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Author
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Topic: Speaking of God in the flesh....
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epouraniois
unregistered
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posted
Perhaps this will help:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.
En arche (4 times in NT ref Gen 1.1){supplies the dependent word by context, where it is not expressed} as here and v.2, supply ‘[of the aions = ages]’. was=was (pre-existent), creation is not mentioned till v.3 – for the Logos then ‘was’, and the aions were prepared by Him - Heb 1:1,2; God who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds.
Heb 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds (aions) were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
Other combinations of ‘arch’;
In Acts 11.15 supply ‘[of our ministry’ (1 Jon 2.4)]. In Phil 4.15 supply ‘[the proclamation of] the Gospel’. Other prepositions on John 6.64 (“ex arches”); John 8.44 (“apo arches”), Heb 1.10 (“kai archas”),.
The same “was” as in v 14. the Word (Logos), as the spoken word reveals the invisible thought, so the Living Word reveals the invisible God; V18 ‘hath declared Him’ – ‘eis’, ‘in’=into, expresses continued relationship. We have therefore, the Living Word to make known, lead the way by expounding “exegesis”, only here Luke 24.35; Acts 10.8; 15.12, 14; 21.19.
Note the figure Polysyndeton, with ‘pros’ implying personal presence and relation (also v18) God with the article = the revealed God of the Bible, THE WORD WAS GOD. This is correct, the article designates THE WORD as the subject.
(1) The order of the words. - In the second sentence of the first verse the original is: Ho logos en pros ton Theon (‘The Word was toward the God’). In the third sentence, however, the order of the words is reversed, Kai Theos en ho logos (‘And God was the Word’).
This change of order is an example of the figure called in Greek Hyperbaton (‘To step over’) and in English ‘Transposition’.
‘Special attention is desired for some particular word. Placed in its ordinary and usual position, it may not be noticed. But, put out of its usual and placed at the beginning, instead of at the end of a sentence, it is impossible for the reader not to be arrested by it’ (Dr. Bullinger’s ‘Figures of Speech’).
The particular word brought into prominence in this case is Theos. The figure therefore emphasis’s the fact that the One Who is revealed under the title Ho Logos is Himself truly and essentially ‘God’. With a few exceptions, we may tell which is the subject or the predicate of a sentence by the presence or absence of the article. In all three clauses here it is ‘The Word’ that is the subject:
‘THE WORD’. - He it is Who was in the beginning.
‘THE WORD’. - He it is Who was with God.
‘THE WORD’. - He it is Who was God.
Parallel with this last form of expression is that found in 4:24, Pneuma ho Theos. Literally, this would be ‘Spirit the God’, but if we render it so that the English reader will get the same effect as the original would give to a Greek, we should have: ‘God is (as to His essence) SPIRIT’ (not ‘a spirit’). So in 1:1, ‘The Word was (as to His essence) GOD’ (not ‘a god’).
(2) The absence of the article. - There are some who would translate it thus: ‘The Word was a God’, because Theos is without the article. The following references, however, all of which occur in the prologue, will be enough to show the incorrectness of such a translation.
‘There was a man sent from a God’ (6).
‘Power to become children of a God’ (12).
‘Which were born of a God’ (13).
‘No man hath seen a God at any time’ (18).
The last reference from verse 18 corresponds with that of verse 1, as is seen by the structure:
‘The Word was God’ (as to His substance or essence).
‘No man hath seen God’ (as to His substance or essence).
A similar usage of the article, or rather of its absence, is found in verse 14:
‘The Word was made flesh’.
It would be manifestly absurd to translate this ‘The Word was made a flesh’. The word Theos is used of God in the Scriptures in three different ways:
(1) Essentially, as in John 4:24: ‘God is Spirit’.
(2) Personally, as of the Father: ‘God the Father’ (Gal. 1:1).
Personally, as of the Son: ‘Unto the Son, He saith ... O God’ (Heb. 1:8). Personally, as of the Spirit: ‘The Holy Ghost ... God’ (Acts 5:3,4).
(3) Manifestly, as of the Word: ‘The Word was God’ (1:1).
Hebrew word salvation # 3444 is Yeshua:
Mat 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
H3444 - salvation
ישׁוּעה
yeshu^‛a^h
yesh-oo'-aw
Feminine passive participle of H3467; something saved, that is, (abstractly) deliverance; hence aid, victory, prosperity: - deliverance, health, help (-ing), salvation, save, saving (health), welfare.
Deu 10:17 For the LORD [Jehovah] your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a Great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward:
Neh 8:6 And Ezra blessed the LORD [Jehovah] , the great God. And all the people answered, Amen, Amen, with lifting up their hands: and they bowed their heads, and worshiped the LORD [JHVA] with their faces to the ground.
Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ;
Gen 15:1 After these things the word of the LORD [Jehovah] came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.
Pro 26:10 The great God that formed all things both rewardeth the fool, and rewardeth transgressors.
Isa 40:3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.
Joh 13:19 Now I tell you before it come, that, when it is come to pass, ye may believe that I am.
1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
The Bible says that:
The heavens are the work of God's hands (Ps 102:25
The heavens are the work of Jesus hand (Heb 1:10)
God laid the foundations of the earth (Is 48:13)
Jesus laid the foundations of the earth (Heb 1:10)
God is our judge (Ps 50:6, Eccl 12:14)
Jesus is our judge ( 2 Tim 4:1, Rev 20:12)
God is the temple of the New Jerusalem (Rev 21:22)
Jesus (the Lamb) is the temple of the New Jerusalem (Rev 21:22)
God is the alpha & omega (Rev 1:8)
Jesus is the alpha & omega (Rev 22:13)
God is the first and last (Is 44:6, 48:12)
Jesus is the first and last (Rev 22:13)
God is the beginning and the end (Rev 21:6)
Jesus is the beginning and the end (Rev 22:13)
Only God can forgive sins (Lk 5:21)
Jesus forgives sins (Lk 5:20)
God is our hope (Ps 71:5)
Jesus is our hope (1 Tim 1:11)
God is eternal (Deut 33:27)
Jesus is eternal (Is 9:6, Heb 1:10,11)
God will come with all the holy ones (Zech 14:5)
Jesus will come with all the holy ones (1 Thess 3:13)
Only God is our savior (Is 43:11)
Jesus is our savior (Tit 2:13, 2 Pet 1:1)
God is the creator of the universe (Is 44:24, Jer 27:5)
Jesus is the creator of the universe (Jn 1:3)
To God, every knee will bow and every tongue confess (Is 45:22,23)
To Jesus, every knee will bow and every tongue confess (Phil 2:10,11)
God is the same and his years will have no end (Ps 102:27)
Jesus is the same and his years will have no end (Heb 1:12)
God is immutable (Mal 3:6)
Jesus is immutable (Heb 13:8)
God is over all (Ps 97:9)
Jesus is over all (Jn 3:31)
The spirit of God dwells in us (Rom 8:9)
The spirit of Jesus dwells in us (Gal 4:6)
God is a stone of offense and a stumbling block (Is 8:14)
Jesus is a stone of offence and a stumbling block (1 Pet 2:8)
God was valued at 30 pieces of silver (Zech 11:12,13)
Jesus was valued at 30 pieces of silver (Mt 26:14-16)
God is our shepherd (Ps 23:1)
Jesus is our shepherd (Jn 10:11, 1 Pet 5:4, Heb 13:20)
God is Mighty God (Is 10:21)
Jesus is Mighty God (Is 9:6)
God is Lord of Lords (Deut 10:17, Ps 136:3)
Jesus is Lord of Lords (Rev 17:14)
God is our only Rock (Is 44:8, Ps 18:2, 94:22)
Jesus is our rock (1 Cor 10:4)
God is our owner (Is 54:5)
Jesus is our only owner (Jude 4)
No one can snatch us out of God's hand (Deut 32:39)
No one can snatch us out of Jesus hand (Jn 10:28)
God is the horn of salvation (2 Sam 22:3)
Jesus is the horn of salvation (Lk 1:68,69)
God renders according to our works (Ps 62:12)
Jesus renders according to our works (Mt 16:27, Rev 22:12)
God loves and corrects (Prov 3:12)
Jesus loves and corrects (Rev 3:19)
God's words will stand forever (Is 40:8)
Jesus words will stand forever (Mt 24:35)
God is the eternal light (Is 60:19)
Jesus is the eternal light (Jn 8:12, Rev 21:3)
God seeks to save the lost (Ez 34:16)
Jesus seeks to save the lost (Lk 19:10)
Paul is a slave of God (Tit 1:1)
Paul is a slave of Jesus (Rom 1:1)
God raised Jesus from the dead (Gal 1:1)
Jesus raised himself from the dead (Jn 2:19-21)
God is our guide (Ps 48:14)
Jesus is our guide (Lk 1:79)
God is our deliverer (Ps 70:5, 2 Sam 22:2)
Jesus is our deliverer (Rom 11:26)
God is called God (Is 44:8)
Jesus is called God (Is 9:6, Jn 20:28)
God is the King of Israel (Is 44:6)
Jesus is the King of Israel (Mt 27:42, Jn 1:19)
Since the Bible doesn't contradict itself, how can all these things be true if Jesus is not God?
Mat 13:11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
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HisGrace
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posted
I am not too familiar with all of the JW's views on the Bible, Primo, but I have added some further thoughts to "God in the Flesh" - maybe they will help you.
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Primoa1970
Advanced Member
Member # 1016
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posted
Hello again! This weekend, my wife and I were supposed to go and witness to a Jehovah's Witnesses couple in their home. Well....the snow sort of thwarted those plans for another time (all in God's providence of course). I have all of my "Deity of Christ" verses ready to go still.
For research sake, I went to the official J.W. website concerning John 1:1 (which is the verse that they always seem to try and use against us as Christians). Unfortunately, the NWT (New World Translation) adds the article "a" in between "word" and "God" (their version also uses God with a small g). This of course, makes it read like this:
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the word was "a" god."
Now....correct me if I'm wrong but....wouldn't that constitute 2 gods?? One thing I know for sure is that J.W.'s are not polytheists. This would shoot down their entire theology as far as God in the flesh is concerned.
So how do they get around this? What should my defense be? Did the Watchtower & Tract society rewrite scripture to their own liking?
-Primo
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1 John 1
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
Posts: 639 | From: Orlando, FL | Registered: Feb 2003
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