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Topic: And was Jonah ever dead?
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Caretaker
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Jonah 2:
Jonah 2
1 Then Jonah prayed unto the LORD his God out of the fish's belly,
2 And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice.
3 For thou hadst cast me into the deep, in the midst of the seas; and the floods compassed me about: all thy billows and thy waves passed over me.
4 Then I said, I am cast out of thy sight; yet I will look again toward thy holy temple.
5 The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head.
6 I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God.
7 When my soul fainted within me I remembered the LORD: and my prayer came in unto thee, into thine holy temple.
8 They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy.
9 But I will sacrifice unto thee with the voice of thanksgiving; I will pay that that I have vowed. Salvation is of the LORD.
10 And the LORD spake unto the fish, and it vomited out Jonah upon the dry land.
The context of scripture does not support Jonah having died in the belly of the fish, but was rather entombed.
The Lord's reference to the sign of Jonah was more the entombing and the length, rather then the death and resurrection of Jonah.
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A Servant of Christ,
Drew
1 Tim. 3:
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh..
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Carol Swenson
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quote:
The DBR of Jonah to, of and from the great fish still speaks to the DBR of Christ not as a mere symbol but as a fact.
The Lord died first, then He was entombed, then He was resurrected with a glorified body never to die again.
Jonah did not die first but he was swallowed alive. And even if he had died inside the fish, he would not have been resurrected. He would have only been brought back to life to die again at a later time.
The sign of Jonah is the expression of "three days and three nights" and our Lord's foreknowledge of His own death, burial, and resurrection. But it's also much more than that. We have to ask why was Jonah preserved? What purpose did God have for saving him?
An evil generation asks for a sign, but the lost sinners of Nineveh did not demand a sign - they believed and repented after hearing Jonah speak even though they had been very evil.
"Nineveh was great in sin, for the Assyrians were known far and wide for their violence, showing no mercy to their enemies. They impaled live victims on sharp poles, leaving them to roast to death in the desert sun; they beheaded people by the thousands and stacked their skulls up in piles by the city gates; and they even skinned people alive. They respected neither age nor sex and followed a policy of killing babies and young children so they wouldn't have to care for them (Nahum 3:10)." (Bible Exposition Commentary - Be Amazed - Jonah).
Through Jonah God saved them, and He said:
Jonah 4:11 (NASB)
11 "Should I not have compassion on Nineveh, the great city in which there are more than 120,000 persons who do not know the difference between their right and left hand, as well as many animals?"
Yet the self-righteous Pharisees were so hard-hearted and arrogant that they would not listen to the very Son of God even after all His works and words of compassionate grace. They accused Him of being in league with the devil! Then they demanded a sign, and the Lord told them the only sign He would give them is the sign of Jonah, and that the people of Nineveh would condemn them on judgment day.
God is compassionate toward the poor and the lost, but Jesus knew these cruel Pharisees would not listen, He knew they would continue to oppress the people they should have cared for, He knew they would kill Him and try to stop Him, He knew that He would be entombed for only three days, He knew the salvation message of God would not be stopped by them, and He knew they were bringing a terrible judgment onto themselves.
Matthew 12:38-42 (NKJV)
38 Then some of the scribes and Pharisees answered, saying, "Teacher, we want to see a sign from You." 39 But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. 40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. 41 The men of Nineveh will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and indeed a greater than Jonah is here. 42 The queen of the South will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, for she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and indeed a greater than Solomon is here.
It gets even worse!
Matthew 12:43-45 (NKJV)
43 "When an unclean spirit goes out of a man, he goes through dry places, seeking rest, and finds none. 44 Then he says, 'I will return to my house from which I came.' And when he comes, he finds it empty, swept, and put in order. 45 Then he goes and takes with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter and dwell there; and the last state of that man is worse than the first. So shall it also be with this wicked generation."
"The primary application is to the nation of Israel, especially that generation present when Jesus ministered on earth. The nation had been purged of idolatry which had plagued them in the Old Testament. But reformation was not enough. Reformation could cleanse, but it could not fill. The nation should have received the Savior and been filled with spiritual life. Instead, the people rejected Him and the end was destruction." (Bible Exposition Commentary - Be Loyal -Matthew).
Nineveh was saved because they repented after hearing Jonah. These Pharisees condemned not only themselves, but the entire nation to destruction.
The sign of Jonah is not just one verse, but everything the Lord said to them that day. It's the entire story of Jonah and what it meant for the future of Israel.
“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. Look, your house is left to you desolate. I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’ ” (Luke 13:34-35 NIV)
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Brother Paul
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Good Morning John, the Lord bless you...
Though teleportation as you suggest is of course possible with the Lord, I do not see it indicated in the story.
A misnomer many surmise, but also not actually stated in the story, is that Jonah somehow washed up on the shore of Ninevah...this is why I said Assyria, which for many, many decades bordered along the Mediterranean Sea.
Jonah was from the Samaritan area of Galillee which was not far from the coast of this same great sea.
When Jonah after his trial decided and comitted to do what the Lord had requested he undoubtedly walked (or bought a camel, or donkey, or caught a lift down the Euphrates) a long way to get to Ninevah. Another misnomer is that Ninevah was only about 3 miles long by 2 miles wide (the main city where the palace remains can be found to this day), but archaeology has discovered that that was Ninevah proper the main city, which had many surrounding burros (like NY), and it was actually quite large. Ninevah the city-state was enclosed on one side by the Tigris and Zab rivers, and it went at least as far south as Calah (no less than twenty miles in that direction), and to as far north as Khorsabad (another 10 to 15 miles in the opposite direction).
So it would not have taken as long as one would think for Jonah to have got to Ninevah (the city-state) in which he spent 3 amd 1/2 days covering all the territory with his history changing message. BY my studies I believe they returned to their malicious ways in the time of Nahum the prophet and this ended in their demise at the hand of Nebuchednezzar.
Cool thought though...I suppose that one day we all will be beamed up...
May the Lord inspire and continue to use you where you are through the opportunities He provides you with...
Your brother in Christ,
Paul
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John Hale
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I always thought it strange the equation of the Assyrians with anything of the sea... Nineveh being so far away from a sea of any kind. And the prophecy of Jonah either understates a significant time lag or was a low key prophecy of teleportation.
There were several teleportations in scripture. Philip was one of the more apparent when witnessing to the Ethiopian eunuch. But Elijah and the "fiery chariot" was another... as was Jesus entering the upper room though all the windows and doors were locked. His appearance on the road to Emmaus and departure once the bread was broken and they realized who he was... his ascension....
Often times we think of it as mere flight until the clouds covered him... the ascension... it was a demonstration of his mastery over the natural (physics) and the supernatural (metaphysics) involving a teleportation which was at times not so instantaneous nor is it necessary to be teleportation.
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Brother Paul
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Who has heard of the god called the Oannes? The Oannes is a god from the Assyrian pantheon that was greatly feared at this time. The Oannes was a half-fish half man god who would allegedly periodically rise from out the sea and come to exact retribution upon the Assyrians.
What do you think the people of Assyria thought as Jonah came up out of the sea, probably bleached white from the salts (or possibly stomach acids) wrapped on the weeds of the deep sea (not a boat in sight) preaching "REPENT OR ELSE in 40 days the God of all gods will utterly destroy you all???"
Well though Jonah (Yunas in Assyrian) is not mentioned by name in connection with this event in any History we have unearthed up until this time, the entire Kingdom of Nineveh did in fact, near to this alleged time, undergo an apparent, sudden, and radical change of heart.
They literally took a 180 degree turn, and ceased from their warlike stance against Israel. Prior to this period, their interrelations were based on a continuous barrage of Assyrian terrorism and persecution over many generations.
The Assyrians were clearly the enemies of Abraham’s God, and of Israel, ever since they had come into power. History tells us these reforms came at the beckoning of King Adad-Nivari of Ninevah, and lasted for the next three generations of Assyrian Kings. It is my belief that Adad-Navari heard the Shofar blast from this apparent Oannes (which was actually Yunas), that he believed this god if not the God, and commanded his people everywhere to repent of their previous barbaric political stance!
Archaeologically we have found a mound inscribed as Yunas mound just outside of Ninevah proper.
Just more food for thought...
Brother Paul
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Eden
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I was taught that Jonah was dead and that he lay inside the whale on a bench of cartilage and Jonah did not eat any Omega-3 and Omega-6 fatty acids because Jonah was dead.
Then when the whale came close to a nice beach, the Lord raised Jonah from the dead while Jonah was still laying inside the whale on the bench of cartilage.
And this sudden movement by Jonah made the whale regurgiate Jonah close to that nice beach, where Jonah laid in the surf like an oldtime Robinson Crusoe for a long time, that's how I heard the story went, anyway ...
love, Eden
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John Hale
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Jonah 2:1-10 (KJV)
1 Then Jonah prayed unto the LORD his God out of the fish’s belly,
2 And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice.
3 For thou hadst cast me into the deep, in the midst of the seas; and the floods compassed me about: all thy billows and thy waves passed over me.
4 Then I said, I am cast out of thy sight; yet I will look again toward thy holy temple.
5 The waters compassed me about, even to the soul: the depth closed me round about, the weeds were wrapped about my head.
6 I went down to the bottoms of the mountains; the earth with her bars was about me for ever: yet hast thou brought up my life from corruption, O LORD my God.
7 When my soul fainted within me I remembered the LORD: and my prayer came in unto thee, into thine holy temple.
8 They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy.
9 But I will sacrifice unto thee with the voice of thanksgiving; I will pay that that I have vowed. Salvation is of the LORD.
10 And the LORD spake unto the fish, and it vomited out Jonah upon the dry land.
The highlighted above can be poetic exaggeration (though not by much) if he did not die... or literal if he did die. Soul fainting within me could be a problem for the resurrected Jonah theory.
Even if Jonah did not die and there was not a resurrection model per se... the example Jesus gave of Jonah is still valid for a prophetic sign of his own resurrection. But I personally believe the actual emphasis was on the timeliness of the events because he could have cited several resurrections in Elijah and Elisha's prophetic ministries and at least two I can think of off hand in his own ministry if the resurrection alone was the sign for this adulterous generation.
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WildB
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Well evidently you have never been under combat situations.
And I find your making lite of the DBR comparison as set fourth in the KJV Bible troubling to my soul.
I don't care what any of these scallops of the cloth have to say about the matter.
Their opinion is only based on a land lovers perspective.
I can clearly see the DBR as set forth by our Christ.
All these side sermons are just plain silly to me.
The man made his prayer within the 1st 5 minutes of his last earth breathed life.
The rest of the time his remains compressed and depressed with the pressures exerted as the gastric juice turned it a tanned yellow and imparted its essence.
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That is all.....
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Eden
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The way I've always heard it is that Jonah was sitting on a bench of cartilage inside the whale's stomach and that Jonah ate Omega-3 and Omega-6 fatty acids. And that Jonah later reported that it was a smooth ride and that the seafood was good. That's the way I heard it, anyway.
love, Eden
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WildB
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A symbol is not a sign.
Did the wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a symbol?
The DBR of Jonah to, of and from the great fish still speaks to the DBR of Christ not as a mere symbol but as a fact.
Its elementary Watson.
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That is all.....
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Carol Swenson
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Expositons of Holy Scripture: Old Testament
The miracle of rescue is the last point. Jonah’s repentance saved his life. So Israel was taught that the break-up of their national life would not be their destruction if they turned to the Lord in their calamity. The wider lesson of the means of making chastisement into blessing, and securing a way of escape—namely, by owning the justice of the stroke, and returning to duty—is meant for us all. He who sends the storm watches its effect on us, and will not let His repentant servants be utterly overwhelmed. That is a better use to make of the story than to discuss whether any kind of known Mediterranean fish could swallow a man. If we believe in miracles, the question need not trouble us. And miracle there must be, not only in the coincidence of the fish and the Prophet being in the same bit of sea at the same moment, but in his living for so long in his strange ‘ark of safety.’
The ever-present providence of God, the possible safety of the nation, even when in captivity, the preservation of every servant of God who turns to the Lord in his chastisement, the exhibition of penitence as the way of deliverance, are the purposes for which the miracle was wrought and told. A devout insight yields a worthy meaning. Jesus Christ employed this incident as a symbol of His Death and Resurrection.
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Carol Swenson
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quote:
The true meat is in the Sign to Israel that Christ was to later proclaim of his DBR (Death Burial Resurrection.)
Fine. I went back and bolded those parts.
But if the Gentiles were only a side issue, why did the Lord make it a point?
29As the crowds were increasing, He began to say, “This generation is a wicked generation; it seeks for a sign, and yet no sign will be given to it but the sign of Jonah. 30“For just as Jonah became a sign to the Ninevites, so will the Son of Man be to this generation. 31“The Queen of the South will rise up with the men of this generation at the judgment and condemn them, because she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and behold, something greater than Solomon is here. 32“The men of Nineveh will stand up with this generation at the judgment and condemn it, because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and behold, something greater than Jonah is here. (Luke 11)
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WildB
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That s all fine and dandy. But if we rightfully divide the scripture we would know that the involvement of the gentiles in this story is a side issue. For did not Paul say...
Col.1
[26] Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
[27] To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
The true meat is in the Sign to Israel that Christ was to later proclaim of his DBR (Death Burial Resurrection.)
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That is all.....
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Carol Swenson
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Okay, maybe next week...I'll check my calendar.
International Standard Bible Encyclopedia
According to the book bearing his name, Jonah the son of Amittai received a command to preach to Nineveh; but he fled in the opposite direction to escape from the task of proclaiming Yahweh’s message to the great heathen city; was arrested by a storm, and at his own request was hurled into the sea, where he was swallowed by a great fish, remaining alive in the belly of the fish for three days. When on his release from the body of the fish the command to go to Nineveh was renewed, Jonah obeyed and announced the overthrow of the wicked city. When the men of Nineveh repented at the preaching of the prophet, God repented of the evil He had threatened to bring upon them. Jonah was grieved that the oppressing city should be spared, and waited in the vicinity to see what would be the final outcome. An intense patriot, Jonah wished for the destruction of the people that threatened to swallow up Israel. He thought that Yahweh was too merciful to the heathen oppressors. By the lesson of the gourd he was taught the value of the heathen in the sight of Yahweh. It is the fashion now in scholarly circles to treat the Book of Jonah as fiction. The story is said to be an allegory or a parable or a symbolic narrative. Why then did the author fasten upon a true and worthy prophet of Yahweh the stigma of rebellion and narrowness? On theory that the narrative is an allegory, J. Kennedy well says that “the man who wrote it was guilty of a gratuitous insult to the memory of a prophet, and could not have been inspired by the prophet’s Master thus to dishonor a faithful servant.”
Our Lord referred on two different occasions to the sign of Jonah the prophet (Mt 12:38-41; Lk 11:29-32; Mt 16:4). He speaks of Jonah’s experience in the belly of the fish as parallel with His own approaching entombment for three days, and cites the repentance of the Ninevites as a rebuke to the unbelieving men of his own generation. Our Lord thus speaks both of the physical miracle of the preservation of Jonah in the body of the fish and of the moral miracle of the repentance of the Ninevites , and without the slightest hint that He regarded the story as an allegory.
The New Unger’s Bible Dictionary
Various interpretations are given of “the sign of Jonah the prophet” (Matthew 12:39). Keil (Com., ad loc.) says: “The mission of Jonah was a fact of symbolical and typical importance, which was intended not only to enlighten Israel as to the position of the Gentile world in relation to the kingdom of God, but also to typify the future adoption of such of the heathen as should observe the word of God, into the fellowship of the salvation prepared in Israel for all nations.” Whedon (Com., ad loc.) explains: “Our Lord, even in refusing a sign, gives a sign. His prophecy of his burial, after the manner of the swallowing of Jonah, was in itself a miracle of foreknowledge, and so a proof of his Messiahship.” Bibliography: F. E. Gaebelein, The Servant and the Dove (1946), pp. 52-143; H. Martin, The Prophet Jonah: His Character and Mission (1958); P. Fairbairn, Jonah, His Life, Character and Mission (1964), pp. 3-81.
Holman Bible Dictionary
In the Gospels, especially at Matthew 12:40, Jonah’s stay in the fish (1:17) is represented as a type of Jesus’ brief confinement to the grave. Exegetically the fish is the means of God’s rescue of the prophet from drowning. In Jewish exposition the incident was given a negative interpretation as a threat from which Jonah had to be saved. Jesus reflected this contemporary understanding: His concern was to teach about His mission rather than to exegete the book.
Warren Wiersbe
We glorify God by enjoying His will and doing it from our hearts (Eph. 6:6), and that’s where Jonah failed.
Jonah could say with the psalmist, “The Lord has chastened me severely, but He has not given me over to death” (Ps. 118:18, NKJV). God prepared a great fish to swallow Jonah and protect his life for three days and three nights.
Jonah no doubt expected to die in the waters of the sea, but when he woke up inside the fish, he realized that God had graciously spared him. As with the Prodigal Son, whom Jonah in his rebellion greatly resembles (Luke 15:11-24), it was the goodness of God that brought him to repentance (Rom. 2:4).
The fact that God chastened His servant is proof that Jonah was truly a child of God, for God disciplines only His own children. “But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons” (v. 8). And the Father chastens us in love so that “afterward” we might enjoy “the peaceable fruit of righteousness”.
The “sign of Jonah” is seen in his experience of “death,” burial, and resurrection on the third day, and it was the only sign Jesus gave to the nation of Israel.
Some students are troubled by the phrase “three days and three nights,” especially since both Scripture and tradition indicate that Jesus was crucified on Friday. In order to protect the integrity of Scripture, some have suggested that the Crucifixion be moved back to Thursday or even Wednesday. But to the Jews, a part of a day was treated as a whole day; and we need not interpret “three days and three nights” to mean seventy-two hours to the very second. For that matter, we can’t prove that Jonah was in the fish exactly seventy-two hours. The important thing is that centuries after the event, Jonah became a “sign” to the Jewish people and pointed them to Jesus Christ.
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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Carol Swenson:
WildB
I agree with you about most things, and I agree with some of what you post here. But, respectfully, I don't agree that Jonah died.
Then you get yourself in the belly juice of a great fish and submerge to depths that would crush the halls of any modern day titanium constructed sub for 3 days and nights and live to prove me silly. Lol, Love ya thou.
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Carol Swenson
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WildB
I agree with you about most things, and I agree with some of what you post here. But, respectfully, I don't agree that Jonah died.
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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Carol Swenson:
If Jonah died, repented in Hades, and was brought back to life, then that would violate Scripture:
And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment ( Hebrews 9:27).
Scripture does teach us of others who were brought back to life, but not because they repented in Hades.
I think that Jonah, like David, was that miserable, but he wasn't physically dead.
Psalm 88
4I am reckoned among those who go down to the pit;
I have become like a man without strength,
5 Forsaken among the dead,
Like the slain who lie in the grave,
Whom You remember no more,
And they are cut off from Your hand.
6 You have put me in the lowest pit,
In dark places, in the depths.
Scripture says that God will chastise those He loves. It does not say that He will kill them and then bring them back to life when they repent.
We must remember that before Christ led captivity captive. That the righteous souls went to Abraham's bosom separated from Hell by a great gulf.
If you say that Jonah did not die then you make Christ a liar and his Jonah sign to Israel of no effect.
How can one not see the death, burial, and reselection?
Do you really believe that a Jew 2000 years ago had any other thought than that the man Jonah came back from the dead after sloping around in the digestive fluids of a great fish for 3 days and nights? I'm shur after this mans resurrection he had a skin tone and after smell that set him apart as most strange. Something that not only opened the eye, nose gate, but most importantly the ear gate of the people of Nineveh.
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Carol Swenson
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If Jonah died, repented in Hades, and was brought back to life, then that would violate Scripture:
And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment ( Hebrews 9:27).
Scripture does teach us of others who were brought back to life, but not because they repented in Hades.
I think that Jonah, like David, was that miserable, but he wasn't physically dead.
Psalm 88
4I am reckoned among those who go down to the pit;
I have become like a man without strength,
5 Forsaken among the dead,
Like the slain who lie in the grave,
Whom You remember no more,
And they are cut off from Your hand.
6 You have put me in the lowest pit,
In dark places, in the depths.
Scripture says that God will chastise those He loves. It does not say that He will kill them and then bring them back to life when they repent.
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becauseHElives
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byfaith , my point exactly....
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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byfaith
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Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead...and the young girl.
so, why not raise Jonah from the dead as well?
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WildB
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quote:
Originally posted by Carol Swenson:
So you're saying that Jonah is an example of a second chance after death.
In Psalms 139 David mentioned making his bed in Sheol, yet how many would think that David died and was resurrected by God (See also Psalm 18.5; 30.3; 88:5)?
No Im saying that Christ used the experience of Jonah as the great Old Testament picture/sign of His own death and resurrection.
David's hell was not physical. David's yet living mind, heart and soul were in a spiritual hell within his yet live body.I assure you his sleep was no longer sweet because of his bedding of another mans wife and the later murdering of her husband. For he also mentioned I am weary with my groaning; all the night make I my bed to swim; I water my couch with my tears.To me that's making ones bed in hell.
This whale of a sin was so great the Bible tells us that,
2Sam.12
[14] Howbeit, because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, the child also that is born unto thee shall surely die.
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Brother Paul
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Another interesting post. Good point Carol. If he was actually physically dead and not merely figurative as dead, then this would imply one of two things:
a) that the Lord sometimes offers as second chance for the disobedient and rebellious after death when they suddenly in Sheol decide to repent, but the word clearly says it is given unto man ONCE to die and then the judgment...or
b) as a "type" of the resurrection Jonah was not actually dead (his soul not yet seperated from his body) but rather as dead (like Lazarus). If the "Cetos" or great sea creature, was actually a massive sperm whale, their sinus cavity below the blow hole has been found to be as large as 4 or 5 square feet and could have possibly provided enough air to breath...however I know the Lord can resusitate the recently "dead" (like Lazarus)so this is also equally plausible and this would not be "the first resurrection".
An interesting fact relative to b as a possiblity is that when objects get stuck in this cavity (which we now know they often do) the whale nearly beaches itself in order to cough or sneeze the object out...
Just my two cents to feed the discussion...
Love in Chist
Brother Paul
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Carol Swenson
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So you're saying that Jonah is an example of a second chance after death.
In Psalms 139 David mentioned making his bed in Sheol, yet how many would think that David died and was resurrected by God? (See also Psalm 18.5; 30.3; 88:5).
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WildB
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Jonah died in the belly of the great fish
Jonah 2:2And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice. KJV
“Out of the belly of hell and the grave cried I.’’ The fish might well be called a grave, and, as it was a prison to which Jonah was condemned for his disobedience and in which he lay under the wrath of God, it might well be called the belly of hell. Thither this good man was cast, and yet thence he cried to God, and it was not in vain; God heard him, heard the voice of his affliction, the voice of his supplication. There is a hell in the other world, out of which there is no crying to God with any hope of being heard; but, whatever hell we may be in the belly of in this world, we may thence cry to God. When Christ lay, as Jonah, three days and three nights in the grave, though he prayed not, as Jonah did, yet his very lying there cried to God for poor sinners, and the cry was heard – Matthew Henry
Other Commentary does matter and does have weight…….
In addition there are many known documented events of men and animals being retrieved from whales after days inside their air compartments. That is not a miracle, only explained events. A miracle is something that man can not explain, it is an act of God, like Jonah and his resurrection
3 Other Scolars, not minimalists, that believe Jonah died: are listed below
Dr. Henry M. Morris also leans toward this view. He said, The Lord Jesus confirmed the historicity of both Jonah and his experience in the “fish” by citing it as a type of his own coming death, burial and resurrection (Matthew 12:39, 40). In fact, these words of Christ probably indicate that Jonah, like Jesus, actually died and was then restored to life (Dr. Henry M. Morris, The Defender’s Study Bible, World Publishing, 1995, note on Jonah 1:17)……
Dr. M. R. DeHaan said,
The Lord Jesus Christ Himself vouches for the historicity and literalness of Jonah by seizing upon it as a type of His own literal Death and Resurrection. In Matthew 12:40, Jesus, in answer to His critics, who questioned His authority, says: “For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the fish’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.” Jonah most probably died and was resurrected……..
(M. R. DeHaan, M.D., Jonah – Fact or Fiction?, Zondervan Publishing House, 1957, Introduction)
J. Vernon McGee, holds the view that Jonah actually died while in the belly of the great fish. The Hebrew word “sheol” is translated “hell” by the translators of the KJV Bible. McGee says this concerning the use of this word in the phrase, “out of the belly of hell”:
The longer I study the Book of Jonah, and Christ’s words in Matthew 12:39-41, the more I tend to agree with Dr. DeHaan that Jonah actually died while he was in the stomach of that fish. Christ literally died on the Cross, and rose again from the dead. And Christ used the experience of Jonah as the great Old Testament picture of His own death and resurrection. This was also the view of Dr. J. Vernon McGee, who went into great detail on this subject in his Thru the Bible Commentary (Dr. J. Vernon McGee, Thru the Bible, Thomas Nelson, 1982, volume III, pp. 749-755).
The phrase, “earth with her bars,” is Elizabethan English and this was a way death was spoken of in day the King James Bible was translated. There is no other way to interpret the phrase except to mean, “bars of death”.
Further, the phrase “brought up my life from corruption”, is referring to the decay of the body. “Corruption” is death. In Acts 2:25-31, Peter states the Lord Jesus did not see corruption. It does not mean He did not die, but that His body did not decay.
The greatest argument for Jonah actually dying and being raised form the dead is in Matthew 12:40. Jesus told the Pharisees that wanted a sign that none would be given but the sign of the prophet Jonah. Jesus said the sign was that as Jonah was three days and three nights in the heart of the earth, so should He would be. Jesus actually died on the cross and was physically
dead for three days and nights in the grave and on the three day rose. Jesus’s using Jonah as a illustration of His resurrection which was to be a sign the Jews would see can not be ignored. For the sign to be used they must have been paralleled. This is the strongest argument to evidence
that as Christ died, so did Jonah.
I believe the evidence weighs heavy in favor of Jonah dying in the fish and being raised again. The miracle of Jonah’s deliverance was greater in that God raised him from death.
Blessings……..
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That is all.....
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Carol Swenson
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Many people feel that the account given in the Bible of Jonah is legendary, since even if there were a fish big enough to swallow a man, certainly no man would be able to survive three days in its digestive tract and then escape to the outside world.
However, again and again, Jesus referred to this as a historical event, and even pointed to it as a foreshadowing of his own death and resurrection.
There are, however, several documented accounts of people who have been swallowed by whales and large fish, and have lived to tell about it, even after several days. One species of fish, the "Sea Dog" (Carcharodon carcharias), is found in all warm seas, and can reach a length of 40 feet. In the year 1758, a sailor fell overboard from a boat in the Mediterranean and was swallowed by a sea dog. The captain of the vessel ordered a cannon on the deck to be fired at the fish, which vomited up the sailor alive and unharmed after it was struck.
Sperm whales can swallow lumps of food eight feet in diameter. Entire skeletons of sharks up to sixteen feet in length have been found in them. In February of 1891, James Bartley, a sailor aboard the whaling ship "Star of the East," was swallowed by a whale in the vicinity of the Falkland Islands. He was within the whale for more than forty-eight hours, and after he was found inside the whale, which had been harpooned and brought aboard the whaling ship, it took him two weeks to recover from the ordeal. Sir Francis Fox wrote as follows about this:
Bartley affirms that he would probably have lived inside his house of flesh until he starved, for he lost his senses through fright and not from lack of air. He remembers the sensation of being thrown out of the boat into the sea. . . . He was then encompassed by a great darkness and he felt he was slipping along a smooth passage of some sort that seemed to move and carry him forward. The sensation lasted but a short time and then he realized he had more room. He felt about him and his hands came in contact with a yielding slimy substance that seemed to shrink from his touch. It finally dawned upon him that he had been swallowed by the whale . . . he could easily breathe; but the heat was terrible. It was not of a scorching, stifling nature, but it seemed to open the pores of his skin and draw out his vitality. . . . His skin where it was exposed to the action of the gastric juice . . . face, neck and hands were bleached to a deadly whiteness and took on the appearance of parchment . . . (and) never recovered its natural appearance . . . (though otherwise) his health did not seem affected by his terrible experience.
Another individual, Marshall Jenkins, was swallowed by a Sperm Whale in the South Seas. The Boston Post Boy, October 14, 1771, reported that an Edgartown (U.S.A.) whaling vessel struck a whale, and that after the whale had bitten one of the boats in two, it took Jenkins in its mouth and went under the water with him. After returning to the surface, the whale vomited him on to the wreckage of the broken boat, "much bruised but not seriously injured."
http://www.grmi.org/Richard_Riss/evidences/8jonah.html
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Carol Swenson
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 Jesus and Jonah
Surely every Bible teacher knows the importance of trying to teach the principles of the Bible more deeply than we often do. One way to do that is to tie together lessons from the Old and New Testament and show how the principles relate to us today.
The book of Jonah probably has as many lessons and principles that relate to Christianity as any book of its size in the Old Testament. One of my earliest sermons of more than 50 years ago (borrowed, I am sure, from another person) discussed the following: We see Jonah first, running away from God. Second, he was running to God. Third, he was running with God. Fourth, he was running ahead of God.
But today I want to consider Jonah as a type of Christ, for Christ said in Matt. 12:40, "For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." Let us note several points that make it proper for the Lord to speak of "the sign of Jonah the prophet" as He compared himself to Jonah (Matt. 12:39). Although He was speaking of His burial, there are several other points of comparison we could make.
First, because of the infinite love of God for a lost and wayward people, Jonah was sent on a mission of revelation, condemnation and redemption. Paul says, "This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief" (I Tim. 1:15). To the Jew, it was amazing almost beyond belief that God loved people in the Gentile nations. It might deepen our appreciation to know that the words "Gentile" and "nations" are often translated from the Greek word "ethnos" which suggests persons of various ethnic groups rather than simply "nations" as we normally think of them. Even after Peter had been with Jesus for three years and had seen His infinite love manifested to the fullest, he could not quite grasp that significant fact, as shown in the story of Cornelius in Acts 10 and 11. I shamefully confess that it is almost beyond my comprehension that God can so love men like Castro and Hitler that He sent His Son to die for them. But it fills me with humble gratitude that I am included in that list for which He died.
Jesus not only came into the world to preach the gospel, but that there might be a gospel to preach. It is remarkable that in most of these lessons on types, Jesus, the antitype is almost always more than the type. He is both the giver and the gift; He is the bread and water; He is the manna and the one who gave it; He is the sacrifice, and the one who offered the sacrifice. So in this case, He is the preacher, and the message preached.
As Jonah voluntarily gave himself up (Jonah 2:2,3) so Christ became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. He said, "No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself" (John 10:18). As in all cases, we must not try to press all details of a story into a type, for Jonah was fleeing from the presence of God because he did not want to do His bidding. Jesus came from God because He did want to do His will. Jonah deserved death for His disobedience. Jesus was delivered up for our offenses, but did not deserve to die.
But when Jesus named Jonah as a type of himself, the primary thing He had in mind was that as Jonah was in the belly of the fish for three days and nights so would Christ be in the heart of the earth. We need to understand that the expression "three days and nights," "on the third day," and "after three days" all refer, in the language of the Bible, to the same period of time. There are some who still erroneously try to find a way to keep Jesus in the tomb for three full 24-hour days. There is no way to do that, for if one managed to twist the chronology to do that, he would still be in trouble with how to reconcile the expression "on the third day" with "after three days". If we realize that we do not have any contradictions to try to reconcile, but the expressions all referred to the same time period, then the chronology is easy to discover.
But as the big fish could not keep Jonah, neither could the grave keep the Savior. He arose to proclaim the saving message to lost people.
God "is long suffering to usward, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance" (2 Peter 3:9).
http://www.oldpaths.com/Archive/Brown/T/Pierce/1923/jonah.html
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Carol Swenson
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The event involved a divine miracle, as the Scripture strongly implies. The “great fish” was prepared and sent by God, as was the intense storm that threatened the ship on which Jonah was traveling. The storm ceased as soon as Jonah was cast overboard (Jonah 1:4, 15). In like manner, it was quite probable that God preserved Jonah's life miraculously all through the horrifying experience.
Scripture does not say Jonah died. How can you say he died?
Are you saying that you no longer believe in divine miracles because they are too much like Disney cartoons? The Bible is full of miracles that commom sense would say are impossible.
Daniel 3:19-28 (NASB)
19 Then Nebuchadnezzar was filled with wrath, and his facial expression was altered toward Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego. He answered by giving orders to heat the furnace seven times more than it was usually heated. 20 He commanded certain valiant warriors who were in his army to tie up Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego in order to cast them into the furnace of blazing fire. 21 Then these men were tied up in their trousers, their coats, their caps and their other clothes, and were cast into the midst of the furnace of blazing fire. 22 For this reason, because the king's command was urgent and the furnace had been made extremely hot, the flame of the fire slew those men who carried up Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego. 23 But these three men, Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego, fell into the midst of the furnace of blazing fire still tied up.
24 Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astounded and stood up in haste; he said to his high officials, "Was it not three men we cast bound into the midst of the fire?" They replied to the king, "Certainly, O king." 25 He said, "Look! I see four men loosed and walking about in the midst of the fire without harm, and the appearance of the fourth is like a son of the gods!" 26 Then Nebuchadnezzar came near to the door of the furnace of blazing fire; he responded and said, "Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego, come out, you servants of the Most High God, and come here!" Then Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego came out of the midst of the fire. 27 The satraps, the prefects, the governors and the king's high officials gathered around and saw in regard to these men that the fire had no effect on the bodies of these men nor was the hair of their head singed, nor were their trousers damaged, nor had the smell of fire even come upon them.
28 Nebuchadnezzar responded and said, "Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego, who has sent His angel and delivered His servants who put their trust in Him, violating the king's command, and yielded up their bodies so as not to serve or worship any god except their own God.
Daniel 6:16-26 (NASB)
16 Then the king gave orders, and Daniel was brought in and cast into the lions' den. The king spoke and said to Daniel, "Your God whom you constantly serve will Himself deliver you." 17 A stone was brought and laid over the mouth of the den; and the king sealed it with his own signet ring and with the signet rings of his nobles, so that nothing would be changed in regard to Daniel. 18 Then the king went off to his palace and spent the night fasting, and no entertainment was brought before him; and his sleep fled from him.
19 Then the king arose at dawn, at the break of day, and went in haste to the lions' den. 20 When he had come near the den to Daniel, he cried out with a troubled voice. The king spoke and said to Daniel, "Daniel, servant of the living God, has your God, whom you constantly serve, been able to deliver you from the lions?" 21 Then Daniel spoke to the king, "O king, live forever! 22 "My God sent His angel and shut the lions' mouths and they have not harmed me, inasmuch as I was found innocent before Him; and also toward you, O king, I have committed no crime." 23 Then the king was very pleased and gave orders for Daniel to be taken up out of the den. So Daniel was taken up out of the den and no injury whatever was found on him, because he had trusted in his God. 24 The king then gave orders, and they brought those men who had maliciously accused Daniel, and they cast them, their children and their wives into the lions' den; and they had not reached the bottom of the den before the lions overpowered them and crushed all their bones.
25 Then Darius the king wrote to all the peoples, nations and men of every language who were living in all the land: "May your peace abound! 26 "I make a decree that in all the dominion of my kingdom men are to fear and tremble before the God of Daniel; For He is the living God and enduring forever, And His kingdom is one which will not be destroyed, And His dominion will be forever.
![[Prayer]](graemlins/prayer.gif) God preserved His own and brought the knowledge of Himself to those pagan peoples. And Jonah was sent for the sake of another pagan people in Nineveh. It is not unbelievable to think that God preserved Jonah's life.
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becauseHElives
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this is a statement carol made in another post..... quote:
And was Jonah ever dead?
you know common sense would suggest Jonah was dead in the belly of that whale .....no air for long periods of time tend to suffocate humans ....
people quit comparing Pinocchio in the Disney carton to the scripture....
Jonah died in that whales belly and Yahweh raised him from the dead so he could finish what he told him to do in the first place.......
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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