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Topic: HOW SMALL WE ARE!
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bluefrog
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EDEN...Well, I think I fixed it. I'm sorry, I have had a headache for about three weeks now and I probably shouldn't even be doing this. I didn't notice where the draft and the final script didn't match. No wonder you said what you did. It had changed the subject but not the paragraph.
Would you believe that I was checking to see if you were paying attention ? Didn't think so.
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bluefrog
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EDEN...If you will notice, where it says something about Gen 2 and rauch...it jumped a cog and the new paragraph didn't happen, so it reads wrong. I will try to change it.
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Eden
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hello, bluefrog, glad to see you back. Are you ready? You wrote quote:
Breath of Life: Theologically, this is a very significant phrase suggesting the distinction between animal and human life. In Gen 2:7 man was formed and God breathed into his nostrils the BOL. In Hebrew, ruah means wind, breath, or spirit.
Ruah is nice but the Hebrew word in Gen.2:7 is "neshamah" of life, and not ruah.
And as I show again below, BOTH humans AND animals have the SAME neshamah, so in the matter of "breath", there is NO distinction between humans and animals.
Strong's Concordance
Genesis 2:7 And the LORD 3068 God 430 formed 3335 man 120 [of] the dust 6083 of 4480 the ground 127, and breathed 5301 into his nostrils 639 the breath 5397 of life 2416; and man 120 became a living 2416 soul 5315.
During the flood, all the animals died, and notice that all the animals that died ALSO had the breath (neshamah) of life in them:
Genesis 7:22 All in whose nostrils 639 [was] the breath 5397 of life 2416, of all that [was] in the dry 2724 [land], died 4191.
5397 neshamah; a puff, i.e. wind, angry or vital breath, divine inspiration, intellect. or (concretely) an animal:--blast, (that) breath(-eth), inspiration, soul, spirit.
love, Eden
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bluefrog
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It's a good thing that I am a frog, the way we jump around here. rivit
We are still on How Small We Are aren't we ? hehe
Breath of Life: Theologically, this is a very significant phrase suggesting the distinction between animal and human life. In Gen 2:7 man was formed and God breathed into his nostrils the BOL.
In Hebrew, ruah means wind, breath, or spirit. (the wind part must be for Texans)
In Gen 2 and other places, ruah represents the vitalizing principle that marks the difference between living and non living things. Gen 6:17 says that only God can cross the dividing line to give and maintain life, oh, and Job 27:3
Gen 6:17 And behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life (chaiy, plural for all kinds of manifistations)
Job 27:3 All the while, my breath (neshamah)is in me, and the spirit (ruach)of GOD is in my nostrils;
There is still something unique about the BOL, because it sets mankind apart from the animals.
God gave life to all biological living creatures, (even mother-in-laws) but the BOL that God breathed into mankind gives him understanding.
Job 32:8 But there is a Spirit (ruach)in man; and the inspiration of THE ALMIGHTY giveth them understanding.
That pretty much says it for me anyway. God has provided me with the Breath of Life and with it an understanding and inspiration.
When we discuss things like the Breath of Life, the Soul, the Spirit, our smallness, our faith, and so forth....don't we assume that we are speaking as Christians ? God tells us the penalty and comparisons for the nonbelievers but they are not dwelt on that much are they ?
All I am trying to say is, shouldn't we dwell on God's Word to us instead of pointing the finger?
As Christians, we have become a new creature so why harp on the old when we have a whole new life to learn about? Know what I mean ?
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Michael Harrison
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The soul is like a light bulb that does not have electricity.
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Michael Harrison
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Death is separation from God. That is why Jesus said to let the dead bury the dead. He meant that they were dead.
When I was in school our teacher once asked us to define life. It is amazing to discover that it isn't so definable.
When I became a hippie, in response to that question I determined that life was a response to the light and warmth of the sun, which caused the elements and compounds to intermingle, and react. Duh!
But what is life? we know people are living, but what does that mean? Well, it doesn't matter. We now know that life is Jesus. And without Him, we are dead, even if we seem alive.
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Eden
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Michael Harrison wrote quote:
Eden, the life that is in us which you call the "breath of life" is death.
The "breath of life" is NOT ENTIRELY DEATH for else you would be, well, dead.
But because of sin, the "breath of life" that is in us is like a weak car battery that is barely charged. And that is why Jesus would say that "virtue has gone out of me", as energy transfered from His strong battery to the weak battery of the people being healed. But it is NOT DEATH, for else you would be, dead.
And for sure, the Holy Spirit which enters us from above is pure, undefiled energy directly from God, which recharges our batteries.
The "neshamah breath of life" is defiled and has come up through the Adam & Eve line; but the "Holy Spirit breath of life" bypasses that line and is put into us directly from heaven:
Isaiah 42:3
A bruised reed shall He not break, and the smoking flax shall He not quench: He shall bring forth judgment unto truth.
love, Eden
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Michael Harrison
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But what is the soul? The soul is who I am (and perhaps I should say apart from Christ). Who I am is an entity who has a mind, a will and emotions. Who doesn't know the difference between his mind, and his emotions. One consists of our thought processes, and the other consists of our feelings. The will is the legislator between the two. After all has no one ever said to not to let your emotions overrule your mind, or in another situation, "follow your heart?" So, quite simply, the will chooses between the feelings or intellect. And that is who I am. I am a created being. I am a creature who makes choices. I have a purpose. I am created by God to be His temple, His home, and to serve and worship Him.
That is why Peter talks of putting off "this tabernacle." He was speaking of his body, which housed his soul, which was 'filled' with the Spirit of God. He was not separate from God. He was 'indwelt'. And his body was just the tent in the wilderness.
So I am a thinking, feeling person who makes choices based on a decision poised between the mind and the emotions, in favor of which one is more correct. And in a fallen state, these, as Watchman Nee has said, are in a state of perilous imbalance without the Holy Spirit in one's life, and without brokenness which yields one to the Holy Spirit.
But to reiterate what I, Michael said: I am a soul, who has a spirit, which without God is 'dead', and my soul and spirit indwells this body. The body is dead because of sin, and will fall away at some point. But my spirit is ALIVE by Christ. Therefore my soul prospers:
3Jn 1:2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.
And my soul prospers by the Spirit of God who indwells me. Selah!
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Michael Harrison
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Eden, the life that is in us which you call the "breath of life" is death. And the Holy Spirit is Life. And we are born again by the Holy Spirit, through the Blood of Jesus, and the Word of God who Jesus is. So in answer to your 'breath of life' assertion, let me affirm that what I am saying is true using this scripture which relates to the so called nephesh creatures to which you refer:
- Luk 9:60 Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury their dead: but go thou and preach the kingdom of God.
And for those who don't get it still, it reads, "Jesus said unto him, let the nephesh creatures bury their nephesh creatures, but go thou and preach the Kingdom of God."
And after all, yahswey already told ya:
quote:
If a person is not born again, then yes they are "nephesh" in the sense as they are like the animals and are basically "dead men walking".
Posts: 3273 | From: Charlotte N.C. | Registered: Sep 2007
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Eden
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yahsway wrote quote:
What do you think being "born again" means?
It is to have God's breath of life again, it is to become "alive" again into His image and His likeness. Just like Adam was before the fall.
If a person is not born again, then yes they are "nephesh" in the sense as they are like the animals and are basically "dead men walking".
That is NOT true. God breathed the "breath of life" into ALL the nephesh-creatures, including into man, and this "breath of life" has NOTHING TO DO with being "born again".
In Hebrew, the "breath of life" is neshamah and both man AND all the animals had (and have) this SAME "neshamah":
Genesis 2
7And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Strong's Concordance
Genesis 2:7 And the LORD 3068 God 430 formed 3335 man 120 [of] the dust 6083 of 4480 the ground 127, and breathed 5301 into his nostrils 639 the breath 5397 of life 2416; and man 120 became a living 2416 soul 5315.
During the flood, all the animals died, and notice that all the animals that died ALSO had the breath (neshamah) of life in them:
Genesis 7:22 All in whose nostrils 639 [was] the breath 5397 of life 2416, of all that [was] in the dry 2724 [land], died 4191.
5397 neshamah; a puff, i.e. wind, angry or vital breath, divine inspiration, intellect. or (concretely) an animal:--blast, (that) breath(-eth), inspiration, soul, spirit.
So yahsway said quote:
What do you think being "born again" means?
It is to have God's breath of life again, it is to become "alive" again into His image and His likeness. Just like Adam was before the fall.
The "breath of life" has NOTHING TO DO with being "born again".
The "breath of life" refers simply to the vital breath that is now, and has always been in all the nephesh-creatures, and even now that we are BORN AGAIN, we STILL have that same "neshamah" in us, because WITHOUT it we cannot live.
Christians now have BOTH the "neshamah breath of life" AND the Holy Spirit. But let's be clear that BOTH man AND animals have the SAME "neshamah breath of life" in them, and since animals are NOT BORN AGAIN, the "neshamah" has NOTHING to do with being BORN AGAIN.
love, Eden
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bluefrog
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Thanks guys. As you see, describing the SOUL is not as simple as one may think. At least it isn't to me.
If there are other folks reading these posts, I sure hope you are getting something out of this. The subject of Soul and Spirit are Supernatural and Spiritual. We try to understand the meanings but it seems to me that there is more to it than we can truly comprehend. Don't give up on us if you are trying to learn from our conversations.
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yahsway
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As I stated above, the word soul has 2 distinct meanings.
What do you think being "born again" means?
It is to have Gods breath of life again, it is to become "alive" again into His image and His likeness. Just like Adam was before the fall.
If a person is not born again, then yes they are "nephesh" in the sense as they are like the animals and are basically "dead men walking".
Adam was made in the image and likeness of God that is until after the fall.
Then Adam beget Seth in his own image and likeness as scripture states Sin was imputed to the human race thru Adams disobediance.
And as you pointed out in another post, Yeshua imputes righteousness to us who believe and accept it and to us who are "born again" unto His likeness and truly become "living Souls".
I was simply pointing out that you and bluefrog are both right in your assessment of the word "soul".
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Eden
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dear yahsway, you wrote quote:
The first use of the word soul in the OT expresses this meaning: "And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living being (soul.
This means more than being given physical life, the biblical writer declares that man became a "living soul", or a person, a human being, one Distinct from all other animals.
I think I refuted this in my post above this one. Man is a nephesh hayya just like all the animals are nephesh hayya.
Indeed, the translators of the KJV showed their BIAS when they wrote that the animals were "living creatures" (but the Hebrew was still "nephesh hayya").
But then when it came to human beings, the KJV translators could not handle calling humans also "creatures", and so the KJV translators decided to call man a living soul (eventhough the Hebrew was still "nephesh hayya").
We are thus NOT different than the animals in the matter of being a "nephesh hayya".
We ARE however DIFFERENT from the OTHER animals in that the Bible says that "WE were made in the image and likeness of God":
Genesis 1:26
And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness ...
THAT is NEVER said of the OTHER nephesh hayya. So yahsway you wrote quote:
... "And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living being (soul).
This means more than being given physical life, the biblical writer declares that man became a "living soul", or a person, a human being, one Distinct from all other animals.
Man is NOT distinct from the other animals in the matter of his "nephesh hayya" part.
love, Eden
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Eden
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Michael Harrison wrote quote:
Bluefrog, I don't know if it is 'edifying' for one to say that one "does not 'have' a soul, but is a soul." For technically, I suppose one is a soul, a living soul. But somehow we dissassociate ourselves and therefore we find it easier to say that we 'have' a soul. After all, I would say that I have a spirit. I would not say I am.
Yes, I think it is correct that you ARE a soul (a creature, an entity, your whole being), and you HAVE a spirit. Thus far you ARE a soul and you HAVE a spirit.
Michael then continued quote:
Also I would say I have a body, but I am a living soul who has a spirit, and a body.
Yes, I think that is how it goes. I am a living soul (creature) with a spirit and a body.
As Watchman Nee puts it, when a spirit and body are JOINED TOGETHER, what results is a soul, a nephesh, a creature.
It may help for instance to realize that whales are also souls or creatures or nephesh:
Genesis 1
21 And God created great whales and every living creature that moves, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
The bolded words above, living creature, is in Hebrew nephesh hayya, meaning living creature.
But many Christians are surprised to learn that people are also nephesh hayya or a living creature[b], just like the whales:
Genesis 2
7 And the LORD God formed [b]man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
The words "living soul" are in Hebrew nephesh hayya, man became a "nephesh hayya", a living creature.
Strong's Concordance
Genesis 1:21 And God 430 created 1254 (8799) great 1419 whales 8577, and every living 2416 creature 5315 that moves 7430 (8802), which the waters 4325 brought forth abundantly ...
Genesis 1:24 And God 430 said 559 (8799), Let the earth 776 bring forth 3318 (8686) the living 2416 creature 5315 after his kind 4327, cattle 929 and creeping things 7431 and ...
living 2416
2416 chay alive; hence, raw (flesh); fresh (plant, water, year), strong; also (as noun, especially in the feminine singular and masculine plural) life (or living thing), whether literally or figuratively:--+ age, alive, appetite, (wild) beast, company, congregation, life(-time), live(-ly), living (creature, thing),
creature 5315
5315 nephesh, properly, a breathing creature, i.e. animal of (abstractly) vitality; used very widely in a literal, accommodated or figurative sense (bodily or mental):--any, appetite, beast, body, breath, creature, X dead(-ly), desire,
Genesis 2:7 And the LORD 3068 God 430 formed 3335 (8799) man 120 [of] the dust 6083 of 4480 the ground 127, and breathed 5301 (8799) into his nostrils 639 the breath 5397 of life 2416; and man 120 became a living 2416 soul 5315.
So man IS a living creature (a nephesh hayya) and HAS a spirit and HAS a body.
Michael Harrison ended with quote:
But hey, why write an encyclopedia on that? I mean, essentially, if it is not edifying, why say it? (Supposedly constructive criticism is edifying, indirectly.)
Why write an encyclopedia on that? Because it is the Bible; the Bible is worth it.
But what is not edifying to say, that we ARE a soul (living creature)?
love, Eden
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yahsway
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Brother bluefrog, you are a soul and you have a soul, for in scripture the word "soul" has 2 distinct meanings. You were not wrong.
The 1st meaning of "soul" is that which makes a human or animal body alive. This usage of the word soul refers to life in the physical body.
The best example in the NT in which the Greek word for soul is translated as "life" is
"For whoever desires to save his life(soul) will lost it", Jesus declared "but whoever loses his life(soul) for My sake and the gospels will save it".
This idea is also present in the OT. For example, the soul of a dying person departed death (Gen 35:18)
The word "soul" also refers to the inner life of a person, the seat of emotions, and the center of human personality.
The first use of the word soul in the OT expresses this meaning: "And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living being (soul.
This means more than being given physical life, the biblical writer declares that man became a "living soul", or a person, a human being, one Distinct from all other animals.
The soul is described as the seat of many emotions and desires: the desire for food (Duet 12"20-21), love (Song 1:11)longing for God (Ps 63:1) rejoicing(Ps 86:4) knowing (Ps 139:14) and memory (Lam 3:20)
In the NT, Jesus spoke of his soul as being "exceedingly sorrowful" (Matt 36:28)
Mary the mother of Jesus, proclaimed that her "soul" magnifies the Lord (Luke 1:46).
John prayed that Gaius would "prosper in all things and be in health, just as your soul prospers" (3John 2).
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Michael Harrison
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Bluefrog, I don't know if it is 'edifying' for one to say that one "does not 'have' a soul, but is a soul." For technically, I suppose one is a soul, a living soul. But somehow we dissassociate ourselves and therefore we find it easier to say that we 'have' a soul. After all, I would say that I have a spirit. I would not say I am. Also I would say I have a body, but I am a living soul who has a spirit, and a body. But hey, why write an encyclopedia on that? I mean, essentially, if it is not edifying, why say it? (Supposedly constructive criticism is edifying, indirectly.)
Oops, gotta go. Lord willing, I will return! God bless yew all!
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Michael Harrison
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quote:
And becausehelives said: quote:
Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.
So indeed. For it is not our strength, not our contribution, not our willingness which accomplishes anything. Rather, by trying, we frustrate the grace of God. But who among us will accept that? Not until our thigh is dislocated do we come to that realization. Not until our 'outward' man is broken, are we enlightened. Till then we think we accomplish something by 'doing' rather than having, and claim we are serving God. Simply though, we start off by grace, and continue by works. This usurps God of the glory. And scripture says that no flesh shall glory in His presence. He seeks for us to come to the end of ourselves.
But when eden says that God shows His power in spite of our weakness, he is not wrong. For our weakness is what moves us out of HIS way, effectually, letting HIM be who HE is. In other words, our weakness cannot take credit for the grace of God which accomplishes certain things on our behalf. That is exactly why God is strong when we are weak. So we are to 'prefer' to be weak.
This is why Paul went into the spill about "If any man has a reason to boast, I have. Born of the stock of David, top of my class, full of zeal...." But he said if he would glory, it would not be in his education, or qualities, but his infirmities. That is the opposite of what you will hear from those who boast of what they 'do' for God. But what one does 'by' God can only be of faith, and without faith it is impossible to please God. And "Whatsoever is not of faith, is sin."
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bluefrog
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WildB started this thread written by CR Stam with the title "How Small are we?" In the text Stam asked "How big are you, actually, in the sight of God (Psalms 8:3,4) Then he commented on Christ's becoming man in order to break the bondage man has with death. He also refered to 1 Cor 1:27-29, v27..But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound (put to shame) the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound (put to shame) the things which are mighty; v28 And base (without family or descent)things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are; v29 That no flesh should glory in His presence.
A few comments were made on this.
On January 13th at 1:21 pm I wrote a script in an attempt to look back on my life, a point of view, not much different from others my age. I was trying to recognize how we usually start off BIG in our own minds as a young person but lacking in knowledge of value. We feel that no one can hold us back and we know it all. We get married and discover that we can be held back by comparison with responsibility and commitment to someone besides ourselves. Somewhere along the line if we are fortunate we also are introduced to God and start learning what is important. This should have been assumed when reading my scrript because I am a Christian. I went on to report that when we come close to our leaving our broken bodies we have time to reflect as long as our memories allow us to remember.
Later I tried to explain it again because of a comment made about it. First, I was told that the 10 spies were kept from the promise land for the same kind of thinking. I will never figure that one out. Then I was informed that age had nothing to do with expectations of what I am capable of doing. He went on later to say that age had nothing to do with our walk in faith. The same person told me that my post was "humanistic dribble" adding nothing to the topic "How small we are".
Some scripture was thrown in for good measure but mostly out of context as I found out later.
I told him I didn't read the rest of the message after the "humanistic dribble" comment. He informed me that I lied.
If in this thread we are not to comment on human life or size in the eyes of God, then what is it?
Later Becausehelives told Betty, WildB and myself that we all seem to think as the 10 spies.
He went on to say that "The church is full of humanistic thinking". He also went on to say that he may be small and old but God is BIG.
Later he told us all that we just focus on the natural, not God. This is so far off of what we had to say that I can't imagine where he came up with this 10 spy thang. ???? However, he informed us that He does focus on God. Then he offered a good word for himself to top it off:
Josh 14:8. Another came on and tried to explain what he was talking about and explained the 10 spies but we already knew that. Where was the connection?
Is there anyone on this board who is not aware of his or her smallness compared to God ? Is it necessary that we say that each time?
I was getting upset. Coming here, I thought was to discuss and learn of God's Word with Christians. At least with those interested.
So, I tried to explain in more detail. Then along came Eden. I had made the comment that
"I have a soul", well, here we go again. He corrected me and said I didn't, but instead I "Was" a soul. Well, I tried to explain my saying that and gave a number of scriptures but it did no good. Being told of my Humanistic Dribble and that I Had No Soul, I had had it. I told Eden he was right, Thanked him, and left the board. I realize that I can be Biblically wrong at times but prefer to told as an adult and not with a tongue lashing.
I thought this over for a few days and I really hate to leave letting the soul issue rest as is.
There is more to it than was brought up. I can't do anything about the 10 spies crossword though. I still don't get the connection to my comments about growing up. ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
I am over my being upset now and consider the source. I have decided to start a new topic on Soul and Spirit.
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becauseHElives
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Amen yahsway ![[thumbsup2]](graemlins/thumbsup2.gif)
Eden, I think the scriptures prove you wrong....
2 Corinthians 12:9-10
And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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Eden
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hi yahsway, you wrote quote:
God uses those infirmities to show others His power and His glory.
I do not think that God USES the infirmities to show His power, but rather that God shows His power and glory IN SPITE of a person's infirmities.
love, Eden
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yahsway
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Bless you Betty, i too know what you mean by the name it and claim it christianity.
But what they dont understand is that although you maybe handicapped, God works thru that handicap
Its when we are weak that is when His glory shines thru. For what may seem impossible for those with infirmities is possible with God.
God uses those infirmities to show others His power and His glory.
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Betty Louise
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that is the message I received. I apologize if I misjudged you. I have taken hits before because of being handicapped, so I admit I am sensitive on the subject. I have also came across some Christians who had the grab and claim it Christianity and they believed if you were not healed you were a inferior Christian.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
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becauseHElives
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Betty, I never even implied what you excuse me of
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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Betty Louise
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That may be what you meant to say, but you came off saying that if you are handicapped or old, you are a lesser Christian.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
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becauseHElives
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quote:
yahsway
If I may,
I believe what becauseHeLives was referring to when he mentioned the 10 spies was that those spies were looking at themselves and saw that the men in the land that they were to cross over and take were "Giants" and they were "Small".
They only saw the "natural" and lacked the faith needed to see in the supernatural. They saw themselves as being insignificant, small, and probably thought themselves "dead men" if they obeyed the Lord and crossed over to take the land.
Some might of thought they were not only too small to take on the Giants, they may have thought they were too "weak", "too old" ect..
Laying out every excuse not to obey the Lord and step out in faith. They only thought of "themselves". The Natural.
As the opening post by wildb said, God chooses the "foolish", "the weak", "the despised" "the base" to accomplish His will.
As the post wildb states Heb 2:15
"and release those who thru "Fear of Death" were ALL their lifetime subject to bondage." Just as the bad report by those spies because of their fear of death and lack of trust in God they lived out the rest of their lives in the desert and did not enter into the Land. The rest of their lives they were in bondage to that fear.
Yes we may at times see ourselves like those spies did as "small and insignificant" but is anything too impossible for God?
How small are we? As small as our faith is. Dont get me wrong, i understand about "regrets" as mentioned by bluefrog, but its not what WE do but what We let God do thru us.
I dont think becauseHeLives was being "superior" but looking at How small we are compared to How Big we can be if we let God rule and reign thru us.
Yes some people think they are "big" or think they are "small" or too weak, too old (As sarah and Abraham thought)ect... but that is looking at things from our humanistic viewpoint.
If God be for you, who or what can be against you? Absolutely nothing. We are able to overcome because Yeshua has overcome. HallaluYah!
that is exactly what I was saying!
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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bluefrog
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EDEN...OK, you are correct. Thank You. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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Eden
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bluefrog wrote to Eden quote:
EDEN...Why do you do this to me? I knew when I said that you would have something to say. Will it never end?
When you say "I have a soul", that needs to be corrected. You don't "have" a soul" bur "are" a soul.
As you also say (now), in the old days, when they said "my nephesh" or "your nephesh" or "his nephesh", it was the same as saying what we now say, "I" and "you" and "he".
So "my nephesh is hungry" (or in the KJV, "my soul is hungry"), nowadays we would say, "I am hungry".
And in Tudor England in the 1600s, they also talked that way in English still, "bless his soul" or "my soul is pines away", but nowadays we would say, "bless him" and "he pines away".
So bluefrog, if you state something that does not seem Biblically correct to me, you can expect that I will address it with you. In that regard, "it will not end" until one of us dies or we both are raptured.
with love, Eden
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oneinchrist
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Hebrews 4:12
For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
I was wondering what some of the distinction may be between the soul and spirit of man and this is some text taken from my bible dictionary under the word SPIRIT that may offer some insight...........
With respect to human beings ruah(spirit) sometimes stands for the "life center" and is practically synonymous with nephesh, "soul." Generally, however, nephesh is the person himself as an individual, whereas ruah(spirit) is to be regarded as the animating(imparting interest or zest to) principle.
SPIRIT. The essential and activating principle or animating force within living personal beings.
SOUL. Life. Man himself. Living being. Person. Creature
--kinda the way that I presently look at it is the soul is the "life" breathed into us, but the spirit is our unique and individual personality.
With love in Christ, Daniel
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bluefrog
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EDEN...Why do you do this to me ? I knew when I said that you would have something to say. Will it never end ?
A soul is the individual self, each person's unique "I", myself, life as experienced by the individual, not an abstract concept.
Matt Matt 16:26, Mark 8:37 Jesus rhetorically asked, What can a man give in exchange for his soul? Here, soul means an individual's self.
To lift up one's soul to God means simply that a person focuses all his attention on the Lord.
There are about a hundred references where it says his soul, my soul, their soul, etc.
1Ch22:10, Ps 3:2, Ps 26:9, Pr 8:36, Jer 6:8,
Eze 4:14..my soul hath not been polluted , Eze 18:4 and many more as examples.
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Eden
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bluefrog wrote quote:
I didn't think I needed to say that I also have a soul.
Actually the Bible says that you became a soul, not that you have a soul:
Genesis 2:7
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
And the word "soul" there is the hebrew word "nephesh" which simply means "creature". And throughout the entire Old Testament, the word "soul" is ALWAYS the word "nephesh".
And so Gen. 2:7 above could have been translated:
Genesis 2:7
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living creature.
But I know of NO reference in the Bible where it is said that man has a soul.
love, Eden
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bluefrog
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I'm sorry folks, I am here in a human body and I didn't think I needed to say that I also have a soul. The discussion started out talking about how little we actually are and how dependent we are on the Lord. Thinking we all sorta knew all that I gave my view on how a person sees things.
To assume that I left Jesus out of the senerio is just silly. I also thought that it might put a smile on someones face and enlighten them on what is to come in the future.
As a greenhorn young person we usually tackle most anything, not relying on the Lord that much.
As we get older and things begin to show obstacles coupled with obligations we start to open our eyes to the Lord and His powers.
(How am I doin now?)
As we get old, we look back on all the things we should have done. (Well, at least us who are not perfect) When retired and given the time to think about the past it gets depressing some of the time to think how much better you could have glorified the Lord and had a better life. Still alive though, you do have the opportunity to share these things with younger folks, well, some anyway.
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yahsway
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If I may,
I believe what becauseHeLives was referring to when he mentioned the 10 spies was that those spies were looking at themselves and saw that the men in the land that they were to cross over and take were "Giants" and they were "Small".
They only saw the "natural" and lacked the faith needed to see in the supernatural. They saw themselves as being insignificant, small, and probably thought themselves "dead men" if they obeyed the Lord and crossed over to take the land.
Some might of thought they were not only too small to take on the Giants, they may have thought they were too "weak", "too old" ect..
Laying out every excuse not to obey the Lord and step out in faith. They only thought of "themselves". The Natural.
As the opening post by wildb said, God chooses the "foolish", "the weak", "the despised" "the base" to accomplish His will.
As the post wildb states Heb 2:15
"and release those who thru "Fear of Death" were ALL their lifetime subject to bondage." Just as the bad report by those spies because of their fear of death and lack of trust in God they lived out the rest of their lives in the desert and did not enter into the Land. The rest of their lives they were in bondage to that fear.
Yes we may at times see ourselves like those spies did as "small and insignificant" but is anything too impossible for God?
How small are we? As small as our faith is. Dont get me wrong, i understand about "regrets" as mentioned by bluefrog, but its not what WE do but what We let God do thru us.
I dont think becauseHeLives was being "superior" but looking at How small we are compared to How Big we can be if we let God rule and reign thru us.
Yes some people think they are "big" or think they are "small" or too weak, too old (As sarah and Abraham thought)ect... but that is looking at things from our humanistic viewpoint.
If God be for you, who or what can be against you? Absolutely nothing. We are able to overcome because Yeshua has overcome. HallaluYah!
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bluefrog
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BECAUSEHELIVES....Subject: How small we are!
You say that I lie ? I did not bother to read past your first sentence. Furthermore, I am not going back and read it now either. You, sir, are not the type of person I care to communicate with. My choice is to speak with persons who love the Lord and share in that happiness. I also live in a human body. I carry my head on my shoulders not in other places. I have met others who share your pleasures in trying to act as if you are superior but it doesn't impress me. Those sort of persons usually run others away rather than attract them.
You have mentioned the ten spies to myself, Betty and Wild B. What are you talking about?
I assume that you are refering to Numbers 13 & 14 but why ? Are you one of those who opens the bible to a random page, points his finger to a random verse and uses it to make your point?
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becauseHElives
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Joshua 14:8
But my brethren who went up with me made the hearts of the people melt; yet I wholly followed the Lord my God.
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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WildB
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Ecclesiastes 12
[1] Remember now thy Creator in the days of thy youth, while the evil days come not, nor the years draw nigh, when thou shalt say, I have no pleasure in them;
[2] While the sun, or the light, or the moon, or the stars, be not darkened, nor the clouds return after the rain:
[3] In the day when the keepers of the house shall tremble, and the strong men shall bow themselves, and the grinders cease because they are few, and those that look out of the windows be darkened,
[4] And the doors shall be shut in the streets, when the sound of the grinding is low, and he shall rise up at the voice of the bird, and all the daughters of musick shall be brought low;
[5] Also when they shall be afraid of that which is high, and fears shall be in the way, and the almond tree shall flourish, and the grasshopper shall be a burden, and desire shall fail: because man goeth to his long home, and the mourners go about the streets:
[6] Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern.
[7] Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
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That is all.....
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becauseHElives
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betty, the ten spies did not say any thing false, they spoke the truth but their focus was on the natural, you go ahead and focus on the natural...
as for me and my house, i will focus with Joshuah and Caleb not on me (old and disabled) but on the Big God I serve and has who tell me He is with me in every circumstance no matter how bad or how good... all things are possible to those whose faith rest in HIM.....
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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Betty Louise
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Until I die or I am raptured to Heaven, I live in a human body. It doesn't matter how spiritual one is we still get old. David got old. He was a man after God's own heart but when he was old and dying, virgins were put in his bed because he could not get warm. Pretending, that I do not walk with a cane and suffer pain does not make it go away. Jesus told Peter that when he was old people would lead him where he did not want to go. Obviously Peter grew old and feeble. Pretending that we do not suffer the pains of old age is ridiculous and pious to say the least.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
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becauseHElives
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I may be small & old but my God is so BIG....
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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becauseHElives
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bluefrog, you evidently read my post even though you said you did not....
bettie, wildb, bluefrog, it is a shame you all seem to think exactly like the 10 spies....
I know very well what old age looks and feels like but faith is a Spiritual walk and must be addressed as such....
Now the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually judged....1 Corinthians 2:14
The Church is full of your humanistic thinking
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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WildB
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Ditto Betty.
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Betty Louise
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bluefrog,
I thought your post was interesting. We do look at life differently at different points in our lives.
I remember in High School when a student who sat by me got killed. The School was in shock. We thought we were invincible. The only people we knew who died were old people. Now at 56, I am closing in on those old people stage. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
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Betty Louise
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bluefrog,
I thought your post was interesting. We do look at life differently at different points in our lives.
I remember in High School when a student who sat by me got killed. The School was in shock. We thought we were invincible. The only people we knew who died were old people. Now at 56, I am closing in on those old people stage.
betty
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Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
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bluefrog
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BECAUSEHELIVES....In that you think my words were humanistic dribble, dont read them.
I didn't read yours for the same reason.
Perhaps when you grow up you will understand what I was saying.
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becauseHElives
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bluefrog,your post was humanistic dribble... adding nothing to the topic "How small we are"
quote:
When you are young you are a giant, capable of doing just about anything you want and no one will stop you.
David was a little boy and by faith he killed the giant...
quote:
When you get married you find that your bean stalk has been taken away and you have a castle to help keep clean.
And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.
quote:
When you are mid life, you sort of settle down to a life of contentment and satisfaction. You show battle scars (wrinkles), and move slower because speed control is a body function at this time.
But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
bluefrog you were rambling on about getting old and not being able to do what you once could....age has nothing to with walking by faith....
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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bluefrog
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BECAUSEHELIVES...Subject: How small we are!
I have no idea what you are talking about.
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becauseHElives
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bluefrog, you need to consider your perspective...
the ten spies were keep out of the promise land for the same kind of thinking you have presented...
I am small, but my God is so big and His promises are true and amen...my age has nothing to do with my expectations of what I am capable of accomplishing because he is my God and Father...
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Strive to enter in at the strait gate:for many, I say unto you will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. ( Luke 13:24 )
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bluefrog
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If I may, I would like to add a comment to this line of thinking.....
When you are young you are a giant, capable of doing just about anything you want and no one will stop you.
When you get married you find that your bean stalk has been taken away and you have a castle to help keep clean.
When you are mid life, you sort of settle down to a life of contentment and satisfaction. You show battle scars (wrinkles), and move slower because speed control is a body function at this time.
When you get old (like me) you look back at the years and your accomplishments, to say nothing about your failures. There should be a word in the dictionary for us to use called "ishoulda" because there are so many of them. Like it or not we find that we have had failures in most of our arenas and for some reason we remember those the most. Hopefully, before we go, we can recall some of the good that we have accomplished but for some reason the other is what we remember.
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Eden
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How small we are! But even that statement does not do justice to how small we are.
The problem with people is that they make themselves WAY TOO BIG. Basically in their heads it goes something like this:
There is nature, there is me, and then there is God.
But we are MUCH smaller than that, millions of times smaller than that. I once read a book which interposed so many hierarchies between me and God, that I suddenly came close to my true small size and there I found a sudden blissful freedom.
But mostly I also make myself WAY TOO BIG; we are MUCH smaller than we think:
Isaiah 40:15
Behold, the nations are as a drop in a bucket, and are counted as the small dust on the balance: behold, He takes up the islands as a very little thing.
Galatians 6:3
For if a man thinks himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself.
![[roll on floor]](graemlins/6.gif)
love, Eden
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yahsway
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Amen! How excellent is His name in All of the Earth!
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