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Author Topic: Israeli troops mass on Lebanon border
Miguel
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quote:
Originally posted by cafferty:
Given that you hold a compulsive liar like Condi in high esteem only shows how badly you are decieved.


By your own confession you support this
http://209.67.212.138/~lebanon/

This comparison does not fit nor is to what we stand in Christ Jesus, anger can cause many word to come forth but the Truth is a light that shineth forth with great power and does not come void. Jesus said that man will distroy themself for his nature is wicked. Now, the thought of children and family is sad but this is a war that have been for the past 76 years!

--------------------
Romans 9:11-24

Our Eschatology may vary even our Ecclesiology may be disputed among us but our Soteriology most assume a singularity and exclusivity which in biblical term is known as Quote; "The Narrow Way" and Quote!

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cafferty
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Given that you hold a compulsive liar like Condi in high esteem only shows how badly you are decieved.


By your own confession you support this
http://209.67.212.138/~lebanon/

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helpforhomeschoolers
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quote:
You sound just like Condi Rice, feigning concern for the Lebonese people while supporting the attacks against them.
I will take that as a compliment. I think that Dr.Condaleezza Rice is an extreemly intelligent and articulate woman who is not afraid to speak her mind .

Here is a quote from her that I would also echo...

In October 2005, Ahmadinejad stated that "Israel must be wiped off the map", to which Rice responded: "When the president of one country says that another country should be wiped off the face of the map, in violation of all of the norms of the United Nations, where they sit together as members, it has to be taken seriously." Rice then went on to name Iran as "probably the world's most important state sponsor of terrorism" whose people live "without freedom and without the prospect of freedom because an unelected few are denying them that" .

Lebanon exists today as a mini state within Lebanon because of its support by Iran and Syria and their agenda to wipe Israel from the face of the earth.

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cafferty
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quote:
I think that is presumptuous and in error to think that because I or anyone else who supports Israel's attacks on Lebanon are not concerned for and praying for the Lebonese people
You sound just like Condi Rice, feigning concern for the Lebonese people while supporting the attacks against them.





Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

1Jo 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.


We are told evil will abound in these final days, yet nowhere are we told to support such evil.

quote:
that because I or anyone else who supports Israel's attacks on Lebanon
By your own confession you support this
http://209.67.212.138/~lebanon/

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helpforhomeschoolers
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First of all. I think that is presumptuous and in error to think that because I or anyone else who supports Israel's attacks on Lebanon are not concerned for and praying for the Lebonese people, the palestinian people, the Jewish people.

My heart breaks for the Palestinian people. They are pawns in a struggle for power of a few and have been horribly exploited by their own people. It did not have to be this way. Not one Palestinian needed leave Israel when Israel was mandated to The Jewsih people for a homeland, they were offered citizenship. It is the militants that have decided that there is not room in Palestine for Jews and Arab Moslems... not the Jew.

It is the militant moslem Arab that teaches their children to hate the Jew and that it is honorable to die killing Jews.

Are there Jews that are also at fault and full of hate yes. I recently read a story of poor Palestinians that were brutlized by Israeli settlers and their olive harvest scattered to the ground and demolished for no other reason than they were Palestinians and not entitled to those olives...The Palestinians returned the next day to pick olives... they are poor and this is their only source of income. This day the Israelis let them pick and then the Israeli settlers came back the following evening after the pickers had gone and destroyed a thousand olive trees some of which have probably been there since the time of Christ. This is a sin and a crime and a disgrace to the Jewish people. I have no doubt what so ever that GOD will avenge those poor Palentinians for what they suffered at the hands of the Israelis.

But no matter how much compassion I have for the Palestinians... that does not change the fact that this land is Israel's land and every nation that surrounds them has vowed their complete and utter destruction and vowed that they will not rest until it be accomplished.

I have news for them... It will not be accomplished for GOD has Chosen Israel and Jerusalem.

I know that God will deal with Israel for their sins, and God will deal with the Arabs for their sins, but I will not and cannot support those who call for the destruction of the nation or the people or the land of Israel because to do this because GOD has said to Abraham ...

Ge 17:7 And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.
Ge 17:8 And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

God confirmed this in Jacob....

Ge 48:4 And said unto me, Behold, I will make thee fruitful, and multiply thee, and I will make of thee a multitude of people; and will give this land to thy seed after thee for an everlasting possession.

and God has said....

Ge 12:3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

God is still cursing those that curse Abraham!

What about the Arab Christians? We as Christians are to take no thought of this life. I pray for their safety and strength and faith and comfort, but should they lose this life, I am very much aware that to LIVE is Christ and to die is GAIN.


There will be no peace in Jerusalem... no peace in Palestine, no peace in the world until Christ comes. As long as Christ tarries we pray... we pray for the lost and we pray for the blind eyes to be opened and we especially pray for those that are so blinded by the hate of Satan for Israel, and we pray for Israel to repent and return to the Torah that they will find Christ, but we do not support those who have called for the destruction of the land of Israel or its people.

quote:
I am concerned that the church is not following the teachings of Christ, but that of men. That they are instead following a people who do not believe in Him. Why are Christians so quick to support every action of a people who deny Him, even when these actions are opposite of what Jesus taught us?
Are they opposite from what Jesus taught?

Joh 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

Their kingdom is right now from here. And God is allowing it for a time to be under seige, and it is right that they fight for it because they have right now no other weapons but carnal... but Christ is coming again and when he comes it will be to avenge the land and the blood of those who have been troddened down by the Gentiles and to inherit an earthly Kingdom that is promised him by the Father GOD. If you do not believe that this is true then I say to you open the OT and see that every single time that GOD allowed Israel to be spoiled by their enemies and their land laid desolate it was to bring them to repentance and every time, GOD eventually brought judgment on the very heathens that he had allowed to spoil Israel, and if you believe that the prophesies that have yet to be fulfilled will be fulfilled then you know that there is coming a day when GOD will avenge Israel and the land and the city and HE will turn the hearts of the people of Abraham to HIM. That land and that people and that Kingdom are promised to David and to Christ an everlasting throne.

As to their non believe and their enemity with us because of non belief...

Ro 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes.

They are beloved of GOD!!! That is enough for me. God loved me.. a gentile, lost and without hope in the world a person without God, a person who was NOT HIS people and HE loved me in that state while I was a sinner, enough to give all he had to reconcile me to HIS life... How much more Israel and the children of HIS beloeved friend Abraham?

Let us pray for the peace of Jerusalem!

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Eduardo Grequi
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Matthew 24 dictates that Jesus has said in the days before His coming there will be wars and rumors of wars. REMEMBER WARS ARE ALSO FOUGHT between Brothers/Fathers Mothers/ Sisters/ etc.. The family would lose its importance and center identity. The bandwagon will be the thing in and those who goes against it- will be dealth with.

THIS CONFLICT I BELIEVE WILL ALLOW ISREAL TO REBUILD THE TEMPLE.

ONLY BECAUSE THE ISLAMIC FACIST WILL END OF BLOWING UP THE DOME OF THE ROCK.

HAVE YOU NOTICED IN IRAQ THAT IT IS BROTHER AGAINST BROTHER OVERTHERE. EACH ONE BLOWS UP THEIR OWN MOSQUE.

DO YOU ALL SEE THE POTENTIAL OF THIS.


I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE SOME GOOD MUSLIMS, LIKE THE'RE SOME GOOD IN ALOT OF OTHER PEOPLE.


DO YOU THINK CHRISTIANS WOULD CARE ABOUT ISREAL IF ISREAL WASN'T CENTRAL TO THEIR RELIGION TOO.

OPEN UP YOUR EYES EVERYONE, THE POTENTIAL STEP ON THE ROCK IS NEAR. A MASSIVE EARTHQUAKE WILL COME AND NOT ONE AREA WILL BE SPARED BECAUSE OF THIS.

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Eduardo Grequi
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It is sad that man can not live in peace. You know there will be no peace in the middle east until the ultimate peace maker comes and that is Jesus the Christ. As long as there is a catalyst there in the middle east there will be no peace. EVIDENTLY I BELIEVE A SHORT LIVED PEACE WILL COME THRU A MAN OF GOODWILL AND EUCEMINENICAL FAITH/ I BELIEVE THAT THE HEZOBOLLAH WILL BLOW UP THE DOME OF THE ROCK AND PERCEIVED IT TO BE ISREALS FAULT. THIS WOULD BE GREAT. BECAUSE ISREAL CAN RECLAIM THE MOUNT AND BUILT THERE TEMPLE ON IT.

I SEE THAT HAPPENING. THE TERROST WILL BE HUNTED DOWN BY THEIR OWN BROTHERS FOR THIS DESCRATION.

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ahar
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I've been debating with a few on this thread:
http://thechristianbbs.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=27;t=000147;p=1#000010

quote:
Originally posted by NLP:
Cafferty:

Most of the victims of the air strikes so far are women and children. I only wonder how many of them are Christian too.

BLAME THE RADICAL MUSLIMS! They cowardly “set up camp” in these innocent civilians’ homes and neighborhoods. If they had their own “military bases” I could assure you that this is where is the Israeli’s would be striking, but they put them in middle of the neighborhoods on purpose so they can cry out “inhumanity”. Believe me they TOTALLY did it on purpose!!!


Of course they did - they're terrorists, that's what they do. However, Israel is a nation state, not a terrorist organisation and must play by a different set of rules.

quote:
Originally posted by NLP:


Who is praying for them? Are these "God's enemies"?

I think most Christians, even on this very board are very much aware of this fact and DO pray for our fellow brothers and sisters over there caught in the middle of this.

One a more personal note, because I believe that is what you are look for:

The Israel people did send ample warning about the attacks and as a parent I can tell you if someone told me they “might” drop a bomb on my house, you better believe I would pack up my family and “get out of dodge.” Whether I felt I had anywhere to go or not; I would die trying to get out, rather than sit and wait for the enviable. When as “Christians” we are warned against something and then sit and wait thinking God will protect me, isn’t that a form of tempting God? Instead of saying “God has graciously set it upon those to give me this warning, so I will see it as just that “God warning me” and will act upon it.

Israel did not send adequate warning - they've only just started dropping leaflets in the last day or two - thats AFTER they've had ten days of bombing. It's pretty hard to get out when the bridges are destroyed, the TV and radio stations are gone so you have no news, roads are destroyed, electricty is down,the airport runways is full of craters, the ports are blockaded and bombs are still falling around you, even as you are being told to get out.

quote:
Originally posted by NLP:

I wonder how many Suicide bombers dropped leaflets over the cafes they walked into and blew up?? Or how much warning they gave the Israelis that they were going to start shooting rockets across the border??

Ah, so because the terrorists have killed civilians, it's okay for Israel to go ahead and do the same thing?

quote:
Originally posted by NLP:

I am concerned by the lack of love for the lost, by the lack of compassion and concern for the Arab Christians who suffer in all this. Do they deserve to be slain because their skin is a darker color? Are they the "enemies of God" if they accept Christ? Does Jesus really want to see them burnt alive or dismembered because they are of the wrong race?

Of course NOT! I’m not sure where you get “race” from? It is more “religion” than anything else. Convert to Islam and give up your land or else……!!

Ah, so because you're a Muslim, that gives Israel carte blanche to steal whatever land you have, bomb the hell out of your country and do what they want. I wonder how the 20% of Israel's Arab Muslim population feel about that.


quote:
Originally posted by NLP:

You want to keep in mind three important things:

1. Not all muslims are terrorist, but almost all terrorists are muslims.

In the middle east this is true, because all the countries except Israel are Muslim. However, terrorists come from every background. Have a search around and read about the supposedly Christian terrorists in Liberia (the Lord's Resistance Army) or in the Nigerian delta.

quote:
Originally posted by NLP:

2. Helpforhomeschoolers already pointed this out: We must not rise against Israel or pray for the triumph of their enemies; lest we become an enemy of the Lord!

This does not mean that we can't critically appraise the actions of Israel - or do you think that this gives them carte blanche to never do anything wrong?

quote:
Originally posted by NLP:

3. To pray for peace and be a peacemaker is one of the best things you can do as a Christian, however TOTAL peace will only happen when the Lord returns, but remember it is those that “cry” peace that will invite the “anti-christ” to come. WE as Christians are told “there will be no peace”, but to the non-Christian they WILL see the anti-christ as the peacemaker. KWIM

Of course there will be total peace, but this does not mean that we should not continually strive to make things better at all opportunities. Otherwise, every time there is trouble in the middle east we will sit back and say "Well, the anti christ is coming so I better not work to end the suffering of loads of innocent people, that would be just plain wrong". We do not KNOW when the end is, so until then how can working for peace and putting an end to suffering ever be wrong?

quote:
Originally posted by NLP:

In the meantime let's just be careful on how we act towards them.
Take the weapons from the "Radicals" and there will be peace, take the weapons from the "Jews" and there will be another Holocaust!

Why should we be careful - are they beyond judgement? Do we not critically appraise their actions just because Israel is a Jewish state, therefore applying a different set of criteria for them than anyone else?

quote:
Originally posted by NLP:

I pray God's gives you peace regarding this situation!

I know this was a quote to cafferty, but I don't want peace for me on this issue - I want to remain angry about it. Anger can be a good thing in the right context, when directed at injustice and suffering - it allows us to take action and speak out.

On a side note, I do enjoy the different points of view on this issue - in the UK public opinion and certainly opinion among the Christians I know is the same as mine and it is interesting to see other points of view.

--------------------
Cheers

Andy

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NLP
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Cafferty:

Most of the victims of the air strikes so far are women and children. I only wonder how many of them are Christian too.

BLAME THE RADICAL MUSLIMS! They cowardly “set up camp” in these innocent civilians’ homes and neighborhoods. If they had their own “military bases” I could assure you that this is where is the Israeli’s would be striking, but they put them in middle of the neighborhoods on purpose so they can cry out “inhumanity”. Believe me they TOTALLY did it on purpose!!!

Who is praying for them? Are these "God's enemies"?

I think most Christians, even on this very board are very much aware of this fact and DO pray for our fellow brothers and sisters over there caught in the middle of this.

One a more personal note, because I believe that is what you are look for:

The Israel people did send ample warning about the attacks and as a parent I can tell you if someone told me they “might” drop a bomb on my house, you better believe I would pack up my family and “get out of dodge.” Whether I felt I had anywhere to go or not; I would die trying to get out, rather than sit and wait for the enviable. When as “Christians” we are warned against something and then sit and wait thinking God will protect me, isn’t that a form of tempting God? Instead of saying “God has graciously set it upon those to give me this warning, so I will see it as just that “God warning me” and will act upon it.

I wonder how many Suicide bombers dropped leaflets over the cafes they walked into and blew up?? Or how much warning they gave the Israelis that they were going to start shooting rockets across the border??


I am concerned by the lack of love for the lost, by the lack of compassion and concern for the Arab Christians who suffer in all this. Do they deserve to be slain because their skin is a darker color? Are they the "enemies of God" if they accept Christ? Does Jesus really want to see them burnt alive or dismembered because they are of the wrong race?

Of course NOT! I’m not sure where you get “race” from? It is more “religion” than anything else. Convert to Islam and give up your land or else……!!

You want to keep in mind three important things:

1. Not all muslims are terrorist, but almost all terrorists are muslims.

2. Helpforhomeschoolers already pointed this out: We must not rise against Israel or pray for the triumph of their enemies; lest we become an enemy of the Lord!

3. To pray for peace and be a peacemaker is one of the best things you can do as a Christian, however TOTAL peace will only happen when the Lord returns, but remember it is those that “cry” peace that will invite the “anti-christ” to come. WE as Christians are told “there will be no peace”, but to the non-Christian they WILL see the anti-christ as the peacemaker. KWIM

Outside of that I do see where you are coming from; my heart does go out to the innocent people in Lebanon and it may seem that the others posters do not, but I don’t think that is the case. They are only trying to point out the validity of this war.

I cannot see innocent babies die regardless of who their parents are, it does pull at one’s heartstrings in a very profound way and that is the compassion that makes us children of the Lord! We are suppose to pray for our enemies, but not encourage them and we must tread very lighty on what we pray for when it comes to those that rise up against who God says are HIS people.
God will take care of the Jews that denied him in his own time! In the meantime let's just be careful on how we act towards them.
Take the weapons from the "Radicals" and there will be peace, take the weapons from the "Jews" and there will be another Holocaust!

I pray God's gives you peace regarding this situation!

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cafferty
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I am praying for the Christians in Lebanon, Palestine and Israel.

I am praying that the Jews and Arabs who do not know Jesus to find Him.

I am not praying for them to kill each other, nor do I relish in the thought.

Amos 5
18: Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end is it for you? the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light.

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Kindgo
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There exists in this world pure evil, and evil must be fought by evil. There could be no "sitting down and discussing things" with the Nazis, and the same is true of terrorists.

Syria has been helping Hizbollah. Whether or not it approved the recent attacks, it has a responsibility for them. Seeing as how Iran is much more dfficult for Israel to get at, I think Syria and Iran are playing a little game with Israel to get Syria off the hook for attacks they've both approved. Syria is going to get hit and hit hard. Iran can kiss its nuclear weapons program goodbye.

I am praying for Israel [Prayer]

--------------------
God bless,
Kindgo

Inside the will of God there is no failure. Outside the will of God there is no success.

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cafferty
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Call me simple minded, but I am concerned about upholding the Christian Spirit of which Christ taught. For His children to be peacemakers, to do unto others as we would have them do unto us, to love our enemies, do good to them, bless them, pray for them.

Those who live by the sword shall die by the sword.

I am concerned by the lack of love for the lost, by the lack of compassion and concern for the Arab Christians who suffer in all this. Do they deserve to be slain because their skin is a darker color? Are they the "enemies of God" if they accept Christ? Does Jesus really want to see them burnt alive or dismembered because they are of the wrong race?

I am concerned that the church is not following the teachings of Christ, but that of men. That they are instead following a people who do not believe in Him.

Why are Christians so quick to support every action of a people who deny Him, even when these actions are opposite of what Jesus taught us?


quote:
... come to avenge those gentiles who have trodden down Israel and Jerusalem.

Doesn't the Gospel say that His vengence is against those who spill the blood of His saints, Christians, those who trust in Him?

Hagee has proven himself to be apostate in his dual covenant theology. Shouldn't this give us pause when we see him ecouraging blind support for the actions of the state of Israel? Is there an apostate agenda working here?

Peace and love in Christ.

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helpforhomeschoolers
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quote:
This is not the way of our Lord Jesus.

I guess someone forgot to tell Zecharias this...

Zec 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

13 And it shall come to pass in that day, that a great tumult from the LORD shall be among them; and they shall lay hold every one on the hand of his neighbour, and his hand shall rise up against the hand of his neighbour.

14 And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance.

15 And so shall be the plague of the horse, of the mule, of the camel, and of the *** , and of all the beasts that shall be in these tents, as this plague.

16 ¶ And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.
18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.
20 In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD’S house shall be like the bowls before the altar.

Jesus is a peacemaker... and peace is made when truth prevails and the truth is that Israel and Jerusalem chosen BY the LORD, and are given to the people of Daniel forever and those who plunder her today will one day feel the vengence of the LORD.

The Peace of Jerusalem will come with the coming of Christ and HE is not coming as a slain lamb, but as the Lion of the Tribe of Judah... a mighty king and warrior... come to avenge those gentiles who have trodden down Israel and Jerusalem.

Until HE comes wars and desolations have been appointed.

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cafferty
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30% of the Lebonese population are Christian.

On the news last night there was a Lebonese man injured in an airstrike, laying in a hospital bed in critical condition. Next to his bed was a picture of Jesus, obviously a Christian.

Most of the victims of the airstrikes so far are women and children. I only wonder how many of them are Christian too.

Who is praying for them? Are these "God's enemies"?

This is not the way of our Lord Jesus.

Mat 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.

Mat 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.


We should be praying for the salvation of the Israelis, not for them to kill more people, many of whom could be our brothers and sisters in Christ.

Mat 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

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Kindgo
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Go Israel!!

Praying for all of Israel, may God confound and confuse their enemies, let no weapon
work against them. [Prayer]

--------------------
God bless,
Kindgo

Inside the will of God there is no failure. Outside the will of God there is no success.

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KnowHim
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Israeli troops mass on Lebanon border

Lebanese president says his army will fight Israelis if they invadeThousands of Israeli troops massed on the Lebanese border Friday as Lebanon's president warned that his army would defend the country if Israel launches a full-scale ground invasion.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/07/21/mideast/index.html

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