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Author
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Topic: The Church has developed a theology that doesn’t require much repentance. We have a t
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freddy05
Advanced Member
Member # 5854
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
In the early 1900’s and before most preaching was considered negative preaching, by today’s standards.
Divorce was almost unheard of in the Church, Protestant or Catholic…
Abortion was unthinkable even to those of he world because of the influence of Christianity…
Premarital sex would make you an outcast…
Modesty was the only excepted thought for any decent girl , unless you were a prostitute….
Women working outside the home, very uncommon….
Men and Women living together without being married….
And I am thrilled that we have moved on out of the 1900´s.
Premarital sex make you an outcast? That´s a good thing in your opinion?? Take a look at the gospels to see how Jesus treated people who had premarital sex.
Women working outside the home uncommon? I´m happy that today women can choose what they want to do. They are just as human as any many and deserve to be treated as so.
Divorce may have been less common, but so was men beating their wives in to submission with no recourse for the woman.
Oh, and remember the good old 1900´s when people who happened to have black skin had to be segragated? And the days when women couldn´t vote? Oh the good old days...
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yahsway
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Member # 3738
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posted
How can the "Church" have a theology that doesn't require much repentence?
Well, it depends on which church/assembly you are talking about or better said, which denomination.
There are some assemblies/denominations that do not preach sin and repentence.
Posts: 1238 | From: Tennessee | Registered: Aug 2004
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Eden
unregistered
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posted
from becauseHelives: The Church has developed a theology that doesn’t require much repentance.
Hi, becauseHElives. I think it takes a LOT of repentance to overcome pride, but then I may be wrong about that?
Overcoming pride is a very difficult thing which requires a LOT of repentance; in fact, it requires our EGO's surrender to what God has done for us with the cross.
I asked a new friend who does not believe yet, and I asked him:
"Do you believe that Jesus rose from the dead?" And yes, he said he believed that.
Then I asked him, "Do you believe that you are a sinner and that Jesus died for your sins?"
And that is the part that most people have a problem with. They can fairly easily say, "Oh yes, I believe that Jesus rose from the dead", because saying that, does not involve THEIR ego.
But the second question pertains to them, "Do you believe that you are a sinner and that Jesus died for your sins", requires some serious repentance on the part of the ego.
Anyone who has made that surrender or repentance automatically becomes a bornagain Christian.
So, becauseHElives, how can the church have a theology that doesn’t require much repentance? It takes a TON of repentance to become a Christian.
Be blessed.
Eden
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Caretaker
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Member # 36
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posted
Romans 8:
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Romans 12:
1: I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
2: And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Main Entry: con·form
Pronunciation: k&n-'form
Function: verb
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French conformer, from Latin conformare, from com- + formare to form, from forma form
transitive verb : to give the same shape, outline, or contour to : bring into harmony or accord <conform furrows to the slope of the land>
intransitive verb
1 : to be similar or identical; also : to be in agreement or harmony -- used with to or with <changes that conform with our plans>
2 a : to be obedient or compliant -- usually used with to <conform to another's wishes> b : to act in accordance with prevailing standards or customs <the pressure to conform>
synonym see ADAPT
Is the Christian to be similar or identical to the world or to Christ Jesus our Lord?????
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
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yahsway
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Member # 3738
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posted
Amen David! Apparantly some have forgotten the words of Yeshua. He says we must count/consider the cost of following Him. It will not always be easy.
Thats what I was referring to in my earlier post by asking is Grace free and Easy? Yes, grace is unmerited favor, a gift from God, but it will cost us something when we accept this gift. Its not always easy to walk the christian walk. We can see that in the Apostle Pauls life as well as the other disciples who gave their very lives for the gospels sake. And even today in many countries, people are being killed because of the gospel.
You are so right in that its not about "going" to church. We are suppose to "Be the Church"
Some people lose their families when they accept Yeshua, some people lose their lives.
And its serious business folks to be a christian, to love your enemies, to forgive those who have hurt and wronged you, to love your neighbor as yourselves ect..
And sin is a serious business as well. Sadly, many pastors are preaching to the flesh and what makes one "feel good" instead of preaching about Sin and how it can lead to an everlasting seperation from God.
I thank God everyday for His free-gift of salvation thru the Blood of His Son Yeshua.
I accept this gift, but I will not trample on such a great price paid for me. Shalom
Posts: 1238 | From: Tennessee | Registered: Aug 2004
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KnowHim
Admin
Member # 1
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posted
It is not about going to Church.
It is not about the bible.
It is not about having fun.
etc.........
IT IS ABOUT KNOWING JESUS CHRIST.
If you don't know Jesus on judgement day you will go to HELL, period.
You can play all the games Satan has for you to play, but if you don't KNOW Jesus you are not saved. You must be born-again. Until you are, life is about YOU. But God created us for Him.
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Matthew 7:21-23 (KJV)
Playing religious games and not knowing Jesus will only send you to hell. Satan loves deception. If you are going to Church because you think it will help save you, you are badly mistaken. You can go to Church everyday, 24/7/365 and still be lost. You must know Jesus to be born again. If you know Him you will know what make Him happy and do it.
Lost in Church? - Click Here
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Posts: 3276 | From: Charlestown, IN | Registered: Jun 2002
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shadowmaker
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Member # 3696
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by BrianGrass1234:
Bible beating and legalism just drive the weaker brother and the unsaved out, away and against the church and make those who live there lives to a legal standard into elite pharasises thinking there superior and then leaves the few who that are truly strong in their faith and seeking God and to follow God's will wondering what happend to the church. Hence America today. I mean just take a look at some of the ridiculas laws that were past into our city, county and state law books. The christians back in the day really wanted to regulate everything people did. Even those who weren't christians at all. Christians are hated now. Literally. And it not because we live a Christ like life, but because they lived like, and many still do, like the pharasisees that were always coming after Jesus because he wasn't following the law to their standards.
I would say its best to get people to understand the truth of the good news of what God has done for us, encurage them further seek the truth in the bible and though prayer, then let them and God sort out what they should and shouldn't do.
I mean really, what does it matter if someone is gay, an alcoholic, addicted to crack, a prostitute, living with their boyfriend/girlfriend or carrying debt. You need to bring these people to Christ. Once they've realized the truth of this world, that God created it, we all have sinned and deserve death, Christ came and payed that price for everyone's sin and then they accept that gift. They'll recieve the Holy Spirit and God will have no problem shining a flash light on the areas of their lives they need to change. He doesn't need busy bodies to do it for Him. especially the ones ignoring the spotlight on their own lives.
I would have to say the only time you should be interfering with anothers morality is if they are causing other belivers and non believers difficulty in finding or following God, or causing significant problems in there own lives where they really need help. And then It should be done with lots of prayer ahead of time and with a very humble heart.
AMEN!!! ![[clap2]](graemlins/clap2.gif)
Its not just the people of the world who have changed, so have the churches. Theres been so many who were there for money only. The churches have left a bad taste in alot of peoples mouths. I know bc I was one of them. What difference does it make what they look like? Preach the word to them and let God clean em up. Who cares if they are tattood and pierced? Who cares if their hair is long and purple? Politics and legalism has taken control of the churches. If someone doesnt like the clothes you wear, they take a Bible versus and twist to support it. I ve heard so many stories of people being ask to dress nicer for church. Some of those people had their best clothes on. (i m not taking daisy dukes and tube tops either) And get mad and not come back. So many churches make being a Christian like a punishment.
Why cant being a Christian be fun too? Well I m a Christian and Im having fun. God gave me the ability to smile and laugh for a reason.
And then all the bickering and fussing in the churches. Even my church isnt perfect. Someone got mad bc they didnt like the color of the dog gone toilet paper in the bathroom. ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif) ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
Now going to church is a social status thing. People go for that reason, it looks good on them in the community. Then when they get there they want to moan and groan.
Look at the country. We took God out of the schools. And now wonder why they are taking guns to school and killing their classmates. Hmmmm Thou shalt not kill is in the Bible. Honor thou mother and father, Love thy neighbor, etc etc. Forget the ladies name who was behind getting prayer out of school, but someone killed her.
They ve taken it out of the court houses. And we wonder WHY gays are getting rights.
85% of the country says they believe in God, regardless if they are saved or not. SO why and how do these laws get passed? Lawsuits and crazy laws.......
How many of you remember being RAISED by the neighborhood? If I did something wrong the neighbor got me and then when I got home mama got me, and when daddy got home he got me. And that went for all the kids in the neighborhood. But now if you do that, LAWSUIT. Some of these kids in my neighborhood now, I d love to put some foot in their hindend. If I d talked back to my mama like kids do now, I d still be picking up what was left of my teeth. And no I wasnt beaten, I was taught right from wrong. I m glad too. I m hard on my kids but they behave. One of them got best citzenship at the Christian summer camp. They make the honor roll. The 9 yr old accepted Jesus and knows about him.
SO to simply blame it on society is wrong. The church has played its part too. Lots and lots of false teachers and prophets. And legalism.
Just like on this board. Now if someone disagrees with me, they ll attack me and say I m not a Christian. Why do the unsaved want to go to church if the people in it are arguing and fussing like the rest of the world? If I dont agree with someone and I ask a question and honestly want to know. We get the "I dont want to talk to this person" or "stay on topic". I refuse to take MANS word for it. Just bc I dont agree doesnt mean I m wrong or youre wrong. Its called a discussion. Sometimes I disagree with people just to get them to convince me. Not bc I m being mean but if you cant convince somebody youre right, you ll never reach em. . Just like Rose and Osteen. I actually agreed with alot of what she said but she wouldnt talk to me bc I disagreed. Unsaved people ask questions. Then they question the questions. If you re following the Bible and teaching what is right, it shouldnt bother you if I ask 100 questions. If you dont have the answer, its ok to say "i dont know but I ll find out". Most people will respect that answer over one that is just made up or your opinion.
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Jazzee
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Member # 6040
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posted
Brian grass I can only agree on your post ![[thumbsup2]](graemlins/thumbsup2.gif)
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all things are possible for she who believes in the Lord
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Jazzee
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Member # 6040
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posted
Grace is free. We cannot add to it. Where in the Bible does it say that women have to not work outside of their home? Where does it say that we are to judge others and bang them in the head with the Bible if they don't conform to our "high" standard? Where does it say: Be selfrighteous"? Good ole days ![[cool_shades]](graemlins/cool_shades.gif) when black and white were separated in the church and so called christians defended their racism with The Bible. Good ole days when no one divorced even though they were halfways beaten to death or lived with a controlfreak that made their lifes miserable and their hearts hard.
Good ole days when there were no abortion but a girl who was unfortunate enough to get pregnant even though NO ONE had sex before marriage( where was the male part?) was looked upon as a ***** for the rest of her poor life. Good ole days when people knew how to be religious but did not know the grace of God.
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all things are possible for she who believes in the Lord
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yahsway
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Member # 3738
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posted
"is grace free and easy or is there something hard added to it?
Wow! think about how the Apostle Paul and the 12 disciples may have answered that question.
Something to think about. Shalom
Posts: 1238 | From: Tennessee | Registered: Aug 2004
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Eden
unregistered
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posted
When the Son of man comes, will He find faith on the earth?
Presumably He will find yours and mine? Or?
Matthew 18 (NJKV)
35 So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.
Matthew 10:32 (NJKV)
Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father who is in heaven.
Christians who never stand up in public for the name of and for what the Lord did, to their friends or their adversaries may not make it either if Jesus has never mentioned their name to the Father?
What really is required for salvation? Is grace free and easy or is there something hard added to it?
Eden
Eden
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BrianGrass1234
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Member # 5845
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posted
Bible beating and legalism just drive the weaker brother and the unsaved out, away and against the church and make those who live there lives to a legal standard into elite pharasises thinking there superior and then leaves the few who that are truly strong in their faith and seeking God and to follow God's will wondering what happend to the church. Hence America today. I mean just take a look at some of the ridiculas laws that were past into our city, county and state law books. The christians back in the day really wanted to regulate everything people did. Even those who weren't christians at all. Christians are hated now. Literally. And it not because we live a Christ like life, but because they lived like, and many still do, like the pharasisees that were always coming after Jesus because he wasn't following the law to their standards.
I would say its best to get people to understand the truth of the good news of what God has done for us, encurage them further seek the truth in the bible and though prayer, then let them and God sort out what they should and shouldn't do.
I mean really, what does it matter if someone is gay, an alcoholic, addicted to crack, a prostitute, living with their boyfriend/girlfriend or carrying debt. You need to bring these people to Christ. Once they've realized the truth of this world, that God created it, we all have sinned and deserve death, Christ came and payed that price for everyone's sin and then they accept that gift. They'll recieve the Holy Spirit and God will have no problem shining a flash light on the areas of their lives they need to change. He doesn't need busy bodies to do it for Him. especially the ones ignoring the spotlight on their own lives.
I would have to say the only time you should be interfering with anothers morality is if they are causing other belivers and non believers difficulty in finding or following God, or causing significant problems in there own lives where they really need help. And then It should be done with lots of prayer ahead of time and with a very humble heart.
Posts: 203 | From: Weed, CA | Registered: Jun 2006
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Eduardo Grequi
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Member # 3984
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posted
the churches of today, have been a speak easy! A positive afirmation to help people to become the best they can with out acknowledge who Jesus is truly!
Positive things are good, but they will not save you: only a true and repented heart will save you!
(Romans 10:8-11)(Rom 10:8) But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
(Rom 10:9) That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
(Rom 10:10) For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
(Rom 10:11) For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Posts: 771 | From: Belvidere, IL | Registered: Oct 2004
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Itty-Bitty Girl
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Member # 4579
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by Clay777:
Rose, I'm sad to say that we don't have many warriors left. What we do have is many cowards who have compromised with the world so that they may be pleasing to the world - but you already know that!
Yes, I am afraid, I do.
quote:
Originally posted by Clay777:
We need, we NEED God to have mercy on us and to raise up Godly preachers who don't fear man or respect the worldly church, but who fear almightly God and will preach about His holiness and how we must be holy because He is holy, and without holiness no one will see the Lord!
Amen, Clay777, and welcome to the board.
Posts: 1051 | Registered: Apr 2005
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Clay777
Community Member
Member # 5985
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posted
J4 -
Good point!
God has called me to seminary for that very purpose.
This is not to say that you have to have seminary to be used of God - not at all! All Christians are called to be salt and light, to be a witness...and a bold witness at that.
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Clay
www.truthfindersgame.com
Posts: 8 | From: Wake Forest, NC | Registered: Aug 2006
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J4Jesus
unregistered
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posted
i know this will sound smart aleck but ya'll say "we need those type of people to stand up" and all that, but why don't ya'll do it?
i'm just sayin, everyone asks me that.
*shrugs*
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Clay777
Community Member
Member # 5985
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posted
Rose, I'm sad to say that we don't have many warriors left. What we do have is many cowards who have compromised with the world so that they may be pleasing to the world - but you already know that!
We need, we NEED God to have mercy on us and to raise up Godly preachers who don't fear man or respect the worldly church, but who fear almightly God and will preach about His holiness and how we must be holy because He is holy, and without holiness no one will see the Lord!
We are in the middle of Laodicea and I pray that God will send us a true revival.
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Clay
www.truthfindersgame.com
Posts: 8 | From: Wake Forest, NC | Registered: Aug 2006
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Clay777
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Oh, that this topic was preached in EVERY church this Sunday!
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Clay
www.truthfindersgame.com
Posts: 8 | From: Wake Forest, NC | Registered: Aug 2006
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becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87
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posted
Rose, the love of the world is what has happen.
1Jo 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things [that are] in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
Mat 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
Amo 6:1 Woe to them [that are] at ease in Zion, and trust in the mountain of Samaria, [which are] named chief of the nations, to whom the house of Israel came!
Ver. 1. Woe to them [that are] at ease in Zion,.... Or "secure" {c} there; which was a strong hold, the city of David, the seat of the kings of Judah; where their court was kept, and the princes and chief men resided and thought themselves safe, the place being well fortified with walls, towers, and bulwarks: or "at ease";
that is, in easy, prosperous, comfortable circumstances of life; as Job was before his troubles, and others he mentions, Job 16:12; though to be in such a state is not criminal, but a blessing of Providential goodness, for which men should be thankful, and make use of it aright: but "woe to the rich in Zion"
{d}, as the Vulgate Latin Version renders it, when they have nothing else but temporal riches; this is all their portion, and the whole of their consolation,
Lu 6:24; when they trust in these uncertain riches, and consume them on their lusts, as described in the following verses; are unconcerned at the troubles of others, and give them no relief, but despise them, Job 12:5; and even are thoughtless about their own future state, and put away the evil day far from them, Lu 12:19;
and such are they who like Moab are at ease from their youth as to their spiritual state, Jer 48:11; never had any true sight of sin, or sense of danger; never complain of a body of sin, or are concerned about sins of omission or commission; nor troubled with the temptations of Satan, and have no fears and doubts about their happiness; and such there be who yet are in Zion, or in a church state, which Zion often signifies; and being there, trust in it, and in the privileges of it,
and so are secure, and at ease; such are the foolish virgins and hypocrites, who place their confidence in a profession of religion, in being church members, and in their submission to external ordinances, and so cry Peace, peace, to themselves, when, destruction is at hand: and are moreover at ease, and wholly unconcerned about the affairs of Zion, both temporal and spiritual, and especially the latter;
they do not trouble themselves about the doctrines they hear, whether truth or error; and about the success of them, whether they are made useful for conversion and edification; and about the continuance of a Gospel ministry, and a succession in it; and about the discipline of the church of God, and the walk of professors; or about what trials and afflictions are like to come upon the churches; or about the judgments of God in the earth; and therefore such carnal secure persons are either called upon to awake out of their sleep, and come off of their beds of ease, and shake off their vain confidence and carnal security;
for the word may be rendered "ho" {e}, as a note of calling, as in Isa 55:1; or a threatening of calamity is denounced upon them, that the day of the Lord should come upon them as a thief in the night, or as a snare upon them that dwell on earth, and they be surprised with the midnight cry, and with the terrors of devouring flames, as the foolish virgins and hypocrite's in Zion will, Mt 25:6.
The Septuagint, Syriac, and Arabic versions, render it, "who despise Zion", or "neglect" her; and the word is sometimes used of insolent persons, and to express their insolence; see Isa 37:29; and so may be understood, not of the Jews in Jerusalem, but of the ten tribes, as the following clause; who despised Zion, the city of solemnities, the temple; and, the worship of God there, and set up the calves at Dan and Bethel, and worshipped them; and therefore a woe is denounced upon them;
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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becauseHElives
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Member # 87
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posted
In the early 1900’s and before most preaching was considered negative preaching, by today’s standards.
Negative in the sense they emphases Godly living. They preached do’s and don’t to those that might think to be “saved” but in today’s enlighten theological world this is frowned upon.
But consider this….
The so called negative preaching produced positive living
Where as
Today’s positive preaching produces negative living.
Divorce was almost unheard of in the Church, Protestant or Catholic…
Abortion was unthinkable even to those of he world because of the influence of Christianity…
Premarital sex would make you an outcast…
Modesty was the only excepted thought for any decent girl , unless you were a prostitute….
Women working outside the home, very uncommon….
Men and Women living together without being married….
Any voice, every voice that will declare to be on Yahweh’s side will raise a cry repent, turn from your evil ways, make straight the paths, redemption is drawing near.
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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