Christian Chat Network

This version of the message boards has closed.
Please click below to go to the new Christian BBS website.

New Message Boards - Click Here

You can still search for the old message here.

Christian Message Boards


Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply
| | search | faq | forum home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Christian Message Boards   » Bible Studies   » Polls Only   » Grace a license to sin or the ability to obey?

   
Author Topic: Grace a license to sin or the ability to obey?
becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87

Icon 18 posted      Profile for becauseHElives   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Dr. Spiros Zodhiates commented, “Grace is like God’s power generator, and we are like the conduits which carry His power to its intended purposes by the Holy Spirit.”

Saving Grace is more than a state of mind, Saving Grace is God's power upon the heart of mankind to transform and regenerate, to cause to be conformed day by day to the image of Christ!

Faith is expressed in good works, so grace is demonstrated in Godly labor as Paul testifies, “By the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me” (I Corinthians 15:10).

quote:
Grace is the enabling gift of God to overcome sin. Grace is power, not just pardon” (Pleasures of God, John Piper, p. 244+).


--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917

Icon 6 posted      Profile for WildB   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by becauseHElives:
James 4:5....do you suppose that the Scripture is speaking to no purpose that says, The Spirit Whom He has caused to dwell in us yearns over us and He yearns for the Spirit [to be welcome] with a jealous love?(A)

6But He gives us more and more grace ([a]power of the Holy Spirit, to meet this evil tendency and all others fully). That is why He says, God sets Himself against the proud and haughty, but gives grace [continually] to the lowly (those who are humble enough to receive it).(B)

7So be subject to God. Resist the devil [stand firm against him], and he will flee from you.

8Come close to God and He will come close to you. [Recognize that you are] sinners, get your soiled hands clean; [realize that you have been disloyal] wavering individuals with divided interests, and purify your hearts [of your spiritual adultery].


understanding "Grace" that saves ! [thumbsup2]

Eisegesis = bad stinky relish

Exegesis = good fruit


Eisegesis is the approach to Bible interpretation where the interpreter tries to "force" the Bible to mean something that fits their existing belief or understanding of a particular issue or doctrine. People who interpret the Bible this way are usually not willing to let the Bible speak for itself and let the chips fall where they may. They set off with the up-front goal of trying to prove a point they already believe in, and everything they read and interpret is filtered through that paradigm. Stated another way, they engage in what the Bible refers to as "private interpretation".

In the end, eisegesis is an exercise that in most cases leads to wrong interpretation, and therefore improper applications of those verses in the person's life.

Exegesis is the process of approaching Bible interpretation with a humble spirit, and an open mind. In order to gain a true understanding of God's Word, one must be willing to allow God's Word to speak for itself, and be willing to abandon cherished beliefs if they are in conflict with God's Word.

Exegesis is not merely an intellectual exercise we do all alone. God tells us that in order to properly understand His Word, we need the help of a) the Holy Spirit and b) others who have strong theological training. We are also cautioned to be careful about who we allow to influence us.

On needing the counsel of others:

Where no counsel [is], the people fall but in the multitude of counsellors [there is] safety.
Proverbs 11:14

On being careful about who you allow to teach you:

Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away [their] ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
2 Timothy 42-4

It is vital that we approach Bible interpretation with humility. Much of God's truth and wisdom are in sharp contrast with today's political correctness and tolerance movements. When practicing true exegesis, be prepared to be viewed as foolish by an ignorant world that has placed its confidence in fallible human knowledge instead of the infallible knowledge of our all-knowing God and Creator.
[cool_shades]

--------------------
That is all.....

Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87

Icon 18 posted      Profile for becauseHElives   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
James 4:5....do you suppose that the Scripture is speaking to no purpose that says, The Spirit Whom He has caused to dwell in us yearns over us and He yearns for the Spirit [to be welcome] with a jealous love?(A)

6But He gives us more and more grace ([a]power of the Holy Spirit, to meet this evil tendency and all others fully). That is why He says, God sets Himself against the proud and haughty, but gives grace [continually] to the lowly (those who are humble enough to receive it).(B)

7So be subject to God. Resist the devil [stand firm against him], and he will flee from you.

8Come close to God and He will come close to you. [Recognize that you are] sinners, get your soiled hands clean; [realize that you have been disloyal] wavering individuals with divided interests, and purify your hearts [of your spiritual adultery].


understanding "Grace" that saves ! [thumbsup2]

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WildB
Moderator
Member # 2917

Icon 6 posted      Profile for WildB   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Again to you and your lawyer buds,


Study and pray about.....


James 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.
[cool_shades]

--------------------
That is all.....

Posts: 8775 | From: USA, MICHIGAN | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87

Icon 1 posted      Profile for becauseHElives   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The above is the reference WildB wanted posted seams like a lot of trouble…...

but I needed to say....

"if'

if a person is "Born Again" he or she is a "new creature"

if you do not love the things Yahweh loves you are not a "new creature" yet....

the "born again" man or woman may not walk perfectly but they will embrace the entirety of scripture and endeavor to live out the principles contained therein....

to many so called Christian chide and make little of that which Yahweh in His word says is perfect.....

Psalm 19.....

1The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.

2Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.

3There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.

4Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,

5Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.

6His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.

7The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

8The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.

9The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.

10More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.

11Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward.

12Who can understand his errors? cleanse thou me from secret faults.

13Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression.

14Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer.

2 Corinthians 3

1Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?

2Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:

3Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

4And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:

5Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;

6Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

7But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

8How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

9For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

10For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.

11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

12Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

13And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

14But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

15But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.

16Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

17Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

18But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
becauseHElives
Advanced Member
Member # 87

Icon 15 posted      Profile for becauseHElives   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
becauseHElives Member # 87

Are Christians free of the 10 Commandments of Yahweh, because of the free gift of Salvation through Grace?


Found in Him Member # 7596

Quote why would any child of God want to be "free" from the commandments??????? Breaking any one of the commandments violates what Christ set in order for us...If we love God with all of our hearts, souls and minds and love our neighbor as ourselves we will keep every commandment.

I am saved by grace through faith... my heart desires have been changed as I was shown my sins by the Holy Spirit's conviction. I am "free" of the bondage of sin! That's Grace!

“If, while we seek to be justified in Christ, it becomes evident that we ourselves are sinners, does that mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! 18If I rebuild what I destroyed, I prove that I am a lawbreaker. 19For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!” (Gal 2)

--------------------
~To Him That is able to keep you from falling and to present you before His glorious presence without fault and with great joy...to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.~ Jude 24


Eduardo Grequi Member # 3984

Are Christians free from the 10 commandments?

should be asked Are Christians free from the penalty of breaking the 10 commandments?

what is the penalty and how does it define grace contrast to it?

whether bond or free the 10 remain law and guides ethics and values.

For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life (Romans 6:23)- Disobedience embarks death, repentance establishes peace. When obedience is done apart from grace it is called works selfish peity, however when obedence occurs because of grace it displays love, desire and a changed heart Romans 12:1-2. Our society would be dubbed "a motherless child". In other words the world we live in have switched what would be wrong for good and good for wrong. Today it is wrong to say Praise Jesus but its okay to say I am going to sue you Mom. And the defiant rude and vulgar words are so readily accepted that those who hear it react with such approval to it. Christians have unknowingly (or maybe knowingly) accepted vulgar language as every day speech. Everyones doing it then it must be okay. That is a so called '60's slogan of the age. But contrary to popular belief not everyone is doing it. If I am not doing this, then the aproval goes to not all. Remember Christians a silent voice assumes approval. Is your voice heard today?


Wombataustralia7 Member # 7893

Quote No we are not free of the Ten Commandments because of Salvation through Grace.

Once we are saved we are obliged to adhere to The Ten Commandments as a way of good Christian Living.

There is certain rules and regulations of being a Christian born again or other, and that is to KEEP the Ten Commandments.

Not to destroy or being covetous.


mathews Member # 7873


Quote Good material to correct our day to day life
mathews

--------------------


KnowHim Member # 1

Quote NO, everyone will answer for any of the 10 Commandments. So if you break even one of them you are bound for hell.

The good news is, Jesus came to pay our sin dept.

But it is not easy believism, you must know Him and if you know Him you will not want to sin but live for Him.

We know that we have come to know him if we obey his commands. The man who says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.
~ 1 John 2:3-6 (NIV)

barrykind Member # 35

Quote Brother David States:


quote: NO, everyone will answer for any of the 10 Commandments. So if you break even one of them you are bound for hell.

The good news is, Jesus came to pay our sin dept.

But it is not easy believism, you must know Him and if you know Him you will not want to sin but live for Him.

We know that we have come to know him if we obey his commands. The man who says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.
~ 1 John 2:3-6 (NIV)

Amen brother David

--------------------
The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27

WildB Member # 2917

Quote

quote:Originally posted by KnowHim:
NO, everyone will answer for any of the 10 Commandments. So if you break even one of them you are bound for hell.

The good news is, Jesus came to pay our sin dept.

But it is not easy believism, you must know Him and if you know Him you will not want to sin but live for Him.

We know that we have come to know him if we obey his commands. The man who says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.
~ 1 John 2:3-6 (NIV)

Actually it goes a little deeper for those who Walk with Him.

James, Chapter 4, 17: Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

As I obeyed in the service to our country. I held myself to...

John, Chapter 15, 13: Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

--------------------
That is all.....

barrykind Member # 35

Quote To answer your question brother Dale...NO!

--------------------
The HEART of the issue is truly the issue of the HEART!
John 3:3;Mark 8:34-38;James 1:27

Barry44 Member # 8375

Quote We keep the Spirit of the law not the letter of the law.

This song says it all: Praise God It's Settled, I'm Saved - The Perrys

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lS_eIDm061I&feature=player_embedded

--------------------

John Hale
unregistered


Quote Romans 3:8 (NASB95)
8 And why not say (as we are slanderously reported and as some claim that we say), “Let us do evil that good may come”? Their condemnation is just.

WildB Member # 2917

Quote

quote:Originally posted by John Hale:
Romans 3:8 (NASB95)
8 And why not say (as we are slanderously reported and as some claim that we say), “Let us do evil that good may come”? Their condemnation is just.

1. let us sin more that more , cus we have security in Christ?

What have you done or are doing my little brother?

--------------------
That is all.....

thywillbedone Member # 8469

Quote Jesus is the Christ!

Dead men(in Christ) can not keep or break any of God's laws.

If you are still "keeping" them, you are not yet dead to sin.

"deny yourself"

Reckon yourself to be dead indead unto sin.

The Sabbath was made for man...
The sheep of the Good Shepherd do not have to keep it.

Praise the Lord!

Carol Swenson Member # 6929

Quote Only Jesus Christ ever lived a life without sin!

If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. (1 John 1:8)

thywillbedone Member # 8469

Quote Jesus is the Christ.

Very true.

If we sheep say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us, because sheep can not talk.

Praise the Lord!

DeeperStill Member # 8478

Quote Where is the poll?


It has been my previous experience that a poll question has options to choose from,

Did I miss it somewhere or is this more like an open opinion thing?

Kind regards


Carol Swenson Member # 6929

Quote Hi DS, it's nice to meet you!

I think this was set up as an open opinion topic.


crixus Member # 8527

Quote No, I don't think grace is a license to sin. I believe that there comes a point to where God pulls the plug, for lack of a better term. We can only turn our back on Him for so long. If we don't show that were serious about repentance, then we will pay the ultimate price... an eternity in Hell. [mad2]

--------------------
Keepin' the faith!


becauseHElives Member # 87

Quote "if'

if a person is "Born Again" he or she is a "new creature"

if you do not love the things Yahweh loves you are not a "new creature" yet....

the "born again" man or woman may not walk perfectly but they will embrace the entirety of scripture and endeavor to live out the principles contained therein....

to many so called Christian chide and make little of that which Yahweh in His word says is perfect.....

Psalm 19.....

1The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.

2Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.

3There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.

4Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,

5Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.

6His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.

7The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

8The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.

9The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.

10More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.

11Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward.

12Who can understand his errors? cleanse thou me from secret faults.

13Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression.

14Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer.

2 Corinthians 3

1Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?

2Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:

3Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

4And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:

5Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;

6Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

7But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

8How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

9For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

10For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.

11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

12Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

13And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

14But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

15But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.

16Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

17Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

18But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

WildB Member # 2917


Quote 7.Don't bring up old threads. If you want to reply to an old thread (over 45 days), please start a new thread and reference the old thread.

Proverbs 26:16 The sluggard is wiser in his own conceit than seven men that can render a reason.

--------------------
Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )

Posts: 4578 | From: Southeast Texas | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator


 
Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:

Contact Us | Christian Message Board | Privacy Statement



Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.5.0

Christian Chat Network

New Message Boards - Click Here