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Author Topic: Many in that day will say Lord, Lord
Carol Swenson
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Isaiah 11:4-5

This is the standard according to which He will judge when saving, and judge when punishing. “And judges the poor with righteousness, and passes sentence with equity for the humble in the land; and smites the earth with the rod of His mouth, and with the breath of His lips He slays the wicked. And righteousness is the girdle of His loins, and faithfulness the girdle of His hips.” The main feature in v. 4 is to be seen in the objective ideas. He will do justice to the dallim , the weak and helpless, by adopting an incorruptibly righteous course towards their oppressors, and decide with straightforwardness for the humble or meek of the land : ‛ânâv, like ‛ânı̄, from ‛ânâh, to bend, the latter denoting a person bowed down by misfortune, the former a person inwardly bowed down, i.e., from all self-conceit (hōcı̄ach l’, as in Job 16:21). The poor and humble, or meek, are the peculiar objects of His royal care ; just as it was really to them that the first beatitudes of the Sermon on the Mount applied. But “the earth” and “the wicked” (the latter is not to be understood collectively, but, as in several passages in the Old Testament, viz., Ps 68:22; 110:6; Hab 3:13-14, as pointing forward prophetically to an eschatological person, in whom hostility towards Jehovah and His Anointed culminates most satanically) will experience the full force of His penal righteousness. The very word of His mouth is a rod which shatters in pieces (Ps 2:9; Rev 1:16); and the breath of His lips is sufficient to destroy, without standing in need of any further means (2 Thess 2:8). As the girdle upon the hips (mothnaim, lxx την̀ ὀσφύν), and in front upon the loins (chălâzaim, lxx τὰς πλευράς), fastens the clothes together, so all the qualities and active powers of His person have for their band tzedâkâh, which follows the inviolable norm of the divine will, and hâ’emūnâh, which holds immovably to the course divinely appointed, according to promise (Isaiah 25:1). Special prominence is given by the article to ’emūnâh; He is the faithful and true witness (Rev 1:5; 3:14). Consequently with Him there commences a new epoch, in which the Son of David and His righteousness acquire a world-subduing force, and find their home in a humanity that has sprung, like Himself, out of deep humiliation.


(Keil & Delitzsch Commentary on the Old Testament Vol. 7: Isaiah)

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becauseHElives
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quote:
We must judge others by God’s standards of fairness.
No Carol, if we judge, we must only judge by the standard we are given... the scriptures...

You use wrongly Isaiah 11:3-5

3And shall make Him of quick understanding and His delight shall be in the reverential and obedient fear of the Lord. And He shall not judge by the sight of His eyes, neither decides by the hearing of His ears;

4But with righteousness and justice shall He judge the poor and decide with fairness for the meek, the poor, and the downtrodden of the earth; and He shall smite the earth and the oppressor with the rod of His mouth, and with the breath of His lips He shall slay the wicked.

5And righteousness shall be the girdle of His waist and faithfulness the girdle of His loins.

An example of what Isaiah was saying…

David was small in stature, and because of his size was looked over by men to be King until Yahweh made it clear the heart was what he was looking for....

As I read the scriptures and look at the world we live in and know that Yahweh has commanded us to be salt and light to those in the world around us.

I see a sickening sight of a Church that has completely forgotten what Yahweh requires of those that are called His children and know why Yahshua said be hot or cold or I will vomit you out of my mouth.

Revelation 3:16
So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. (Another scripture against Once Saved Always Saved)

You thought the little thing about the computer was cute but that has nothing to do with Yahweh being the same yesterday, today, forever….

Technology changes, the character of Yahweh never changes and what He expects of His people never changes….

What Yahweh expected of the first century Church He still expects from us today, he may even expect more being we have greater technological tools at our disposal ….

Women have left the home for the work place, this in and of itself is the greatest cause of the decay of this once great nation…

I do not blame the women; the scripture tell us they are more easily deceived….

2 Timothy 3:6
For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,

and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

Genesis3: 16 has not been changed by Grace....

14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

The heart of every issue is the issue of the heart!

What has changed in your life since you believed?

Has anything changed or did you just add Jesus/Yahshua to what you were?

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

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Carol Swenson
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becauseHElives, this was posted by WildB

quote:

Eph.5

[25] Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

[28] So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
[29] For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

[33] Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.


These verse to me means you are to DIE in the defence of your lady~Nothing short is exceptible.

becauseHElives, will you defend yourself, sing your own praises, but say not one word for your lady? Are you just going to ignore WildB?
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Eden
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becauseHElives says
quote:
I also have a full beard and not a feminine bone in my body.
So true. In fact, one of your masculine bones is now the feminine woman:

Genesis 2
21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from the man, made He a woman, and brought her to the man.

23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

But it's true what becauseHElives says
quote:
I also have a full beard and not a feminine bone in my body.
It is true. But, one of your masculine bones is now a feminine woman.

with love, eden

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Carol Swenson
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His delight will be obedience to the Lord. He will not judge by appearance, false evidence, or hearsay, but will defend the poor and the exploited. He will rule against the wicked who oppress them. For he will be clothed with fairness and with truth. (Isaiah 11:3-5, TLB)


We must judge others by God’s standards of fairness. God will judge with righteousness and justice. How we long for fair treatment from others, but do we give it? We hate those who base their judgments on appearance, false evidence, or hearsay, but are we quick to judge others using those standards? Only Christ can be the perfectly fair judge. Only as he governs our heart can we learn to be as fair in our treatment of others as we expect others to be toward us.


(The Handbook of Bible Application)

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Michael Harrison
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quote:
Now I'm trying to unravel how a first century Christian uses an on-line computer to tell us that nothing has changed but it isn't the same...
For sure! The biggest problem with mankind is dominating another's space, and making the calls for them. Everybody has their station. Everyone is called somewhere. Sometimes we are to stay where we were when we were called. We each have our own journey. But for some who would direct, the other is only there to be dictated to about what to do, or how to act, when to do it and on and on. The love of our Lord is not in that very often. HE leads. We follow. He is able to coax us into that which He desires.

Although, there will sometimes be a bark, too many think it is their perogative to turn this way and that, barking all the while! Usually this is reserved for the demons. But, however, some feel fulfilled in it. Yet we all get enough of that in the world. But those who preach to not be conformed to the world don't seem to see this aspect of their behavior as wrong; only that belonging to all of the rest. Herein is why we are not to be judges! It would be better to pray to the one who can change it for another, rather than to try to dominate one another, which is 'the sin' of the world. If one is right with Him, "The effectual fervent prayer of the righteous man availeth much!" They would know they were righteous by the answered prayer. And to give consideration to the axiom, "Prayer changes things, or it will change you," tis good for the Godly man or woman to consider.

But for some this is a replacement for righteousness - the pointing out someone else's shortcomings!

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Michael Harrison
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Carol! Now I know why you have so much time to post!!! [Razz] I did that for a while. I worked twelve hour third shift on weekends for a while. It was a hoot! I have tales to tell.

My boss was petite also, but she was not a believer, like you, or I'd still be working there perhaps. Seems she wanted her son to have my position, (and some other things were made murkey). He didn't want the position when I took the job, she had said earlier on. Evidently it changed. I am embarrased to say that I didn't take it well. (It was all part of 'strange' adversity that has been going on.)

You aren't that cute blonde that I met while I was driving a truck are you? I delivered to a warehouse or something in the L.A. area, or just a little north of there. I think she would have been willing to quit the guard business on the spot, and go trucking, from the looks of that smile she gave me! Oh that's right! You are in Colorado. I went there recently too. Can't remember the name of that church that I went to, kinda downtown Denver. Seems like downtown was in the name of it. Or it was something church, downtown. Anyway! I worked the flea market near there. Seems that there are not many in the area.

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becauseHElives
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I do greet all my brothers with a kiss and a hug.

Romans 16:16 Salute one another with an holy kiss. The churches of Christ salute you.

I also have a full beard and not a feminine bone in my body.

I do lift "holy hands" in worship.

1 Timothy 2:8 I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.

I also believe in women wearing a head covering if they are praying or prophesying in the Church...

1 Corinthians 11:5But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.

Contrary to some I do not add to are take away from Yahweh's commands to the New Testament Church...

People explain away why they don't obey the word by saying that was for those in another century but the scriptures say Yahweh does not change, He is the same yesterday, today and forever...

Grace was the same in the 1st century as it is today...

only today there is another Gospel being preached and another Jesus being preach...

Grace is cheapen and no separation from the world expected.

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

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Carol Swenson
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Adam Clarke’s Commentary on the Old Testament

Deuteronomy 22:5

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man—כלי גבר keli geber, the instruments or arms of a man. As the word גבר geber is here used, which properly signifies a strong man or man of war, it is very probable that armor is here intended ; especially as we know that in the worship of Venus, to which that of Astarte or Ashtaroth among the Canaanites bore a striking resemblance, the women were accustomed to appear in armor before her. It certainly cannot mean a simple change in dress, whereby the men might pass for women, and vice versa. This would have been impossible in those countries where the dress of the sexes had but little to distinguish it, and where every man wore a long beard.


The Believer’s Study Bible

22:5 This verse is not primarily a reference to principles of fashion , as one clearly notes in the final clause. Rather this refers to the practice of transvestitism, i.e., a deviant sexual behavior which is exhibited in the adoption of dress and behavior unnatural for one’s own sex. The danger, perhaps, lies in its close association with homosexuality (cf. Lev 18:22 and 20:13, where the same word “abomination” occurs; see also Rom 1:24, note) and in the fact that such practices were often associated with the worship of pagan deities.


New Commentary on the Whole Bible: Old Testament Volume

5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment—“that which pertaineth” (Heb. kelı̂) quite literally means implements or articles, thus anything worn by man, including weapons, ornaments, etc.


Warren Wiersbe’s “Be” Series: Old & New Testaments

Deuteronomy 22:5

The principle behind the law is that of separation from the world and recognition of God’s order for men and women. It’s a principle that helps us honor God and avoid confusion and sin. To say that we have to obey the letter of this law today is to miss the point. Does this also mean we can’t wear garments with mixed fibers (Deut. 22:11) or that we must sew tassels on our clothing? (v. 12; see Num. 15:37-40; Matt. 23:5) Perhaps the prohibition about mixed fabrics is a further reminder of Israel’s responsibility to be separated from the other nations that practiced these things, perhaps as part of their religious system.

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jimbarn
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As I understand these scriptures and the times, the men wore robes.I do not think I want to.
This is, in my limited understanding, a lot like the Jews that wanted new believers in Acts to be circumcised.
Also, do we want our women to wear burkas?
Paul also addressed an issue like this and instructed women only in dressing like whores.

Jimbarn
A recovering pharisee [Smile]

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WildB
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BRAVE NEW SCHOOLS
3rd-graders asked to help classmate in gender change
Parents given 1-day notice of presentation explaining boy would now wear girl clothes
Posted: May 10, 2008
6:55 pm Eastern

© 2008 WorldNetDaily

A Pennsylvania elementary school has angered parents by giving them one-day's notice of planned counseling sessions with 100 third-grade students to explain that one of their male classmates would soon begin wearing girls' clothing and taking a female name and to ask that they accept him as a girl and not make unkind remarks.

The exercise in "social transition" was initiated by the boy's parents who approached the administration at Chatham Park Elementary School in Haverford Township asking that the school help in having their child's female identity find acceptance among his peers. After consulting experts on transgender children, the Haverford School District sent letters to parents advising them the school guidance counselor would meet with their children, reported the Philadelphia Inquirer.

While some parents contacted the principal asking that their children be excused, others took their anger out online.

"Why is the school introducing this subject to 8- and 9-year-olds?" wrote an angry parent who started a discussion on the Haverford Township's blog site. "Why were we not notified sooner. We received the letter today, the discussion at school is tomorrow."

The Haverford Township blog is not currently viewable.

In the letter to parents, Chatham Park principal Daniel Marsella assured parents the counseling would use "developmentally appropriate language" to explain "how we need to help this student make a social transition in school."

(Story continues below)

"This is something that was going to come out," said Mary Beth Lauer, district director of community relations. "Isn't it better to be proactive, and let people know what is happening and how we're dealing with it?"

According to Valerie Huff, whose daughter is a friend of the boy, he had started wearing girls' clothes and an upcoming school event would have made his gender identity public.

"I did not think that the letter needed to go out," Huff said. "The kids don't make any big deal about it at all."

But not so the parents. Postings to the community blog have upset the boy's parents, the Inquirer reported.

WND reported a pediatric endocrinologist at the renowned Boston Children's Hospital has launched a new program to drug transgender children to delay puberty so they can decide at a later age whether they want a male or a female body.

The Haverford boy has not received medical treatments to change his sex, but has told others he sees himself a girl.

WND has reported previously on some of the controversies prompted by the belief that a man can be born in a woman's body, or vice versa, including in Montgomery County, Md., where county officials have adopted a law that precludes those who provide public accommodations from discriminating based on that "gender identity."

Voters there have petitioned to have a vote on that law because they fear men who "decide" they are female walking into women's restrooms and locker rooms.

Paul McHugh, a psychiatrist and professor at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, was critical of the school's handing of the issue.

"They do not have a right to stop the child, but it's different when they gather everyone around and say, 'Johnnie is Jeanie," he said.

McHugh, who has studied sexual reassignment surgery for 30 years, particularly in the 1970s when Hopkins was a leader in the field, said society should not support decisions of immature persons.

"People came to us saying that if we changed them, we'd solve all their problems," he said. "So we changed them, and their problems remained."

Chatham Park guidance counselor Catherine Mallam said the students she spoke to seemed to be accepting of the boy's change of identity.

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That is all.....

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WildB
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Eph.5

[25] Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

[28] So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
[29] For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

[33] Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.


These verse to me means you are to DIE in the defence of your lady~Nothing short is exceptible.

--------------------
That is all.....

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becauseHElives
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If we abide by the principles taught in the Bible, our country will go on prospering.... But if we or our posterity neglect it and its instructions and authority, no man can tell how sudden a catastrophe may overwhelm us and bury all our glory in profound obscurity.

~ Daniel Webster

If any have a proud and arrogant heart they can not receive instruction from the Spirit...

I any are humble Yahweh will direct their path and give His Grace...

I am no one's Judge....

The Word of Yahweh is the only Judge....

Do we stand in defiance against the principles Yahweh has declared because of our circumstances or do we cry for mercy and the ability to change our circumstances.

I don't pretend to understand why Yahweh choses to go outside principles laid down in the scripture like with Deborah.... that's His business, he is always proving you can not put Him in a box.

but


The desire to emulate men in dress has seriously affected the fine and noble characteristics of womanhood.

and often it does takes a second glance to determine the sex of a woman today, due to the distorted and strange garb she wears and the close proximity of her attire to that of a man.

And the Scriptures does call this practice an abomination unto Yahweh or something Yahweh hates.


If you are my little sister, I love you enough to tell you the Truth....

you keep thinking I am mad at you but that is far from the truth,

Genesis3: 16
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

Genesis3: 16 has not been changed by Grace....

(I Peter 3:1-5)
Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they may also without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; while they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear. Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning or of plaiting of the hair, and of wearing of gold, or putting on of apparel; but let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price. For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their husbands”

I Peter 3:1-5 has not been changed by Grace...

I Timothy 2:8-10
“I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands , without wrath and doubting. In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair or gold, or pearls, or costly array; but (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works”

I Timothy 2:8-10 has not been changed by Grace...

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

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becauseHElives
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New Testament Teaching for Women

The New Testament makes several specific statements pertaining to women’s dress in the epistles of Paul and Peter.

“I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands , without wrath and doubting. In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair or gold, or pearls, or costly array; but (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works” (I Timothy 2:8-10)

Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they may also without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; while they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear. Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning or of plaiting of the hair, and of wearing of gold, or putting on of apparel; but let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price. For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their husbands” (I Peter 3:1-5)

Paul admonished women to dress according to certain standards and listed them in this order: modesty, inexpensive and non ornamental attire, and clothing that becomes godliness. To be modest means to be decent and respectful. The True Christian woman seeks to emulate all the fine virtues of Christian womanhood, so carefully and prayerfully selects her attire in order to not unduly expose her body to the stares of the public. She is not so old fashioned as to look like a monstrosity, but she is deliberately methodical in choosing clothing that will dignify her womanhood without provoking the stares of the opposite sex.

She has dedicated herself to the cause of Christianity. This manner of dedication avoids expensive, extravagant clothing and superfluous, ornamental jewelry, permitting only the functional use of a wristwatch. The great needs of Christian evangelism and charitable assistance to the poor demand that she deny herself the exorbitant tastes of expensive fads so that she might practice the Christian art of concern for others. In this manner, she professes a godliness that stems from a heart-felt desire for virtuous, holy living.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Corinthians%2011%20;&version=45;

Against this picture of scriptural womanhood, we have the worldly female of today who tries by every conceivable means; it seems, to flirt with hazards of indecency. Costumes and apparel that are inclined toward nudity are sought after intensely. The results are demonstrated in a wanton display of seminude parades on our public streets. Many authorities agree that this concentration on exposure of the body has contributed greatly to the serious problems of immorality that threaten the basic foundations of our homes and families. It has also been a cause in inviting serious sexual atrocities.

The worldly woman also makes a hobby of fashion crazes and style shows. She sets up a contest with her neighbors as to who owns the most expensive jewelry, who wears the latest clothes, and who has traveled the farthest to buy the latest creation. It makes for an interesting discussion over a cocktail, but it does not alleviate the serious problems and needs of a reeling world, which Christians are called upon to address with a Christ-like zeal to help desperate souls, both by their means and their consecration.

Distinction Between Male and Female

Moreover, the Scriptures teach a great difference between femininity and masculinity as to dress. “The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment; for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God” (Deuteronomy 22:5).

The desire to emulate men in dress has seriously affected the fine and noble characteristics of womanhood. Often it takes a second glance to determine the sex of a woman today, due to the distorted and strange garb she wears and the close proximity of her attire to that of a man. The Scriptures call this practice an abomination unto Yahweh or something Yahweh hates.

Perhaps some will say this standard has changed due to the inception of the age of grace introduced by Jesus Christ. But this verse deals with moral law and with the nature of Yahweh, which never change, not with a ceremonial ritual fulfilled by Christ. Moreover, when the Apostle Peter wished to instruct Christian women about proper conduct, he used Sarah, the wife of Abraham, as his example (I Peter 3:5). Thus, we are not out of order in this instance to use a verse of Scripture from the law. We rightfully go back over the years and learn a spiritual lesson that sharply rebukes the customs and practices of our day.

Scriptural Guidelines Summarized

Holy women of old concentrated on adorning their spiritual life by developing the character of the heart. This is the major concentration and beautification of the Christian woman. Thus the Apostle Peter used the great dedication of women of another age to impress the women of the first century with the need for the ornament or adornment of a meek and quiet spirit.

By the same token, we are within reasonable rights to insist that Christian women today heed the influential, sensible, and divinely inspired advice of the apostles.

Here are the biblical guidelines concerning Christian example in dress for women.
1. Modesty.
2. Moderation in cost.
3. Inclination toward godliness (decency).
4. Avoidance of outward adornment.
5. Shamefacedness and sobriety.
6. Distinction between male and female.

Guidelines for Men

The New Testament does not provide instructions expressly for men’s clothing. Apparently immodest dress was not as much a problem for men in those days, even though it often is today. However, in many instances it may well be said, “What is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.”

The trend to indecent exposure is even having an impression on the male sex today. Comfort seems to be the overall objective instead of a cautious, considerate thought for decorum and dignity. But comfort can be achieved without some of the ridiculous, outlandish costumes now being displayed on our busy avenues.

We can honestly proclaim that the basic principles of godly appearance that apply to Christian women should also apply to men; namely, modesty, moderation, decency, elimination of ornamentation and costly finery, and distinction between the male and female in hair and dress.

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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator


 
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