|
Author
|
Topic: No Oscar Nod For God??
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Nobleweb,
You most assuredly do not have any personal knowledge of Mel Gibson whatsoever so therefore you should not be judging him nor tearing him down!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged | 
|
|
nobleweb
Advanced Member
Member # 2156
|
posted
quote:
Not only does it espouse a subject that many in Hollywood loathe (or must pretend to loathe in order to be perceived as "hip" and/or hold onto their jobs)
Actually, this is precisely why I will not watch this movie!
Mel Gibson is a man who consistently takes God's name in vain in his movies. He also "condones" sex outside marriage and other sinful things in his movies. Why does he do this? TO BE "HIP" AND HOLD ONTO HIS HIGH PAYING JOB!
Posts: 26 | Registered: Sep 2003
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Bloodbought
Advanced Member
Member # 4365
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by volodymyrdolgoruki:
Think it's time to get the focus OFF the movie.
People view truth from different perspectives:
Some see black and white
Others see varrying shades or Grey.
The REAL questions are
1. How much is your faith growing?
2. How is it being manifested to the lost?
#1 MUST lead to #2 or it's meaningless
Amen,
1 and 2 are the important issues.
Posts: 822 | From: Ireland | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
Think it's time to get the focus OFF the movie.
People view truth from different perspectives:
Some see black and white
Others see varrying shades or Grey.
The REAL questions are
1. How much is your faith growing?
2. How is it being manifested to the lost?
#1 MUST lead to #2 or it's meaningless
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
HisGrace
unregistered
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by Bloodbought:
As I pointed out from scripture in an earlier post, faith comes by hearing, not by sight. When people hear the good news that Jesus took their sins and took the punishment for sin on their behalf, the power of the Spirit and the Word can bring them to Christ.
Sometimes when I hear a word of knowledge it comes directly from God and not the scriptures.
IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Favorminded and His Grace,
Amen! I agree with your postings! God bless you always!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
Bloodbought
Advanced Member
Member # 4365
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by HisGrace:
[QUOTE]God uses human vessels in many ways through music, inspirational books and words of knowledge to convict people. For example, you must agree that if a Christain sees a fellow believer being led astray, a concerned brother/sister can bring insightful words to that person to bring them back into the fold.
Yes’this is very true because it is very biblical. As I pointed out from scripture in an earlier post, faith comes by hearing, not by sight. When people hear the good news that Jesus took their sins and took the punishment for sin on their behalf, the power of the Spirit and the Word can bring them to Christ.
And as you say, “if a Christain sees a fellow believer being led astray, a concerned brother/sister can bring insightful words to that person to bring them back into the fold.”
Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted.
Regarding movies, if a movie has proved to be a huge success humanly speaking, is that a sign that it meets with God’s approval? I don’t think so. God uses the hearing to draw people to Christ but the enemy uses the visual to deceive. Take Eve for example, she looked at the fruit and seen that it was good, but was it? Yes, very good and she eat it but God forbid her to eat it. The problem was that what she heard was true but her vision brought such strong temptation that she was unable to resist reaching out and accepting the devils lie. Eve could actually have been better spiritually if she had been blind, because she received truth through hearing and deception through sight.
2 Cor 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.
Posts: 822 | From: Ireland | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
HisGrace
unregistered
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by Bloodbought:
How do you know it’s the movie and not the study of the word that’s winning people to Christ?
God uses human vessels in many ways through music, inspirational books and words of knowledge to convict people. For example, you must agree that if a Christain sees a fellow believer being led astray, a concerned brother/sister can bring insightful words to that person to bring them back into the fold.
Mel Gibson's motives seem to be in question here, partly because we realize he is Catholic and partly because of speculation that he had monetary gain in mind. He put $25,000,000 (have checked out the facts) of his own money into the project. He took a risk with this movie and realized that it could be a total flop. He would have no way of predicting that it would gross millions of dollars.
Even if Mel Gibson's reputation is on the line, I personally believe he was sincere with his motives. We can't deny that the movie has had a strong impact. So for such doubters lets look at it this way -
1 Corinthians 1:27
But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong.
volodymyrdolgoruki, thank-you for your apology to this forum. May God richly bless you.
IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
I've seen the movie.
I was not attacking you whan I want to known where you got the info thousands and thousands have been won to Christ from the movie.
But If you post a claim, I want to know where it came from.
If it is not based in actual data then it is a baseless claim and means nothing.
Robby, these people just dismiss the DATA from Barna,
who shows the effects of this movie were over stated and short lived.
Time will prove out Mel
He is making a movie about a druid goddess
Matthew 7:15-23
(15) "Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
(16) "You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they?
(17) "So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit.
(18) "A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit.
(19) "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
(20) "So then, you will know them by their fruits.
(21) "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.
(22) "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'
(23) "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'
Making a movie about a druid goddess?
NOW THAT SOUNDS VERY VERY CHRISTIAN
YUM GOOD FRUIT
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Robby
Advanced Member
Member # 448
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by volodymyrdolgoruki:
quote:
The Passion Of The christ has won thousands and thousands of people to Jesus Christ and that is ALL that matters!
Where did you get this stat. Where is the data showing thousands and thousands.
If you make a claim be prepared to back it up.
Trying to measure with statistics what God has done with the human heart is a rather spurious way of looking at the saving grace of Christ. Statistics can opine whether or not people were impacted, in some way, by the film. But stats cannot demonstrate the personal interaction of the Holy Spirit and transforming nature of Christ inside.
If you really must have stats though, about the best you'll do is with the Barna group (just search "The Passion" on their site).
Posts: 364 | Registered: Sep 2002
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Favor Minded
unregistered
|
posted
By no means a "feel good" movie, The Passion nonetheless makes you feel—in a most powerful way which works for good. Troubles in your own life shrink in proportion as you focus on the One who redeemed us, who shed His innocent blood to pay our colossal debt—a debt which too many of us are ignorant of. Now that Gibson has brought Christ's passion to life so that we may experience the ultimate, sacrificial death (in the convenient space of a mere two hours), those who wish to avoid the film's impact rationalize their stance by saying the film is too graphic. Yet difficult as it is to watch, this is a film to be received with reverence, wonder, and thankfulness. Gibson should be commended for his courage to show it like it was, in all its dark and grisly details. Moreover, his having made such a movie available to the world is a stunning accomplishment in itself. Modern media has been used in ways so horrendously harmful to faith and morals, that it is bittersweet justice to see this movie used as a tool of God.
The Passion is an intense paradox of divine proportions. How can a movie so graphically disturbing be refreshing and encouraging? The fact that it is so disturbing tells us something. In our own thoughts of Christ's life, we all too easily breeze by the painful parts, or else sugar-coat them so that they're palatable. But in doing this, we're in danger of minimizing the greatest act of love. How can we ponder upon the way Christ brings so much goodness out of evil if we refuse to recognize the evil? Christ assures us as He labors under the weight of the cross, "I make all things new." This applies not only to His mutilated body, but to our sin-stained souls.
Only by moving past personal prejudices to realize Gibson doesn't mean this film to be a celebration of gore, but as a means to expose the very vile nature of sin, can the viewer hope to understand why such suffering is essential. During the scourging, the soldiers delight in the spray of blood, the way many of us delight in our sins, failing to see their truly foul nature. Likewise, our moral carelessness is contrasted to Mary's tender, meticulous devotion as she mops up her Son's precious blood. As the movie progresses, every gruesome act is balanced by remarkable moments of mercy and love, such as Christ embracing the cross, Veronica wiping His face, and Mary kissing her Son's bloody feet. We respond not only to the sorrow, but to the goodness, truth, and courage. If Christ can bear all this for us, His love knows no bounds. Faith is bolstered, hope is enkindled, and life takes on new meaning.
As "Catholic" means "universal," so is this film. While working on multiple levels, it speaks to us all, no matter that the language is foreign. The subtitles, far from being distracting, appear naturally, while the use of Aramaic and Latin increase the sense of historical authenticity. What viewer could sit through this heart-wrenching drama unmoved? Voice tone, facial expressions, and actions all speak to the heart with a universal language of love, pain, and forgiveness. Ruthless acts are interspersed with skillful flashback scenes of touching proportions. The relationship of Mary and Jesus brings home to us a very human, personal aspect.
"It's just too disturbing," people still protest as an excuse to avoid the experience that may force them to alter their lives. We're fortunate Christ didn't take such an outlook when it came to saving us, for it's due to this extremely disturbing nature that forgiveness was merited and the gates of heaven were opened to us. At Christ's death, this realization is what makes the devil unleash his hellish shriek. If Christ had the courage to carry the cross and die for us, surely we can find the courage to sit back in cushy seats and behold this courage. Christ suffered excruciatingly; the least we can do is make ourselves aware of it. In this way, perhaps we can begin to appreciate just how much He suffered.
It is an understatement to say that The Passion demands your full attention. Christ endures such severe savagery from the soldiers; indeed, He invites more torture by his unwavering submission to the will of His father. Your eyes remain riveted to the screen, though forced to avert their gaze at particularly excruciating moments. Unlike the devil's unyielding black eyes, we don't delight in these brutal images. The goodness in us flinches at every whiplash. So powerful are the images portrayed—such as the sweating of blood in the garden of Gethsemane, the horrifying scourging, the forcing on of the crown of thorns—that those who have never meditated—indeed, who barely know the meaning of the word—will find themselves doing so; while others who have attempted this contemplative form of prayer will discover just how far short they have fallen from envisioning the real passion.
Conditioned by the world to avoid pain, it is all to easy to flit over Christ's sufferings briefly, even casually, as we minimize them in our imagination. This movie changes that. Faced with the stark, soul-shaking reality, one must embrace it, lest he flee like Judas, driven to despair. Only by embracing the truth can one discover the depths of supernatural beauty and love concealed in Christ's sufferings. You find yourself thinking, Christ did so much, suffered so much for me . . . What can I do for him? In contrast to the worldly attitude of, "What can I get?", the viewer now asks, "What can I give?" Like Simon who was forced to help carry the cross, we may protest at first. But then, having come so close to Christ, a holy allegiance is formed so that we will endure anything for Him—because we are with Him, and He gives us strength. And when the journey is accomplished, we do not want to leave Christ's side.
Yes, The Passion is a disturbing movie, but in a most beneficial way. It rocks mellow Christians out of a comfort zone of passive, sketchy views of the passion.
If you can bear it, you will be rewarded with the final triumph—made all the more triumphant because it is not final at all, but a glorious victory for all eternity.
The film ends, but it is not the end. Christ offers this triumph of salvation to us all—if we'll only pick up our cross and follow Him.
IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Volodymyrdolgoruki,
In answer to your question the Holy Spirit gives me my words and I do not question the Holy Spirit.
Now for some totally unknown reason you have decided to single me out and attack me in your postings in this thread. I see you deleted one of your postings where you very blatantly directed at me stated "you wouldn't know the spirit if it knocked you in the head with a baseball bat!" That's just one example. I have grown very weary of your judgemental attacks and now I'm telling you not to address me whatsoever at all ever again not only in this thread but also any other thread in which I may or may not participate!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Freaknpv,
Mel Gibson is a christian and that is what matters!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
quote:
The Passion Of The christ has won thousands and thousands of people to Jesus Christ and that is ALL that matters!
Where did you get this stat. Where is the data showing thousands and thousands.
If you make a claim be prepared to back it up.
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
freaknpv
Advanced Member
Member # 4423
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gramajo320:
Freaknpv,
That same survey was posted quite some time ago and at the bottom of the survey it told the total number of people surveyed which was only a little over 1,600 which certainly is not representative of ALL the people around the world. The Passion Of The christ has won thousands and thousands of people to Jesus Christ and that is ALL that matters!
By the way Mel Gibson is a christian.
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
Actually He is a very rich Catholic
--------------------
Head in Heaven, Fingers in the Mire
Posts: 25 | From: Cali. | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Freaknpv,
That same survey was posted quite some time ago and at the bottom of the survey it told the total number of people surveyed which was only a little over 1,600 which certainly is not representative of ALL the people around the world. The Passion Of The christ has won thousands and thousands of people to Jesus Christ and that is ALL that matters!
By the way Mel Gibson is a christian.
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
freaknpv
Advanced Member
Member # 4423
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gramajo320:
The Passion Of The Christ has been and continues to be an evangelizing witness all around the world and thousands upon thousands have been won to Jesus Christ which is and still remains the very most important thing! Those won to Jesus Christ do indeed study the bible to learn more!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
OK, I dont deny the power of and that for the most part that the Passion was powerful and effective for the believer, but to say it won "thousands upon thousans" to Jesus goes contrary to all data and reality.
A George Barna survey done in July of 2004 found
"the most startling outcomes drawn from the research is the apparent absence of a direct evangelistic impact by the movie. Despite marketing campaigns labeling the movie the “greatest evangelistic tool” of our era, less than one-tenth of one percent of those who saw the film stated that they made a profession of faith or accepted Jesus Christ as their savior in reaction to the film’s content"
That means that if 2 million people saw this movie that, would mean that less than 1000 where won to Jesus, now thats awesone, dont get me wrong, 1 is awesone but that is hardly thousands upon thousands.
The Passion succeeded in 2 areas helping christian get a better understanding of what our Lord suffered and making Mel Gibson a whole lotta money.
Now dont hurt me Im new ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
--------------------
Head in Heaven, Fingers in the Mire
Posts: 25 | From: Cali. | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
Here's something to ponder.
If the movie had been more Bible, truth centered;
Less man made centered:
More the True Word of God in it;
(Romans 10:17)
So faith comes by hearing [what is told], and what is heard comes by the preaching [of the message that came from the lips] of Christ (the Messiah Himself).
(Hebrews 4:12) For the Word that God speaks is alive and full of power [making it active, operative, energizing, and effective]; it is sharper than any two-edged sword, penetrating to the dividing line of the breath of life (soul) and [the immortal] spirit, and of joints and marrow [of the deepest parts of our nature], exposing and sifting and analyzing and judging the very thoughts and purposes of the heart.
Could God haved used it even more powerfully?
Would it had made any difference?
Would more people come to faith?
Would more peoples faith grown?
I say WITHOUT A DOUBT
YES
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
|
posted
To my Brothers and Sisters in Christ Jesus our Lord:
I want to make one final statement before I leave the Passion movie behind me. Not one spoken word in favor of or opposed to the movie, posted on a BB, will make much difference. The movie has been shown, and will continue to be so.
My fervent prayer is that any who see the movie, who do not know our Lord Jesus as personal Lord and Savior, might be moved to seek Him in His Word, and to study God's true and eternal revelations of Him as He was manifest in the flesh, dwelt among us, sacrificially bore our sins and iniquities, and set His children free.
May each of us seek more and more of our Lord Jesus Christ, and less and less of ourselves. May we seek His eternal truth, His Way, His Life, and may the lost and hurting be our top priority.
Beloved in Christ, our God reigns from everlasting to everlasting, and may all Glory, all Honor, all Praises be given from our hearts unto Him.
God bless each of you my Brothers and Sisters in Christ Jesus our Lord.
--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
|
|
mohawk
Advanced Member
Member # 2898
|
posted
Hello everyone
Wow, what a storm brewed up over this topic...
The movies, like it or not, are about the most powerful form of artistic communication. We all watch them--we all form opinions on them. There are dozens of films depicting the story of Jesus, and hundreds of films that feature Jesus in their story lines. "Ben-Hur" for example, shows Jesus in one or two very brief scenes.
It is very likely that no single film depicting Christ, gets every detail perfect. In fact, very very few films about ANY subject, get every detail. But that does not mean they are to be interpretted as an attack on the subject matter. The silent film by D.W. Griffith, "Intolerance" depicts Christ's crucifixion, without ever showing the resurrection. Yet the film is, by all practical means, very respectful and reverent. Griffith was not denying the resurrection by leaving it out--it was simply not the focal point of the film's message. (The crucifixion was). The creation of art involves the imagination and the exploration of ideas. And we possess creativity because... we are made in the likeness of The Creator; that's what The Book says.
If possessing an imagination is condemned, then any child who has ever played with a toy or made up pretend games should be locked up and preached at until they are completely "deprogrammed" from such ungodliness and void of any desire to "play" again... right????? Uh... no.
I defend "The Passion," knowing full well it is only a movie. It does not replace the Bible as the official telling of Christ's sacrifice. But it DOES stir in people an interest in finding out more... which leads them to seek out sources of information (including the Bible most definitely) that may just lead the heart to Christ. How do I know this? Well... read it here, for openers!
God works in ways that are above ours. He uses things as tools that might just baffle, confuse (perhaps even incense) some of His servants down here--because He can seem to operate by methods that don't conform to our selfish vision of how we think He OUGHT TO work.
To attempt to dictate what God is capable of doing--or likely / unlikely to do--based upon one's own faulty human intuition, or a tunnel-visioned interpretation of scripture, is to put God "in a box" and own Him. Well, He will not be owned. We need God, but He doesn't need us to determine what His methods "should" be. We have salvation ONLY because He has extended His Grace to us, through Christ.
If we could dictate the conditions by which He could bestow Grace upon us, then Christ would have been crucified for nothing.
What a sermon, here in the Movie forum, huh? Sorry to step on anyone's toes... but we've spent this entire thread sticking our toes out... and I started the thread!
May God bless this exchange, His children who are participating, and a lively discussion of His Word. Amen.
![[spiny]](graemlins/spiny.gif)
Posts: 223 | From: california | Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
Gramajo320 and everyone else.
I apologize for my lack of civility, and my judgemental attitude in posting in this topic.
My intent is not to attact you, but point out the lack of truth in the movie, Truth being Scripture.
I will keep the posts aimed in this direction.
You didn't make the movie so don't take my critisisun of the movie personally. OK?
But I also ask the same civility from you.
Defend the movie if you must.
Just don't say I'm wrong in doing so (Unless you point out lies or misquoting Scripture) or that I'm going to stand in judgement for critiquing the movie, or that by doing so I'm not in the Spirit.
Is this fair?
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
HisGrace
unregistered
|
posted
volodymyrdolgoruki, I enjoy reading your views, but I find that some of your posts make personal attacks, and you could be accused of that dreaded word that none of us Christians like to hear, "judgmental."
That doesn't mean you can't give your own personal views, but there are ways of doing it so that posters can't accuse you of attacking them personally.
Hoping you will stay.
IP: Logged |
|
|
Bloodbought
Advanced Member
Member # 4365
|
posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gramajo320:
The Passion Of The Christ has been and continues to be an evangelizing witness all around the world and thousands upon thousands have been won to Jesus Christ which is and still remains the very most important thing! Those won to Jesus Christ do indeed study the bible to learn more!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
How do you know it’s the movie and not the study of the word that’s winning people to Christ?
Posts: 822 | From: Ireland | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Volodymyrdolgoruki,
There is a huge difference between proclaiming Jesus Christ's truth as opposed to tearing others down!
I'm certain you know that so you will please walk in the spirit not the flesh! Jesus Christ's work is all about winning souls to Jesus Christ!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
I WILL NEVER NEVER REST FROM PROCLAINING TRUTH AS LONG AS HE GIVES ME THE GRACE TO CONTINUE
But it looks like you didn't even READ what I posted.
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Volodymyrdolgoruki,
You will please keep from judging me whatsoever for you know nothing about me or what's in my heart! The Lord and our Heavenly Father do know and that's all sufficient for me! I do walk in the spirit and the Holy Spirit leads me in many areas. Tearing others down is perpetuating satan's work not the Lord's work! Please walk in the spirit not the flesh!
Now it's totally past time to give all of this a complete rest!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
The Passion Of The Christ has been and continues to be an evangelizing witness all around the world and thousands upon thousands have been won to Jesus Christ which is and still remains the very most important thing! Those won to Jesus Christ do indeed study the bible to learn more!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
Bloodbought
Advanced Member
Member # 4365
|
posted
Many Christians are of the opinion that the passion of the Christ movie is a tool that can evangelise the world and bring thousands to faith in Christ, that’s fine, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. There is nothing I would like more, than to see people being converted to Christ in thousands, but I don’t believe a movie can do it and here is why.
Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing , and hearing by the word of God.
Faith comes by hearing and a movie that is intended to bring faith by sight is a violation of this biblical principle.
2 Cor 5:7 (For we walk by faith , not by sight )
I would give the spoken Word the award as far as bringing people to faith in Christ.
God bless you all.
Posts: 822 | From: Ireland | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
volodymyrdolgoruki,
You will have much to answer for on Judgement Day as you stand before God and you try to explain how you just want to tear down such a great witnessing tool as this movie has been and continues to be! It's very apparent that all you want to do is continue your tearing down and your debating which is so wrong to do! You will please start walking in the spirit and quit walking in the flesh! The Passion Of The Christ has won ever so many many souls to Jesus Christ and it continues to do so! It's way past time for you to give it a rest!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
The fulfilment of prophecy occueed ON THE CROSS
NOT in the Garden, but that doesn't really matter does it.
The bible says
(Matthew 27:19) While he was sitting on the judgment seat, his wife sent him a message, saying, "Have nothing to do with that righteous Man; for last night I suffered greatly in a dream because of Him."
She SENT HIM A MESSAGE, not went and talked to him.
Some people BELIEVE that Jesus went to America and taught the Indians in the years before He started His ministry.
Shall we accept that also?
So people teach that Jesus went to India and that area before He started His ministry.
Shall we also accept that?
What about the people who wrote the lost books of the Bible, shall we start teaching from them also?
When you start down the slippery slope of adding to or altering The Holy Living Word of God, where does it end???
I BELIEVE in the Sufficiency of Scripture. It's ALL we need for Godly living
2 Timothy 3:16-17
(16) Every Scripture is God-breathed (given by His inspiration) and profitable for instruction, for reproof and conviction of sin, for correction of error and discipline in obedience, [and] for training in righteousness (in holy living, in conformity to God's will in thought, purpose, and action),
(17) So that the man of God may be complete and proficient, well fitted and thoroughly equipped for every good work.
I BELIEVE in The POWER of God's Word
Hebrews 4:12-13
(12) For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.
(13) And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do.
I BELIEVE it is The Word Of God ALONE that brings life to a dead soul
1 Peter 1:23
(23) You have been regenerated (born again), not from a mortal origin (seed, sperm), but from one that is immortal by the ever living and lasting Word of God.
Does man HAVE to or NEED to add to, alter, change or make palitable The Holy Word Of God???
NO
I will stand firm, by and thru His Grace and Word ALONE
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Favor Minded
unregistered
|
posted
Yes - You are indeed deceived if you believe in this way.
God uses the power of such a thing to bring about real change - Real awakening.
I noticed you did not even touch on my questions? Why is that?
I see you totally missed the fulfilment of prophecy in the scene you mention in the movie.
That scene, in the garden, was the fulfilment of Genesis 3:14
14 So the LORD God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this,
"Cursed are you above all the livestock
and all the wild animals!
You will crawl on your belly
and you will eat dust
all the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring [a] and hers;
he will crush [b] your head,
and you will strike his heel."
You mention Claudia - Claudia is not mentioned in the Bible - Only in History as being Pilates wife. Do you think that a Pastor of a church should speak ONLY scripture, and never use any other words? Do you think that when you speak to someone about Christ, you should only quote from the bible, and not use ANY other words in your speaking?
The movie was made based on what the Gospels agree on.
Do you not think it possible that Claudia spoke to her husband, that she may have disagreed with him?
Do you know that white linen was used as a symbol of purity? She gave these to the Marys as a symbol of her belief that he was pure. Why is that hard to accept? HOW does that detract from the signifigance of the monumental sacrifice that the last 12 hours of the life of Christ was??
HOW??
The Gospels do not say what happened in the background while the guards were busy taunting him, sticking a crown of thorns on his head, hitting him and helping to fulfill the prophecy of Isaiah that says he would not be recognizable as a human.
WHo are YOU to say that they DID NOT wipe it up? What would YOU DO if it was YOUR SON? He WAS HER son! SHE bore and raised him.
Silly things to use as examples of what detracts from the movie. It does NOT detract - And God has USED THIS MOVIE MIGHTILY!
How will you STAND BEFORE THE ALMIGHTY GOD and say I TORE DOWN THE MOST POWERFUL TOOL YOU USED TO BRING 1000's upon 1000's back to Christ.
How will you stand and tell him that you stood against what he was trying to accomplish?
Jesus became the topic of more secular arenas that EVER before! Still today - The movie was viewed by more that 70% of Americans!!!!
How can you stand and say that God wants you to tear it down? Do you honestly think he would allow these to be deceived?? And, if so, HOW ARE THEY BEING DECEIVED?
By being presented with the enormity of the sacrifice? By understanding the britality he endured for us? By seeing the painful fulfilment of prophecy in the messiah and seeing the power of his love for them, despite what they did to him?
By watching him crawl onto the cross, willingly fulfilling the will of God?
You should find some other great witnessing tools God has created and used and tear those down too!
Why stop at just one? There has to be some that have reached as many as The Passion has? I can't think of any but there must be.
IP: Logged |
|
|
Study
Advanced Member
Member # 3991
|
posted
If, “The Passion of the Christ” saved one soul! That is more than any Oscar sitting on a shelf. The seed was planted and God will give the increase.
How many times have we listen to a sermon and the Pastor/Preacher have given their inserts of what they image happen back in those days in between the scriptures. And I’m sure we have done the same also. Mel gave his inserts used his imagination, as with all Bible base moves. None of us was back there and can only imagine, base on scripture.
Lets stop nick picking and allowing the enemy to divide the body of Christ.
I love you all in Jesus name.
--------------------
http://www.biblenotebooks.com
The book no Christian should be without!
Posts: 364 | From: NJ | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged |
|
|
mohawk
Advanced Member
Member # 2898
|
posted
What I think is sad, is that some people think they have God in a box, that only they can cast criticism, that only they are "annointed" to give a yay or a nay. Pardon my bringing this up at the risk of bursting anyone's bubble: WE ALL FALL SHORT of God's standard, and have salvation only by His Grace.
May I also remind everyone (did you forget?) that the Devil can quote scripture.
Are those who found salvation in Christ, because they found it after seeing "Passion" still unwashed? The people who picked up a Bible for the first time, after seeing "Passion"... are we telling them "whoops, nope, that was just a false alarm--go back to the world, you don't qualify for God's family yet"??
This is exactly the kind of nit-picky legalism that makes those who are still babes in Christ wonder if they made a right decision.
Let's use this logic on another film about Jesus and see how it holds up: The Bible definitely states that Jesus was tempted by Satan while on the cross (Luke 23). Well... that was exactly what "The Last Temptation of Christ" used as its whole plot! Do you therefore prefer that film over "Passion?"
I think that some people are a bit resentful of "Passion's" success. The point is, "Passion" takes Jesus more seriously than any "Hollywoodized" version of the gospel. That may be why some people (even some Christians) grope desperately for any trifling element to try and discredit the film.
Jesus (who was with God in the beginning, and is Himself God, as John reminds us) really did suffer unimaginable horrors on His way to the cross--He really did die for the sins of man--and was physically resurrected in triumph over death and the grave. "Passion" shows all of that, in defiance of the secular guffawing of Hollywood--and apparently also the subconscious fears of some within the church.
Rip pages out of your Bibles and throw them at me. I feel God's provision of courage in saying these things.
Posts: 223 | From: california | Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Favorminded,
Amen! Excellent posting and God bless you! I'm in total agreement with you!
Study, God bless you also!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
Study
Advanced Member
Member # 3991
|
posted
If “The Passion of the Christ” is going to be picked apart, then we might as well pick apart all the other bible base movies. The Ten Commandments for instants. Where in the Bible does it say that Moses actually stumped around in the mud pit? Where in the Bible does it say Pharaoh’s wife had Moses brought from the mud pit to seduce him. Where does it say he saved his mother from a stone rolling over her? Where does it state that the woman was thrown out the window when she wanted to reveal Moses was a son of a Hebrew?
Even if The Passion of the Christ movie was meant for evil, God can turn evil around for his Glory.
My ½ cent.
God bless us all
--------------------
http://www.biblenotebooks.com
The book no Christian should be without!
Posts: 364 | From: NJ | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
Show me IN SCRIPTURE where satan was in the garden of Gethsemane tempting Jesus?
(Matthew 27:19) While he was sitting on the judgment seat, his wife sent him a message, saying, "Have nothing to do with that righteous Man; for last night I suffered greatly in a dream because of Him."
Whay does the movie show her telling Pilate this in person.
This point may be trivial, by couldn't he have used truth? Why did he have to cahange it??
In the garden of Gethsemane Mel added words to Jesus prayers that were NOT in the Bible.
Is The Truth not enough??
There is much more wrong with this movie.
Where in The Bible does it have the woman wipping up the blood of Christ with the white cloth??
(1 Timothy 4:7) But have nothing to do with worldly fables fit only for old women. On the other hand, discipline yourself for the purpose of godliness;
2 Timothy 2:15-17
(15) Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, ACCURATELY handling the word of truth.
(16) But avoid worldly and empty chatter, for it will lead to further ungodliness,
(17) and their talk will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus,
(2 Timothy 2:23) But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels.
(Titus 1:9) holding fast the faithful word which is in accordance with the teaching, so that he will be able both to exhort in sound doctrine and to refute those who contradict.
Titus 1:10-11
(10) For there are many rebellious men, empty talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision,
(11) who must be silenced because they are upsetting whole families, teaching things they should not teach for the sake of sordid gain.
Your right if being decieved means BELIEVING SCRITURE ALONE and REJECTING THE TEACHING OF MEN.
God is PURE
Man CORRUPTS
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
I am decived?
How do you explain the parts in the movie that are contrary to SCRIPTURE???
ONLY Scripture is TRUTH!!!
Satan takes truth and blends a little bit of lies into it.
Others have been doing it ever since
This movie does the same.
The ONLY way to JUDGE the movie is in the LIGHT OF SCRIPTURE.
In that LIGHT the movie fails.
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Favor Minded
unregistered
|
posted
ANYONE who claims that The Passion is not of God, is not rooted in scripture, does not follow the gospels, etc. is quite plainly deceived.
How sad -
I will pray for the deceived ones who would serve to tear down something that God has used so mightily to present Jesus to the people, to have Jesus be the topic of conversation in more places than EVER in history -
Deception and lies would tear it down and try to prevent people from knowing the truth -
It will be interesting when these so called truth knowers have to stand before God and say
"Lord, I felt in was not scriptural so I stood against it - And he will say HOW COULD YOU try to stop something that I HAVE USED TO BRING MORE PEOPLE TO CHRIST, PUT JESUS IN THE HOMES OF MORE PEOPLE THAN EVER BEFORE IN HISTORY, PUT JESUS ON MORE NATIONAL SECULAR NEWS CHANNELS THAN EVER BEFORE, and make Jesus the topic of discussion in more places than ever before - "
Not since he was alivein the Flesh has he been more prevalent -
But then you TRUTH knowers can explain to God himself how you stood against it!
DO YOU REALLY THINK that God wants you to tear it down?
You are the deceived, NOT the other way around...
IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Volodymyrdolgoruki,
You do not know me whatsoever so you will please not be so presumptuous as to make any such statements or judgements about me whatsoever ever again! I DO KNOW GOD'S TRUTH! It's indeed very sad that all you're wanting to do is to continue to debate and to tear down! Please walk in the spirit not the flesh!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Volodymyrdolgoruki,
For the final time The Passsion Of The Christ is a very powerful movie, it brought about a world wide revival, it won ever so many many
non-believers to Jesus Christ! Winning people to Jesus Christ is what is so very important and that's a fact that cannot be denied.
I will reiterate to you that I will not debate this movie with you and that is what I meant!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
If I took the time and effort to post the untruths in the movie would you HONESTLY exam and evaluate them.
Will you be like those from Berea
(Acts 17:11) Now these were more noble-minded than those in Thessalonica, for they received the word with great eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see whether these things were so.
NEVER be afraid to search for truth
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Mohawk,
Amen, how true, and God bless you! I agree!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
mohawk
Advanced Member
Member # 2898
|
posted
Let's see, "Passion of the Christ" portrayed Jesus as being crucified for the sins of mankind, and then being resurrected. Is that what some of you folks are calling "counterfeit?" Hoo-boy. Are you saying that ISN'T what happened??
Once again, as I mentioned in a post elsewhere--I think some people have come to follow and worship their own sectarianism, rather than admit the Lord works in ways bigger than their church by-laws (typed up nice and neat and framed over the sanctuary) say.
I don't view "Jesus" and "Passion" as being in competition. Some unsaved were more prone to come to Christ watching "Jesus" and others needed what "Passion" showed them, in order that their eyes be opened. If just ONE PERSON out of the millions who saw "Passion" came to God because of it... PRAISE THE FATHER! AMEN!
(But I'd be willing to say that there was more than one.)
I'm sorry, but my Lord Jesus is too big to fit in the box some think they've got Him in. Just like that... tomb, 2,000 years ago. ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
Posts: 223 | From: california | Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
Volodymrdolgoruki,
I totally disagree with you and no I'm in no way deceived whatsoever! You cannot deny the fact that The Passion Of The Christ brought about such a tremendous renewed revival around the world and many many non-believers around the world were won to Jesus Christ! Winning souls to Jesus Christ is what's really important!
I have my beliefs and you have yours. I will not debate this with you at all!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
volodymyrdolgoruki
Advanced Member
Member # 4400
|
posted
Gramajo320 I speak the TRUTH in LOVE
The Passion does not follow scripture.
It is not rooted in The Word of God
In fact it cntradicts it in many many places.
God Does Not Contradict Himself
Our Faith MUST MUST MUST be rooted in TRUTH, God's Truth ALONE
--------------------
Don't wish for a better day
Be glad and use the one you're in
Fear God and do exactly what He says
That's what matters
All else fades like the flowers
Posts: 73 | From: God's Kingdom | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
The Passion Of The Christ is most assuredly not a counterfeit at all and it has won ever so many many non-believers to Jesus Christ which is definitely very important!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
|
posted
http://www.jesusfilm.org/aboutus/index.html
Many mission experts have acclaimed the "JESUS" film as one of the greatest evangelistic success stories of all time. The ultimate success of this project won't be measured by how many people have already seen it, but by how many will follow Him after seeing this film.
Through use by The JESUS Film Project, and more than 1,500 Christian agencies, this powerful film has had more than 5 billion viewings worldwide since 1979. On top of that, the great majority of those heard the story of Jesus in a language they easily understand.
As a result, more than 197 million people have indicated decisions to accept Christ as their personal Savior and Lord.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
A Christian Church should support the truth. Not buy out blocks of theatre tickets to present a counterfeit.
I would never give one searching for truth, the New World Translation of scripture, or the Book of Mormon.
--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
The Passion Of The Christ has indeed won many many non-believers to Jesus Christ and the movie itself was very well produced and filmed. Perhaps some of you haven't seen it and perhaps you should before deciding you should tear it down!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
Caretaker
Advanced Member
Member # 36
|
posted
It is so interesting volodymyrdolgoruki, that the "Jesus" movie, based exclusively on the Book of Luke, in a multitude of different languages, has literally won millions to Jesus over the years.
Yet we find the evangalicals throwing such support behind a counterfeit, (based on the Dolorus Passion of Christ). Kind of like encouraging your friends to receive Jesus, by giving them the Book of Mormon because it does mention Jesus, or to study the Bible from the New World Translation to learn sound doctrine.
--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
Posts: 3978 | From: Council Grove, KS USA | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
|
|
Gramajo320
unregistered
|
posted
For any one who has not done so they should see The Passion Of The Christ before trying so hard to tear it down! This powerful movie brought about a very renewed world wide revival and has brought many many to Jesus Christ!
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
In Christ's love,
Gramajo320
IP: Logged |
|
|
|
Printer-friendly view of this topic
