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Posted by knowHim (Member # 8) on :
January 27th Bible Reading

What stood out most to me today was the below.

Mat 18:19 "Again I say to you that if two of you agree on earth concerning anything that they ask, it will be done for them by My Father in heaven.

I always thought when this verse was referred to that anytime two or more people agree in prayer it would be done. This was confusing to me. But now that I know from John MacArthur note it is referring to what Jesus was talking about which was Church discipline. Not just two people getting together and requesting something. I know that there is power when true believers get together and pray, but this is not a verse saying you can ask someone to pray with you and then you can get what you want bible verse.

if two of you agree on earth. This promise applies to the issue of discipline discussed in verses Mat_18:15-17. The "two of you" spoken of here harks back to the two or three witnesses involved in step two of the discipline process.
Posted by Betty Louise (Member # 7175) on :

I am confuse . Maybe it is because I am sick at the moment. I have always heard preachers used this verse when they prayed over the sick. How is this verse supposed to be used?
Posted by knowHim (Member # 8) on :
Below is the whole context in which they are actually discussing church discipline.

(Matthew 18:15) "Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.

(Matthew 18:16) But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that 'BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY WORD MAY BE ESTABLISHED.'

(Matthew 18:17) And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.

(Matthew 18:18) "Assuredly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

(Matthew 18:19) "Again I say to you that if two of you agree on earth concerning anything that they ask, it will be done for them by My Father in heaven.

(Matthew 18:20) For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them."

John MacArthur state the following:
(two or three) Jewish tradition requires at least ten men (a minyan) to constitute a synagogue or even hold public prayer. Here Christ promises to be present in the midst of an even smaller flock—"two or three witnesses" gathered in His name for the purpose of discipline

So in this passage, Jesus is talking about church discipline. I do not see where he is including anything else. Just seems interesting to me. Jesus must be letting people know that He is changing the Jewish traditions. Which He did a lot.

I am sure it is always better to pray together in groups.

Posted by WildB (Member # 2917) on :
Originally posted by Betty Louise:

I am confuse . Maybe it is because I am sick at the moment. I have always heard preachers used this verse when they prayed over the sick. How is this verse supposed to be used?

Found this and was led to post....its from

Now, let’s see what the Lord Jesus told Paul about how prayer works today in the dispensation of grace. Here’s where we find the answer to the problem of unanswered prayer!

We begin with a passage in Paul’s letter to the Romans where Paul begins to explain what the Lord told him about prayer today under grace, and why we don’t get everything that we pray for today:

26 “Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

27 “Now He who searches the hearts knows what the mind of the Spirit is, because He makes intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

28 “And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose” (Rom. 8:26-28).

For those of us in the dispensation of grace, God never promises that He will give us everything that we ask. You can abundantly prove this by simply reading through the letters written by the Apostle Paul. He wrote thirteen letters, from Romans to Philemon, and we never read a prayer promise like “Whatever you ask,” or “ask what you desire.” Instead we read that “We do not know what to pray for as we ought” (Rom. 8:26).

God has promised to “work all things together for good” in our lives, but He hasn’t revealed HOW He is going to do that. He has promised it, and we take that by faith and believe that He is working all things—even the “tragedies” of life—together for good for us; but we often don’t see it. But as Paul wrote, “We walk by faith and not by seeing.”

Since we don’t know how God is going to work all things for good, we don’t know exactly how to pray. How could God promise us that He will answer all our prayers, if He tells us up-front that we don’t even know what to pray for?

Paul’s letters contain many testimonies of unanswered prayers. People flock today to hear testimonies of answered prayers, but Paul writes of many of his unanswered prayers! He knew how to pray in the dispensation of grace, and didn’t become discouraged when he didn’t receive what he asked for. He believed that his Father in heaven had everything under control and was working all things together for his good. He gives us a great testimony of unanswered prayer in 2 Corinthians 12:8-9.

7 “And lest I should be exalted above measure by the abundance of the revelations, a thorn in the flesh was given to me, a messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I be exalted above measure.

8 “Concerning this thing I pleaded with the Lord three times that it might depart from me.

9 “And He said to me, `My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness.’ Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

10 “Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in needs, in persecutions, in distresses, for Christ’s sake. For when I am weak, then I am strong” (2 Cor. 12:7-10).

We see in verse 7 that God allowed Paul to suffer with this “thorn in the flesh,” some physical suffering that even came from Satan, but God allowed it for a good purpose in Paul’s life. But Paul pleaded for the Lord to remove the problem. Don’t we always pray, “Fix it, Lord!”? We find Paul praying, pleading three times, for the Lord to fix his problem.

And then the Lord spoke, and He didn’t say, “Whatever you ask you’ll receive, if you have faith!” No! Not at all. The Lord told Paul that His grace would be enough, sufficient for him—and His grace means His power working in Paul’s life. “My power is made perfect in your weakness.” We always want the Lord to just fix the problem; He wants to show the sufficiency of His grace, and the magnificence of His power working in our lives so that we can “bloom wherever He has planted us!”

Paul’s whole attitude about suffering changed as a result of this prayer experience. He says that he learned to take “pleasure [!] in infirmities, in reproaches, in needs, in persecutions, in distresses, for Christ’s sake. For when I am weak, then I am strong.”

We need to learn that it is not God’s will to take away all our problems, to fix all our weaknesses, to remove all our needs, but it is God’s will in all the circumstances of our lives to give us all the grace and strength that we’ll need to live through the problems, and even to rejoice in them!

Paul prayed for the Colossian saints:

“For this reason we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to ask that you may be filled with the knowledge of His will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding…strengthened with all might, according to His glorious power, for all patience and longsuffering with joy” (Col. 1:9-11).

He prayed that these saints would be “filled with the knowledge of God’s will” and the result would be that they would be “strengthened with all might [wow!], according to His glorious power [think of that!], for all patience and longsuffering with joy.”

“Patience” here speaks of endurance and perseverance in the face of life’s circumstances, while “longsuffering” speaks of having a “long fuse” on our tempers when faced with unpleasant people in our lives, and Paul says to do this all with “joy!” God doesn’t promise to take away all our problems, to answer all our prayers—we don’t even know what to ask for—but He does promise to give us the grace and strength that we’ll need to live under the difficult circumstances of life, and to live with the difficult people of life, and to do it all with joy.

That’s God’s picture of being “strengthened with all might according to His glorious power.” It’s living in the midst of trying circumstances and difficult people that would drive anyone else crazy, but instead of despair, there’s joy. That’s real power, and grace—and the Lord Jesus says to us today, “My grace is sufficient for you wherever you are, and whatever your problems may be, I’m working it all together for good, and My power is being made perfect. It reaches its greatest expression and demonstration when you are weak, but miraculously, you find that by faith you are `strengthened with all might…for patience and longsuffering with joy.'”

Paul never forgot the lesson that the Lord taught him from his “thornprayer.” Many years later Paul would write to the Philippians out of a prison cell—near the end of five years spent in prison for the Lord:

11 “Not that I speak in regard to need, for I have learned in whatever state I am, to be content:

12 “I know how to be abased, and I know how to abound. Everywhere and in all things I have learned both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.

13 “I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me” (Phil. 4:11-13).

Paul says that he has learned the secret of contentment, he knows how to abound, and also how to be abased. God does not promise us today, living in the dispensation of grace, that He is going to fix all our problems, but He does promise us grace more than enough to make us able to rejoice through it all. So Paul writes that everywhere and in all things he has learned how to cope, and more, how to cope with joy. And the secret? “I can do all things through Christ who [constantly] strengthens me.” We can almost hear those words from years before still ringing in Paul’s heart, “My strength is made perfect in your weakness” as Paul writes, “I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.”

When the woman from Far Rockaway prayed for her husband and had everyone praying for him, if only her pastor had understood how to “rightly divide the word of truth” (2 Timothy 2:15), realizing that the prayer promises in the Four Gospels are not given to us today, living under grace in the dispensation of grace, but were made to Israel with their Messianic Kingdom in view. Even in the Letter of James where he writes about the “prayer of faith,” and how God would heal the sick, we need to read the first verse of James’ letter, and see that he is only writing to “the twelve tribes scattered abroad.” This is not “our mail” in the Bible. We can read it and study it and learn from it, but we need always to remember that the twelve tribes and the chosen nation are today “on the outs with God,” and these promises, their promises, don’t work today.

I am more than confident that the verse below is a constant truth in any dispensation.

Malachi 3:16 Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name.
Posted by knowHim (Member # 8) on :
Thanks WildB I enjoyed that.


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