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Topic: WAS JESUS A GNOSTIC?
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A. Ben-Shema
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posted
I thought I'd already replied to this nonsense!
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Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
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posted
There is NOT ONE here who will in any way accept your doctrines/visions of demons, gnostic. You bring NOTHING BUT ABOMINATION, and no Believer will ever accept the lies and deceit which you teach.
Jesus arose from the dead, was seen by some 500 witnesses, and ascended and is coming again, and this time He is NOT coming as the Lamb of God, but as the Lion of the Tribe of Judah and your master is headed straight to the Lake of Fire just like yourself unless you repent and turn to Christ.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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A. Ben-Shema
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Eden,
When are you going to understand that your most sincere "beliefs" in corrupted scripture (see my previous post) will not save you, nor will your most sincere "beliefs" in following a man (e.g. Jesus) that you never knew, and now (because he's dead) cannot KNOW! The true Gnosis of God never dies - it UNITES one with God - just as Jesus apparently said (I say apparently, because no one can actually KNOW now precisely what He said) "I and My Father are ONE" i.e. UNITED IN KNOWLEDGE and TRUTH - NOT BELIEF!!!
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Eden
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posted
A. Ben-Shema, I believe in the gnosis of God. But all of our gnosis of God isn't going past our death, whereas, in exchange for the death of Jesus, God is EVEN WILLING to GIVE us eternal life like Jesus had, beginning a NEW generation of NEW KINDS of people, people like Jesus was:
Philippians 3:21
Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.
God is even willing to throw in eternal life, that God may beget MANY SONS and DAUGHTERS like Jesus, only, with Jesus always remaining the Preemient Son, the first fruits of those RAISED FROM THE DEAD:
Acts 26:23
That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.
Romans 8:11
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Colossians 1:18
And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Though we shall be sons and daughters just like Jesus according to the free gift of God (by the suffering of Jesus on the cross), Jesus alone will always have some special distintions.
Be blessed, A. Ben-Shema
Eden
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A. Ben-Shema
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by EL3LN3TN:
No, I don't think Christ was a bona fide member of any Gnostic sects at the time, in fact I don't think the Gnosticism movement even began to flourish until a century or so after Christ's time
My comment:
'Genuine' Gnosticism (i.e. the attainment of Divine Knowledge)is NOT a sect. Such Gnosis comes from God and has been flourishing since the very beginning of time! And it will continue to flourish amongst the few of God's chosen ones, notwithstanding the attacks of Christianity and other religions of 'belief'.
EL3LN3TN:
They were denounced as a heretical sect by the early church, [i]largely because their teachings were so difficult to understand, for commoners at the time, and they relied on teachers, and oral tradition, rather than a singular written canon so it's spread was discouraged..
My comment:
Yes, indeed, both 'genuine' Gnostics, as well as the many pseudo-gnostic sects, were condemned by the early Roman church (which was pagan influenced, materialistic, worldly, unspiritual, and corrupt - from the very beginning)! This is the church which most Christians believe has faithfully preserved the NT intact - with no editing and corruption! This is the church which banned anything other than its teachings! This was the church which started murdering anyone not holding to its viewpoint of God! This is the church which uses violence and threats to get its own way!
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A. Ben-Shema
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Eden here:
Actually, I WAS as blind as the Pharisees and Sadducees, but now I see.
Ben-Shema:
If YOU now truly SEE, then YOU must be equal in Spiritual Knowledge (i.e. Gnosis) as those who wrote the scriptures (presuming that they had Spiritual Knowledge). So why do you not speak from your Enlightened heart, instead of quoting from other people (i.e. the scriptures)???
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Eden
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A. Ben-Shema said:
Thanks for that. You clearly show yourself to be as blind as the Pharisees and Sadducees. Never mind. One day, no doubt, you will come to understand the Truth.
Eden here:
Actually, I WAS as blind as the Pharisees and Sadducees, but now I see.
John 9
34 They answered and said to him, You were altogether born in sins, and do you teach us? And they cast him out.
35 Jesus heard that they had cast him out; and when he had found him, he said to him, Do you believe on the Son of God?
36 He answered and said, Who is he, Lord, that I might believe on him?
37 And Jesus said to him, You have both seen him, and it is he who talks with you.
38 And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.
39 Then Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they who cannot see, might see; and that they who see might be made blind.
40 And some of the Pharisees who were with him heard these words, and they said to him, Are we also blind?
41 And Jesus said to them, If you were blind, you should have no sin: but now that you say, We see; therefore your sin remains.[/b]
But go and learn what that means: "you are yet in your sins".
Be blessed.
Eden
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A. Ben-Shema
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Thanks for that. You clearly show yourself to be as blind as the Pharisees and Sadducees. Never mind. One day, no doubt, you will come to understand the Truth.
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Eden
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Hi, A. Ben-Shema. You said:
First we must define what a genuine Gnostic is.
Eden here: we?
A. Ben-Shema continues:
The word comes from ancient Greek (Gnosis), and … a genuine Gnostic is one who has …“first-hand” Divine KNOWLEDGE of God. (N.B. Not mere 'book knowledge', 'beliefs', or 'theories'!)
The question is: was Jesus a Gnostic? If what we are told in the New Testament is true, then obviously Jesus must have been a Gnostic, as must all the other great Prophets and Masters of the Old Testament. For did they not tell us that they had direct "KNOWLEDGE" of God, not from books (i.e. 'beliefs'), but through various "face to face" visions and direct personal revelations from God - HIMSELF! (Hebrew: "Shekhinah").
To believe that God would only reveal Himself to one ‘clan’ (or ‘race’) of people (i.e. the Hebrews/Jews) demonstrates the typical blindness and ignorance of many religious people! It is claimed that the “Israelites” are the “chosen people of God.” This claim is, indeed, true—…
Eden here:
This is where you are wrong, A. Ben-Shema. The Creator of heaven and earth, the Living God, IS revealing Himself through the Shem-Jacob-Israel line, as testified to in the MANY INSTANCES OF MIRACLES in both the OLD Testament and the NEW Testament.
A. Ben-Shema continues:
but again we have to understand what this name or “title” (i.e. "ISRAEL") actually means in the ancient Hebrew. The term ISRAEL comes from three Hebrew roots: ’ish (= a Spiritual / conscious ‘being’/‘human’); ra’eh (= ‘seeing’/’vision’); and ’el (= ‘God’ / ‘Supreme Spirit’). Thus, when put together, the word (Israel) means: “Spiritually conscious one who SEES God.”
From this explanation it should be quite obvious that the term does not apply to any particular ‘race’ or ‘clan’ of people, but to ALL those who SEE.
Eden here:
This is where your are wrong, A. Ben-Shema. The Living God IS using the descendents of Abraham/Sarah Isaac/Jacob to SHOW Himself to the earth. ISRAEL is called ISRAEL BECAUSE it is the tribe that this God of Israel has CREATED, starting from Abraham, to SHOW Himself to the earth. ONLY ONE NATION SAW GOD AND THAT WAS JACOB_ISRAEL, and not ANY NATION TRIBE as you ALLEGE received this vision of the Living God, the Creator of heaven and earth, whose mighty deeds in the earth ARE set forth in the Old and New Testament.
A. Ben-Shema continues:
, and thus KNOW God, i.e. all genuine Gnostics! So certainly the TRUE 'Israelites' (i.e. Gnostics) are the chosen people of God! This explanation is also confirmed by the fact that Jacob was given this title (or name) after having had a "face to face" vision of God (see GEN. 32:28-30).
Eden here:
There is ONLY ONE TRIBE on earth called JACOB-ISRAEL. If you want to make ANY SEEING PEOPLE into ISRAEL, that is YOUR business, but there is ONLY ONE JACOB-ISRAEL in the world, and you know where THAT is located.
A. Ben-Shema continues:
I obtained this information from a remarkable new book called the "Church of God? or the Temples of Satan" by R.A.Anderson. Has anyone read it yet?
Eden here:
No.
Eden
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WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917
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posted
"Genuine Gnostics do not follow books of any kind "
Then Follow Christ not.....
Psalms40
[7] Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me,
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That is all.....
Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004
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A. Ben-Shema
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posted
Genuine Gnostics do not follow books of any kind - they, like the true, contemporary, disciples of Jesus, follow only their living (contemporary) Spiritual Master - He who can REVEAL the TRUTH. Christians have been waiting for two thousand years for Jesus to return to earth! The Jews have been waiting for their Messiah for much longer! Buddists are also waiting for Buddha to return! etc. etc. etc. They just do not recognise their Master when He comes - for He has returned many times - and is indeed here today!!!
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ahar
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Member # 5810
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posted
I had obviously heard of the Gnostic scripts found, but had no idea that anyone was following them .
You live and learn.
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Cheers
Andy
Posts: 290 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2006
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EL3LN3TN
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quote:
Originally posted by Aaron:
I knew some gnostics once. They came to our church meeting. Once their intentions and "persuasion" was clear they were promptly asked to leave. They had no respect for authority, were their own teachers, and acted as if they were saving us from our "blindness". Always talked of Christ as "preeminent" but rarely as "Lord". They did not recognize that there is "one Head over one Body". In fact, they acted as if God had made them "head" over what they chose.
This is just the tip of their issues.
Say "yes" to Christ and "no" to gnostics.
The original
Aaron ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
Interesting...what church(?) or religious organization(?) did they claim affiliation with??? ![[Wink]](wink.gif) Did anybody find out??
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EL3LN3TN
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My quick 0.02 - No, I don't think Christ was a bona fide member of any Gnostic sects at the time, in fact I don't think the Gnosticism movement even began to flourish until a century or so after Christ's time (citation needed!!) ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
They were denounced as a heretical sect by the early church, largely because their teachings were so difficult to understand, for commoners at the time, and they relied on teachers, and oral tradition, rather than a singular written canon - to use a modernism - "it just won't sell in Omaha!", so it's spread was discouraged..
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Aaron
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I knew some gnostics once. They came to our church meeting. Once their intentions and "persuasion" was clear they were promptly asked to leave. They had no respect for authority, were their own teachers, and acted as if they were saving us from our "blindness". Always talked of Christ as "preeminent" but rarely as "Lord". They did not recognize that there is "one Head over one Body". In fact, they acted as if God had made them "head" over what they chose.
This is just the tip of their issues.
Say "yes" to Christ and "no" to gnostics.
The original
Aaron
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A. Ben-Shema
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Originally posted by Caretaker:
Those who bring anything which is contrary to the Word of God bring nothing but error and deception.
Reply:
So what is the WORD of God?
Again I will quote from: "Church of God? or the Temples of Satan": ...
According to "Revelation": “His (God’s) NAME is called the Word of God.” (REV.19:13).
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was (is) God.” (JOHN 1:1). The scriptures themselves have become commonly known as the ‘Word of God,’ but this is very misleading. There are two Greek terms used in the New Testament which are both translated into English as ‘word,’ rhema (mundane usage), and Logos (Mystical – with no exact English equivalent). Logos has a long tradition in Greek philosophy, in which it has a variety of complex meanings. In ancient times, words were believed to have mystical powers; thus, the use of logos has great theological significance. The "Word" is the active, powerful, presence of God! The Word (Logos) that Jesus revealed and used was the Word of transforming power. By His Word the sick were made whole (MATT.8:8; LUKE 7:7) and demons driven out (MATT.8:16). It was also the ‘Word’ of Salvation that was able to bring Life to the (Spiritually) dead and transform the Spiritually decayed (JOHN 5:24; 17:17; cf. JAMES 1:18; 1 PET.1:23). The Word of God is a Living and active Power, a timeless moment at which, in our own time and space, we can meet the living God! It has nothing to do with the narrative words of scripture!
Firstly, then, the Divine “Name” (or “Word”) of God. A good definition of a ‘name’ is: “that by which someone or something is KNOWN.” It was possibly for this reason that the term name began to be used of the Mystic / ineffable Essence of God, i.e. that (mystery) by which God in KNOWN. This Holy Name is not a speakable or inscribable word or title – not like the mere labels: “Yahweh”, “Elohim”, “Jesus”, “God”, “Allah”, etc., as the savants of orthodoxy might have us believe – but that which is the very Essence, Nucleus, and Power of GOD: HIS very BEING! Traditional orthodox Judaism has always believed that the title: “Yahweh” is itself the Mystic Name of God, and thus they assumed that this was the Name or Word that may not (cannot!) be pronounced. They misunderstood that it was not by merely refusing to speak the Divine Name that made it ineffable, but that it was (and is) ineffable by nature, i.e. the Sacred Name is simply not a speakable word – but the very Essence of God: the Life Force itself! This is the True, Great, and Powerful Name that the scriptures refer to – NOT to a personal name such as Jesus! It should also be clearly understood that there is another term that came to be used synonymously with “Name” to refer to this Mystic Essence of God, i.e. the Holy “WORD” or “LOGOS”.
Footnotes:
“He (the Father) revealed how the Living Word is not made up of vowels or consonants, that one might read it and think of something foolish, but Spiritual letters of Truth which they alone invoke who know them… The Name is not formed of letters, nor does His Name consist of appellations, but it is invisible.” (Coptic – Gospel of Truth).
Just as the term “Name” was used to describe the Mystic Essence of God, because a name implies: “that by which something/someone is known,” so, too, was the Greek term for “Divine Word” / “Oracle” (viz. “Logos” / “Logion” = “the teaching / revelation of [a] God”, i.e. that by which the ‘Mystic Essence’ is known) also frequently used in scripture. That these terms (‘Name’ and ‘Word’ of God) are synonymous is also confirmed in the text of the New Testament: “His (the Lord’s) Name is called: the Word of God.” (REV.19:13). Unfortunately the English translation of Logos as ‘word’ does not transmit adequately the original Mystical / Spiritual meaning of the Greek, and has lead to many people falsely believing that the written texts (i.e. religious scriptures) themselves are the Word of God.
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Caretaker
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posted
John 10:
27: My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
28: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
29: My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
30: I and my Father are one.
II Timothy 3:
13: But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
14: But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15: And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16: All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
II Peter 1:21.
16: For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.
17: For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
18: And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.
19: We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
20: Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21: For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
Those who bring anything which is contrary to the Word of God bring nothing but error and deception.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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A. Ben-Shema
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posted
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Caretaker:
The Gnostic
Caretaker:
Gnosis refers to a knowledge that is essential to free oneself from the evil material world and bodily existence (Crim: 277). Gnostics believe humans err because they are ignorant, unlike the Christian belief that man is sinful by nature. Gnostics will receive salvation when they gain knowledge, gnosis. The knowledge must be of their inner self or soul. It is similar to the Hindu definition of meditation (Borce).
Reply:
Indeed, mankind is ignorant of the Spirit from birth, and without Knowledge of Truth (i.e. God) he cannot Know the 'way'. This Knowledge, as you correctly stated, is of our innermost Divine Self (NOT our ego, or conscious mind!). Does the NT not report that Jesus said: "the Kingdom of God is within you."
Caretaker:
Some of the basic beliefs of Gnosticism are as follows:
Reply:
This is a contradiction of terms - for a "genuine" Gnostic does not "believe" - if he is genuine, he KNOWS! That is why I assume Jesus was a Gnostic - not a religious 'believer'! (as were the Pharisees and Sadducees)
Caretaker:
You say that you believe that what was written in the New Testament is true, and you say that Jesus was a prophet and had to be a gnostic. You error, for Jesus did not "experience" God, He was God manifest in the flesh.
Reply:
I have never said that I believe what is written in the NT is all true! Please do not misquote me. I believe some of what is said, but much has been twisted and corrupted by the early roman (materialistic) church.
The Gnostic:
To believe that God would only reveal Himself to one ‘clan’ (or ‘race’) of people (i.e. the Hebrews/Jews) demonstrates the typical blindness and ignorance of many religious people! It is claimed that the “Israelites” are the “chosen people of God.” This claim is, indeed, true – but again we have to understand what this name or “title” (i.e. "ISRAEL") actually means in the ancient Hebrew. The term ISRAEL comes from three Hebrew roots: ’ish (= a Spiritual / conscious ‘being’/‘human’); ra’eh (= ‘seeing’/’vision’); and ’el (= ‘God’ / ‘Supreme Spirit’). Thus, when put together, the word (Israel) means: “Spiritually conscious one who SEES God.”
Caretaker:
Israel = "God prevails"
Reply:
This definition is only the 'opinion' of Spiritually ignorant scholars (i.e. the modern day 'scribes' and Pharisees) who do not, and never have, understood the Truth. Philo Judaeus (a Jewish contemporary of Jesus) stated that the name Israel originally meant "one who sees (and knows) God". This makes complete sense, both from the three Hebrew root words, and in the circumstances of its use to rename Jacob.
The Gnostic:
From this explanation it should be quite obvious that the term does not apply to any particular ‘race’ or ‘clan’ of people, but to ALL those who SEE, and thus KNOW God, i.e. all genuine Gnostics! So certainly the TRUE 'Israelites' (i.e. Gnostics) are the chosen people of God! This explanation is also confirmed by the fact that Jacob was given this title (or name) after having had a "face to face" vision of God (see GEN. 32:28-30).
I obtained this information from a remarkable new book called the "Church of God? or the Temples of Satan" by R.A.Anderson. Has anyone read it yet?
Caretaker:
The book is a false teaching and not worth the paper it is printed on, for it is a false teaching and denies the very truth of the person and teaching of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord God manifest in the flesh.
Reply:
Have you actually read the book? I think not. If not, how can you criticise it???
I will quote a passage from this book to you - if you can bear to read it:
Once again, it must be emphasised that it is absolutely essential to have an open mind if one genuinely desires to know the Truth. To stubbornly cling to traditional ‘beliefs’ and arrogantly ignore all further facts and revelations is exactly what many Jews did at the time of Jesus (e.g. the scribes (= religious scholars); the Sadducees (= aristocratic, authoritarian, materialistic, priestly, literalists); and the Pharisees (= popular, self-righteous, conservative theologians / philosophers) – who are all so much criticised in the pages of the New Testament. The problem with all these types – then, as today – is their stubborn arrogance and pride. It is reported that Jesus said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the Kingdom of Heaven.” (MATT.18:3). In other words, anyone wishing to understand the Truth must first cleanse their mind of all indoctrinated religious beliefs, pride, and prejudice, and be completely open and ready to listen and learn afresh, like little children.
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A. Ben-Shema
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quote:
Originally posted by Caretaker:
The Gnostic:
First we must define what a genuine Gnostic is. The word comes from ancient Greek (Gnosis), and means Divine (i.e. Mystical / Spiritual) experiential KNOWLEDGE of God (i.e. the “Supreme Power”, the “ALL”). Thus a genuine Gnostic is one who has such “first-hand” Divine KNOWLEDGE of God. (N.B. Not mere 'book knowledge', 'beliefs', or 'theories'!)
Caretaker:
http://www.meta-religion.com/Esoterism/Gnosticism/gnosticism.htm
Beliefs
Gnosis refers to a knowledge that is essential to free oneself from the evil material world and bodily existence (Crim: 277). Gnostics believe humans err because they are ignorant, unlike the Christian belief that man is sinful by nature. Gnostics will receive salvation when they gain knowledge, gnosis. The knowledge must be of their inner self or soul. It is similar to the Hindu definition of meditation (Borce).
Some of the basic beliefs of Gnosticism are as follows:
"Between this world and the God incomprehensible to our thought, the 'primal cause,' there is an irreconcilable antagonism.
The 'self,' the 'I' of the gnostic, his 'spirit' or soul, is unalterably divine.
This 'I,' however, has fallen into this world, has been imprisoned and anaesthetized by it, and cannot free itself from it.
Only a divine 'call' from the world of light loosens the bonds of captivity.
The Gnostic:
The question is: was Jesus a Gnostic? If what we are told in the New Testament is true, then obviously Jesus must have been a Gnostic, as must all the other great Prophets and Masters of the Old Testament. For did they not tell us that they had direct "KNOWLEDGE" of God, not from books (i.e. 'beliefs'), but through various "face to face" visions and direct personal revelations from God - HIMSELF! (Hebrew: "Shekhinah").
Caretaker:
You say that you believe that what was written in the New Testament is true, and you say that Jesus was a prophet and had to be a gnostic. You error, for Jesus did not "experience" God, He was God manifest in the flesh.
If you believe what Jesus said then you must understand that Jesus said that He was the way, the truth, and the life, and that NO ONE could come to the Father but through Jesus. Jesus said:
John 3:
16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17: For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18: He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
The Gnostic:
To believe that God would only reveal Himself to one ‘clan’ (or ‘race’) of people (i.e. the Hebrews/Jews) demonstrates the typical blindness and ignorance of many religious people! It is claimed that the “Israelites” are the “chosen people of God.” This claim is, indeed, true – but again we have to understand what this name or “title” (i.e. "ISRAEL") actually means in the ancient Hebrew. The term ISRAEL comes from three Hebrew roots: ’ish (= a Spiritual / conscious ‘being’/‘human’); ra’eh (= ‘seeing’/’vision’); and ’el (= ‘God’ / ‘Supreme Spirit’). Thus, when put together, the word (Israel) means: “Spiritually conscious one who SEES God.”
Caretaker:
Israel:
Strong's Number: 03478 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
larXy from (08280) and (0410)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Yisra'el None
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
yis-raw-ale' Proper Name Masculine
Definition
Israel = "God prevails"
1. the second name for Jacob given to him by God after his wrestling with the angel at Peniel
2. the name of the descendants and the nation of the descendants of Jacob
1. the name of the nation until the death of Solomon and the split
2. the name used and given to the northern kingdom consisting of the 10 tribes under Jeroboam; the southern kingdom was known as Judah
3. the name of the nation after the return from exile
God spoke to Moses from the burning Bush. God destroyed the false gods of Egypt, and led the Children of Israel to freedom. God established His Law from Mt. Sinai, and declared that thou shalt have no other gods before Me. Jesus confirmed the validity of the Mosaic Law in His teaching and revealed its fulfillment from the Cross of Calvary.
Jesus said to beware of false prophets:
Matt. 7:
15: Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16: Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17: Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18: A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19: Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20: Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
21: Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22: Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23: And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
The Gnostic:
From this explanation it should be quite obvious that the term does not apply to any particular ‘race’ or ‘clan’ of people, but to ALL those who SEE, and thus KNOW God, i.e. all genuine Gnostics! So certainly the TRUE 'Israelites' (i.e. Gnostics) are the chosen people of God! This explanation is also confirmed by the fact that Jacob was given this title (or name) after having had a "face to face" vision of God (see GEN. 32:28-30).
I obtained this information from a remarkable new book called the "Church of God? or the Temples of Satan" by R.A.Anderson. Has anyone read it yet?
Caretaker:
The book is a false teaching and not worth the paper it is printed on, for it is a false teaching and denies the very truth of the person and teaching of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord God manifest in the flesh.
The Apostles wrote against the gnostic heresy, and those who follow Christ must stand against it today.
1 John 5:
10: He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
11: And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
12: He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
13: These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.
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Caretaker
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The Gnostic:
First we must define what a genuine Gnostic is. The word comes from ancient Greek (Gnosis), and means Divine (i.e. Mystical / Spiritual) experiential KNOWLEDGE of God (i.e. the “Supreme Power”, the “ALL”). Thus a genuine Gnostic is one who has such “first-hand” Divine KNOWLEDGE of God. (N.B. Not mere 'book knowledge', 'beliefs', or 'theories'!)
Caretaker:
http://www.meta-religion.com/Esoterism/Gnosticism/gnosticism.htm
Beliefs
Gnosis refers to a knowledge that is essential to free oneself from the evil material world and bodily existence (Crim: 277). Gnostics believe humans err because they are ignorant, unlike the Christian belief that man is sinful by nature. Gnostics will receive salvation when they gain knowledge, gnosis. The knowledge must be of their inner self or soul. It is similar to the Hindu definition of meditation (Borce).
Some of the basic beliefs of Gnosticism are as follows:
"Between this world and the God incomprehensible to our thought, the 'primal cause,' there is an irreconcilable antagonism.
The 'self,' the 'I' of the gnostic, his 'spirit' or soul, is unalterably divine.
This 'I,' however, has fallen into this world, has been imprisoned and anaesthetized by it, and cannot free itself from it.
Only a divine 'call' from the world of light loosens the bonds of captivity.
The Gnostic:
The question is: was Jesus a Gnostic? If what we are told in the New Testament is true, then obviously Jesus must have been a Gnostic, as must all the other great Prophets and Masters of the Old Testament. For did they not tell us that they had direct "KNOWLEDGE" of God, not from books (i.e. 'beliefs'), but through various "face to face" visions and direct personal revelations from God - HIMSELF! (Hebrew: "Shekhinah").
Caretaker:
You say that you believe that what was written in the New Testament is true, and you say that Jesus was a prophet and had to be a gnostic. You error, for Jesus did not "experience" God, He was God manifest in the flesh.
If you believe what Jesus said then you must understand that Jesus said that He was the way, the truth, and the life, and that NO ONE could come to the Father but through Jesus. Jesus said:
John 3:
16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17: For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18: He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
The Gnostic:
To believe that God would only reveal Himself to one ‘clan’ (or ‘race’) of people (i.e. the Hebrews/Jews) demonstrates the typical blindness and ignorance of many religious people! It is claimed that the “Israelites” are the “chosen people of God.” This claim is, indeed, true – but again we have to understand what this name or “title” (i.e. "ISRAEL") actually means in the ancient Hebrew. The term ISRAEL comes from three Hebrew roots: ’ish (= a Spiritual / conscious ‘being’/‘human’); ra’eh (= ‘seeing’/’vision’); and ’el (= ‘God’ / ‘Supreme Spirit’). Thus, when put together, the word (Israel) means: “Spiritually conscious one who SEES God.”
Caretaker:
Israel:
Strong's Number: 03478 Browse Lexicon
Original Word Word Origin
larXy from (08280) and (0410)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Yisra'el None
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
yis-raw-ale' Proper Name Masculine
Definition
Israel = "God prevails"
1. the second name for Jacob given to him by God after his wrestling with the angel at Peniel
2. the name of the descendants and the nation of the descendants of Jacob
1. the name of the nation until the death of Solomon and the split
2. the name used and given to the northern kingdom consisting of the 10 tribes under Jeroboam; the southern kingdom was known as Judah
3. the name of the nation after the return from exile
God spoke to Moses from the burning Bush. God destroyed the false gods of Egypt, and led the Children of Israel to freedom. God established His Law from Mt. Sinai, and declared that thou shalt have no other gods before Me. Jesus confirmed the validity of the Mosaic Law in His teaching and revealed its fulfillment from the Cross of Calvary.
Jesus said to beware of false prophets:
Matt. 7:
15: Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16: Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17: Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18: A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19: Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20: Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
21: Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22: Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23: And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
The Gnostic:
From this explanation it should be quite obvious that the term does not apply to any particular ‘race’ or ‘clan’ of people, but to ALL those who SEE, and thus KNOW God, i.e. all genuine Gnostics! So certainly the TRUE 'Israelites' (i.e. Gnostics) are the chosen people of God! This explanation is also confirmed by the fact that Jacob was given this title (or name) after having had a "face to face" vision of God (see GEN. 32:28-30).
I obtained this information from a remarkable new book called the "Church of God? or the Temples of Satan" by R.A.Anderson. Has anyone read it yet?
Caretaker:
The book is a false teaching and not worth the paper it is printed on, for it is a false teaching and denies the very truth of the person and teaching of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord God manifest in the flesh.
The Apostles wrote against the gnostic heresy, and those who follow Christ must stand against it today.
1 John 5:
10: He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
11: And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
12: He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
13: These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.
--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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A. Ben-Shema
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posted
First we must define what a genuine Gnostic is. The word comes from ancient Greek (Gnosis), and means Divine (i.e. Mystical / Spiritual) experiential KNOWLEDGE of God (i.e. the “Supreme Power”, the “ALL”). Thus a genuine Gnostic is one who has such “first-hand” Divine KNOWLEDGE of God. (N.B. Not mere 'book knowledge', 'beliefs', or 'theories'!)
The question is: was Jesus a Gnostic? If what we are told in the New Testament is true, then obviously Jesus must have been a Gnostic, as must all the other great Prophets and Masters of the Old Testament. For did they not tell us that they had direct "KNOWLEDGE" of God, not from books (i.e. 'beliefs'), but through various "face to face" visions and direct personal revelations from God - HIMSELF! (Hebrew: "Shekhinah").
To believe that God would only reveal Himself to one ‘clan’ (or ‘race’) of people (i.e. the Hebrews/Jews) demonstrates the typical blindness and ignorance of many religious people! It is claimed that the “Israelites” are the “chosen people of God.” This claim is, indeed, true – but again we have to understand what this name or “title” (i.e. "ISRAEL") actually means in the ancient Hebrew. The term ISRAEL comes from three Hebrew roots: ’ish (= a Spiritual / conscious ‘being’/‘human’); ra’eh (= ‘seeing’/’vision’); and ’el (= ‘God’ / ‘Supreme Spirit’). Thus, when put together, the word (Israel) means: “Spiritually conscious one who SEES God.” From this explanation it should be quite obvious that the term does not apply to any particular ‘race’ or ‘clan’ of people, but to ALL those who SEE, and thus KNOW God, i.e. all genuine Gnostics! So certainly the TRUE 'Israelites' (i.e. Gnostics) are the chosen people of God! This explanation is also confirmed by the fact that Jacob was given this title (or name) after having had a "face to face" vision of God (see GEN. 32:28-30).
I obtained this information from a remarkable new book called the "Church of God? or the Temples of Satan" by R.A.Anderson. Has anyone read it yet?
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