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Topic: Happy Chanukkah! Celebrating The Light of The World!
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SoftTouch
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Member # 2316
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posted
Now on that - We do agree ![[Smile]](smile.gif) Jesus First in All Things
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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HisGrace
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quote:
Originally posted by SoftTouch:
I'm not going to argue with you... But there is Nothing Legalistic about celebrating the Appointed Times that GOD Himself set
I agree. You and I never seem to come to an impasse SoftTouch.
I just want to close by saying that the Lord has shown me that everything spiritual we do should always be Christ-centred.
As a Christian we always have to put JESUS FIRST.
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SoftTouch
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posted
I'm not going to argue with you... But there is Nothing Legalistic about celebrating the Appointed Times that GOD Himself set
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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HisGrace
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by SoftTouch:
[quote] Indeed! But celebrating God's High Holy Days and the Festival of Lights (Chanukkah) has absolutely Nothing to do with the Law
The must for celebrating these festivals can become too legalistic.
legalistic -giving too much attention to legal rules and details.
Christmas should very Christ-centred. Gift-giving isn't a ceremonial ritual; just a nice gesture to follow the tradition of gift-giving by the wise men. Pageants aren't a mandatory ritual; just something that a church can partake in, only if they wish to do so. Burning of candles can be done, but it is not a legalistic must.
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SoftTouch
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by HisGrace:
The cross has released us from the law.
Romans 7:6 but now we have been released from the law, for we died with Christ, and we are no longer captive to its power. Now we can really serve God, not in the old way by obeying the letter of the law, but in the new way by the Spirit.
Indeed! But celebrating God's High Holy Days and the Festival of Lights (Chanukkah) has absolutely Nothing to do with the Law
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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HisGrace
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by SoftTouch:
Remember, Jesus was Jewish (born of a Jewish mother) and he observed All the Jewish Feasts (which were Ordained and Set by God Himself - who Jesus IS). So then, what difference does it make as to what an Orthodox Rabbi thinks in light of the truth?
The cross has released us from the law.
Romans 7:6 but now we have been released from the law, for we died with Christ, and we are no longer captive to its power. Now we can really serve God, not in the old way by obeying the letter of the law, but in the new way by the Spirit.
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SoftTouch
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by HisGrace:
I have seen Orthodox Jewish rabbis interviewed and they are offended with this wave of Messianic Christians who put their own spin on Jewish traditions.
I am sure they wouldn't see the Shamash as Jesus in the Chanukkia - they don't consider him to be the Messiah.
I'm certain the Orthodox don't... but the Messianic's Do The Messianic Jews (and Gentiles) KNOW that Yeshua HaMachiach (Jesus the Messiah) IS our Redeemer, our Lord, Our Savior, Our King and Our God. Remember, Jesus was Jewish (born of a Jewish mother) and he observed All the Jewish Feasts (which were Ordained and Set by God Himself - who Jesus IS). So then, what difference does it make as to what an Orthodox Rabbi thinks in light of the truth?
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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HisGrace
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quote:
Originally posted by SoftTouch:
I was hoping that some would see the beauty of this Holiday If God had not Blessed the Macabees and granted them success, it's possible the Jewish race could have been wipped out. Of course the Lord would never have allowed that to happen since it was HIS plan from the beginning to bring Salvation to All through the Jews via Jesus
I find the example of the Chanukkia (9 candled lamp) with Yeshua (Jesus) being the Center Candle (the One who provides the Light to the rest, and the servant of the rest) to be a Wonderful picture of our Lord and Savior!
I have seen Orthodox Jewish rabbis interviewed and they are offended with this wave of Messianic Christians who put their own spin on Jewish traditions.
I am sure they wouldn't see the Shamash as Jesus in the Chanukkia - they don't consider him to be the Messiah.
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SoftTouch
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Praise The Lord SilverLion! God is GOOD!!!
Here's a link to Chosen People Ministry: http://www.chosenpeople.com/
I don't know if you can find the info you want online there, but you can certainly contact them. I'm sure they have loads of info on witnessing to Jewish people about our Awsome Messiah!
There also Jews For Jesus: http://jewsforjesus.com/
These are the only two Messianic groups that I personally know (and trust) that are Online.
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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silverlion
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Member # 5293
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posted
Hello Again, Dear SoftTouch!
I am so glad you posted this! I was,believe it or not ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) ,looking for info' on the Hanukkah subject,and perhaps info'on how they celebrate as well.I've been thinking about this for awhile.I'll have to come back and read your posts more thoroughly!
Gotta go off-line for a break,but i had a wonderful shopping experience recently,and the little sales gal was a Jew from Israel,she's only been in the US for about 4 months! She was so kind and sweet,and made my whole week better!!!
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Psalm 68:13b ...treasures-Doves with wings of silver and feathers of gold.
Posts: 50 | From: Idaho | Registered: Nov 2005
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SoftTouch
Advanced Member
Member # 2316
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posted
I was hoping that some would see the beauty of this Holiday If God had not Blessed the Macabees and granted them success, it's possible the Jewish race could have been wipped out. Of course the Lord would never have allowed that to happen since it was HIS plan from the beginning to bring Salvation to All through the Jews via Jesus
I find the example of the Chanukkia (9 candled lamp) with Yeshua (Jesus) being the Center Candle (the One who provides the Light to the rest, and the servant of the rest) to be a Wonderful picture of our Lord and Savior!
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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SoftTouch
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posted
Celebrating The Light of The World!
Understanding Chanukkah from a Messianic Perspective:
(Taken from: http://www.jewsforjesus.org/publications/issues/3_5/hanukkah )
From the time of the Babylonian Exile, our people were under foreign domination. From 539 to 333 B.C.E., about two hundred years, we were subjects of the Persian Empire. This vast kingdom, included Syria to the north of Israel and Egypt, which is to the south. The Persians placed a governor in Israel who did not interfere much with the religious practices of our people. He was mainly concerned that we pay taxes to Persia and that we obey the Imperial civil laws. But it was the High Priest who was recognized as the representative of the people. He dealt with the Persian governor. And for the most part, there was little interference from the Emperor.
But the Persian government grew weak and vulnerable. Alexander and his formidable army conquered the Persians and under Greek rule, the system of government changed. Alexander died ten years later, and his kingdom was divided between many rulers, all of them Greek. These kingdoms were far from harmonious. Syria was under the Seleucids and Egypt under the Ptolemies. They were less than friendly to one another and Judea was caught between.
For the better part of the third century B.C.E., we were under the dominion of the Ptolemies. Unlike the Persians, no foreign governor was installed. Instead, the High Priest served as both political ruler and religious representative. Along with this greater measure of self-rule came a certain amount of pressure upon our people to adopt Greek culture and customs. This gave rise to political parties within Israel, some more disposed to the Greco-Syrians and others to the Greco-Egyptians. Wars were frequent. Eventually, Syria conquered the Jewish land. This meant more changes. The Seleucids were even more dedicated to establishing the Greek way of life amongst our people that the Ptolemies had been. Many Jews adopted Greek names. Jews began wearing togas. Even in Jerusalem, a gymnasium was erected and Greek games were introduced.
Antiochus IV, who called himself "Epiphanes" (the visible god) was the despised Syrian ruler. Acting as High Priest, was a hellenized Jew named Joshua, who had taken the Greek name Jason. Jason thought himself to be a moderate, but Antiochus wanted a more committed hellenist in his position and three years later, Menelaus (formerly Menachem) was installed as High Priest.
The Persians only wanted tribute. The Greek successors to Alexander, especially Antiochus IV, shared his vision and arrogant belief in the superiority of "the Greek way of life" called hellenism. While it is true that hellenism encouraged intellectual pursuits and a polite, highly civilized society, it nevertheless involved idolatry and exalted the wisdom of man. The hellenists had nothing but disdain for the Jewish religion and the Jewish way of life and they set about to "civilize" the people of Judea by forcing them into the Greek mold under Antiochus Epiphanes. Only those who would renounce the "old ways" could have a place in the idealized Greek society. The rest were treated like barbarians, enemies of the state. The practice of worshipping the God of Israel became a "crime."
During this time, many of our people were slain and the Holy Temple in Jerusalem was defiled. The golden altar, the candlesticks, all the gold and silver utensils were taken from the Temple. And to show his utter contempt for our religion, Antiochus sacrificed a sow in the Temple, offering it to the Greek god, Jupiter.
Meanwhile, war between Greek Egypt and Greek Syria continued. While Syria was advancing in its war with Egypt, Antiochus reluctantly withdrew in response to pressure from the Roman Senate. Judea then became the southern border of Syria. Wanting to keep the boundary with Egypt secure, he issued a decree for all the peoples in his kingdom demanding that they were to worship Grecian gods and to become Greeks. This was accepted by all Antiochus' subjects, all but the Jews. Our rejection of hellenism infuriated the Syrian king and we read in I Maccabees of the persecution that ensued:
The Books of the Law which they (the hellenists) found, they tore into pieces and burned. Wherever a book of the covenant was found in anyone's possession, or if anyone respected the Law, the decree of the king imposed the sentence of death upon him. Month after month, they dealt brutally with every Israelite who was found in the cities…In accordance with the decree, they put to death the women who had circumcised their children, hanging the newborn babies around their necks; and they also put to death their families as well as those who had circumcised them…
Some Jews fled from the cities to the hills of Judea, forming themselves into bands of guerrilla fighters. They were faithful to the God of Israel and would not assimilate into Greek culture and idolatry. One such group was led by a family of priests from the town of Modin, near Jerusalem. They were called Hasmoz scans, though no one seems to know how that name came about. Unlike the other bands of Jewish resistance fighters, the leader Mattathais and his five sons believed that for self-defense purposes, it was permissible to fight on the Sabbath. Until this time, the Greeks could prevail simply by attacking on the Sabbath. This guerrilla company was valiantly successful in its skirmishes with the Syrian soldiers. They grew in numbers and in the ability to fight. According to the account in the extra-biblical writings, Mattathais died within a year and his son Judah took charge. He was given the nickname, "Maccabee" which means "hammer." It was said that he was God's hammer to smash the Syrians. History and legend seem interwoven, but as best as we can piece it together, after three years of fighting, the Hasmoneans, under the leaddership of Judah Maccabee, vanquished the Syrians in Jerusalem and set about to purify the Temple. The altar which had been defiled with the sacrifice of pigs was dismantled and a new one built. New holy vessels were crafted. A date was set for the rededication of the Temple—the 25th of Kislev, the same day on which, three years earlier, Antiochus had issued his decree.
When Judah dedicated the Temple, only one vessel of sanctified oil was found—enough for one day. Miraculously, it burned for eight days. This is remembered by the kindling of lights for eight days. A special lamp, the menorah, is used.
It is the event of the dedication of the Temple in 165 B.C.E. which Jews around the world commemorate each year in the festival called Hanukkah. While some today maintain that Hanukkah is a minor festival, elevated only by the presence of Christmas in the same season, it was certainly important to Jews before the time of Jesus and yes, even during the first century for Jesus Himself celebrated the Festival of Hanukkah.
We read in the Gospel of John, a reference to Hanukkah:
Then came the Feast of Dedication at Jerusalem. It was winter, and Jesus was in the Temple area walking in Solomon's Colonnade. (John 10:22, 23)
They celebrated Hanukkah, not as a potato latkes party, but as a solemn time to remember the rededication of the Temple. It became a national festival, as well. The spirit was similar to Independence Day in the U.S., only the character of the feast was religious, not secular. It was observed with ceremonies resembling the Feast of Booths, accompanied by the offering of many sacrifices.
After the Temple in Jerusalem was destroyed, many Jews apparently lost their zeal for celebrating Hanukkah. It is ironic, that it is those who believe in Jesus, Jews and Gentiles, who can see more significance in this celebration of God's faithfulness. For those of us who believe in Jesus, believe His words, "Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days." (John 2:19)
Jesus was, by these words, speaking of himself as the Temple, the place of sacrifice, and the Holy altar. He was telling the people that while he would be destroyed physically, he would rise from the dead, that the Temple of God might never be defiled again, might never be made rubble. But, instead would stand for all eternity.
Today, Hanukkah is often called "the Festival of Lights." In Josephus' writings, we find no mention of the term "Hanukkah." Instead, he says, "From that time onward unto this day we celebrate the festival calling it 'Lights'" (Antiquities 12:325). His explanation for the name is that the right to serve God came to the people unexpectedly, like a sudden light.
It is interesting to note that it is traditional to have a shammos candle as part of the Hanukkah menorah. This candle is in addition to the eight candles. "Shammos" means servant. One of the reasons given for having this extra candle is that it can be used to light the others. The eight candies receive their light from the one. It's role is to serve. The writer of this article believes that the shammos can be regarded as a visual symbol of Jesus, who gives light to all who allow themselves to shine for God. He said of himself, "the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life as a ransom for many." (Matthew 20:28) We also read, that he was the true light, "…that gives light to every man." (John 1:9)
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Psalm 119:104Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way. 105Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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