psykhe alsorefers to the whole person, and shows that a psykhe can die. And this is also true for nephesh in the OT, as shown below in Genesis 2:17:
2:17 [And the LORD God said to the man], But of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, you [Hebrew, nephesh] shall not eat of it: for in the day that you eat thereof, you shall surely die.
The above plainly states that a soul [nephesh] can die. And if the nephesh can die, then the soul cannot be something immortal which dwells inside of us. Another OT verse which shows that the nephesh can die is 1 Kings 1:52 which says :
1:52 ... but if wickedness shall be found in him [Hebrew, nephesh], he shall die.
Also in Genesis 7:21-23, which describes destruction by Noah’s Flood of all flesh outside the ark, all the animals and all mankind outside the ark died, saying:
7:21 And all flesh that moved on the earth perished, birds, and cattle and beasts ... and all mankind;
7:23 Of all that was on the dry land, all in whose nostrils was the breath [neshamah] of the spirit of life, died.
Or Numbers 23:10 says:
23:10 Let me [literally in Hebrew, my soul, nephesh] die the death of the upright.
And Leviticus 21:1 says:
21:1 No one shall defile himself for a dead person [nephesh].
And Ezekiel 18:4 states plainly:
18:4 The soul [nephesh] who sins will die.
And finally, Ecclesiastes 3:19-20 says:
3:19 For the fate of the sons of men and the fate of the beasts is the same. As one dies, so dies the other; indeed they all have the same breath [ruahh] and there is no advantage for man over beast, for all is vanity.
3:20 All go to the same place. All come from the dust and all return to the dust.
The above verses make it clear that the word nephesh, which among other English words is translated soul, doesn’t mean soul in the way many Christians think of soul, but means the whole physical person, and as shown above, nephesh equally refers to animals, and both persons and animals can die.
As stated above, in the OT, Ezekiel 18:4 said that:
18:4 The soul [nephesh] who sins will die.
And this idea is carried right into NT times, where the Apostle Paul said in Romans 6:23:
6:23 The wages of sin is death.
And further consider the last part of that same verse Romans 6:23:
6:23 But the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
But … don’t I already have eternal life—don’t I already have an immortal soul dwelling inside of me? Why then do I still need eternal life as a gift?
Note that Paul states this even more plainly in the NT at 1 Corinthians 15:53-54:
15:53 For this corruption must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written [in Isaiah 25:8], “Death is swallowed up in victory”.
This couldn’t be stated more plainly. Paul flat out says that we are mortals and that in order for us to become immortal, we must still put on immortality.
This can only mean that the nephesh or the psykhe doesn’t have any immortality inside of him or her of any kind as yet, else the nephesh or the psykhe wouldn’t need to receive immortality as a gift and wouldn’t need to still put immortality on.
And this is in complete agreement with all we know about the nephesh, namely that the nephesh is made of dust, of the ground, as plainly stated by the LORD in Genesis 2:7:
2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul [nephesh].
love, Eden
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