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Topic: the "meeting" the Lord in the air is an "apantesis"
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oneinchrist
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posted
Amen Carol!
We can all fight and bicker about the when is this and when is that, is it before this or after that, or is it pre, mid, or post, or is it symbolic, spiritual, literal, or literally spiritual etc. etc. etc.......but are we ready for that Day? That is what really matters
The truth is........ that what is sanctifying to the heart......is the anticipation/hopeful expectation of beholding the glory of our Lord and Savior coming on the clouds of heaven to take us home to Him. Heaven forbid if any of us were to say(in that Great and Mighty Day)........Jesus, I didnt think you were supposed to be here yet. I thought I had it figured out.
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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Carol Swenson
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Hi Betty!
We are told to watch for our Lord's coming.
The apostle Paul picks up Jesus' language in his own admonition to the Thessalonians:
But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, "Peace and safety!" then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. . . . Therefore let us not sleep, as others do, but let us watch and be sober. (I Thessalonians 5:1-4, 6)
Thieves send no warning messages ahead of them that they are coming, so break-ins are usually sudden and shocking events. We are assured that Christ's return will be equally surprising to most on the earth. The Bible's indications are that He will come when a majority of people least expect Him.
Yet, Christians should not be taken by surprise. We are supposed to be aware of the signs of the times, evaluating the course of events, and growing in the grace and knowledge of God, so that, no matter when He comes, we are prepared to meet Christ in the air. Because we are not in darkness, our eyes should be fixed on what is truly important during these troubled times: God's Kingdom and His righteousness.
Like his Master, Paul tells us to watch, and he adds, "Be sober." A sober person's mind is unadulterated by anything that would cause poor judgment, as a drunk's ability to make proper decisions is affected by the booze in his system.
This should be our stance now, despite what people claim about the timing of Christ's return. The promise of His coming has not been delayed, and things are not as they always were. God's plan marches on; He is maneuvering events, circumstances, and individuals into place. We have been given front-row seats to witness the most astounding series of prophetic fulfillments in human history, and to keep them, we must watch, be sober, and prepare for the return of Jesus Christ.
(truegospel.org)
The King of Kings and Lord of Lords' glorious appearing at the end of the Tribulation, on the other hand, will be seen by ALL people.
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Betty Louise
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Your right Carol. God will take His Church out of this world before the tribulation.
betty
1Th 1:10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, [even] Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
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oneinchrist
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There are different schools of thought on the words "keep from" ........some believe that it is a promise "to be protected from".
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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Carol Swenson
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Rev 3:10
Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
Greek: ek
Out of, from, by, away from
It doesn't say He will keep us during the hour or through it, He says from it.
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oneinchrist
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I do believe the scriptures when they say that we are "caught up in the air". Since I also believe the scriptures teach that the Great tribulation is before the Coming of Jesus, I believe(like Eden) that Jesus' Coming is the Hallmark evidence of the end of Gods patience, the gathering of His harvest, and the establishment of His Kingdom on earth. I admit that I am not sure what the very next thing will be after us being "caught up with Jesus" in the air......but I do not believe that we go to heaven and wait for another Great tribulation/or even part of a Great tribulation to end.
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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Carol Swenson
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Actually, I wasn't mocking Eden. Just the whole U turn theory strikes me as hilarious.
It's eis apantēsin
G529. ἀπάντησις apantēsis; gen. apantēseōs, fem. noun from apantaō (G528), to meet coming from different directions. A meeting (Matt. 25:1, 6; Acts 28:15).
In 1 Thess. 4:17, the expression eis (unto) apantēsin (meeting) indicates that the Lord will be coming from one direction and we shall be coming from another to meet together in the air. See Sept.: 1 Sam. 9:14; 1 Chr. 12:17; Jer. 41:6.
Syn.: sunantēsis (G4877), meeting with; enteuxis (G1783), meeting at one place, interview, supplication.
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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
WildB wrote, about Eden quote:
Galatians 2:5,6
To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.[6] But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person:) for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me:
But Jesus said,
Matthew 26:40
And He came to the disciples and found them asleep and He said to Peter, "What, could you not even watch with me for one hour?
I, like you and Carol Swenson, are saved by the blood which Jesus shed on Calvary for our sins, but thankfully He rose again.
And the Lord Jesus will be MY substitute, WildB, as much as He will be YOUR Substitute, and as much as He will be YOUR Subtitute, Carol Swenson.
Like it or not, God has accepted me on the basis of the bloof His Son Jesus shed at Calvary. Can you also accept me as being saved by the blood of Jesus?
For you have heard my confession, "Jesus took my place and died for my sins on the painful cross, and Jesus also rose again on the third day, that He might be my Living Lord and Savior, and that He will come again to rule and reign over the nations of Jerusalem" .... WildB and Carol Swenson, do you really think that a nonbornagain person is going to make a confession like that?
Matthew 26:40
And He came to the disciples and found them asleep and He said to Peter, ]b]What, could you not even watch with Me for one hour?[/b]
love, Eden
You can give a drunk a 5$ bill and he will quote scripture and confess Christ too.
ON THIS WE STAND.
Personal SALVATION is by God's grace, through faith in the crucified, risen, and glorified Christ (Rom.3:24-28; Eph.2:8,9; Cor.15:1-4).
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That is all.....
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Eden
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The Greek word "apantesis" means to "out of courtesy, go out to meet an oncoming important person, and when you reach the place where the important person is, you greet Him and you turn around with Him to the place that HE is going, not to the place where YOU are going".
THAT, church, is the meaning of the Greek word "apantesis", used in the New Testament verse:
1 Thessalonians 4:17
Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet {Greek, apantesis Lord in the air; and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
1 Corinthians 15
51 Look, I show you a mystery; We shall not all sleep but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
In rhe twinkling of an eye, by the miraculous hand of God, we ascend in our glorified bodies from the earth to where Jesus and the heavenly host are waiting above the earth, and in the twinkling of an eye, we meet (Greek, apantesis} the Lord Jesus in the air, where we joyfully greet Him as "our oncoming important guest", and WE accompany this important guest, the Lord Jesus, to where He is going.
And HE is going TO THE EARTH:
Malachi 4
1 For, look, the day comes that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yes, all who do wickedly shall be stubble; and the day that comes shall burn them up, says the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
2 But to you who fear My name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in His wings; and you shall go forth and grow up as calves of the stall.
3 And you shall tread down the wicked for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, says the LORD of hosts.
The Greek word "Parousia" refers to a "victorious king" whose army has "taken a city" and after the city is taken by the army, the army commander sends a message to the king to "come in your Parousia, lest I myself claim this city has having won it for myself".
So in His Parousia or Second Coming, the Lord Jesus will "come as the Victorious King" before Whom ran servants shouting, "Bend the knee! Bend the knee!". And whoever did NOT bow the knee "quickly enough" was hewn down with the sword at the front of the chariot procession:
Genesis 41
42 And Pharaoh took off his ring from his hand, and put it upon Joseph's hand, and clothed him in vestures of fine linen and put a gold chain about his neck.
43 And he {Pharaoh} made him {Joseph} ride in the second chariot which he had; and they cried before him, Bow the knee; and he made him ruler over all the land of Egypt.
When the Lord Jesus comes at His Parousia or His Victorious Second Coming, when the Lord Jesus comes close to earth, He will call His Christians who are dead to arise from the grave and He will catch the Christian who are alive up in the "apantesis", and as we go up, He will clothe us with a spiritual body like Jesus had after the resurrection of Jesus.
And we will rise into the air in our glorified bodies in which we were changed in the "twinkling of an eye", and we will ascend in our glorified bodies to "meet" or to "apantesis" the Lord Jesus in the air somewhere above the earth.
And then we will "apantesis" or "accompany the Lord Jesus wherever HE is going", which is to "take over the earth and to rule over the nations from Jerusalem".
And on the day when the Lord Jesus and we Christians in our glorified bodies going to Jerusalem "reach the earth", we will find that the resisting wicked ones who did "not bow the knee" because they did not want "this man to reign over us" will be as "ashes under the soles of our feet".
After dying for our sins as the Suffering Servant and Suffering Son of Isaiah 53, the Lord Jesus is next coming as the Parousia Victorious King, and we will receive our glorified bodies "in the twinkling of an eye" and we will be "caught up" in our glorified bodies to "meet" or "apantesis" the oncoming Lord Jesus in the air, and so shall we be "ever with the Lord".
And we accompany the oncoming Lord Jesus to Jerusalem and to the Mount of Olives where His feet will touch down, as we accompany Him in His Parousia in our glorified bodies, received "in the twinkling of an eye".
love, Eden
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Eden
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WildB wrote, about Eden quote:
Galatians 2:5
To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
But Jesus said,
Matthew 26:40
And He came to the disciples and found them asleep and He said to Peter, "What, could you not even watch with me for one hour?
I, like you and Carol Swenson, are saved by the blood which Jesus shed on Calvary for our sins, but thankfully He rose again.
And the Lord Jesus will be MY substitute, WildB, as much as He will be YOUR Substitute, and as much as He will be YOUR Subtitute, Carol Swenson.
Like it or not, God has accepted me on the basis of the bloof His Son Jesus shed at Calvary. Can you also accept me as being saved by the blood of Jesus?
For you have heard my confession, "Jesus took my place and died for my sins on the painful cross, and Jesus also rose again on the third day, that He might be my Living Lord and Savior, and that He will come again to rule and reign over the nations of Jerusalem" .... WildB and Carol Swenson, do you really think that a nonbornagain person is going to make a confession like that?
Matthew 26:40
And He came to the disciples and found them asleep and He said to Peter, ]b]What, could you not even watch with Me for one hour?[/b]
love, Eden
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WildB
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Gal.2
[4] And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:
[5] To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
[6] But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person : ) for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me:
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That is all.....
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Eden
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okay, here's my thing today, WildB and Carol Swenson, thankfully I come from an emotionally stable family and after I got saved at some point, I was even stabler emotionally than before.
And so I have a strong personality and can take the mocking and ridicule and even the flat-out rejection.
But if someone came from an emotionally UNSTABLE background and got saved and found the refuge of the Lord Jesus Christ, and then they encounter the mocking and ridicule and even flat-out rejection from two supposedly "Christian elders", that person might well have a nervous breakdown and even commit suicide, just based on this last-resort mocking and ridicule and rejection that you have, say, put out to me.
I'm saying you need to be careful with what you are saying as a bornagain Christian, because if you are ridiculing and mocking a Christian who comes from a fractious emotional background and found refuge in Jesus, and then within the church that person is mocked and ridiculed, then you could have their nervous breakdown or worse on your hands.
As I said, I thankfully came from an emotionally stable background when I got saved, and Jesus only made me stronger, but for Christian "elders" both WildB and Carol Swenson (I know she said she was 60 years old or so), I think you need to be a lot more careful of the mocking that you do IN THE CHURCH, and it is UNBECOMING of Christian "elders", in the Lord Jesus Christ, in my opinion.
You never know ahead of time what a person's emotional background is, before you start to mock and ridicule him or her.
Isaiah 40:1
Comfort, comfort My people, says your God.
1 Thessalonians 5:11
Wherefore comfort yourselves together and edify one another, even as also you are doing.
Because you have limited information, you need to be careful of whom you are mocking and ridiculing, as you have me.
Then they:
ohn 9:34
They answered him saying, You were altogether born in sins and do you teach us? And they threw him out.
love, Eden
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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Eden:
Galatians 6:7
Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man sows, that shall he ![[happyhappy]](graemlins/happyhappy.gif) (or she ) also reap.
love, Eden
Weak.
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That is all.....
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Eden
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Galatians 6:7
Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man sows, that shall he (or she ) also reap.
love, Eden
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oneinchrist
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If I may join in on your conversation here (where it appears that Eden is being mocked for his presentation of thoughts on the matter of the rapture).......
I believe that the "Day of the Lord" is an expression that conveys the meaning of a "succession of events" that will begin at the time that Jesus returns and continue afterwards until the creation of the New Heaven and earth. For those who are on earth(alive) at the time of His coming, they are not doing a U turn per se, but they are being joined to the Lord and following Him wherever He goes. People have a tendency to look at this issue from a real humanistic angle of "up" and "down"......when the spiritual realm is about "being present with Jesus" or "not being with Jesus".
With love in Christ, Daniel
Posts: 1389 | From: Wind Lake, WI | Registered: May 2007
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Eden
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Hello, everyone ...
I just checked with Jesus to see if He had "really saved WildB and Carol Swenson", and Jesus told me that, "Yes, I have saved WildB and Carol Swenson by the blood of Jesus", so I guess that He accepts just about everyone and anyone. ![[youpi]](graemlins/youpi.gif)
love, Eden
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Carol Swenson
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and shall have a major traffic jam in the clouds
"Hi great-great-great Grandpa! Nice bumping into you like this. Um, which way are you headed!?"
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WildB
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Yea CS and I hear that this big U e will happen in the twinkling of a eye.
BA(edens) bible reads.
1eden4
16 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye the dead in Christ shall make their U e first.
17Then we which are alive and remain shall make a sharper U e.
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That is all.....
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Carol Swenson
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Hi WildB!
The big U turn. Millions of people who have been raptured about two seconds ago are suddenly spun into a U turn and headed back to earth. I wonder what that would look like.
Have you ever ridden the bumper cars in an amusement park?
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Eden
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1 Thessalonians 4
17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet {Greek, apantesis} the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Dr. James McKeever, for one, has pointed out that the Greek word for meet in 1Thes.4:17 above is the word apantesis.
This word occurs only 4 times in the NT (see Strong's 529), and means to go out to meet an arriving person, and then TO TURN AROUND and ACCOMPANY THAT PERSON BACK TO WHERE WE CAME FROM.
A good example of how apantesis works is found in Acts 28:15, where the Christian brethren of Rome heard that Paul was coming toward Rome, and so the brethren left Rome and came as far out of Appii Forum to meet {Greek, apantesis} the oncoming Paul:
Acts 28
14 Where we {the oncoming Paul} found brethren, and were desired to tarry with them seven days: and so we {the oncoming Paul} went toward Rome.
15 And from there, when the brethren {of Rome} heard of us, they came to MEET us as far as Appii forum, at The three taverns: whom when Paul saw, he thanked God, and took courage.
16 And when we came to Rome, the centurion delivered the prisoners to the captain of the guard: but Paul was suffered to dwell by himself with a soldier that kept him.
So we see the brethren went from Rome to Appii Forum, where they met or apantesis with Paul, and then the brethren turned around and accompanied Paul back to Rome.
Let me now apply this use of apantesis to 1 Thes.4:17:
1 Thessalonians 4
17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet {Greek, apantesis} the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
That is, when the Lord comes toward the earth at the Second Coming, we are caught up from the earth to meet or apantesis the Lord in the air, and then we turn around and accompany the Lord back to the earth where the Lord is headed.
When that catching up occurs, we therefore do not go to heaven, but we accompany the Lord back to the earth in our glorified bodies.
The other two instances in the NT where this word apantesis occurs are Matthew 25:1 and 25:6:
Matthew 25
1 Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet {Greek, apantesis} the bridegroom.
6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom comes; go out to meet {Greek, apantesis} him.
These two verses from Matthew 25 refer to the same event as that described in 1 Thessalonians 4:17 at the top of this Topic.
love, Eden
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