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» Christian Message Boards   » Bible Studies   » Polls Only   » "Christian Democrat"? (Page 3)

 
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Author Topic: "Christian Democrat"?
freddy05
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What a silly question! (But I understand why you ask, so many relgious right Christians can´t comprehend!) But the poll is split, so it can´t be that silly! [Smile]

After seeing the amount of suffering, death, and economic hardship around the world from Republican policies, I would think maybe "Can a person be a Christian and a Republican?" may be a better question.

So who is worse?
Republicans have racist policies that view Latinos, Blacks, and Arabs as second class citizens (if they are American) or subhuman (if they are foreign). These policies lead to the deaths of at least 50,000 in Iraq (so estimates MUCH higher). Who know´s how many died or suffered torture in Latin America throughout the US supported military dictator ships. They support economic policies which rains wealth on few and blames everyone else as being lazy, unintellegent, not trying hard enough, etc... And don´t even start on the environment... who cares if we pollute the earth and cause many types of plants and animals to go extinct... who cares if we run out of oil in 200 years, Christ is coming back in the next few years, right? Global environmental problems will harm, and are harming poor areas of the world, but not America! So let´s keep it up!

Democrats kill truckloads of babies and want to steal your money.

So who´s worse?

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
I guess the last part of my statement was missed about helping those who are truly in need yet you are right in that I find it offencive to help the "lazy" which I am not using as a code word for anything except laziness. I don't accept it in my children, my co-workers or my employees. So why must I accept it in the general public.

Well, I am not talking about the "lazy" people, I am talking about the underpaid hard-workers, the disabled, the victims of discrimination and others that have been denied freedom from this oppressive system.

The system that does not give equal treatment to all, fails people like the ones that I have mentioned. They are the ones that racist, classist and fascist people fail to acknowledge.

All that the oppressed want is freedom.

Power to all people.

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reflectingtheson
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I guess the last part of my statement was missed about helping those who are truly in need yet you are right in that I find it offencive to help the "lazy" which I am not using as a code word for anything except laziness. I don't accept it in my children, my co-workers or my employees. So why must I accept it in the general public.

Wait until there is a real crisis in this country and see what the "lazy" do to demand that of those of us who have toiled for our substance. They will not settle for a little giving of what you have but in all likelyhood will take all they want and not think about you. It will not be like the great depression where people were kind and helped one another regardless of status.

I truly understand what you are saying in helping All, but in reality it always fails because mens hearts are wicked and no longer think as you would like them to, as honerable as you seem in your beliefs.

Will continue later,
thanks for the discussion,
Rick

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
Itty Bitty Girl, You say that you want equality for ALL, but that is not possible here on earth.

Why should others be denied equal treatment? Why should others be denied their freedom?

That is NOT fair. There must be a change.

Condoning unequal treatment is an obscenity.


quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
So if that is how it will be then then why is it to be different now. Let us say you have a garden that taxes your mental and physical strength every day but it provides you with you daily needs. And living next to you is a person of equal mental and physical strength yet choses to sit on his porch all day.

Do you then give an equal portion of your food to the person who has not toiled in the field?

The thing that I find so offensive about your response, is how people can degrade and vilify those in need of help. Although, I don't see the word "lazy" there, I believe that is what you are inferring.

Oftentimes, they call ALL of those in need of help, "lazy".

I hate that so much. That is nothing but the devil.

Recieving help for the government has nothing to do with laziness. That "laziness" that you are referring to is a common stereotype. People get diabled and need help, or people can't get a decent paying job due to discrimination and need help.

You are making it seem like ALL of those who need aid are "lazy". And that is the kind of thinking that hardens people, and takes away the compassion for the needy. I believe the racist and classist media also tries to make others feel unsympathetic toward the suffering of blacks and poor by using stereotypes and bias reports to degrade and vilify them.

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Caretaker
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For myself I have voted in every election since the 18-year-olds were given the right to vote in 1972. My first ballot was cast in the Nixon-McGovern election. I just mailed-in my ballots, and this represents 34 years of voting my conscience, and exercising my rights as a citizen.

I very seldom vote a straight ticket, as I seek the character of the candidate and their specific voting record, or declaration on the issues.

I listened on a hot August day in 1963 when Brother Martin dreamed that one day our children would be judged on the content of their character rather than the color of their skin.

Each of us has the freedom to cast our vote of conscience, and to speak from our heart in this and other forums, because our fathers and their fathers, and our mothers and their mothers laid their hearts and lives on the line for our country and our freedom. Their sacrifices are our endowment, the legacy which they have given to their children and their children's children.

I watched the barbed wire divide Berlin, and the easterners mowed-down by machine-gun fire as they franticly tried to cross.

I watched the Kennedy/Nixon debate on our first television. I was never more proud when I listened to those famous words from the Berlin wall,"Ich bin ein Berliner".

I watched with pride as the sledge hammers broke through the wall, in 1989, as the children of those shot regained their freedom.

Vote your conscience, and above all else seek to understand the character of the candidate, and which will most represent your personal values.

--------------------
A Servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..

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reflectingtheson
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Itty Bitty Girl, You say that you want equality for ALL, but that is not possible here on earth. In God's eye we as christian's are equaly saved but we are not equaly going to recieve from Him equal treasures since they, the treasures, are given in measure of our faithfulness here.

So if that is how it will be then then why is it to be different now. Let us say you have a garden that taxes your mental and physical strength every day but it provides you with you daily needs. And living next to you is a person of equal mental and physical strength yet choses to sit on his porch all day.

Do you then give an equal portion of your food to the person who has not toiled in the field?

.


.


.


.


.

even if it is contray to God's word in
2 Thessalonians 3:7-13

I am of the opinion that if a person can not even attempt to help themselves then thier sorry is on thier head. But if a brother or sister is in truth down and out yet are making an effort to pick themselves up I am there to lend a hand to get them up, NOT to prop them up.

Do you see the difference as I see it?

Rick

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
Now these are jewish decendance living in their own land and you think you and other americans of African lineage have it bad here because of a few stupid people. I'm sorry but quit you whining and look for the good people around you. You are a christian practice christian love,

I am practicing Christian love, Rick.

I read that story and I do feel for those people overseas and in other nations... but I as an African-American, must not forget my history or turn a blind eye to the injustice going on in America at the present time. I'm sorry if you think I'm "whining", but I'm telling how I feel, and why I am a "Christian Democrat". I hope you can understand.


quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
God Bless you and your family, Itty-Bitty Girl, but because of your total disdane for anything beyond the democratic party line it is hard to have a reasonable discussion on these matters. I have read other things from you in other topics with pleasure and agreement, but from here I must regretfully depart.

I am sorry that you feel that it would be hard to have a resonable discussion with me on such matters. It is not about a disdain for other political parties, because I have no disdain for any other party, but I am all about equality for ALL.

If I wanted to, I could belong to an independant party, I wouldn't care. I'm just saying that just because a party says that it "protects religious rights", doesn't mean that the party is a "religious" party, especially when it does not care for ALL of the American people. God is no respector of persons.

Power to ALL people.

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reflectingtheson
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I think I will leave this discussion to others. Yes there have been and in some circles still hatefilled people here, but this is still the greatest country on earth today. If you really think that it is so bad here try living the following scene from a jewish christian, named Jerry Golden, I Keep up with who is living in Israel.
quote:
Our oldest daughter and son-in-law are visiting with us it is his first visit to Israel. Because my wife and I want all our children home here in Israel I wanted to show him how wonderful Israel is this of course would start with my playing the role of a tourist guide to show him all the places he would like to see.

It was early Sunday morning, Yom Reshon, (the first day of the week in Israel) he ask me if it was possible for me to take him to Bethlehem, I said no, Israelis are not allowed to go there, so then he ask if we could take him to Jericho, I said no Israelis are not allowed there either. Then he said how about the Garden Tomb, I told him that was in East Jerusalem and it all depended on the circumstances and if these Arabs who call themselves Palestinians are rioting or if there is any terrorist alerts. Well what about the Temple Mount he asked, can we go there, and I then I told him, that we Jews are not allowed to go there most of the time but some times if we behave ourselves they are generous to us and allow us to go there in small numbers on Tuesday afternoons. But we can’t go there now because this is the Islamic holiday of Ramadan and they would kill us.

So what about the Old City, I told him yes we can go there and if they are not throwing rocks over the wall from the Temple Mount we can go to the Western Wall and Pray. But if we are allowed onto the Temple mount next Tuesday we are not allowed to pray there, the Moslems walk around watching to see if Jews or Christians are praying and they will run you off the Mount if they catch you praying. You see the one thing they fear is our prayers. But we can walk through the Jewish Quarters and even parts of the Old City, for example through the Jaffa gate all the way to the Temple Mount is for the most part safe for us, but we dare not venture into the Moslem quarters around Herold’s Gate and there has been a rash of stabbings of Jews around the area of the Damascus Gate. It would not be to smart for us to attempt to go through the Lions Gate (St. Stephen’s Gate) that leads directly into the north end of the Temple Mount and there is always danger for us there.

I think you have the picture by now, of these problems that are directly related to the weak Israeli Government and their desire to please the US and not the Jews of Israel. To begin with the fact that they have given the Holiest site in the Jewish world to the Jordanians is in itself beyond understanding. When we consider that Jerusalem isn’t even mentioned in their Koran, and there is no real proof that their Prophet ever came to Jerusalem. It is very clear that their holy sites in Mecca and Medina should be enough, but their desire to destroy the Jewish People goes back to Ishmael and Isaac and that is really what it is all about. It can also be seen in the one thing that unites all the Arabs, the destruction not only of Israel but of all the Jewish People. They will of course fail as they have always failed.

We are living in the days when good is called evil and evil good and there isn’t a better way to see this than to take a close look at Islam. They call Jews and Christians evil and themselves good. They teach their children from kinder garden that to be a suicide bomber and to kill the Jews and Christian is good because they are evil. What we are talking about here is approximately one third of the population of the planet who has been taken over by the Devil.

Now these are jewish decendance living in their own land and you think you and other americans of African lineage have it bad here because of a few stupid people. I'm sorry but quit you whining and look for the good people around you. You are a christian practice christian love,

4 Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant,

5 does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered,

6 does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth;

7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

God Bless you and your family, Itty-Bitty Girl, but because of your total disdane for anything beyond the democratic party line it is hard to have a reasonable discussion on these matters. I have read other things from you in other topics with pleasure and agreement, but from here I must regretfully depart.

Rick

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
If this were a democracy then would it be OK if the 73% of the european heritage of americans voted and decided to round up by force all african and hispanic decendance and sent them back to their old countries? This would be how a true democracy would work, and there would be nothing anyone could say because the majority of the people voted in favor of that outcome.

Even if it was a democracy, I don't believe that would ever happen. That is an unlikely scenario.


quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
BUT Thank God this is a republic were laws are the principle means by which we live and are established by the people for the betterment of ALL who live here.

Racial segregation was the law of the land. So would segregatrion qualify as a principal by which we lived, and was established by the people, for the betterment of ALL who lived here?


quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
The whole setup of this country was to provide a place for its people were Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness is allowed to flurish. That means the pursuit of my happiness does not infringe on your liberty and your liberty does not harm anothers life.

Remember what it was like before 1776??? America was a British colony, and they fought for a change. In spite of the British conviction that Americans had no right to establish their own laws to promote the general welfare of the people living here in America, the colonized immigrant felt he had no choice but to raise the gun to defend his welfare.

And for the American government, for the American people, one such form of protection was the Declaration of Independence, which states: ". . . whenever any government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute a new government, laying its foundations on such principles and organizing its powers in such forms as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness."

And now, with that said, I believe that now these same colonized White people, these bondsmen, paupers, and thieves deny the colonized Black man not only the right to abolish this oppressive system, but to even speak of abolishing it, with the labeling of such a movement as "anarchy".

Don't you see the hypocrisy in that? That is very sad.


quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
And yet we have flipped 180 degrees to try and make all our people happy at the expence of our liberty and in some cases life.
Anyone remember Waco and Ruby Ridge????

What is that?
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reflectingtheson
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quote:
This is very sad. This is NOT a democracy, I believe that neither you nor I have ever witnessed democracy, all that we have ever witnessed is hypocracy.

If this were a democracy then would it be OK if the 73% of the european heritage of americans voted and decided to round up by force all african and hispanic decendance and sent them back to their old countries? This would be how a true democracy would work, and there would be nothing anyone could say because the majority of the people voted in favor of that outcome.

BUT Thank God this is a republic were laws are the principle means by which we live and are established by the people for the betterment of ALL who live here.

The whole setup of this country was to provide a place for its people were Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness is allowed to flurish. That means the pursuit of my happiness does not infringe on your liberty and your liberty does not harm anothers life. And yet we have flipped 180 degrees to try and make all our people happy at the expence of our liberty and in some cases life.
Anyone remember Waco and Ruby Ridge????

But then sometimes reason is lost to the emotional.

Rick

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by BrianGrass1234:
Explain this to me cause I don't get it.

I can't, because I don't get it either.
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BrianGrass1234
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What happens if I don't pay my taxes?

If I don't pay them long enough men with guns will eventually come kidnap me and hold me against my will. If I resist, they will kill me. How does that sound to you? That is what our current government does.

In your democracy do I get to say, "leave me alone" or will you come with guns to take me away, or kill me as well? Doesn't that sound like slavery to you? If I don't offer up the fruits of my labor, they get taken by force. Do you understand? You want to take from me, and kill me if I don't pay. Does that sound right to you? It doesn't to me. If I wasn't a christian, I would fight till the death to keep you from stealing from me and others. Taking by force is not right. Not right in any circumstance as far as I'm concerned. Even if someone owes me money, I would never use violence to get my money. If they don't pay I can ignore them, offer them no more services or goods, ostrasize them by letting others no what they have done. But I would not use violence just to get paid. Why do think this is OK for the government to imprison and kill those who don't do what you want them do? Explain this to me cause I don't get it.

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by BrianGrass1234:
So you want to take from others, by force, against their will, to pay for others who happen to be in a bad situation, whether it is their fault or not. Am I correct? Is it OK to steal if it is the majority that wants it? Like I said in the other thread, democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on whats for dinner.

Democracy is good, better a democracy than a dictatorship.

I can't see how one can "steal" by collecting. If this is the tax thing you are talking about, it is wrong. The government is not stealing by collecting the taxes from the people.

In fact, I believe that those hurricane Katrina victims who starved and died, paid taxes like any other American citizen, so why were they treated so cruel? The scene of chaos did not look like it was even going on in America, it looked like a different country.

The American government is supposed to help ALL OF its people, because the people are supposed to be in power.


This is supposed to be a democratic government, but it is not. The people are ALL supposed have power, but they do not, that is why the government fails to serve ALL people in their time of need.


Power to ALL people!

God is no respector of persons.

And for the new American government, for the American people, one such form of protection was the Declaration of Independence, which states: ". . . whenever any government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute a new government, laying its foundations on such principles and organizing its powers in such forms as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness."

This rascist and classist government needs to be changed into a government that cares for all of the people, that would please God. And if it be God's will to abolish this evil government, and create a new good one, then may His will be done through us, the people.

This is very sad. This is NOT a democracy, I believe that neither you nor I have ever witnessed democracy, all that we have ever witnessed is hypocracy.

There needs to be a change.

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BrianGrass1234
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quote:
Originally posted by Itty-Bitty Girl:
quote:
Originally posted by BrianGrass1234:
The federal government should have had no response. Individuals should either seek reimbursment from their insurance companies if it is in their contracts, should be responsible for themselves, or seek help from voluntary charities. Not expect the government to extract help through others through force.

No response for the American citizens, from the American Government??? The government is supposed to serve the people.

Others??? What others are you talking about???

The government is responsible for taking care of the American people, AIDING THEM IN THEIR TIME OF NEED.

And for anyone to say to me that the government should not have responded to help those less fortunate in the Katrina aftermath, is an obscenity.

The government that fails to aid its citizens when they are in need is the goverment that needs to be either altered or abolished, so a new one can be put in place to serve ALL OF ITS CITIZENS.

So you want to take from others, by force, against their will, to pay for others who happen to be in a bad situation, whether it is their fault or not. Am I correct? Is it OK to steal if it is the majority that wants it? Like I said in the other thread, democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on whats for dinner.
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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by BrianGrass1234:
The federal government should have had no response. Individuals should either seek reimbursment from their insurance companies if it is in their contracts, should be responsible for themselves, or seek help from voluntary charities. Not expect the government to extract help through others through force.

No response for the American citizens, from the American Government??? The government is supposed to serve the people.

Others??? What others are you talking about???

The government is responsible for taking care of the American people, AIDING THEM IN THEIR TIME OF NEED.

And for anyone to say to me that the government should not have responded to help those less fortunate in the Katrina aftermath, is an obscenity.

The government that fails to aid its citizens when they are in need is the goverment that needs to be either altered or abolished, so a new one can be put in place to serve ALL OF ITS CITIZENS.

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BrianGrass1234
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quote:
Originally posted by Itty-Bitty Girl:
quote:
Originally posted by BrianGrass1234:
As far as hurricane damage is concerned, it has nothing to do with the federal government, or at least shouldn't. Any damage done to private property should be taken care of by the insurance that should have been held by the property owners. If the insurance company doesn't hold up to their contract than its a civil lawsuit to handle the matter. Any government property that was damaged should be rebuilt by the local governments that had ownership over those properties. If there are any federal buildings that were destroy, than it is up to the federal government to decide if they want to rebuild or not and to fund the rebuilding. As far as helping the poor and those who did not have insurance for their property, then that should come from voluntary charities, not forced wealth redistribution.

I believe that you are missing the point, I am not talking about the damage.

There was a DELAY in the federal response time, A DELAY in RESPONSE.

The federal government HAD THE RESOURCES, but failed the poor and black citizens by delaying response and starving them off. I blame the goverment for STARVING THEM OFF.

The federal government should have had no response. Individuals should either seek reimbursment from their insurance companies if it is in their contracts, should be responsible for themselves, or seek help from voluntary charities. Not expect the government to extract help through others through force.
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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by BrianGrass1234:
As far as hurricane damage is concerned, it has nothing to do with the federal government, or at least shouldn't. Any damage done to private property should be taken care of by the insurance that should have been held by the property owners. If the insurance company doesn't hold up to their contract than its a civil lawsuit to handle the matter. Any government property that was damaged should be rebuilt by the local governments that had ownership over those properties. If there are any federal buildings that were destroy, than it is up to the federal government to decide if they want to rebuild or not and to fund the rebuilding. As far as helping the poor and those who did not have insurance for their property, then that should come from voluntary charities, not forced wealth redistribution.

I believe that you are missing the point, I am not talking about the damage.

There was a DELAY in the federal response time, A DELAY in RESPONSE.

The federal government HAD THE RESOURCES, but failed the poor and black citizens by delaying response and starving them off. I blame the goverment for STARVING THEM OFF.

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BrianGrass1234
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As far as hurricane damage is concerned, it has nothing to do with the federal government, or at least shouldn't. Any damage done to private property should be taken care of by the insurance that should have been held by the property owners. If the insurance company doesn't hold up to their contract than its a civil lawsuit to handle the matter. Any government property that was damaged should be rebuilt by the local governments that had ownership over those properties. If there are any federal buildings that were destroy, than it is up to the federal government to decide if they want to rebuild or not and to fund the rebuilding. As far as helping the poor and those who did not have insurance for their property, then that should come from voluntary charities, not forced wealth redistribution.
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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
I think that the poor democratic people of this country had voted in their party for over forty years and it never got them anywhere. After a transfer of wealth for the "rich" to the "poor" in this country of over 5,000,000,000,000.oo(trillion) the poor are no better off then they have ever been. Why is that? [Confused]

Never got them anywhere??? The poor and democratic of this country were better of with a democratic president who cares about the blacks and poor. I was more better off with former president Clinton, than I could ever be with president George W Bush and the Racist Republican party.

Where have you gotten those so-called "stats" from? Any sources? I see none. Why is that? [Confused]

The Republican Party is racist, I believe that most blacks believe that. My family believes that. I believe that. And I have cited my sources in the above posts as proof that the Republican Party is racist.


quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
Now as to the thing that really gets misreported, I live in Baton Rouge, LA. All I have heard from the national media is how President Bush HATES the blackpeople of N.O.

I believe that the word "HATES" is a strong one. The president DOES NOT CARE about the black people of N.O. He may hate them, but I believe that he does not care about them, he is not really concerned about their welfare.


quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
The government did fail those people down there, but not the one you and most others want to blame. It was the failure of the local N.O. mayor for not demanding an evac soon enough. A black democrat mayor.

Are you serious??? So you blame it ALL ON THE BLACK MAN and the white DEMOCRAT?

And even if the mayor did not demand an evac soon enough, is that justification for the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT to treat its citizens in that manner???

The federal government had more power! They had power enough to feed them, and they starved them for FIVE DAYS. The mayor was outraged at the federal response and he had the right to be.

The mayor cared enough to call in for federal aid, and the federal aid let those people down. The federal government let them down, not the local or state one. I believe that blaming the lack of federal reponse on the mayor is an obscenity!


quote:
Originally posted by reflectingtheson:
And yet after the storm destroys the area the president, which I am sure was not voted for by the majority of these poeple,

Bingo!

That's it, I believe that is why Bush did not care.... it was because the majority of those people did NOT VOTE FOR HIM. That could be a reason why he wanted them starved off! That is why the response was delayed to them, because he knew that they did not vote for him. So Bush did not care!

Bush does not care about the poor and black, because they do not vote for him. They know what he is about, they know what the Republican Party is about- Racism, classism and fascism.

I took snippets of the interview where the New Orleans Mayor, Ray Nagin, blasted the slow pace of federal and state relief efforts in an expletive-laced interview with local radio station WWL-AM:

quote:
NAGIN: I told him we had an incredible crisis here and that his flying over in Air Force One does not do it justice. And that I have been all around this city, and I am very frustrated because we are not able to marshal resources and we're outmanned in just about every respect.

You know the reason why the looters got out of control? Because we had most of our resources saving people, thousands of people that were stuck in attics, man, old ladies. ... You pull off the doggone ventilator vent and you look down there and they're standing in there in water up to their freaking necks.

And they don't have a clue what's going on down here. They flew down here one time two days after the doggone event was over with TV cameras, AP reporters, all kind of ******* -- excuse my French everybody in America, but I am pissed.

WWL: Did you say to the president of the United States, "I need the military in here"?

NAGIN: I said, "I need everything."

quote:
NAGIN: I have no idea what they're doing. But I will tell you this: You know, God is looking down on all this, and if they are not doing everything in their power to save people, they are going to pay the price. Because every day that we delay, people are dying and they're dying by the hundreds, I'm willing to bet you.
quote:
NAGIN: I don't know. I don't think so.

But we called for martial law when we realized that the looting was getting out of control. And we redirected all of our police officers back to patrolling the streets. They were dead-tired from saving people, but they worked all night because we thought this thing was going to blow wide open last night. And so we redirected all of our resources, and we hold it under check.

I'm not sure if we can do that another night with the current resources.

And I am telling you right now: They're showing all these reports of people looting and doing all that weird stuff, and they are doing that, but people are desperate and they're trying to find food and water, the majority of them.

Now you got some knuckleheads out there, and they are taking advantage of this lawless -- this situation where, you know, we can't really control it, and they're doing some awful, awful things. But that's a small majority of the people. Most people are looking to try and survive.

quote:
NAGIN: Organize people to write letters and make calls to their congressmen, to the president, to the governor. Flood their doggone offices with requests to do something. This is ridiculous.

I don't want to see anybody do anymore ******* press conferences. Put a moratorium on press conferences. Don't do another press conference until the resources are in this city. And then come down to this city and stand with us when there are military trucks and troops that we can't even count.

Don't tell me 40,000 people are coming here. They're not here. It's too doggone late. Now get off your ***es and do something, and let's fix the biggest ******* crisis in the history of this country.

Source cited: http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/09/02/nagin.transcript/


With that, I believe us blacks should wise up and not believe the hype of the so-called "Religious Right".

That's why I believe most of us vote Democrat because we know who is really concerned about our welfare, and we are Christian, too! God knows!

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BrianGrass1234
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Christians can be Democrats, Republicans, Communists, Green Party Members, Libertarians, Peace and Freedom members, Constitutionalists, ext...

Where you have to be careful of is what your party is promoting.

Just looking at the Democrats and the Republicans, because they are the two main parties by a long way, they both promote and continue to support something Christ would not. That is taking from one person, against their will, and then giving to another.

The democrats love to take from one person, against their will, to then provide for another through providing welfare checks, free or subsidized health care, regulation of business, funding sciences and research, ext... On the flip side the republicans like to take from one, against their will, to provide for another through military protection, police force, legislated morality, subsidies for businesses, ext... This isn't exact, stolen goods get used on both sides for differing reasons also based on who is lining their pockets.

I think Christ would be of a more libertarian or anarchist persuasion as to not be using government force to achieve any particular groups goals, but rather through non violent persuasion.

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reflectingtheson
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Dear Itty-Bitty Girl, you wrote
quote:
The government is SUPPOSED to HELP and serve its people, the PEOPLE elect them into office. THE GOVERNMENT had BETTER take care of them. If the government does not HELP THEM then they fail to do their job, and need to be replaced.

This government has been oppressing the black and poor for a long time, denying them the help and service that they need. Help and service is NOT a HANDOUT.

I think that the poor democratic people of this country had voted in their party for over forty years and it never got them anywhere. After a transfer of wealth for the "rich" to the "poor" in this country of over 5,000,000,000,000.oo(trillion) the poor are no better off then they have ever been. Why is that? [Confused]

Now as to the thing that really gets misreported, I live in Baton Rouge, LA. All I have heard from the national media is how President Bush HATES the blackpeople of N.O. That he let them drown in Katrina and starve and thirst in the heat of August. You have written
quote:
Those people stuck down there thought that the Government cared about the poor and black, and they thought wrong.

"Our government failed those people in the beginning, and I take it now there is no dispute about it," Clinton told CNN. "One hundred percent of the people recognize that -- that it was a failure."

Yes you are right. The government did fail those people down there, but not the one you and most others want to blame. It was the failure of the local N.O. mayor for not demanding an evac soon enough. A black democrat mayor. Where is the disdane for his not caring? They are his voters!
Then there is the state of LA. govevnor who waited until the hurricane was at our front door to ask for help. A white democrat female. Where is the disdane for her not caring? They are her voters!

And yet after the storm destroys the area the president, which I am sure was not voted for by the majority of these poeple,mobilizes the largest search and rescue in this country's history and it is his fault [Confused] . This must be bizaro world!!!

Rick

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by NLP:
See who is really looking out for your best interested which is (or should be) Christ and the public worship of Him above all else!

Just food for thought!

OOOOOOOOOooooooooooo. Speaking of the "food", what steps have the REPUBLICANs taken to feed the poor in this country?

Do they even care about aiding the poor? If not, that is very un-Christian of them.

.
.
.

Jesus is not pleased with those who oppress and despise the poor.

Matthew 25:45-46
"Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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"Religous Right"? More like "Racist Right".

quote:
WASHINGTON, Sept. 29 /U.S. Newswire/ -- Former Republican Secretary of Education William Bennett remarked yesterday on his radio show that, "I do know that it's true that if you wanted to reduce crime, you could -- if that were your sole purpose, you could abort every black baby in this country, and your crime rate would go down."
Source cited: http://releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=54319


Bill Bennett? Ain't that the racist REPUBLICAN that said abort black babies to REDUCE CRIME?

I thought Republicans were against abortion, I guess not against BLACK ABORTIONS.

Christian?

.
.
.
.
.


Trent Lott Is A Racist And Proud Of It:

quote:
"What I want to tell you...Ladies and Gentlemen...That there's not enough troops in the Army...to force the southern people to break down segregation and admit the nigger race into our theatres, into our swimming pools, into our homes and into our churches."
-- Strom Thurman, 1948.

"When Strom Thurman ran for president, we voted for him! We're proud of it! And if the rest of the country had followed our lead, we wouldn't have had all of these problems over all of these years either."
-- Trent Lott, December, 2002.

"If we had elected this man 30 years ago, we wouldn't be in the mess we are today."
-- Trent Lott, 1980.

Source cited: http://www.onlisareinsradar.com/archives/000724.php


Trent Lott? Ain't that the racist REPUBLICAN that was proud to vote for a SEGREGATIONIST for PRESIDENT?

I thought that God was no respector of persons...

Christian?

.
.
.
.

DISGUSTING RACISM of the REPUBLICAN PARTY.

I'm sure there are plenty more racists where those came from. The Republican Party could care less about the wellbeing of people who look like me.

They were never really looking out for our(black people's) best interest.

Christian Democrat??? I'm starting to wonder if there is really a such thing as a "Christian Republican"...

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by NLP:
Here's one up to date fact on how the democratic elected officials are voting on your behalf.

Question: (Parapharsed) Do you want to stop tax dollars from supporting organizations that want to infringe of Religious rights?

The U.S. House of Representatives passed the PERA bill which would block tax dollars from going to the ACLU and similar groups in cases of lawsuits to remove 10 Commandments plaques and religious symbols from public buildings and courthouses.

Who's votes do you think passed this? Republicans or Democrats?

To see how your Congressional representatives voted on this bill here is the link.

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2006/roll480.xml

Seems the Democratic elected officials overwelming would like to eventually see Christianity put to a halt and they want to have your money out of your tax dollars to do it, but the Repulicans (who voted yes to the blocking of funds) do not!
Judge for yourself by reviewing the undisputed facts of how the parties voted with just this one example. See who is really looking out for your best interested which is (or should be) Christ and the public worship of Him above all else!

Just food for thought!

AY, remember that Mark Foley scandal??? With that grown gay man IM-ing a 16 year old boy ABOUT SEX. MARK FOLEY WAS A REPUBLICAN. I thought the Republicans were RELIGIOUS!

How did this GAY man get in there, corrupting minors???

Saying no to gay marriage don't mean saying no to homosexuality. THINK ABOUT IT.

I thought that the Republican party was Christian. I guess not! Is this the Democrats' fault???

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
DUH to me!!
Sorry, my bad…Steve’s not lazy Joe is. I should have double checked the name. Now does that make sense?

And what if Joe is disabled and cannot work, does that mean that he would be "lazy"? Or What if Joe can't get a job because of discrimination, does that mean he would be "lazy"?

What constututes as being LAZY?


quote:
I believe in the same philosophy that our founding fathers believed in (for the most part).
I believe that SLAVERY was the MOST PART.


quote:
If you’re calling me a racist and classiest, then you are calling God the same things. Oh wait people are already calling him that. Just ask any Atheist! I can guarantee you that these words will come out their mouths.
God is not a racist or classist, the God that I serve is no respector of persons.

The athiest may call God racist and classist because of the way that the bible was twisted by the white southerners to make it seem like God condoned chattel slavery. Now they think that chattel slavery is what God wanted, because they think it's "in the bible".


quote:
Ok, WHY OH WHY are people DEPENDING on the Government to solve their trials and tribulations?? I could go into a bunch of stories of my g.grandparents, etc. and the trials they went through (hurricanes, Wars, etc) WITHOUT anything from the Government.
Why are people blaming the oppressed and not the oppressor? Not everybody is like your g.grandparents, some people have had it harder in life than them. There are some people who need help from the government because they can't help themselves.

The government is SUPPOSED to HELP and serve its people, the PEOPLE elect them into office. THE GOVERNMENT had BETTER take care of them. If the government does not HELP THEM then they fail to do their job, and need to be replaced.

This government has been oppressing the black and poor for a long time, denying them the help and service that they need. Help and service is NOT a HANDOUT.


quote:
The government wasn’t intended to be replied upon like they are a god. So why do we do it?
I don't think that anybody is doing that. The government is supposed to help and serve the people, they could never replace God. As a matter of fact, I hope that God replaces this racist and classist government with a new one that pleases Him.


quote:
The reason why the Government is: For the Government, and by the Government is because we have become lazy and allowed them to take control so it is no longer by the people. How much easier is it for people to point others in the direction of Government welfare rather than help to them support themselves. Which you can’t argue this point because this is exactly what we are doing. This is the ‘laziness’ I am referring to.
Recieving help for the government has nothing to do with laziness. That "laziness" that you are referring to is a common stereotype. People get diabled and need help, or people can't get a decent paying job due to discrimination and need help.

You are making it seem like all of those who need aid are "lazy". And that is the kind of thinking that hardens people, and takes away the compassion for the needy. I believe the racist and classist media tries to make others feel unsympathetic toward the suffering of blacks and poor by using stereotypes and bias reports to degrade and vilify them.


quote:
The victims of Katrina should have been able to depend on their fellow citizens (neighbors) not the government. So I don’t and won’t blame the government for Katrina. I blame ‘us’ the American people so being so dependant on the government instead of each other. By this we are more and more coming under the thumb of them that will lead to that bondage.
Telling people not to depend on the government and eachother instead? What was that? Don't blame the government for failing its citizens, leaving them to die in the streets??? And you JUSTIFY THE FAILURE OF THE GOVERNMENT?

If this is how the Republican feels.... then I am proud to be a Democrat.

Where is the Christian compassion??? Those people stuck down there thought that the Government cared about the poor and black, and they thought wrong.

"Our government failed those people in the beginning, and I take it now there is no dispute about it," Clinton told CNN. "One hundred percent of the people recognize that -- that it was a failure."
Source cited: http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/09/05/clinton.katrina/

You won't even admit that the Government failed those people, instead you blame "us"? That is twisted and un-Christian. We don't even have the resources of the Government.


quote:
I as a Christian would never feel OK with this blindly said statement, Sorry! I don’t want the child molesters, murders, rapist, and abortionist to have the same power (equal) as good God fearing people. Which is exactly what is happening, under the democracy of equality...to all! That is why WE have constant, constant, constant, repeat offenders.
I as a Christian, disgree with your blindly said statement. I don't wan't racist, fascist and classist bigots who claim to be "good God fearing people" to have power over us poor and black people. Which is exactly what would happen under the republic of inequality.

I am a revolutionary, I am a proletarian, I am the people. ALL power to ALL people.


quote:
Being a republican makes me far from a racist. That would be like me saying because you are Democrat you are a murderer, because it’s no surprise that the Democrats are the #1 supporters of abortion rights. Unless you do believe in abortion rights?
Abortion Rights??? Republican Party ain't about the gospel or stopping abortion rights or the so called "gay agenda". It is all about money. If the Republican Party were "Christian" they wouldn't have left the blacks and poor to die in the streets of New Orleans. It seems like Bush pretends to care about the babies inside of the womb, because his actions show how much he cares about the ones outside of the womb caught up in the Katrina aftermath. He does NOT CARE.

What about the ones that George Bush failed outside of the womb???

 -

"Religious Right"? More like "Racist Right".

George bush let them starve, and it was reported that one baby died. The lives of the poor and black don't matter to the GOP, these so called Christians. By doing that, they show how much they do not care about the blacks and poor. They never have and never will.

This government does not seem to care about black people, this government does not seem to care about the poor. The government does not understand suffering, it cannot comprehend the language of suffering.

The Republican Party is not a Christian one.
Republican Party's religion is capitalism, and its language is money.


quote:
Isn’t it funny though that the MOST powerful woman in America is black? Oprah Winfrey and she did it all without the help of the US Government, go figure?

By the way my 2 great, great, grandfathers were in the Civil War (North). One died the other one was in the troop that Robert E. Lee surrendered to. The one that died, the government gave my g.grandmother 1 cent, period! She had eight children at the time and she made it through on her own. No whinning or complaining to the government.

Does this mean that asking for federal aid is "whinning or complaining to the government"? That is twisted. When the government fails to serve its people it must be altered or abolished, and a new one must be put in place.

With this racist, classist and fascist government, do you really think that all black people and all poor people have the same opportunities as the white and rich?


quote:
So in a nutshell, shame on you for thinking Republicans are racist (my FAMILY personally suffered to abolish slavery) and for thinking your dependency should be in the hands of the government. God teaches you better than that.
You think slavery is over and done??? Slavery is not over, yet. America is not the "land of the free", blacks have only entered into another form of slavery. A blind eye is turned to their suffering because prejudice people with respect of persons do not want to see them.

I also know that there is still a long way to go for black people in the struggle for equality. It is in society today that the chains and shackles of physical chattel slavery of African-Americans have been replaced with the invisible chains and shackles of mental slavery, suffering and oppression.


quote:
When you talk about equality you’re thinking of race, creed, religion, etc. If it was just that then Yes, Rose I would agree w/you 100%. But it is not; it’s much much more than that.
Please, don't call me Rose. I'm "Glacialis Caerul Femella" the revolutionary.
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EL3LN3TN
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quote:
Originally posted by Itty-Bitty Girl:
It's nice to see that you agree, EL3LN3TN.

Are you also a Christian Democrat???

uh...well...we don't really have that in this country (U.S.) that I'm aware of
[Confused]

I tend to vote as an independent, with a slight conservative lean on local issues but as it gets closer to the "big picture" (State/Federal) I shift a bit liberal.

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EL3LN3TN
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quote:
Originally posted by NLP:
"The transcendent values of Biblical natural law were the foundation of the American republic."


In the American republic, the "principles which did not change" and which were "certain and universal in their operation upon all the members of the community" were the principles of Biblical natural law.

Whoa! Wait a minute [Eek!] ...I must confess this "Biblical natural law" is a bit of a new one to me.

...and I'll outrightly suggest that Montesquieu is being (incorrectly) taken out of context w/ this - I think the term(s) we're looking for are "Natural Law" / "Natural Rights" guided by a political philosophy of "Republican Liberalism" as espoused by Montesquieu, John Locke, Thomas Paine, Madison, Jefferson, etc...

Really, I think the "Biblical" part is on shaky basis, with not much hard supporting evidence. [Wink]

btw - I notice no link reference or credit - from where was this article taken? Who's the author?

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NLP
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Here's one up to date fact on how the democratic elected officials are voting on your behalf.

Question: (Parapharsed) Do you want to stop tax dollars from supporting organizations that want to infringe of Religious rights?

The U.S. House of Representatives passed the PERA bill which would block tax dollars from going to the ACLU and similar groups in cases of lawsuits to remove 10 Commandments plaques and religious symbols from public buildings and courthouses.

Who's votes do you think passed this? Republicans or Democrats?

To see how your Congressional representatives voted on this bill here is the link.

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2006/roll480.xml

Seems the Democratic elected officials overwelming would like to eventually see Christianity put to a halt and they want to have your money out of your tax dollars to do it, but the Repulicans (who voted yes to the blocking of funds) do not!
Judge for yourself by reviewing the undisputed facts of how the parties voted with just this one example. See who is really looking out for your best interested which is (or should be) Christ and the public worship of Him above all else!

Just food for thought!

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NLP
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DUH to me!!
Sorry, my bad…Steve’s not lazy Joe is. I should have double checked the name. Now does that make sense? Like I said and I will repeat it because you skipped it.
I believe in the same philosophy that our founding fathers believed in (for the most part). It seems you were quick to completely skip over that part.


As for the "republican" party- I believe it's RACIST and classist.

It truly digusts me.

I can't stand behind a racist party. That is not godly at all.

If you’re calling me a racist and classiest, then you are calling God the same things. Oh wait people are already calling him that. Just ask any Atheist! I can guarantee you that these words will come out their mouths.

Do you think I care how much money my neighbor makes? No, not really! If he makes a fortune then let him. I DO NOT COVET and if someone is bitter because Bill Gates makes a zillion bucks that is what God tells us is coveting. It’s kind of like a little kid throwing a temper tantrum because another kid has more toys than them. Who care nobody is taking it w/them when they die. God’s not going to give Bill more than me in heaven because he made more ‘money’. As long as person is making money in a just way and not by ripping people off then I could care less, because ones again I do not covet.


REMEMBER HURRICANE KATRINA.
The poor and black starved for FIVE DAYS, a baby died. The thing that cuts deep is that they looked just like me.


Ok, WHY OH WHY are people DEPENDING on the Government to solve their trials and tribulations?? I could go into a bunch of stories of my g.grandparents, etc. and the trials they went through (hurricanes, Wars, etc) WITHOUT anything from the Government. The government wasn’t intended to be replied upon like they are a god. So why do we do it? The reason why the Government is: For the Government, and by the Government is because we have become lazy and allowed them to take control so it is no longer by the people. How much easier is it for people to point others in the direction of Government welfare rather than help to them support themselves. Which you can’t argue this point because this is exactly what we are doing. This is the ‘laziness’ I am referring to. The victims of Katrina should have been able to depend on their fellow citizens (neighbors) not the government. So I don’t and won’t blame the government for Katrina. I blame ‘us’ the American people so being so dependant on the government instead of each other. By this we are more and more coming under the thumb of them that will lead to that bondage.

I say, power to ALL people.

I as a Christian would never feel OK with this blindly said statement, Sorry! I don’t want the child molesters, murders, rapist, and abortionist to have the same power (equal) as good God fearing people. Which is exactly what is happening, under the democracy of equality...to all! That is why WE have constant, constant, constant, repeat offenders.

Color of skin doesn’t matter much up here….I see rich black, powerful black people all over the place up here. I am now beginning to believe it is a southern problem. My sister who moved about 8 years ago to Virginia called me one day. She works for a large company and said and I quote “You wouldn’t believe that people down here are still racist”. She says sometimes she feels like she’s living in past. The reason she said this to me was because it is something we don’t deal w/up here and she wasn’t use to seeing it. Race means nothing to me it, never has, and never will. I could care less what color skin someone has. It’s irrelevant. Being a republican makes me far from a racist. That would be like me saying because you are Democrat you are a murderer, because it’s no surprise that the Democrats are the #1 supporters of abortion rights. Unless you do believe in abortion rights?
Isn’t it funny though that the MOST powerful woman in America is black? Oprah Winfrey and she did it all without the help of the US Government, go figure?

By the way my 2 great, great, grandfathers were in the Civil War (North). One died the other one was in the troop that Robert E. Lee surrendered to. The one that died, the government gave my g.grandmother 1 cent, period! She had eight children at the time and she made it through on her own. No whinning or complaining to the government.

So in a nutshell, shame on you for thinking Republicans are racist (my FAMILY personally suffered to abolish slavery) and for thinking your dependency should be in the hands of the government. God teaches you better than that.

When you talk about equality you’re thinking of race, creed, religion, etc. If it was just that then Yes, Rose I would agree w/you 100%. But it is not; it’s much much more than that.

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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I am a revolutionary! I am the people! [spiny]


I say, power to ALL people.

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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quote:
Originally posted by NLP:

Well, OK Steve is poor and only makes $5.00 so he needs the extra money to feed his family which I have no problem with this, but Steve is lazy and won’t get up off the couch to go to work. Why should I have to have my hard earned money go to him?

The answer is I shouldn’t..the reason why I believe this is because the Lord tells us ….“For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat".

If steve is poor and makes $5.00 and is "lazy", then how did he make the $5 in the first place?

I thought that you had to work to get money.

It just looks like steve, like so many others, just have low incomes. I believe that low incomes have nothing to do with laziness.

And what if Steve is disabled and cannot work, does that mean that he would be "lazy"?

What is LAZY?

How would a democracy promote laziness, anyway? I believe in equality for all. God made us all equal and all should be treated equally and fair. My Christian beliefs tell me that God is no respector of persons.


The founding fathers may have wanted a republic, but a new "democratic" nation, was founded.

The founding fathers??? Aren't they the ones who profitted off of SLAVE LABOR.

We cannot erase the evil that was done in history.


quote:

The sorry legacy of the founders

By Ulrich Boser

1/12/04

In 1784, five years before he became president of the United States, George Washington, 52, was nearly toothless. So he hired a dentist to transplant nine teeth into his jaw--having extracted them from the mouths of his slaves.

That's a far different image from the cherry-tree-chopping George most people remember from their history books. But recently, many historians have begun to focus on the role slavery played in the lives of the founding generation. They have been spurred in part by DNA evidence made available in 1998, which almost certainly proved Thomas Jefferson had fathered at least one child with his slave Sally Hemings. And only over the past 30 years have scholars examined history from the bottom up. Works by Gore Vidal, Henry Wiencek, and Garry Wills reveal the moral compromises made by the nation's early leaders and the fragile nature of the country's infancy. More significant, they argue that many of the Founding Fathers knew slavery was wrong--and yet most did little to fight it.

More than anything, the historians say, the founders were hampered by the culture of their time. While Washington and Jefferson privately expressed distaste for slavery (Jefferson once called it an "execrable commerce"), they also understood that it was part of the political and economic bedrock of the country they helped to create.

Political capital. For one thing, the South could not afford to part with its slaves. Owning slaves was "like having a large bank account," says Wiencek, author of An Imperfect God: George Washington, His Slaves, and the Creation of America. The southern states would not have signed the Constitution without protections for the "peculiar institution," including a clause that counted a slave as three fifths of a man for purposes of congressional representation.

And the statesmen's political lives depended on slavery. The three-fifths formula handed Jefferson his narrow victory in the presidential election of 1800 by inflating the votes of the southern states in the Electoral College. Once in office, Jefferson extended slavery with the Louisiana Purchase in 1803; the new land was carved into 13 states, including three slave states.

Still, Jefferson freed Hemings's children--though not Hemings herself or his approximately 150 other slaves. Washington, who had begun to believe that all men were created equal after observing the valor of black soldiers during the Revolutionary War, overcame the strong opposition of his relatives to grant his slaves their freedom in his will. Only a decade earlier, such an act would have required legislative approval in Virginia. He suspected the country would eventually come to its moral senses and find the notion of owning other human beings repugnant, says Joseph Ellis, author of the bestselling Founding Brothers. "He knew his legacy depended on it. He knew that we were watching."

Yet how should we view other framers of independence such as signer of the Declaration of Independence Richard Henry Lee and Patrick Henry, who traded and whipped their slaves?

Or James Monroe, who, as governor of Virginia in 1800, after rushed trials, executed nearly 30 slaves after an attempted revolt? For some historians, such actions cloud their legacy. "The other founders resisted emancipation, not because it was a mad scheme but because they did not want to relinquish the wealth which slave sales poured into their coffers," says Wiencek.

Other scholars believe the Founding Fathers can best be seen squarely within their time. "To contextualize is not to excuse," says Rutgers University historian Jan Lewis. "It's to show the complexity." Understanding the early leaders' severe lapse in judgment over slavery, say Lewis and other historians, makes their ability to found a new and democratic nation all the more incredible.


Source Cited: http://www.usnews.com/usnews/culture/articles/040112/12slave.htm


quote:
The transcendent values of Biblical natural law were the foundation of the American republic. Consider the stability this provides: in our republic, murder will always be a crime, for it is always a crime according to the Word of God. however, in a democracy, if majority of the people decide that murder is no longer a crime, murder will no longer be a crime.
BIBLICAL NATURAL LAW???

WHAT IS SO BIBLICAL ABOUT CHATTEL SLAVERY???

I don't get it.

Oh yeah, and those quotes about "democracy" make no sense.

***

As for the "republican" party- I believe it's RACIST and classist.

It truly digusts me.

I can't stand behind a racist party. That is not godly at all.


A "blond-haired, blue-eyed, middle-class, middle-aged white guy" wrote an article concerning the racism of the "Republican Party". I pulled some snippets:

quote:

I know from experience that Trent Lott is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to racism in the Republican Party.

I can't count the number of times some Anglo conservative has used the N-word in reference to African-Americans in front of me, even towards those they root for, such as Dallas Cowboys running back Emmitt Smith. I can't count the number of racial "jokes" or references some white City Council member, police officer, businessman, or other establishment figure - whom I know is a Republican - has told to my face. A popular "joke" during this time of year by such racist Republicans is, "What are you doing for Martin Luther Coon' Day?" Or they will snicker, "Have you learned anything during Black *** ' History Month?"

I've sat at high school football games in Republican-dominated towns as Anglo adults in the stands taunted the lone black player on the opposing team using that N-word. I've attended all-white meetings -- as a reporter, not participant - in which elitist Republicans have discussed getting around the Voting Rights Act by lobbying for requirements that voters have to own property. I didn't need someone to spell out what they were talking about -- they wanted some way to keep blacks from voting.

In the 1920s, Dallas had more Ku Klux Klan members per capita than any other large U.S. city. The city had an actual "segregation of the races" clause written in to its charter as late as 1968. Peter Gent, a former Cowboy player and author of classics like North Dallas Forty, says he was shocked to arrive from the Midwest in the mid-1960s to witness such blatant Jim Crow segregation. For example, the team's black players had to drive an extra hour from their segregated South Dallas neighborhoods to reach practice in North Dallas. Through lawsuits, protests, and other measures, the blatant racist policies are gone, but they have been replaced with subtle, back-door racism executed from still all-white country clubs and subdivisions in the suburbs.

quote:
The Republican Party in general launched a strategy during the late 1960s to capture the southern racist vote by opposing affirmative action, supporting the rights of states like South Carolina to fly the Confederate flag in front of public buildings, and similar positions. Dubya Bush himself spoke before the segregationist Bob Jones University in South Carolina, genuflected before the Confederate flag, and helped implement the racist Willie Horton ad during the 1988 presidential campaign of Bush Sr., who approved the racist ad after lobbying by his son. Both Bush's have appointed many racists - both subtle and overt - to high offices, who now work to further erode civil rights.
quote:
Who can forget the Florida 2000 recount battle, when white supremacists rallied for Republicans who embraced their support? What about Florida Republican Gov. Jeb Bush's and former Bush-state-campaign-co-chair-Secretary-of-State-turned-Congresswoman Katherine Harris' openly racist system of purges before the 2000 election that took the names of mostly African-American voters off the rolls? What about the police roadblocks near black precincts on election days? And how about the Republican warnings in communities across the country about impending black voter fraud that usually occur a few days before an election, not to mention misleading fliers circulated by Republican operatives in African-American neighborhoods telling them of different days to vote or wrongly warning that their criminal backgrounds and parking tickets will be checked to try to intimidate them against voting?
quote:
Jefferson Sessions of Alabama. Sessions has called a black assistant U.S. attorney "boy" and a white civil rights attorney a "disgrace to his race." As a prosecutor, Sessions pursued civil rights workers on phony voter fraud charges. As Alabama attorney general, he again pursued allegations of voter fraud in African-American communities, looked the other way in Anglo communities, and refused to aggressively investigate burnings and bombings of black churches. He also said he thought KKK members were "OK" until he heard some might have smoked marijuana and charged the NAACP with being "un-American" and "Communist-inspired." Despite such a past, Bush and other Republicans have campaigned for Sessions.

The other Republican senator from Alabama, Richard Shelby, callously equated Lott's verbal criticism in the media with an atrocious physical act of violence against African-Americans and others. "I think we should not lynch him," Shelby told CNN.

quote:
That's why I call Republicans like Bush and Cheney and Bennett, who publicly embrace Martin Luther King Jr. as they call for a colorblind society, yet live in their mostly-white neighborhoods and practice racism when it suits their political agenda, closet racists. They like to point out that lynching black people is wrong as they oppose proposals that would do more to bring about real equality and execute racist campaigns -- as Bush did against McCain in South Carolina in 2000 -- to gain political victory.
quote:
As the Martin Luther King Jr. holiday approaches, these subtle racist Republicans will talk like they have supported King's vision of a colorblind society and African-American rights all along, when their records and actions speak otherwise. That's just more of the Republican con job.
Source cited: http://www.americanpolitics.com/20030110Thoreau.html


Not only Racist, but classist, too.

I don't believe that Christianity is the Republican religion. I believe that the Republican religion is capitalism and its language is money, which is why it cannot understand the language of pain and suffering of the oppressed poor and black.

REMEMBER HURRICANE KATRINA.

The poor and black starved for FIVE DAYS, a baby died. The thing that cuts deep is that they looked just like me.

George Bush does not care about black people. Republican party does not care about black people, they have never cared about us, NEVER.


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Just an idea.

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NLP
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I said Yes, my parents who love the Lord are democrats. I however am a republican. I believe in the same philosophy that our founding fathers believed in (for the most part). The US was originally set up and intended to be a republic not a democracy, hence the saying “…And to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God…and the “Battle Hymn of the Republic", etc, etc.

Just for an example a democracy believes in equality for ALL; a republic does not. This is something I believe in, and let me explain what I mean by this. Why should I go to work 40 hours a week to have someone say… “OK, you made a $145. so you can have $50.00 a week because that is all you need to survive and we will give Joe $50.00 and Steve $45.00 because there is equality to all.

Well, OK Steve is poor and only makes $5.00 so he needs the extra money to feed his family which I have no problem with this, but Steve is lazy and won’t get up off the couch to go to work. Why should I have to have my hard earned money go to him?

The answer is I shouldn’t..the reason why I believe this is because the Lord tells us ….“For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat".

My Christian belief tells me not to believe in the sort of mentality that promotes rewarding laziness, which the Lord would never do. And under the TRUE umbrella of a democratic state this is exactly what will happen.
This is one of the reasons why our founding fathers made sure the word “Democracy” appears no where in our constitution nor in our Declaration of Independance. I am just going to copy and paste this article you might want to read

Republic v. Democracy

We have grown accustomed to hearing that we are a democracy; such was never the intent. The form of government entrusted to us by our Founders was a republic, not a democracy. Our Founders had an opportunity to establish a democracy in America and chose not to. In fact, the Founders made clear that we were not, and were never to become, a democracy:

Democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security, or the rights of property; and have, in general, been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths. James Madison

Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide. John Adams

A democracy is a volcano which conceals the fiery materials of its own destruction. These will produce an eruption and carry desolation in their way. The known propensity of a democracy is to licentiousness [excessive license] which the ambitious call, and ignorant believe to be liberty. Fisher Ames, Author of the House Language for the First Amendment

We have seen the tumult of democracy terminate . . . as [it has] everywhere terminated, in despotism. . . . Democracy! savage and wild. Thou who wouldst bring down the virtuous and wise to thy level of folly and guilt. Gouverneur Morris, Signer and Penman of the Constitution

The experience of all former ages had shown that of all human governments, democracy was the most unstable, fluctuating and short-lived. John Quincy Adams

A simple democracy . . . is one of the greatest of evils. Benjamin Rush, Signer of the Declaration

In democracy . . . there are commonly tumults and disorders. . . . Therefore a pure democracy is generally a very bad government. It is often the most tyrannical government on earth. Noah Webster

Pure democracy cannot subsist long nor be carried far into the departments of state, it is very subject to caprice and the madness of popular rage. John Witherspoon, Signer of the Declaration

It may generally be remarked that the more a government resembles a pure democracy the more they abound with disorder and confusion. Zephaniah Swift, Author of America's First Legal Text

Many Americans today seem to be unable to define the difference between the two, but there is a difference, a big difference. That difference rests in the source of authority.

A pure democracy operates by direct majority vote of the people. When an issue is to be decided, the entire population votes on it; the majority wins and rules. A republic differs in that the general population elects representatives who then pass laws to govern the nation. A democracy is the rule by majority feeling (what the Founders described as a "mobocracy"); a republic is rule by law. If the source of law for a democracy is the popular feeling of the people, then what is the source of law for the American republic? According to Founder Noah Webster:

The transcendent values of Biblical natural law were the foundation of the American republic. Consider the stability this provides: in our republic, murder will always be a crime, for it is always a crime according to the Word of God. however, in a democracy, if majority of the people decide that murder is no longer a crime, murder will no longer be a crime.

America's immutable principles of right and wrong were not based on the rapidly fluctuating feelings and emotions of the people but rather on what Montesquieu identified as the "principles that do not change." Benjamin Rush similarly observed:
Where there is no law, there is no liberty; and nothing deserves the name of law but that which is certain and universal in its operation upon all the members of the community.


In the American republic, the "principles which did not change" and which were "certain and universal in their operation upon all the members of the community" were the principles of Biblical natural law. In fact, so firmly were these principles ensconced in the American republic that early law books taught that government was free to set its own policy only if God had not ruled in an area.
For example, Blackstone's Commentaries explained:
To instance in the case of murder: this is expressly forbidden by the Divine. . . . If any human law should allow or enjoin us to commit it we are bound to transgress that human law. . . . But, with regard to matters that are . . . not commanded or forbidden by those superior laws such, for instance, as exporting of wool into foreign countries; here the . . . legislature has scope and opportunity to interpose.

The Founders echoed that theme: All [laws], however, may be arranged in two different classes. 1) Divine. 2) Human. . . . But it should always be remembered that this law, natural or revealed, made for men or for nations, flows from the same Divine source: it is the law of God. . . . Human law must rest its authority ultimately upon the authority of that law which is Divine. James Wilson, Signer of the Constitution; U. S. Supreme Court Justice
The law . . . dictated by God Himself is, of course, superior in obligation to any other. It is binding over all the globe, in all countries, and at all times. No human laws are of any validity if contrary to this. Alexander Hamilton, Signer of the Constitution

The . . . law established by the Creator . . . extends over the whole globe, is everywhere and at all times binding upon mankind. . . . [This] is the law of God by which he makes his way known to man and is paramount to all human control. Rufus King, Signer of the Constitution


The Founders understood that Biblical values formed the basis of the republic and that the republic would be destroyed if the people's knowledge of those values should ever be lost.
A republic is the highest form of government devised by man, but it also requires the greatest amount of human care and maintenance. If neglected, it can deteriorate into a variety of lesser forms, including a democracy (a government conducted by popular feeling); anarchy (a system in which each person determines his own rules and standards); oligarchy (a government run by a small council or a group of elite individuals): or dictatorship (a government run by a single individual). As John Adams explained:


Understanding the foundation of the American republic is a vital key toward protecting it.


I could go into more detail on this but I hope you understand what I am saying.

The time and legimacy of the following quote remains to be seen [Confused] but either way, judge the words of the message to see if it has any ring of truth.

A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most money from the public treasury, with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policies followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's great civilizations has been 200 years. These nations have progressed through the following sequence:

From bondage to spiritual faith;

From spiritual faith to great courage;

From courage to liberty;

From to liberty to abundance;

From abundance to selfishness;

From selfishness to complacency;

From complacency to apathy;

From apathy to dependency; and,

From dependency back to bondage.


Do you think the US could fit somewhere in this statement????

In the end I love my country and thank God I was born here, love my parents despite the fact that they are democrats but they are wrong (OK that was a joke)and I love my fellow Christians regardless of party. If you truly feel a candidate falls into line with your beliefs then by all means vote for them regardless of party. What I have learned from the replies of my own post is that if I truly don’t feel comfortable voting for any of the candidates then I won’t vote and will skip over that particular area on the ballot.

So as a Christian that means when you die you will either become a Heavlican or a Heavencrat. [Smile]

God Bless,
Nina

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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It's nice to see that you agree, EL3LN3TN.

Are you also a Christian Democrat???

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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I consider myself as a Christian Democrat.
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EL3LN3TN
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Certainly! [youpi] Don't see why not.

Many European countries (West Germany, Sweden) have, at one time or another , been led under Christian Democratic Socialist governments, and personally I think most of what gets labeled as the "Religious Right" in this country (U.S.) leans strongly toward Christian Democratic Socialism much of the time. [Wink]

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Itty-Bitty Girl
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Do you think a Christian can be a Democrat???

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